Printable version of thread

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 5th May 2024, 01:15 PM

So with the local elections results almost wrapped it seems a good time to start this thread. The general election will be the first to be held since 12th December 2019.

It must be held by the 28th January 2025 however it is widely expected to be held at some point in the latter half of 2024. The Prime Minister has said his “working assumption” is that the election will be held in the second half of 2024 - and given it’s in his power to call it there’s no reason not to believe him.

For the first time since 2010 the boundaries of parliamentary constituencies will be changing however the total number of constituencies up for election will stay the same at 650.

The actual results of the 2019 election by constituency can be found https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Results_of_the_2019_United_Kingdom_general_election. The notional results of the 2019 election by constituency based on the new boundaries can be found https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notional_results_of_the_2019_United_Kingdom_general_election_by_2024_constituenc
y.

The breakdown of MPs elected in 2019 was:

Conservative Party - 365
Labour Party - 202
Scottish National Party - 48
Liberal Democrats - 11
Democratic Unionist Party - 8
Sinn Fein - 7
Plaid Cymru - 4
Social Democratic and Labour Party - 2
Green Party of England and Wales - 1
Alliance Party of Northern Ireland - 1
Speaker - 1

Over the course of this parliament that breakdown has changed as a result of resignations, by-elections, defections and suspensions. The break down of current MPs is as follows:

Conservative - 345 (-20)
Labour - 203 (+1)
Scottish National Party - 43 (-5)
Liberal Democrats - 15 (+4)
Democratic Unionist Party - 7 (-1)
Sinn Fein - 7 (-)
Plaid Cymru 3 (-1)
Social Democratic and Labour Party - 2 (-)
Alba Party - 2 (+2)
Alliance Party of Northern Ireland - 1 (-)
Green Party of England and Wales - 1 (-)
Workers Party of Great Britain - 1 (+1)
Reform UK - 1 (-)
Independent - 18 (+18)
Speaker - 1

The breakdown of vote-share for the parties that won more than 0.1% of the vote at the 2019 general election was as follows:

Conservative - 43.63%
Labour - 32.08%
Liberal Democrats - 11.55%
Scottish National Party - 3.88%
Green Party of England and Wales - 2.61%
Brexit Party - 2.01%
DUP - 0.76%
Sinn Fein - 0.57%
Plaid Cymru - 0.48%
Alliance - 0.42%
SDLP - 0.37%
Ulster Unionist - 0.29%

According to https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-67361138 of the new boundaries Labour would need a record swing of 12.7% to win and overall majority in the election. That's more than achieved by Clement Attlee in 1945 or Tony Blair in 1997. Current polling suggest that they are on course to with a swing even bigger than that but the polls could narrow as we move closer to the election.

The Guardians https://www.theguardian.com/politics/ng-interactive/2024/apr/15/uk-general-election-opinion-poll-tracker-latest-labour-tories-starmer-sunak at the time of writing this has the main parties as follows:

Labour - 43.6%
Conservative - 23.4%
Reform - 12.1%
Liberal Democrat - 9.3%
Green Party - 5.8%

Obviously under First Past the Post those vote-shares won't translate directly into seat numbers - as demonstrated by the last election. The current seat prediction from https://www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/prediction_main.html as of May is as follows:

Conservatives - 85
Labour - 472
Liberal Democrat - 50
Reform - 0
Green - 2
Scottish National Party - 19
Plaid Cymru - 4
Other - 2
Democratic Unionist Party - 8
Sinn Fein - 7
Social Democratic and Labour Party - 2
Alliance Party of Northern Ireland - 1


There will be live coverage of the election results as they come in on BBC, ITV, Channel 4 and Sky News. Other smaller channels may also cover it.

At present it is not known if leadership debates that have been a feature since the 2010 election will take place or whether the Prime Minister will take part in them (in 2017 Theresa May boycotted them).

Finally of note - a minimum of https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-68839793 - 63 of them Conservatives - have already announced that they will be standing down/not seeking re-election at the upcoming general election. This may make some difference in the result in seats where an incumbency factor might have otherwise helped their party to keep the seat.

Key Dates (added 28th May)
30th May - Parliament dissolved
5th-16th June - Party manifestos expected to be published (based on stats on past elections)
7th June - Deadline for candidate nominations
18th June - Deadline for new voter registrations
19th June - Deadline for new postal vote applications
26th June - Deadline for new proxy vote applications and voter authority certificates
4th July - Polling day. Emergency proxy votes deadline 5pm. Polls 7am-10pm.

Posted by: Scene 5th May 2024, 01:26 PM

Finally coming round Cannot wait to see the tories annihilated! I just hope another Labour smear campaign doesn’t sabotage them this time around.

Posted by: Smint 5th May 2024, 01:57 PM

Genuinely shocked that Labour only have ONE more MP then 2019 after all their election success since PartyGate

Posted by: Smint 5th May 2024, 02:15 PM

I'm sure the Mail and co will try their best, as in Desperate Dan Hodges trying to hype that boring tax affair story about Rayner tax for the 93832th day when nobody cares. Luckily, Johnson already released the Saville/Starmer connection nonsense about 2 years too early as we just knew that they'd throw that one out on election week but it's now debunked news. I just can't see anything working this time - certainly not enough to replace the horrific legacy of the Tories and their unpopular leader.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 5th May 2024, 02:22 PM

It's going to be hard for them to convince anyone to give a shit about £3000 in unpaid capital gains tax from a genuine error when the PM is responsible for hundreds of millions of pounds of PPE fraud whilst he was chancellor.

The more concerning thing is that Sunak has decided a lurch to the hard-right will save his election fortunes. He's wrong but that's no solace for the people these policies target.

Posted by: Envoirment 5th May 2024, 02:23 PM

Really excited for the upcoming election night. I really hope that the polling remains similar, if not the conservatives fall even further. I do feel that the public are very much in favour of big change from the current government and that they can't pull the wool over their eyes as easily as they have done the last 10+ years.

Hopefully Labour will build in the coming months with many sensible & popular policies being revealed - such as their recent policy to nationalise the railways. They should extend that policy to the likes of water & electricity as well in the coming months to align themselves with what a lot of the public would want.

Lastly, it will be amazing for the greens to get a 2nd seat in parliament! They have really been going from strength to strength over the last 10 years despite the voting system being quite against them. I do think they will be able to take Bristol Central with how well their local election result went. And likely end up gaining record-high votes breaking their previous 2015 record in a general election.

I do feel the greens may become a fairly significant party in the 2030s. Hopefully their local election success and gaining their 2nd MP will help build a great foundation for them to continue their gains.

Posted by: Long Dong Silver 5th May 2024, 05:09 PM

Greens are neoliberals and have a lot of posh Tories in their ranks. The real leftist party, except under scabs like Starmer, is Labour. But yes, we need Labour to bring in pr. That way, we'll almost be free of rhe evil Tories forever.

Posted by: Chez Wombat 5th May 2024, 05:26 PM

Let's go with the 1997 style wipeout *.* (I was too young to pay much attention when it last happened x). I imagine the next few months will be scrambling to ensure that them and their mates get cushy deals or GB News posts and an election probably September/October.

Though their friends there will certainly try, I can't see how any media scandal can stop Labour now. They've been pretty smart and the Tories have just continually dug deeper with a leader that wasn't even their first choice. I do hope Labour use this opportunity to show how how their policies they can actually change things and not just go for the centrists, it's not like the Tories are not pleasing anyone right now so it's not like they've got much to lose x (I will likely vote for them but purely tactically, Starmer isn't appealing to me much)

Posted by: Liam sota 5th May 2024, 05:27 PM

Nobody appealing to me at all. I'd like to see more independents but fat chance of that. I'd probably vote green if I could be bothered to vote just for something different but a lot of them are focused on nonsense. If it's November I guess we will hsvevthe US and UK elections almost at the same time

Posted by: Long Dong Silver 5th May 2024, 05:31 PM

Depends on your sest. FPTP means you vote for the area's biggesy party or its biggest opposition in that seat, or your vote does nothing

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 5th May 2024, 06:10 PM

Except for when people voting for a third party in 2015 led to a referendum on Europe and ultimately our exit from the European Union - 12.6% of our population having a bigger impact on policy than the 67.2% who voted for Labour/Conservative in that election. Third party votes do have an impact on policy of the major parties whether they're in opposition or government. It's not true to say it does nothing - it just doesn't necessarily affect the winner in that seat - it can still have a huge impact on main parties policies. Unfortunately it's not going to have as much impact under PR but it looks unlikely we'll get PR any time soon at the moment. There is also of course the 2010 election where people voting for a third party managed to moderate the worst excesses of a Tory majority government to some degree in that parliament - even if we ended up with a Tory government anyway 5 years later.

On which note one of the interesting things at the next election will actually be the impact of third parties. Reform UK will not be replicating the Brexit Party in standing aside in rafts of seats to aid the Conservatives instead standing everywhere and the Workers Party of Great Britain say it will be standing in all seats. Whilst this probably lead to a large number of lost deposits for both parties, it could also influence both the Conservatives and the Labour Party in terms of election policy - with Conservatives veering further to the right - and Labour looking to through sops to more economically left-wing vote without going full on Corbynite or Gallowayian in their policies. There's also going to be a lot of pro-Gaza independents in heavily Muslim areas - looking at the council votes in more detail it's clear many Muslim areas shows independents doing well at Labours expense on that issue - I actually suspect a handful of MPs at the general might be decided on the Gaza issue - either WPGB or Independent pro-Palestinian candidates.

Those announcements mean we can expect at least 6 candidates in most seats (Labour, Conservative, Liberal Democrat, Greens, Reform and Workers Party). That's before regionalist parties. smaller parties and independents are taken into account.

Posted by: Rooney 5th May 2024, 06:52 PM

I can't see Labour changing their scope, I imagine they might try a bit harder to engage with local communities, but a general election is a different beast altogether. Not sure Reform or Workers Party will win any seats. I'm fairly certain the SNP and Labour lose seats and Galloway also loses. However, I do think 5 years down the line we will be in trouble, but we can only play what's in front of us and a lot of the future is going to be dicatated by foreign policy and what Russia does next.

Posted by: Long Dong Silver 5th May 2024, 07:35 PM

That's called ILLUSION of choice x

Posted by: Smint 5th May 2024, 08:32 PM

Galloway's Workers Party of Britain - terrible name of a party as it stigmatises people who can't work (I know that Labour could be the same but thats been the name of party for centuries whereas the WPB formed in 2019) will hopefully suffer due to their homophobic leader's recent interview where he said gay relationships aren't normal and shouldn't be taught at school.

That's more extreme than the official Conservative party position. Prob a ploy to some of the Muslim community.

Posted by: Long Dong Silver 5th May 2024, 08:50 PM

Didn't he crawl around the floor, meowing like a cat, to impress a woman? He's not a goof barometer of "normal", as whatever that is ... it ain't him.

Posted by: Scene 6th May 2024, 07:37 AM

!!!!!!!!


I'm hoping a lot of pressure is put on Sunak to call an early election!

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 6th May 2024, 07:56 AM

There might be a lot of pressure from other parties but the pressure from his own party has gone. You've even got rebels openly saying it's too late to replace him and wanting the defeat squarely put at his door. He was only going to go early if a viable plot to oust him and there's no such plot. That means he can wait until at least one flight to Rwanda has gone off and an interest rate cut has taken place.

We should all remember though even if it was a "early election" it's technically a "late election" as the government repealed the legislation that meant it should have been held on May 2nd alongside the local elections.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 6th May 2024, 01:28 PM

So in the first shots to fire post-local elections the Liberal Democrats are going to table a motion of no confidence in the government tomorrow. It's somewhat unlikely to be selected for debate or voted on but if it is it will force the Tories to either publicly support Sunak or vote no confidence and essentially for a general election. Neither option is great for Tory MPs trying to distance themselves from their leader.

https://www.thenational.scot/news/24301524.libdems-table-motion-no-confidence-tory-government/

Posted by: Hassaan 6th May 2024, 01:33 PM

Fingers crossed it does lead to a general election.

Posted by: Long Dong Silver 6th May 2024, 03:05 PM

Thr client journslists are saying they heard "rumours" that the rlection will be in November, to give Richi Rich two full years.

Posted by: Liam sota 6th May 2024, 03:33 PM

Do you think it should be changed back? Seems absurd a Gov can decide to delay an election if they're unpopular

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 6th May 2024, 03:57 PM

What would be the point? As was shown in 2019 it was circumventable by a simple majority act of parliament and repealable by a simple majority act of parliament as shown in 2022. Any government with a majority would just repeal it - it was only useful during the 2010-2015 parliament due to very specific circumstances and in the 2017-2019 Conservative minority government parliament actually made it harder for the Tories to call an election due to the two-thirds majority requirement (hence the Early Parliamentary General Election Bill 2019). It's been got rid of for good reasons even if leaves frustration when watching a dead duck government run the clock to the last minute - but that happens when all governments are doing woefully in the polls (2005-2010 Labour, 1992-1997 Conservatives). Governments can't bind a future parliament so it was only ever of use in 2010-2015 and probably should have been repealed by Cameron in the 2015-17 parliament.

George Osbourne said in January that the likely date of the election had been leaked to him and is 14 November - it'd seem a fairly good bet barring any miracles changing the Conservatives polling fortune.

Posted by: Suedehead2 6th May 2024, 04:10 PM

A date a couple weeks earlier would be better. Holding it in half-term week means avoiding closing schools for a day to use as polling stations. From a purely selfish perspective, I would be able to keep my record of staying up for every general election since I was able to vote.

Posted by: Botchia 6th May 2024, 04:40 PM

I love the fact that a 31 October election is a real possibility. The headlines will write themselves.

Posted by: My... WAP?? 7th May 2024, 12:15 AM

I'll be voting for none of them and yes that does count as an official vote through the medium of a spoiled ballet.

It doesn't matter one iota since my seat has been safe Labour for donkeys years but I will have made my own voice heard I guess.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 7th May 2024, 03:41 PM

The modern face of democracy from the Conservatives Party - scrap postal voting.

https://twitter.com/Bren4Bassetlaw/status/1787744981798527463?

Posted by: Doctor Blind 7th May 2024, 04:03 PM

It's also pretty much your view too, isn't it?



Some people can't physically vote at the polling station, do you really support removing the right of these people to vote?

Posted by: Long Dong Silver 7th May 2024, 04:33 PM

Lmoa I thought that too!! He was sayin the same fash thing!

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 7th May 2024, 04:39 PM

Actually, no. I think I was being a bit idealistic in suggesting that and having read the arguments against it - especially people who work away and those who have mobility issues. The old system where you had to evidence why you need a postal vote would be ideal but it would be too costly, overly bureaucratic and a bit pointless to reintroduce it. I've never needed a postal vote, but there's obvious situations where I could - as indeed any of us could and I'd be a bit miffed not to have the option.

Coercion is a real issue in some communities but denying the disabled and people who work away a vote just because it might prevent some people being pressured by family members on postal votes is a bit too far on reflection.

Unlike most members of parliament I can put my hand up when I'm wrong.

Posted by: Long Dong Silver 7th May 2024, 04:43 PM

Postal votes are a necessary part of democracy.

Posted by: Suedehead2 7th May 2024, 08:45 PM

It's always good to see people accepting that they made a mistake.

Posted by: Steve201 8th May 2024, 09:24 AM

Yeh I’m the same I didn’t even think of people who can’t go to the polling stations which is ridiculous of me.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 8th May 2024, 11:26 AM

Another Conservative defection to Labour from Natalie Elphicke.

I can't be the only one who things Starmer should have told her where to shove it.

Posted by: Herbs 8th May 2024, 11:36 AM

I don't think I will ever understand how someone defects from Tory to Labour.....

Or maybe they are just abandoning a sinking ship.....

Posted by: Liam sota 8th May 2024, 11:38 AM

If I was a Tory MP that's what I'd be looking to do about now. Self preservation is one reason obviously but also Rishi is so bad the Tories are all over the place no coherent plans and most people see Labour under Starmer as Tory-lite

Posted by: Jessie Where 8th May 2024, 11:56 AM

She can F all the way OFF, quite frankly

Her and that sex pest husband of hers.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 8th May 2024, 11:57 AM

The fact Labour is even opening it's door to somewhere as far right as Elphicke tells you exactly what kind of government were going to get from Labour.

Thankfully she's not standing for election but I do really think Labour should have told her where to go rather than actually welcoming her into the party as if she was some centrist. She's the kind of person you'd expect to defect to Reform not the Labour Party.

Posted by: Smint 8th May 2024, 12:42 PM

Terrible decision from Starmer - whose next? Suella Bravermann going to cross over to become Shadow Home Secretary next?

Posted by: Rooney 8th May 2024, 02:15 PM

I think that’s a bit over the top.

I’m not really a fan of MPs crossing the lines between the red and blues as it feeds in to the narrative that all politicians are the same, but I don’t believe this to be the case. This one is purely symbolic, the small boats issues is about the last big thing the Tories have to cling on to and by all accounts, so just seems like a kick in the teeth and pure party politics. Starmer’s version of Labour is obviously more to the right, but guess the centre ground wins the elections. In a week this will all blow over, but the symbolism still exists of the Tories falling apart under Sunak.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 8th May 2024, 02:33 PM

The centre ground does indeed win in politics. You're correct. All the more reason not accept right-wingers like Elphick into the Labour party fold.

Posted by: Rooney 8th May 2024, 03:00 PM

I think they have accepted her purely on symbolism and she’s standing down at the next election if I’m correct? I’m not a huge fan of accepting deflections full stop, but the last two have been really symbolic. I’m not a fan of it myself, but I can understand from a strategic point of view why this decision was made. The positives outweighs the negatives imo in short termism to get elected.

Posted by: Steve201 8th May 2024, 09:38 PM

So Jeremy Corbyn and Diane Abbott have been suspended from the party but Natalie Elphicke is invited in like an old friend - f*** right off Starmer!

Posted by: Smint 8th May 2024, 09:44 PM

They apparently gave the whip back to Kate Osamor from the left of the party purely to calm some of the disquiet in Labour ranks. But Abbot and Corbyn are apparently just too toxic - despite Starmer being in the same Shadow Cabinet as recently as 2019.

Posted by: Steve201 8th May 2024, 10:16 PM

I hate the course he’s taking, I would nearly rather a Tory government than this fake BS Starmer is providing. The quote from Malcolm X about Liberals and the fox springs to mind. The fox will smile at you and act like your friend a bit like liberals!

Posted by: Rooney 8th May 2024, 11:37 PM

Well if anything it's royally upset Owen Jones, so that's a positive.

Posted by: SemiDongContest 8th May 2024, 11:52 PM

Owen Jones is a strong socialidt voice. Upsetting him is NOTHING TO BE PROUD OF!!

Posted by: Smint 9th May 2024, 08:56 AM

Indeed, Owen is a legend, one of the very few mainstream journalists who dares to speak out on so many issues - Palestine, transphobia, poverty, racism. Of course a lot of people hate him - that's what you get in mainstream capitalist society for challenging the status quo.

Posted by: Liam sota 9th May 2024, 09:58 AM

Oh no. Not a fan at all. I think always when this guy is representing a cause its usually doomed to failure, he's such a bad advocate for it and off-putting to most people. The Palestine issue is a big example it's such an obvious issue, there's a hugely well backed country clearly doing whatever they want, breaking any laws, committing war crimes it should be obvious this is not something anyone should be supporting in this manner but then almost all the big voices for the cause are usually sketchy people and it can create this situation where the average Joe goes against them

Posted by: Rooney 9th May 2024, 11:09 AM

He’s almost 40 and acts like a child. He’s in the pocket of influential people too. Snipes away from the backbones of his columns and cries when someone challenges him. Isn’t he telling everyone to vote for the Greens now anyway who don’t even know who is repeating their party and what views they all hold.

Abbot should be reinstated back to the Party, but isn’t it well documented she hasn’t apologised or done the required training course? All seems very stubborn to me. But of course this part is never peddled from her allies and staunch supporters!

Posted by: Smint 9th May 2024, 01:27 PM

He walked off a show once when he was upset over the LGBT massacre in Orlando and he thought that they were dismissing the hate crime angle several years ago but don't recall him "crying" ever. He argues forcefully and yes writes a newspaper column where he makes commentary like most other political journalists. There are so, so few mainstream journalists who even go half the way he does on several progressive, human rights issues. Which influential people is he in the pockets of?

Posted by: Rooney 9th May 2024, 04:12 PM

He's blocked half of Twitter. I’ve no problem with any political commentator commenting on anything, but Owen Jones is right on every single issue. He always supports David vs Goliath on every single issue irrespective of who is right and wrong to presented as a hero. I sometimes think that he sees himself as Jesus. Must be amazing to be right on every single issue and never wrong! I genuinely think he’d rather the Tories would stay in power. He’s in the pockets of the same people who powered the Corbyn machine. Just like the likes of Matt Zarb-Cousin etc. are too. Always complaining, never happy, never their fault on anything.

Posted by: SemiDongContest 9th May 2024, 05:54 PM

Momentum is a great movement, and simply aims to shift the Overton window back so that we can ACTUALLY HAVE A DEMOCRACY AGAIN!! Plus, it advocates for the people and is run by the people; it's basically a textbook example of a REAL grassroots movement.

Owens is one of the best journalists around, a true voice of solidarity and socialism. I couldn't give two shets if he blocks loudmouthed far righters on Twitter to protect both his message and his mental health. And childish? Because he doesn't wear suits and act like he's an alpha and better than everyone else? Mkay

Posted by: Iz 🌟 9th May 2024, 06:40 PM

The Elphicke defection is the first one of these to raise my eyebrows - a nepotistic MP parachuted in after her husband's conviction sexual assault, who's been rubbishing protesters and is clearly a right-wing stooge that embodies the feeling of 'it does actually matter how Labour wins, and winning by slapping red paint on former Conservatives is not the change the country needs, because it ends up being the same shit'.

I am seeing and potentially agreeing with a few interpretations of this acceptance as a way to make Labour a natural party of government, give the voters who have been constantly lost to shit grifter parties like UKIP, Brexit and Reform a chance to vote Labour, get them pleased with a few relatively agreeable things that Labour does like improve housing and the economy and now they're Labour voters pleased with something that a left-wing party has done for them, meaning Labour is more likely to be returned as the government in the future. Accepting someone who has been pandering to that wing is a first step.

Of course all of the above is a bit insulting while principled Labour advocates for years like Abbott and Corbyn remain outside the party, people who were activists for Labour recently defecting to the Greens and the above explanation does stink a bit too much of 'hold off your criticism, Sir Starmer has a masterful gambit you need to wait for him to unleash', but I do have to assume that Starmer didn't just accept a morally dubious MP on a whim.

(I also agree with Owen Jones on much, though he does have a flaw of being a little preachy)

Posted by: Envoirment 9th May 2024, 07:04 PM

Whilst I can see why the move was disagreeable, I think it was actually the perfect move from Labour. In one way it's refreshing to see Labour play the political game well for once.

Iz sums it up nicely above. Elphicke should not be anywhere near a seat in the next election (although I believe they're standing down anyway), but the defection will likely have more of a positive effect for labour and a negative one for the conservatives.

I realise things could go the wrong way once the actual election campaign starts, but it seems to me that Labour under Keir Starmer is steadily navigating the political mess of the conservative government - allowing them to drown themselves whilst avoid being dragged under by it too.

Posted by: Rooney 9th May 2024, 07:20 PM

Momentum had some good ideas, but was deeply flawed. But the group let in a lot of people with extreme views, anti-semities etc. and did not know how to deal with the situation due to the lack of governance. Imagine where we'd be today if Long-Bailey got the nomination - highly likely another 5 years of the Tories incoming! I think a large part of the issues is groups like Momentum were so attached to ideological purity and would rather sulk and be challengers than win and be challenged.

Owen Jones is not childish because he does not wear a suit. He has an incredibly high opinion of himself and he is always right (when he is not always righ..t). I actually agree with some of his views and some of his work is really good, but he throws his toys out of the pram, can never admit to being wrong and not sure he actually has any ideas for how to solve the problems that are practical and is purely driven by ideology. I just think he needs to grow up.

Anyway, in the event Labour do not win at the election, the irony will not be lost on me that the "evil Centrists" will now be able to blame the "evil far Left"!

Posted by: The Dong Contest 10th May 2024, 05:59 PM

A literal article on Sky about how Labour is insisting there is "no place for Farage in the party"!!! It's bad when people are ssying the party's so right wing now that even Farage could get in.

Posted by: Steve201 10th May 2024, 08:13 PM

So again who is he in the pockets of them?

Posted by: Suedehead2 10th May 2024, 09:19 PM

Owen Jones demonstrates what is so wrong with the left of the Labour Party. He gives the impression that he would prefer opposition to a Labour government that he can only agree with 50% of the time. He claims to support people on a low income, but by refusing to support a Labour party that agrees with him on everything, he is doing exactly the opposite.

Posted by: Rooney 10th May 2024, 09:35 PM

That whole Novara group. I'm not suggesting Owen Jones takes back handers, but he's very clearly influenced by that group through donations.

Posted by: Steve201 10th May 2024, 09:52 PM

yous think they were the Murdochs the way your talking. Pretty sure he’s happy to agree with them considering they are the modern face of the Bennite left!

Posted by: Steve201 10th May 2024, 10:15 PM

Problem is what if a Labour government isnt actually helping people on low incomes due to their policies.

Posted by: Rooney 10th May 2024, 11:36 PM

I'm sure he is and I'm sure he's happy to take the donations too.



Has there ever been a Labour government that has not helped people on low incomes due to their policies? Nobody knows the majority of the Labour policies so far and while I do think the stratgeosts need to be careful not to over-do things. I think the issue I have (and a lot of other people have) is I reckon Starmer could find a way to get every single household well above the poverty line and Owen Jones would still complain.

Posted by: Steve201 11th May 2024, 06:57 AM

Of course he would, but surely that’s his job?

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 11th May 2024, 06:04 PM

A better idea of how the Conservatives reckon the election might be shaping up as they identify 200 seats as vulnerable and offer them extra resources.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/may/11/uk-conservatives-mark-200-constituencies-as-vulnerable-in-next-general-election

Posted by: The Dong Contest 11th May 2024, 06:26 PM

Extra resources to campaign, or more money for the areas, like a bribe, like authoritarian fash Blojo promised?

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 11th May 2024, 06:39 PM

Extra resources for campaigning such as 'printed material'. I can't be the only one who thinks the bare minimum for any campaign should be some printed material through the door regardless of the safeness of the seat - I live in a safe Labour seat and we normally still get a pamphlet through anyway. Are the Conservatives not send pamphlets out in safe seats for some reason?

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 13th May 2024, 05:37 PM

So an interesting development today as Rishi Sunak fires the starting gun on his election campaign with the slogan "Who Do You Trust To Keep You Safe?" - arguing that only a Conservatives can keep us safe. It's an interesting tactic and perhaps a sign that he realises he can't fight the election on any of the usual issues as his government is failing on them.

A quick scan of reddit and the guardian comments shows no ones buying it.

Posted by: Smint 13th May 2024, 06:29 PM

Guardian comments won't buy it anyway I would have thought. But as everything is so utterly shite in this country now, this won't work either as the Tories have been in power 14 effing years and so all has gone to pot on their watch. And more importantly, no one likes Sunak. He doesn't even have a cult following like Bravermann, Truss do.

Posted by: Rooney 13th May 2024, 06:40 PM

I don't think anyone can buy this against Starmer. I know loads of people hate him and think he's not left enough, but not sure there are any fears to play in to here. And even taking politics aside for a moment.. do people really feel safe? I'm sure things have got worse in that regard with respect to this Government.

Posted by: Scene 16th May 2024, 05:11 PM

Keir Starmer has revealed Labour’s plans including a stable economy, more NHS appointments and employing more teachers.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-69016719

Posted by: T Boy 16th May 2024, 05:19 PM

Employing more teachers is a noble goal but how exactly will he do this? Teacher recruitment and retention will only improve if the conditions of the job do.

Posted by: Silas 16th May 2024, 05:26 PM

Teachers aren’t something you can just magic up overnight either. They have to be trained. How are they going to get more people training as teachers?

These are Wooly at best

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 16th May 2024, 05:33 PM

Not a patch on Corbyn's manifesto, which was a thing of beauty. Unfortunateky, people wanted an arrogant, poor-hating Etonian, poah boy charlatan, with all the intelligence of a sea sponge.

Posted by: Steve201 16th May 2024, 08:59 PM

Defence has been shown to be the only measure currently the tories are ahead of Labour on in the polls so no surprise they are pushing that!

Posted by: ElectroBoy 17th May 2024, 09:42 AM

Love the fact yesterday Labour launched their vision for the future and how they want to shape things for the next 10 years...

Sunak meanwhile appears on Loose Women and gets grilled by Judi Love and fails spectacularly... i'm guessing he's trying for the Karen/ Facebook Mum vote

Posted by: Jessie Where 17th May 2024, 10:00 AM

Imagine being a Prime Minister and making an ass of yourself on LOOSE WOMEN of all things

Posted by: Liam sota 17th May 2024, 10:27 AM

Rishi is like one of them pretty capable students with no street sense at all. He has lost every type of voter you can imagine

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 17th May 2024, 10:27 AM

Given how messed up they've managed to make army recruitment they have no right to be ahead on defence.

Hopefully Kier and the rest of the party can rip a new one into him on this, given there's so much that's gone wrong in that field. I don't think "who do you trust to keep you safe?" framing of the election is going to do much or anything for the Tories - similarly rhetoric worked when Corbyn was in charge of Labour but it's not going to go anywhere with Kier in place and his background.

Posted by: Scene 17th May 2024, 11:53 AM

I felt like he was given a far too easy ride. The presenters would challenge him, let him talk his way out of it and then just nod in agreement.

Posted by: Liam sota 22nd May 2024, 11:24 AM

These guys reckon there will be a snap election called today 🤣cant see it https://x.com/montie/status/1793219505658696070?s=46

Posted by: Hassaan 22nd May 2024, 11:26 AM

I mean I'd love it, but mid way through the Euros? They seem like the sort of people who would want to avoid that.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 22nd May 2024, 11:30 AM

These rumours that an an election is about to be called seem to crop every week and are getting tiresome. I really hope they're right for a change as at least it would stop this rubbish of constant rumours that never seem to lead anyway.

If he does call it today that would make the election on the 27 June. I'd imagine he wants to avoid an election in July/August and the other option is then September/October which would clash with the US presidential race.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 22nd May 2024, 11:33 AM

Definitely not happening - sticking to 'second half of the year' line at PMQs. 27 June isn't second half of the year so won't be calling a general election today.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2024/may/22/labour-tories-police-prison-overcrowding-crisis-pmqs-rishi-sunak-keir-starmer-uk-politics-latest-updates

Posted by: Scene 22nd May 2024, 11:47 AM

Isn’t the US election set for November?

Maybe our one could be first/second week of September?

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 22nd May 2024, 12:10 PM

Yes the US election is held in November but campaigning will be in full swing with a Trump v Biden debate taking place on ABC on September 10th.

Posted by: Scene 22nd May 2024, 12:12 PM

Ahh right I see. Surely they won’t call one over the summer holidays though? Just thinking if that would actually benefit them.

Posted by: Iz 🌟 22nd May 2024, 01:00 PM

All I’ll say is that our client journalists are making this sound like more of a thing that is happening than most of the rumours in the past few months.

Also Cameron’s cut short his Albania trip.

it’s this or the most pointless reshuffle since, er… October 22

Posted by: Liam sota 22nd May 2024, 01:38 PM

We will find out at 5pm clearly something is happening

Posted by: Smint 22nd May 2024, 01:43 PM

Well they can't push through any more hateful legislation then if an election is called. Weren't they going to crackdown further on protests for example?

Posted by: Scene 22nd May 2024, 01:47 PM

Why 5pm?

Posted by: Jessie Where 22nd May 2024, 01:58 PM

Any bets on number 4?

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 22nd May 2024, 02:00 PM

Cameron's cut short his trip to Albania to 'attend a meeting in London'. No clear indication of what that meeting is.

Unless Sunak's changed his mind in the space of a few hours after he said 'second half of the year.' I've thing were looking at a national emergency rather than an election being called.

Unless he's announcing a potential date now, to go to the king later in the year to ask for it? That would be an unusual move.

Posted by: ElectroBoy 22nd May 2024, 02:05 PM

Yeah I'm guessing it will be a resuffle or something pointless.

Hopefully i'm wrong; sooner the Tories are out the better!

Posted by: ElectroBoy 22nd May 2024, 02:06 PM

Rumours are 4th July; which is the 2nd half of the year

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 22nd May 2024, 02:12 PM

But he wouldn't need to call the election today for the 4 July. He'd need to call it next Thursday. The list is here:
https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-9921/

Unless his government is so incompetent it can't work out what day to call an election under the rules.

If he calls it today and goes to see the King it would be for the 27th June.

Posted by: Liam sota 22nd May 2024, 02:21 PM

You could get odds of 1/3 on a November/December election yesterday now its 7/1

I do think all this is election related and fit some reason he is getting rid of Jeremy hunt too but we will find out soon maybe he wants to run it by senior people first to check he isn't making a blunder

Posted by: ElectroBoy 22nd May 2024, 02:26 PM

Sunak calls a press conference for any old sh!te these days though

Posted by: Rooney 22nd May 2024, 02:29 PM

Sounds like a snap election is being called, inflation figures look better today, Reform dropping slightly in the polls, probably found some money somewhere to offer a tax cut..probably see it as a way to catch Labour off guard and take their chances. Think Hunt was meant to appear on Peston tonight and he’s pulled out so something is definitely happening.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 22nd May 2024, 02:30 PM

Just realised that spreadsheet goes by date of dissolution not day the election is called, so it could be 4 July if he calls it today.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 22nd May 2024, 02:37 PM

https://x.com/nicholaswatt/status/1793286414651572467

What happens if he calls the election and then the no confidence threshold is reached?

Posted by: ElectroBoy 22nd May 2024, 02:37 PM

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 22nd May 2024, 02:47 PM

Sums up the Tory party -


https://x.com/nicholaswatt/status/1793286414651572467

Posted by: Rooney 22nd May 2024, 03:06 PM

Don’t think they can do this if Parliament is dissolved?

Sounds like this is happening OR it’s the biggest political catfish ever!

Posted by: ElectroBoy 22nd May 2024, 03:13 PM

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 22nd May 2024, 03:14 PM

No chance. They'll be going for November, tp piggyback off free right wing campaigns in the US

Posted by: Hassaan 22nd May 2024, 03:16 PM

To echo myself from earlier, July 4th is such a random time to do it.

Maybe they're hoping to piggyback on football fever or something.

Posted by: Liam sota 22nd May 2024, 03:22 PM

Yeah weird time but needed Rishi was going nowhere no idea if he believes he can win or he truly is that deluded. Not sure what they're even going campaign on really.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 22nd May 2024, 03:24 PM

'Inflation is back under control' is already cropping up. Expecting us to forget that the Tories are the reason it was so high in the first place.

Posted by: Iz 🌟 22nd May 2024, 03:26 PM

US school term starts in August... for any interested former PMs looking to tech bro themselves up in Silicon Valley but also needing to get the girls off to a prestigious private school

Anyway once it's officially announced I'll try and lay down my thoughts on the election, short form is that the result of this election was decided in October 2022 and that all further faffing about has been a waste of good governing time.

Posted by: Scene 22nd May 2024, 03:28 PM

OMG so hyped the tv election debates will be must-see!!

Posted by: Liam sota 22nd May 2024, 03:34 PM

Yeah and its just such a small thing considering prices aren't falling they're just rising less, nobody is going to notice much of a difference

Posted by: Hassaan 22nd May 2024, 03:37 PM

Loving the Benny Hill theme tune being played in the background on BBC News right now.

Posted by: Iz 🌟 22nd May 2024, 03:37 PM

I'd like to hear about Rishi's secret plan to fight inflation.

yakkety sax and the imperial march clearly on the background in BBC coverage, people taking this very seriously as they should

Posted by: blacksquare 22nd May 2024, 03:40 PM

Ha, Sunak would rather be in the US this summer than pretend to have any grasp on the job anymore.

I wonder how quickly he'll disappear.

Posted by: Scene 22nd May 2024, 03:58 PM

The podium has been put in place

Posted by: Iz 🌟 22nd May 2024, 03:59 PM

The BBC has acknowledged FEBRILE *_*

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 22nd May 2024, 04:11 PM

Lecturn being set up now.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 22nd May 2024, 04:11 PM

I thought he'd be digging in till November for the free far right campaigning he'd grt from thr simuktaneous US election groups, but guess he needs to enroll the kids in school by August in the US! He's off to the Valley for sure.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 22nd May 2024, 04:15 PM

Cut the crap and announce.

Bollocking about the furlough scheme.

Posted by: ElectroBoy 22nd May 2024, 04:16 PM

Pissing is down with rain

and Things can only get better drowning him out

Posted by: Liam sota 22nd May 2024, 04:17 PM

This is a mess🤣

Posted by: ElectroBoy 22nd May 2024, 04:18 PM

Yeah even for Sunak this announcement is a car crash

Posted by: Iz 🌟 22nd May 2024, 04:18 PM

This is ridiculous. No authority at all.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 22nd May 2024, 04:19 PM

YES f*** YES!!!

And who is playing Laboue's song?!

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 22nd May 2024, 04:19 PM

This is the least Prime Ministerial speech that's ever been given. completely soaked wet through and Things Can Only Better being belted out. Really should have done this inside - is that room they used for Covid not available?

Posted by: ElectroBoy 22nd May 2024, 04:19 PM

I hope when the song finishes they put it on again

Posted by: Rooney 22nd May 2024, 04:19 PM

Jesus this is dreadful, they’ve had a nightmare here. This is meme worthy.

Posted by: Iz 🌟 22nd May 2024, 04:20 PM

'Labour have no plan!'

DRINK!

Posted by: ElectroBoy 22nd May 2024, 04:21 PM

What a mess of a speech (and suit)

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 22nd May 2024, 04:22 PM

"Over the next six weeks I will fight for evrry vote"

Ummm you've had 14 YEARS TO DO IT!!

Flush.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 22nd May 2024, 04:23 PM

'Who do you trust?' - not you.

Posted by: ElectroBoy 22nd May 2024, 04:24 PM

Posted by: Jessie Where 22nd May 2024, 04:29 PM

Here we go!

I was laughing my head off at 'Things Can Only Get Better'

Posted by: My... WAP?? 22nd May 2024, 04:35 PM

Oh BLOODY ELL!!

Announcement is over and BBC are still wittering on. When can I watch Pointless??

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 22nd May 2024, 04:37 PM

Probably not tonight. Guessing they'll just fill until 6pm.

Posted by: My... WAP?? 22nd May 2024, 04:40 PM

Oh bollocks!!!

In other news Rishi wouldn’t have looked out of place in a satire. The music almost drowning him out and the rain making it look like he had bird shit on his jacket. An appropriate display to represent the state of things.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 22nd May 2024, 04:41 PM

And off we go, a surprisingly good campaign video from the Labour Party

https://x.com/Keir_Starmer/status/1793315231147405811

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 22nd May 2024, 04:41 PM

Omg we are gonna be celebrsting the 4th of july on both sides of the dea!!!!! Celebrating independence from the etonian overlords in two counries at the same time!!

Posted by: hinterland 22nd May 2024, 04:49 PM

although swapping out the Tories for Labour feels like getting kicked in the balls as opposed to being punched in the face, I’m pleased that the shitshow under Sunak is inevitably drawing to a close. certainly wasn’t expecting an election before autumn!

Posted by: Suedehead2 22nd May 2024, 04:53 PM

It’s on BBC2.

Posted by: My... WAP?? 22nd May 2024, 04:54 PM

That would imply there was real fundamental change worth celebrating.

I’m sure things will be marginally better under Labour, they can surely only get better at this point (tee hee). I won’t be spending a second deluding myself that everything will be sunny on the other side with a slightly watered down version of the same thing though.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 22nd May 2024, 04:56 PM

Ahh so football fans will be flying off to Germany the day of the election if England reaches the semis. Maybe they're hoping dor a low turnout that way. Everyone focused on thd football, loads flying out to Germany, nobody paying attention to the election or the campaigning

Posted by: Calum 22nd May 2024, 04:58 PM

Posted by: Chez Wombat 22nd May 2024, 05:01 PM

I guess the inflation news would've influenced this, I've never seen a more monotonous announcement, the pouring rain and and the fact that Things Can Only Get Better went on so long, it's a perfect metaphor, almost like he knows. Still, just six more weeks of Tory majority, let's goooo *.*

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 22nd May 2024, 05:16 PM

Starmer looking far more Prime Ministerial in his speech and actually offering us something to go at as a voter.

Posted by: Doctor Blind 22nd May 2024, 05:30 PM

Love it. The low energy, the soaking rain, the blaring out of D:Ream. Inject it to my veins and let's see the Tory party destroyed forever!

Posted by: Harve 22nd May 2024, 05:43 PM

Is this surprise to throw off a Farage Joins Reform timeline? Idk what he's been planning but I believe that has been rumoured for a while.

Posted by: Scene 22nd May 2024, 05:45 PM

They should have played this during the announcement delay to counterbalance Sunak's rhetoric.

Posted by: dandy* 22nd May 2024, 06:00 PM

It was utterly wonderful!!!

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 22nd May 2024, 06:33 PM

Farage will.join far right Tories and try to become pm that way

Posted by: Steve201 22nd May 2024, 06:34 PM

That speech was a metaphor lol the papers and media were loving it!

Posted by: Steve201 22nd May 2024, 06:38 PM

Last time Britain went to the polls in July was in 1945….

Posted by: Liam sota 22nd May 2024, 06:57 PM

I heard that he called the election as he was hearing more defections were imminent and the defectors were going to blame him

Posted by: Suedehead2 22nd May 2024, 07:02 PM

That didn’t go well for the Tories.

Posted by: Iz 🌟 22nd May 2024, 07:03 PM

So as for the start of this campaign... we all know the parties have been set in their ways for a long while and the result of this election is pretty much foregone? Or is it? I am sceptical that predictions of 500-seat Labour wipeouts will actually come to fruition but that's what the uniform swing is saying

Conservatives

Beaten, dishevelled, drowned rats escaping a sinking ship. I wouldn't be surprised if they barely try. Sunak's speech was certainly barely trying.

Labour

Genuinely the most sure-footed, confident Labour pre-election campaign I can remember. Obviously (from my view as a committed leftie) the Corbyn ones had a bit more substance to them but the confidence and the ability to reach out to people across the country seems to be doing Starmer's team very well. From media presentation and their own presentation they look in control and ready to take charge.

Other parties

Lib Dems probably in good form to come back in Home County like territory, I don't know yet if they're nailed on to outpace the Tories on seats but they have a chance. SNP possibly a bit wrongfooted by the July election but they've had their own problems anyway, will likely fall back significantly in Scotland. Green will go hard on winning Bristol and Brighton but probably won't get over the line in either now they won't have Lucas as an incumbent. Reform will dog the Tory vote in a few places but I really don't see at this early juncture them getting much, they haven't had enough time to build in as the 'real' right-wing lunatics.

anyway at the moment I see Labour landslide and not much else, as far as the state of play goes from the start.

Posted by: Silas 22nd May 2024, 07:13 PM

Let’s goooooooooooooooooooooo


Time to fire these c**ts into the sun

Posted by: Rooney 22nd May 2024, 07:21 PM

Seems fairly likely at this stage. Something has obviously changed over the last 48 hours.

RE Farage - imo he will likely re-join the Conservatives if someone like Braverman gets the Party Leader nod, or he will join Reform.

Posted by: Steve201 22nd May 2024, 08:06 PM

Makes more sense that than calling a poll now!

Posted by: Steve201 22nd May 2024, 08:09 PM

You do know the snp are set to be on like 19 seats?

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 22nd May 2024, 08:27 PM

Not a one party state! And last time, snp did brillianyly ... but we got blojo and hard brexshit... We need the tories gone. Wonder if we might get free movement and enter into the economic arwa soon?!

Posted by: Smint 22nd May 2024, 08:56 PM

What a day and a pitiful announcement. I'm not a huge fan of Starmer's Labour for all the reasons many of you are here but I hope to God that the Tories get knocked out something rotten. Even though I like his policies I personally don't go with the Owen Jones theory of "Shoe-in for Labour", vote for Green or Independent. There's been way too many disappointing evenings where the non Tory parties have knocked each other out to try and play the next move early. A lot of my leftist friends feel differently though. We do have to hope for proper tactical voting for Lib Dems in the posh South and West-country.

But can't see anything but Sunak's Tories being toast. Reform under Tice won't do much either. And I wouldn't expect a pre-election stunt that Farage's Brexit party did for Johnson in 2019. That worked well because of the characters involved and the actual prize of Brexit. It'd be interesting to see how the evil right wing press play this - will Murdoch's Sun and Times go (reluctantly) for Starmer? Will Mail and Telegraph so half hearted in on him as well - it's interesting that they really want to trip up the more unpredictable, naturally left wing and popular Angela Rayner instead. I think they'll go ultra hard on Labour after the election so it will be important to enjoy the night itself for what it is!

Glad that this is way before the US election so some of the tactics in play there which would be truly horrific won't be in place much for this election (although interesting to see how badly photo ID effects the outcome, I think a lowish turnout may supress that). Israel/Palestine could be significant - both in terms of Muslim voters abandoning Labour for George Galloway's party and independents but also in terms of whether there is lot of Zionist/Israeli propaganda in play a la Eurovision.

Posted by: Liam sota 22nd May 2024, 09:17 PM

https://x.com/christopherhope/status/1793382405203456276?s=46

Don't underestimate the possibility of this

Posted by: Hassaan 22nd May 2024, 09:21 PM

Hilariously throwing their toys out of the pram.

I am worried that the non Tory parties may split the vote.

Posted by: Jessie Where 22nd May 2024, 09:54 PM

View this post on Instagram

Hard to believe she's now on the good side these days!

Posted by: Scene 22nd May 2024, 09:56 PM

Carol waking up

Posted by: Silas 22nd May 2024, 10:00 PM

Meh we will see how it turns out but I expect a lot of indie supporters will stupidly vote for the red Tories. I don’t care, it’s not Holyrood, regardless it makes no difference to Scotland. So long as the Tories are gone

Posted by: Steve201 22nd May 2024, 10:17 PM

Some polls are suggesting they could be on 35 as well so as it’s FPTP a lot of seats will and are currently very close so let’s hope it’ll be nearer 40 than 20 and if Labour don’t get a huge majority (ie the tories reach 180 seats which would still be a landslide) then the snp could still do well.

I think it is important for projecting snp power!

Posted by: Rooney 22nd May 2024, 10:22 PM

Zero chance of this happening I'd say, plus looks like the author is an editor on GB News so he's probably talking to someone on the extreme fringes who doesnt see how these things work.

Posted by: Envoirment 22nd May 2024, 10:32 PM

So happy for the election to finally be called. And the way it was announced just sums up the last 14 years really.

Really impressed by the initial Labour campaign/response so far. I know Keir has been up and down the country visiting various businesses and such over the last few months in preperation for the election. I think that will pay off.

Looking forward to the manifestos being published.

Posted by: Scene 23rd May 2024, 06:21 AM

Me too Anyone know when they'll likely be out?

Posted by: Iz 🌟 23rd May 2024, 07:03 AM

Based on 2019, a couple of weeks before the vote they'll be out, so I'd guess middle of June.

Posted by: Scene 23rd May 2024, 07:18 AM

Ok good to know, thank you.

Posted by: Scene 23rd May 2024, 08:08 AM

Here we go

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/05/23/uk-election-rishi-sunak-conservative-party-world-war-putin/

Posted by: Steve201 23rd May 2024, 10:02 AM

Pretty sure the war has started already tbf!

Posted by: J00prstar 23rd May 2024, 10:28 AM

Saw that they might have timed it this way to avoid televised debate as the Euros will be on through all of June nearly every night on tv

Posted by: Steve201 23rd May 2024, 10:34 AM

I’d say it wouldn’t matter both will just say they haven’t agreed on the rules to avoid them. Starmer won’t want to have them to make mistakes although Rishi will avoid it would probably be a better idea for him albeit I think he would perform poorly.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 23rd May 2024, 10:39 AM

The televised debates aren't anywhere near as important as we all thought they would be after their introduction in 2010. Best plan is just to scrap them but neither party leader will feel confident suggesting that. We'll likely just get a BBC and an ITV one this time round - which is enough.

Posted by: Liam sota 23rd May 2024, 10:47 AM

They should do a 15 min debate on BBC1 at half-time of an England match

Posted by: Smint 23rd May 2024, 10:50 AM

Yep it's all a referendum on the Tories record. Tbh despite being an elections lover, I find the campaigning bit a bit dull - in some cases like May's 2017 disaster we could see a trend towards Labour (I think the good weather helped them as they could do more inspiring campaigning outdoors). But most times it doesn't make a difference - I don't see there being much of a change. Maybe a mini surge to the Greens/Indies if Palestine affects but I think even that is now priced in and the Locals shown it was a noticeable but not overall result affecting factor.

Posted by: Steve201 23rd May 2024, 10:59 AM

It’ll certainly effect a FPTP election though as some seats will be quite close

Posted by: Steve201 23rd May 2024, 12:14 PM

BBC coverage already pissing me off - the one o clock news showed it’s first coverage this afternoon showing the tories then Labour then thirdly Reform who have 1 seat ffs then the Lib Dem’s who have 17 seats?!

Posted by: Smint 23rd May 2024, 12:40 PM

I stopped paying for a licence fee for the reason they are so biased towards the right wing and could use my money on better things than supporting this agenda.

Posted by: Steve201 23rd May 2024, 01:02 PM

How did you stop paying if you own a tv?

Posted by: Smint 23rd May 2024, 01:18 PM

I never watch TV on any channel. I don't miss it tbh. If BBC wasn't biased so much may have considered keeping one.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 23rd May 2024, 02:08 PM

The strange thing is there news content being so skewed to the right when there dramas constantly pander to the far left.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 23rd May 2024, 02:31 PM

If the Tories are really planning to take this line their going to end up laughed out office....

https://x.com/PickardJE/status/1793547209037787230?

Posted by: Liam sota 23rd May 2024, 02:38 PM

Its pitiful how bad Rishi is its like he's subconsciously given up but it hasn't quite filtered through to the rest of him yet

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 23rd May 2024, 03:14 PM

"Far left"

Ahem ...how so?

I have seen 0 dramas railimg against neoliberalism? None against the evil Tories? We're not far left btw; we're moderate European left. We focus on economics btw...

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 23rd May 2024, 03:26 PM

Sunak taking questions from Conservative councillors posing as ordinary workers/voters. This is embarrassingly basic stuff to be getting so wrong.

https://bylinetimes.com/2024/05/23/rishi-sunak-staged-election-question-from-conservative-councillor-posing-as-ordinary-voter/

Posted by: Scene 23rd May 2024, 03:35 PM

Social media being productive for once the second link especially

Posted by: Steve201 23rd May 2024, 05:35 PM

And the first Question Time of the campaign has of course 2 tories In Tim Montgomery and MP Mark Spencer and also the lovely Bridget Phillipson for Labour and Daisy Cooper for the Lib Dem’s!

Posted by: Liam sota 23rd May 2024, 05:58 PM

https://x.com/politlcsuk/status/1793696325713994152?s=46

Sad levels of desperation.

Just now realised they paid Rwanda all that money for nothing. Calling an election you're certain to lose early meaning it'll be wasted money for sure just a further indication they're so wasteful with public funds.

The only silver lining for the Tories is that they've screwed up so bad Labour cannot do anything. The immigration topic will be insufferable and they won't be able to stop any boats or anything. There is literally no money, they owe so much, borrowed so much, wastec so much. Labour cant spend anything. So if the Tories get a charamatic leader and bank on Labour losing their own supporters by being Tory-lite or just restricted they have a chance next time round possibly

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 23rd May 2024, 05:59 PM

That's why if Labour is smart, they'll introduce pr and Levinson 2 immediately

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 23rd May 2024, 06:10 PM

Can't believe the Tories actually think re-instating Matt Hancock or Bob Stewart is in anyway a good look before going to the country and asking to be re-elected.

Two people who were kicked out the party for very good reasons and we now are expected to treat what they've done as okay.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 23rd May 2024, 06:15 PM

But you are right. Thr country rrslly does have no money left; Tories "spaffed" it all away, to use Blojo's words, and borrowing is so high, ans the economy has just rrcovered from being crashed by Truss, plus threm siphoning money off for thrmselves, their friends, especially during the virus, plus Brexshit... The Tories has a great economy after Labour. It was recovering well, due to Gordon Brown,xs plan, which was adopted WORLDWIDE!!! The public decided the Tories would have a brtter plan lol.

Posted by: Hassaan 23rd May 2024, 06:31 PM

Yet somehow I feel the Tories could sneak it if they tap into the right demographic. I.e. go even nastier.

Also, "a goodwill gesture"? What's even the point?

Posted by: Brett-Butler 23rd May 2024, 07:45 PM

I will go with the same prediction for this General Election that I made at the start of the year - that Labour will win the most seats & a working majority, but only just, meaning that they will rely on support from Lib Dems to get certain policies over the line whilst dealing with an "awkward squad" of around 10 MPs that dig their heels in at every turn. That's even with every opinion poll giving Labour a 20 point lead for the past 18 months - six weeks is a long time and things can change massively (there's no way that Reform will be anywhere near 5% in the polls come July), and in terms of where things stand I would only give credence to them in the week leading up to the election.

Of course I've been wrong in every Generation Election prediction I've made on here since 2015, so I'll probably be wrong again.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 23rd May 2024, 08:23 PM

Labour landslide, with Reform polling eell due to totslly disenchanted Tory voters/ UKIPers

Posted by: TheSnake 23rd May 2024, 08:33 PM

I think Reform will not do well at all though, most on the hard right wing will vote Conservative because the right wing media will tell them to (eg. 'a vote for Reform is a vote for Labour'), and becuase of the promise of the immigration Rwanda policy.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 23rd May 2024, 08:43 PM

Noo, the comments online from them are VERY anti Tory. They won't go to Laboue, so that leaves Reform.

Posted by: Steve201 23rd May 2024, 08:48 PM

I really don’t think it matters if Reform are on 7% or 17% it won’t stop a Labour win imo. It’s just weather it’s an extinction event or a 97 style landslide. Think it’s more likely to be the latter and the tories will get 150-190 seats. So confident I am is I would stick a new thread about who the Tory leader will be in the leadership election after this!

How many votes will the Social Democrats get Brett 😀?

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 23rd May 2024, 08:50 PM

I reckon the Tories are so clueless that they will now swing even more far right. Blojo will be back, or Suella, or Penny. Penny would be thr biggest threat electorally and not as extreme right

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 23rd May 2024, 08:53 PM

Many simply won't vote. Could be one of the lowest turnout elections in the modern era.

Posted by: Rooney 23rd May 2024, 08:55 PM

Yeah the local election data suggestions Reform are pulling voters away from the Conservatives. not Labour. Really different to UKIP who were pulling votes from both sides.

The Reform angle will be to try and win a couple if seats, then influence the Tories to move further to the Right.

Posted by: Envoirment 23rd May 2024, 08:58 PM

I wonder if the voter ID thing will cause lower turnout and potentially hurt the conservatives own voter base.

I personally think we might be surprised and see a fairly good/high turnout with how many people are fed up of the current government.

Hoping that tactical voting occurs to unseat many conservative MPs. Although I don't think that will happen as Labour will likely not agree a pact with the Lib Dems/Greens.

Posted by: Steve201 23rd May 2024, 09:22 PM

Let’s be honest they don’t need MPs to move the tories to the right the media and the party itself will continue to do that, Farage never got voted in to a British parliament ever and he’s had more influence than anyone in British politics in the past 40 years and he’s changed the Tory party already.

Posted by: Smint 23rd May 2024, 10:03 PM

Yes noticeably Farage has again chickened out at standing as an MP for Reform - doesn't want yet ANOTHER loss. Reform won't win any seats at all and will flop badly.

Posted by: Suedehead2 23rd May 2024, 10:14 PM

Tactical voting can happen without a formal pact. Voters can see for themselves who is best placed to defeat Tory MPs and opposition parties will concentrate their efforts on seats they can win. In my home county of Sussex (East and West), Labour will ignore Lewes and Eastbourne while the Lib Dems will do nothing in Crawley.

Posted by: Liam sota 24th May 2024, 06:42 AM

With reform I see them being 2nd/3rd a lot but not winning a seat and I don't think voters will care anymore if they cost Tories seats to labour etc

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 24th May 2024, 05:52 PM

https://x.com/PGMcNamara/status/1793702331961450798 still looking for candidates in 100 seats including my own with a 48 hour deadline. Many of them are Labour safe seats but you'd think you'd have candidates lined up before you call an election.

Posted by: Suedehead2 24th May 2024, 07:02 PM

John Redwood and Michael Gove have both joined the long list of Tory MPs who won’t be contesting the election. They, along with Dominic Raab, represent seats being targeted by the Lib Dems. That’s three potential Portillo moments gone.

Posted by: Steve201 24th May 2024, 07:07 PM

They’re just cowards!

Posted by: Mack. 24th May 2024, 07:08 PM

Gove again just being a wet blanket.

Posted by: Smint 24th May 2024, 07:57 PM

John Redwood seems to have been an MP since the dawn of time and he has been utterly loathsome on every issue ever especially hard Brexit. Really can't stand him. Good effing riddance

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 24th May 2024, 08:01 PM

Andrea Leadsom standing down as well now.

Posted by: Jessie Where 24th May 2024, 08:14 PM

To think that vile person was once a hair's breadth from becoming the PM

Posted by: Envoirment 24th May 2024, 08:21 PM

Can't wait to see all of those above out of the government *_* I hope even more don't stand and quit/retire.

Posted by: hinterland 24th May 2024, 08:25 PM

what a mess *____*

Posted by: Chez Wombat 24th May 2024, 08:27 PM

Rats fleeing a sinking ship if ever I saw one.

Posted by: Steve201 24th May 2024, 08:31 PM

It really annoys me that they won’t be judged in July like they should!

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 24th May 2024, 08:36 PM

They didn't even plan for an umbrella in the rain

Posted by: Steve201 24th May 2024, 08:36 PM

The 2019-24 parliament has been prorogued so the tories cannot legislate anymore terrible laws for hopefully at least 5 more years!

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 24th May 2024, 08:55 PM

OMG YES YES YES!!!!

No Rwanda flights, no morr nasty attacks on the nhs or people on pip, no more public money for their mates, it's done!!! It's done!!!! The nightmsre is finally over - hopefully forever, with younger genersrions waking up to how evil the Tories are? And ... wkth pr? Hint hint, Starmier!!

Also, still imcredibly illegal when Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dumb, the aristocratic eronian posh boys, went to prorogue parliament over brexshit!! Shocking, entitled, anti demoractic, rotten borough behaviour

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 24th May 2024, 08:59 PM

I've been numbed by enough general election campaigns (especially 2017 when Corbyn got close to meaningful change) not to count chickens on this one. There's a lot of people out their who will say to pollsters they're voting Labour and then vote Tory anyway sadly. The swing Labour needs is massive.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 24th May 2024, 09:03 PM

Tories are done. The far right have deserted them, so their brexshit coalition has collapsed from that alone. North has abandoned them. The northeast scabs who switched in the first place should be ASHAMED. All for a charlatan. The North should ALWAYS remember. Lib Dems will take their blur wall seats. Labour will tske back its rrd wall seats. What's left? Their strong older voting block has been torpedoed by their disgracrful brexshit ... policies, plus by voter id lsws...

Posted by: Steve201 24th May 2024, 09:13 PM

Fascinated to see how Scotland votes!

Posted by: Brer 24th May 2024, 10:01 PM

New Cassetteboy banger dropped x

(also lol at the announcement of no Rwanda flights before the election - with Labour looking very likely to win and promising to drop that scheme if they do (caveat: I know better than to assume Keir Starmer will stand by anything he promises), it looks like the whole Rwanda farce will be drawing to a hopefully final close with a grand outcome of exactly 0 flights. Not that I want there to be any flights but what an outrageous waste of money this whole thing was)

Posted by: Harve 24th May 2024, 10:34 PM

This was uploaded in 2008 and I cannot believe that Cassetteboy is gonna outlive 14 years of Tory government.

Posted by: ElectroBoy 25th May 2024, 08:43 AM

Yeah I’m still apprehensive/ sceptical about the Tory collapse and a Labour landslide. Would be great to see it happen, but I have little faith that the public will go that way

Hopefully they do and this will be one of the better election evenings.

Posted by: Doctor Blind 25th May 2024, 08:52 AM

That's actually not strictly true. I mean, it's the kind of thing that Kuenssberg has been saying however from reading the comments of psephologists it's probably only a 7-8 pt uniform swing required to give Labour a working majority this time round. I think the reason for that is that according to analysis of the 2024 local elections their vote is becoming more efficient. So for example, the swing from CON to LAB was greater in areas where the Conservatives had a much greater lead in 2019 whereas it is signficantly lower in areas where Labour won or had a large majority.



Some further analysis on this chart below which shows that during the late 1990s and early 2000s the Labour vote was so efficient that even had they polled lower than the Tories nationwide they'd have still got a majority.



Further to this we have the https://stopthetories.vote/ campaign supported by Carol Vorderman, which wants to reduce the Tories to ’30 to 40’ MPs.

In https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1993_Canadian_federal_election the Canadian Conservatives were reduced to just two (2) MPs with a new party called 'Reform' enjoying a surge in support splintering from the governing party and effectively removed and replaced the previous right wing Conservative party as the biggest in that parliament..

Posted by: Liam sota 25th May 2024, 09:13 AM

I got every election right including brexit but this one has no mystique I think pro-labour people etc have ptsd from previous elections there is no need to worry this will be a complete blowout and I'm sure the lib Dems will be closer in seats to the tories than the polls suggest too

Posted by: Iz 🌟 25th May 2024, 10:22 AM

I agree Doc Blind, the swing required is much less than people may think from looking at Labour's current relatively low count of ~200 MPs, and the idea that FPTP swings get exponentially more extreme is something that isn't quite intuitive just looking at seat numbers. Not that uniform swing can really be an exact simulation but due to where the parties are heading it's not too far off.

Every seat that Labour lost in 2019 was a seat that votes Labour by default in almost all circumstances that aren't political fatigue and encapturement by a conman (the Tory campaign then offered loads that they cannot offer now), which 2019 had and 2024 has nothing of, and in fact has so many scenarios more favourable to Labour. Pretty much all of the "Red Wall" is essentially back in Labour's camp already and I would be shocked if all of those don't immediately fall back bar the odd one that's trended into Hard Right territory so hard that Reform are challenging, but that sort of thing (e.g. Boston & Skegness, Castle Point) is rare and easily counterbalanced by the fact that many less urban seats across England are in play for Labour now. The sort of seat that got Tory 10k majorities in the last election all across southern and central England are going to be Labour targets and will be full of the middle class voters that the Tories have spent this parliament entirely ignoring and Labour have spent a fair amount of time courting. I expect the blue countryside will be so much less apparent than any election we're used to.

Posted by: Steve201 25th May 2024, 11:56 AM

Will the Palestinian conflict have any effect in a GE compared to the council elections?

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 25th May 2024, 12:12 PM

It might cost Labour a handful of seats in areas with high Muslim populations but aside from that it's likely to make a minor difference.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 26th May 2024, 01:44 PM

Looking at how badly the Tory campaign has been going and how high Labour are polling I really think we could see Labour take more than 50% of the vote. The last time any party managed that was the Conservative's in 1931 with 55.0% of the vote. The Conservatives also managed it in 1900 with 50.2% of the vote.

Posted by: Steve201 26th May 2024, 02:01 PM

In 1931 though they had a National government with national liberals and nationa Labour MPs so 1900 is a better example although even then they had taken part of the liberal party onto them!

Posted by: Scene 27th May 2024, 09:05 AM

Keir Starmer is delivering first major speech of GE. Live coverage on Sky News.

Posted by: Iz 🌟 27th May 2024, 10:32 AM

Based on this, which is familiar with what Starmer was sending up in the months prior so not too much new there; I am encouraged by the message discipline from Labour thus far, in great contrast to the Tory mess. The themes of security are pretty good for staving off attack lines without in my view going too far away from left-wing views on such. It's far less draconian and weirdly evil than the Tory line on immigration, stopping illegal immigration for the migrants' own sake with effective ways to do it, recognising the horrors in Gaza without promising any power that he does not have to unilaterally stop it. Not perfect, but a good contrast for the campaign.

Posted by: Liam sota 27th May 2024, 03:39 PM

😂😂😂https://x.com/politlcsuk/status/1795112013183471799?s=46

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 27th May 2024, 03:44 PM

Jesus Christ. Also I'm not sure she's going to be the last to do this, next few days could be interesting.


Meanwhile Starmer says that he'd tell Netanyhu to stop - like that is any way a realistically likely tactic to work. There's some stuff he should just keep his mouth shut on.

Do you ever feel like your choosing between dog shit or cat shit when it comes to choosing a PM?

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 27th May 2024, 03:49 PM

No sooner have I said that and see Nick Fletcher has backed Lee Anderson

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-68787921

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 27th May 2024, 04:49 PM

Tories now revealed that teenagers would be jailed for not attending!!

Posted by: Hassaan 27th May 2024, 05:03 PM

I mean, if Reform just splits the Tory vote, that's a positive, surely?

The Tories winning in 2019 was awful but I can see why they did. The Brexit thing definitely helped. They have nothing like that this time round.

Posted by: Hassaan 27th May 2024, 05:04 PM

They're like cartoon villains. Hard to imagine we ever took them seriously.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 27th May 2024, 05:11 PM

In what prison space? We're letting lags out early as we speak cos the system is full to bursting, where exactly are all these teenagers going to go?

Posted by: Steve201 27th May 2024, 05:53 PM

Give it 5-10 years and they’ll be back knowing the English electorate!

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 27th May 2024, 05:53 PM

They'd have to let thr swrious offenders out to get the teenagwrs in :rodl: Maximum punishment for not obeyong their Tory overlords! For the plebs only, of course.

Posted by: Steve201 27th May 2024, 05:54 PM

They said it wouldn’t be compulsory!

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 27th May 2024, 05:55 PM

They also said no leaving the single market, as it would be madness, and they said no 2nd and 3rd lockdowns etc etc. Lying toads!!!

Posted by: Liam sota 28th May 2024, 08:32 AM

That's what I see happening. Reform genuinely costing Tories usually safe seats but not winning many if any themselves. I wouldn't even say the Tories getting under 100 seats is off the table just yet

Posted by: Herbs 28th May 2024, 08:38 AM

So Tories have already revealed their National Service plans and now a tax advantage that will benefit pensioners.

Are they just going for/relying on the older voter?

Wouldn't surprise me if they now go for some anti-LGBTQIA items.....

Posted by: Scene 28th May 2024, 09:11 AM

Thought I'd copy and paste this from another forum as might be helpful as a reminder of key dates. Maybe could be added to OP.

30th May - Parliament dissolved
5th-16th June - Party manifestos expected to be published (based on stats on past elections)
7th June - Deadline for candidate nominations
18th June - Deadline for new voter registrations
19th June - Deadline for new postal vote applications
26th June - Deadline for new proxy vote applications and voter authority certificates
4th July - Polling day. Emergency proxy votes deadline 5pm. Polls 7am-10pm.

Posted by: J00prstar 28th May 2024, 09:29 AM

Looking forward to the Pensioner's Party being dead and buried at the polls.

It shouldn't even be allowed that they can just use the tax payments of an entire country to ringfence a single demographic while leaving everyon else to suffer.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 28th May 2024, 10:03 AM

Added to the OP.

Posted by: Herbs 28th May 2024, 10:14 AM

Anyone else have family members proudly defecting from Conservative to Reform?

TBH anything that dilutes the vote for both parties can only be a good thing......(although I will still argue a toss with them if they express certain views)

Posted by: Scene 28th May 2024, 10:16 AM

My dad is very much in the camp of remaining with Tories but then any thought of change is scary to him lol “better the devil you know etc” but luckily he doesn’t bother to vote

Posted by: Herbs 28th May 2024, 10:20 AM

My dad was similar. Although weirdly he had some conservative views, but refused to vote for them (he came from a farming background, passionately hated Maggie Thatcher and that never shook)

Posted by: Scene 28th May 2024, 10:25 AM

Strange though as my parents were both very Labour when I was a kid, but now both swing towards the Tories (worth mentioning they’ve been separated for 20 years so wouldn’t have been influenced by each other). Makes me worried it’s a natural progression of life.

Posted by: Herbs 28th May 2024, 10:33 AM

Yeah mine claimed they were both Lib Dems (I question that now, especially with my mum)

I have heard that some people do steer more towards conservative views as they get older

I also think though that the population above 50 have seen quite major changes since they were children (e.g. society has become more diverse, people previously hidden away are now visible etc) and there has been some backlash towards that. I don't necessarily think that will happen as much with future generations, especially as I get the impression that the younger generation are coming through a lot more tolerant and accepting of difference

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 28th May 2024, 11:30 AM

It's generally thought that once you own your home you're more likely to vote Tory. You usually do this at an older age, but that age has been getting older and older over the past few years.

Posted by: Liam sota 28th May 2024, 12:14 PM

This is the problem with Labour to me. They’re not liked in general, Starmer most people don’t like him but they generally don’t dislike him enough which is a positive BUT this election is on a plate so why would people do things like this? https://x.com/jonashworth/status/1795112597332615662?s=46 it seems small but it’s the type of thing that will remind people why they don’t like Labour. For me it’s the fakeness of it. They act like they’re working class for the people party when they’re just not at all. I really wish they would just say little and stick to being lukewarm and they win big by a mile. If they actually show their true colours they could easy mess this up and end up with 100+ less seats

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 28th May 2024, 12:18 PM

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cv22px91700o

Clive Myrie and Laura Kuensburg to present the election night coverage for the BBC. Hopefully they're sensible and get Myrie to do the exit poll announcement rather than Kuensburg. Also hopefully means the next election they can quietly drop Kuensburg and give it to Myrie.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 28th May 2024, 12:21 PM

Especially as thousands of Labour voters- including myself - were probably were 'picked last at school'. It's just such a petty think to do - everybody has rightly criticised the pettiness from the Tories with 'sleepy Kier' it just seems stupid for senior Labour figures to be engaging in this American style nonsense. Nobody expects politicians to be good footballers.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 28th May 2024, 01:03 PM

I was reasing an article where TWO TEENAGERS! werw against , ans thw rest were all for it. They were air cadets ans young Tories. Anyone would think teenagers were divides on it. Then I realised ... it was a BBTory article. Even on ideas where the majority are DEAD SET AGAINST IR, they have to make it sound like itt's all up for debate and 50/50, and, of course, they have to peotect their Tory overlords at all costs. Shockingly bad broadcaster.

Posted by: Steve201 28th May 2024, 01:56 PM

Myrie is really good imo, always calm under pressure.

Plus his surname changes to Kylie when I type it in here 😆

Posted by: Steve201 28th May 2024, 01:58 PM

I don’t think Starmers Labour pretend at all to stand for the working classes they are very much after the middle classss and are the middle class.

Makes you wonder why people moved from Labour in 2010 when they are offering again what’s on offer now and the tories weren’t popular in 2010 considering the playing field. They only won majorities when brexit became a thing!

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 28th May 2024, 02:35 PM

100% this!!

The problem now is disingenuous Labour Blairites and EXTREME centrists can now claim that centrism eins and right wing wins. But ... Corbyn's policies were WILDLY populsr. Taking that mrssage to the people, he was 2k votss fron beating Mad May, after starting off on like 15%!! What happened was the entire British establishment, plus the extreme centrists in Labour, sabotaged him all together and made him hated tbf we can take solace from the fact that thr pandemic started months later. Whilst Corbyn would have been 100x brtter than Blojo the Etonian cloen, a circus of British class system and cap doffin failures, what he wanted to do ... he wouldn't havr bern able to, mostly, due to the pandemic and aftershocks of it PLUS thr Brexshit mess.

Posted by: Hassaan 28th May 2024, 02:49 PM

I'm not sure what Starmer is going for. Is he trying to be a nicer version of the Tories to win votes?

They could go aggressively the other way (and being basically the opposite of the Tories) but many would argue that wouldn't win votes.

I do think childish behaviour on social media doesn't help though. There's so many things to criticise Sunak for than his footballing skills.

Posted by: Rooney 28th May 2024, 02:58 PM

Not sure really- the definition of working class doesn’t really exist anymore and neither does the middle class. It’s such a broad spectrum these days, you’ve lots of people on traditional working class jobs that comfortably earn near 40% rates and likewise you have plenty of traditional white colllar office jobs that pay just above the Living Wage. I think this whole “not working for the working class” is nonsense, they clearly do, but they’ll clearly let corporate business influence them too, hopefully leading to the best of both worlds allowing the economy and quality of life to flourish.

Feels stupid to pick on Rishi for his football skills too, agree, that’s not needed and no need to stoop to that level imo.

Posted by: Liam sota 28th May 2024, 03:28 PM

I don’t even mind mocking rishi it was the tone, like it was a bullying type vibe, he gets picked last ha ha ha. A lot of people have horrible school experiences of being picked last and being terrible and most of them are the ones labour generally claim to stand up for. It’s a totally unnecessary angle to come from when your only chance of not winning comfortably is doing things like that.

So here’s something that is interesting at 5pm a big poll is coming out

https://x.com/redfieldwilton/status/1795394583934755154?s=46

Then I seen this tweet from guido who is more close to Tories https://x.com/guidofawkes/status/1795462783464562721?s=46

So I imagine they’re related and it’s the first poll since the whole national service thing which I did think might help the Tories because it’s a more popular policy than it seems and the sheer disdain for it will always create a backlash among people who actually like it, so even though it’s a BS fairytale policy it can make people go back to saying they’ll be pro Tory but let’s see hopefully it’s not too much of a change

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 28th May 2024, 03:47 PM

It covers over the weekend - so likely both before and after the national service announcement. Might be the case the Tories get a small bump in this only to lose it in polls conducted after it. I think everybody with an ounce of common sense knows the polls will narrow but it's unlikely to be enough to overturn Labour's lead.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 28th May 2024, 04:03 PM

It's a 23% lead for Labour (Lab 46% Con 23% REF 13% LD 9% GRN 5%).

If that's the good Tory poll what the hell are the bad ones gonna look like?

Posted by: ElectroBoy 28th May 2024, 04:11 PM

Posted by: Scene 28th May 2024, 04:22 PM

Reform's spike in popularity on that graph

Posted by: Brett-Butler 28th May 2024, 05:38 PM

In other news, Liberal Democrat leader Ed Davey obviously forgot to heed the advice not to get involved in any photo-op that could lead to embarrassment -

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 28th May 2024, 05:40 PM

What is it with all these neoliberal party leaders getting soggy this election?!

Posted by: Envoirment 28th May 2024, 06:12 PM

So much for that poll being positive news for the Tories.

I just want the manifestos to be released already. Labour seem to be going the ways of popular policies with acceptable ways of getting there such as renationalisation of the railways, likely renationalising energy and I'm hoping they will also go the way of renationalising water too.

And I do agree about the comment of Labour MPs should stay fairly quiet/not criticise unless being attacked directly by the conservatives. Although what always frustrates me is that people will use a magnifying glass for labour and say "Rishi is being picked on" and causing an issue with Labour. However, those very same people will defend racist/homophobic/transphobic/misogynistic statesments from conservatives MPs saying things along the lines of "they're entitled to their opinions"

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 28th May 2024, 06:18 PM

The energy plans have already been announced by Labour and they don't include the renationalisation of energy - rather setting up a state company. The private sector would still operate. I remember being disappointed when it was announced. The rail nationalisation policy is also very weak - it'll take years before all train companies are brought into public ownership.

Posted by: Envoirment 28th May 2024, 06:28 PM

Thanks, I'll have a read through the energy plans. Although the exact detail won't be until we get the manifestos.

I don't think the rail nationalisation policy is very weak. It makes sense to only renationalise when contracts expire over the next 5 years or so. Otherwise it will cost the government an arm and a leg which it doesn't have to spend currently. It'll also allow British rail to build up overtime, reducing risk of disruption from trying to take public ownership of all railways at once.

It'll also likely mean contractual changes/new pay system being established for all railway staff and trying to negotiate/sort that out will take time. So better to do it in increments as the various contracts expire as opposed to all at once.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 28th May 2024, 06:30 PM

Corbyn was going to do the same with rsil. It makes sense.

Posted by: Steve201 28th May 2024, 07:48 PM

What is it with these ‘State Companies’ they come up with now, just nationalise them please!

Agree with the rail policies!

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 29th May 2024, 10:15 AM

First TV debate confirmed. ITV on the 4th June - at 9pm for some ridiculous reason. Moderated by Julie Etchingham.

Wasn't going to watch but certainly not going to watch it that late at night.

Posted by: ElectroBoy 29th May 2024, 10:21 AM

I'm going to swerve the tv 'debates'

Watching Sunak just saying the same endless gaslighting sh!te will just annoy me

Posted by: Liam sota 29th May 2024, 10:32 AM

These polls have been horrendous for the Tories some showing 60% of under 50’s voting Labour and less than 10% Tories. If Starmer wins the debates too it really could be a pretty ugly number for the Tories. And quite frankly I can’t see Rishi being good at debates I think they’ll overtrain him and he will keep repeating himself

Posted by: Steve201 29th May 2024, 10:35 AM

He’s not too bad at PMQs tbf but comes across as a bit nasty when slabbering about the Labour Party which won’t look good when he’s on the tv debates with no tories behind him baying along.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 29th May 2024, 10:42 AM

YouGov had a poll on the debates yesterday and only 33% were actually interested in watching the debates. Don't think they're going to be a factor like they were in 2010

https://x.com/YouGov/status/1795495808554385420

Posted by: ElectroBoy 29th May 2024, 10:49 AM

I don't think they have much of an impact anyway. Nick Clegg became popular during the course of them, but didn't help the Lib Dems come the election night.

Posted by: ElectroBoy 29th May 2024, 10:51 AM

Posted by: Scene 29th May 2024, 11:27 AM

Good for the opposition/Labour I guess.

I’ll definitely be watching the debates. though worried everyone will just pile-on against Labour…

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 29th May 2024, 12:16 PM

It's a Sunak v Starmer head to head this time round by the looks of it so less chance of a pile on.

Posted by: Scene 29th May 2024, 12:49 PM

Definitely watching then!

Posted by: T Boy 29th May 2024, 01:24 PM

I don’t really see the point of watching a debate if you already know who you’re voting for and who you’re not voting for. There is nothing Sunak can do or say that will make me decide to vote Tory.

Posted by: Hassaan 29th May 2024, 02:12 PM

I don't know if I'll watch it but it'll be worth it to see Sunak put his foot in it and to see Starmer (hopefully) expose his weaknesses.

Posted by: J00prstar 29th May 2024, 02:15 PM

Just to note in here on the subject of Sunak talking about stopping universities from being able to teach 'useless' degrees...

Looking at the last 4 PMs -

Sunak, Truss, and Cameron all studied philosophy, while Boris did Classics.

Not a STEM in sight.

Posted by: hinterland 29th May 2024, 02:21 PM

surely in this instance people are most likely to watch the debates to laugh at Sunak as opposed to help them inform their decision on who to vote for :,) I very much doubt many viewers will go into the debate still on the fence

Posted by: T Boy 29th May 2024, 04:46 PM

I’m too busy to laugh at Sunak. I don’t find him at all funny. This should be politics not entertainment. People conflating the two is the reason why the last five years in particular have been an absolute nightmare to live through. But I guess as long as people get their lols.

Posted by: Scene 29th May 2024, 04:54 PM

I think there’s more to watching it than for entertainment or to decide. I know I’m voting Labour but I want to keep up to date with their speeches to get an idea of how well they come across etc. Starmer and Reeves have been great so far from what I’ve seen. Very assured, no dithering or dodging questions, but I want to see how he does in a debate scenario.

Posted by: Harve 29th May 2024, 05:05 PM

I was deliberating because a Tory wipeout would be soooo funny and it would be cool to be part of that but I just can't vote for a party which bars Diane Abbott while welcoming Rosie Duffield or Natalie Elphicke.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 29th May 2024, 05:10 PM

Dianne Abbot isn't being barred from standing!

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 29th May 2024, 05:37 PM

Preach!!! We shouldn't even have debates, especially with our class system infiltrating everything, including the media. This isn't the USA.

Posted by: Doctor Blind 29th May 2024, 05:43 PM

I'm pretty disgusted with the way that Diane Abbott has been treated. The whole process has been designed to humiliate and belittle her as much as possible, ignoring how much of a contribution she has made over her long career, and how much of an icon and pioneering politician that she was.

As Adam Bienkov says 'It's hard to avoid the conclusion that if Diane Abbott had been from the same faction of the Labour party as Keir Starmer then her treatment over the past year would have been very different'

Anyway, given the video below canvessing opinions in her constituency of Hackney North and Stoke Newington, I believe that she should stand as an independent anyway like Jeremy Corbyn is.

Posted by: Suedehead2 29th May 2024, 05:46 PM

I refuse to watch the debates if only two leaders are invited.

Meanwhile, Lloyd Russell-Moyle, my MP, has been suspended by the Labour Party which means he can’t be a Labour candidate. We’ll see who the party high command impose as a candidate.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 29th May 2024, 06:00 PM

Looking at the ITV schedule it looks like the other party leaders will be interviewed/invited to comment in a programme straight after the debate - presumably the only way to get round impartiality rules for the election and still have a head to head debate between our potential future PMs.

On another note - I live in what would be considered a very safe Labour constituency - they'd win without any campaigning - but my MP still looks to be doing the door knocking side of things from a leaflet dropped through today while I was out. Looks like they're taking nothing for granted.

Posted by: Suedehead2 29th May 2024, 06:10 PM

How far are you from a marginal seat? If there is nowhere reasonably close to send activists, they will be encouraged to work in your constituency.

Posted by: Iz 🌟 29th May 2024, 08:12 PM

Pretty bad day for Labour to have deselection fights with left-wing MPs showing up. Factionalism from the likes of Streeting is them doing their best to sabotage the party's chances while trying to block any left-wing voices in the next Parliament. Abbott's been treated awfully.

I hope that comes up during the debate.

Posted by: Rooney 29th May 2024, 08:27 PM

It will all be forgotten about shortly. To be honest, this just shows why Labour HQ have decided to not select Abbott. Leaked her side to the media to cause hostility. Why would you have someone as an MP who is vocally hostile to the current leader and breaks protocol on a regular basis? No doubt she has had a great career and to be the first elected black MP is fantastic, but her views are so out of sync with the Labour Party at times, she's a liability unfortunately. Not sure they are alientating the views on the Left, I'd suggest they're more alienating the Corbyn loyalists. Not sure her de-selection has been handled in the best way, as it appears someone has leaked something, which is what is causing the backlash now rather than the retirement and seat in the Lords.

Posted by: Steve201 29th May 2024, 09:07 PM

There’s usually seperate debates for the smaller parties. No point in having Sunak and Starmer and 5 other leaders who have a total of 50 MPs altogether

What was he suspended for? Know he’s left wing so probably that!

Posted by: Liam sota 29th May 2024, 09:12 PM

Shows his selfish Diane Abbott is really to cause all this mess at such a crucial time

Posted by: Steve201 29th May 2024, 09:12 PM

I honestly don’t know where to start with this centrist bias. The sentence when you said ‘shows why Labour HQ have decided not to select her’ says it all really!

Posted by: Jessie Where 29th May 2024, 09:46 PM

This is basically what he's said about it:

View this post on Instagram

Posted by: Steve201 29th May 2024, 10:59 PM

This storm is growing as the day goes on for Starmer - Faiza Shaheen now is not being allowed to run in Chingford, one of the few seats that Labour increased their vote in in 2019 again on spurious claims of previous likes on Twitter.

Imagine these purges were happening under a left wing leader 🤔

Posted by: Scene 29th May 2024, 11:10 PM

I just hope the public remember through all the pre-election media the last 14 years of government. It’s a big ask.

Posted by: Iz 🌟 29th May 2024, 11:25 PM

I remember Faiza from 2019, she should have beaten IDS then, I was pleased to see she'd been selected again and now, the Labour Party's giving up on one of its most promising advocates apparently for liking a tweet, meanwhile selecting Luke Akehurst, a despicable pro-Israel character with no shortage of dodgy tweets online over the years.

It's not so much its effect on Labour's chances I'm concerned with, but the governance afterward. The PLP is going to be huge and it seems mostly aligned with Starmer, with very little input from the left, which the country really really needs after years of right of centre governance. This is very clearly about purging any left MP they can get away with, meaning there will be fewer advocates to push Labour left in government. The most important moments in British politics are decided in backroom selection processes and the Labour leadership are ideologically controlling them so no left thoughts emerge again even as the country seems to be demanding it for the first election cycle in years.

Abbott I could understand, even as I wish her the best in protecting her legacy, but adding in Shaheen, Russell Moyle, Begum, it's a miracle Zarah Sultana and Nadia Whittome still seem to be selected, we hope.



I think it's very clearly the Labour leadership messing her about that's caused this, they could have finished all this process up months ago and gave her good concessions like letting her retire and promising an ideologically similar successor if they were willing to work with her for the good of Hackney, but they definitely have not done that.

Posted by: Rooney 29th May 2024, 11:44 PM

Broken loads of rules, liked racist material, already on a warning allegedly and decides to endorse Green candidates. I don't think it matters what your political views are, you can't endorse other Party candidates. I'd say it's either incredibly stupid from her or she knew what she was doing and she's looking for something else or become a political martyr.

Posted by: Steve201 29th May 2024, 11:56 PM

And yet Natalie Elphick was welcomed opened arms!

Posted by: Steve201 30th May 2024, 12:00 AM

The material in question she liked was from the John Stewart show in America - clearly the centre of anti semetism in liberal America!

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 30th May 2024, 06:20 AM

I think it's endorsing Green candidates that's the issue. Starmer rightly called on Sunak to get rid of Lucy Allan for endorsing Reform, he kind of has to show the same principles.

I doubt this or the Abbot stuff will have a massive effect on polling but we'll see in a few days.

Posted by: Steve201 30th May 2024, 06:54 AM

She liked these Green tweets when she wasn’t even in the party.

As I said Natalie Elphick literally was in a different party until a few weeks ago and she was one of the right wing populists in the party before even going into the claims about her partner. Surely that’s much worse….

Posted by: hinterland 30th May 2024, 07:06 AM

and indeed it would be if our nation had not initially voted in a laughing stock ~5 years ago/voted Conservative in 2017... all of it is laughable, neither party are fit to run the country, both are complicit in a genocide to varying degrees. these are two men, neither of whom are in touch with the needs of British people + indeed the action necessary regarding various global conflicts

you may be too busy to laugh (whatever that means, I'm busy too but still have the time to acknowledge the sheer misery of this whole situation), but I cannot help but laugh in despair that we went from nearly voting in Corbyn six years ago to being stuck with Sunak or Starmer in 2024

Posted by: blacksquare 30th May 2024, 07:19 AM

Luke Akehurst being parachuted into a safe seat says everything about this rendition of Labour and their views on racism. It's also truly laughable to suggest anything other than pure factionalism when Neil Coyle has been reselected.

Posted by: Liam sota 30th May 2024, 07:23 AM

Pretty clear they dont want her standing, pretty clear she never had any intention of relinquishing power. After that it's all posturing. She'll always manage to make herself the victim but she's suddenly whipped up a frenzy purely because she wants pressure so she can keep power even if it costs labour tons of support/votes this is clearly selfish given she's been there forever and her area is one of the worst in London by a mile. Her & Corbyn had power for decades and both are ancient and they can't let go. Let new people have a chance, it shouldn't be a lifetime role especially when you're a net loss for your party in terms of support and votes.

Posted by: hinterland 30th May 2024, 07:48 AM

this is why I'm becoming increasingly critical of people's sentiments of voting for labour simply 'because they're better than the tories' ... oh to be in such a privileged position where you convince yourself you're acting for the good of the common man by voting for a party that still actively condone a literal genocide

Posted by: Iz 🌟 30th May 2024, 08:06 AM

It's also pretty privileged to expect people to use their vote inefficiently - for all the shit that the Labour Right are doing the party in power will improve outcomes for people far more than the Tories. That will positively affect people and people should vote for that if Labour is the most realistic progressive option where they live.

though I would draw the line if I lived in North Durham or some similar area where the Labour candidate was a ghoul.

Posted by: Steve201 30th May 2024, 08:44 AM

Exactly I would say Akehurst has been to Tel Aviv more than Durham!

Posted by: Steve201 30th May 2024, 08:46 AM

Your acting as if she’s some kind of dictator, she’s an elected mp for 40 years, she must be doing something right?

Posted by: hinterland 30th May 2024, 09:05 AM

indeed, however it is a travesty that we must take it as a foregone conclusion that so many people are unwilling to do their research and realise how morally questionable the Labour Party is in 2024 + therefore it becomes necessary for some politically educated people to vote for labour as they’re the only realistic alternative to the Tories.

i long for the day Green becomes a feasible option in more areas than just Bristol and Brighton. my neighbourhood in Birmingham had Green second in the local election behind labour, but is mostly made up of reasonably well-educated young professionals/creatives. in so many working class areas across Britain political literacy is so poor - through no fault of their own, mind - that an alternative to red or blue seems an impossibility in the near future. it is saddening

Posted by: Rooney 30th May 2024, 09:53 AM

Morally questionable Labour in 2024.. there’s plenty of morally questionable people in politics. You’ve got plenty of people in one wing of Labour who deny massacres in former Yugoslavia. Point is, politics is full of people with questionable views, you’ve just got to support the best of the bad bunch. The U.K. has been centrist for 80 odd years and the moment a party battles further to the right or the left they lose a lot of votes.

Posted by: spiceboy 30th May 2024, 10:04 AM

Really poor choice of wording tbh.

Posted by: T Boy 30th May 2024, 10:27 AM

I have some massive issues with parts of the current Labour Party but unfortunately I’m resigned to voting for them anyway. I want them to be better but this election is all about getting the Tories out whatever it takes. We can deal with the issues in Labour once that is done. Unfortunately, any more years of Conservative government is not worth risking just because Labour aren’t as great as we’d like.

Posted by: hinterland 30th May 2024, 10:35 AM

how, there are a fair few current labour MP's that will condone Israel's current interventions in Gaza. and I would call the killing of >10,000 innocent families/children a genocide

Posted by: hinterland 30th May 2024, 10:39 AM

very true, I wish the circumstances were different but ultimately a Labour government will produce some degree of positive change in Britain, whether that's substantial or minor we shall have to wait and see (and hope!)

Posted by: Scene 30th May 2024, 12:03 PM

This could be a disaster for the Tories in my county.

https://www.kentlive.news/news/kent-news/conservatives-forecast-lose-11-kent-9310553.amp

Last election they won 16 out of 17 seats.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 30th May 2024, 12:25 PM

From the greatest politivian and party since attlee to ... this greta british public strikes again!

Posted by: Liam sota 30th May 2024, 12:39 PM

I'm not sure we will get any good change but you have to have some punishment for being terrible so the Tories deserve to be wiped out and I don't really care who by as long as they get wiped out. Those Corbyn fanatics need to face reality they had power and two elections all they did was give Boris a super majority. They had their chance. Try it again with someone younger and fresher or with less baggage if you must but going on and on about Corbyn or his old clique us just redundant, they're old news. And if you want the truth he is a really miserable old man a family member has a club that goes through his office and he would be the most unnecessary rudest person you could be about it every single time. Don't let politics distort someones real image, he is a miserable bitter old man I promise you. Now Starmer I believe he lives on the next street from me and while I don't care for him by all accounts him and his family are pleasant people. I think this stuff matters, you have to be actually nice not I'm standing up for the oppressed so I'm great but bitter and cranky every other minute if the day

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 30th May 2024, 01:23 PM

WROOONG!!!

Sabotaged by the entire British neolib state plus party apparatus, as soon as they saw how popular he was in 2017. Thatw as our knly chance. It's not a REAL democracy you see.

Posted by: Jessie Where 30th May 2024, 01:24 PM

My Labour MP (Florence Eshalomi) is absolutely excellent so for that reason I'll have no qualms voting Labour (whereas the previous constituency MP Kate Hoey, I couldn't see myself putting an X beside her name )

In 2019 Labour won with a 19,000 majority in my constituency so we're pretty safe.

Posted by: T Boy 30th May 2024, 01:47 PM

Well, my family member interviewed both Corbyn and Johnson on their visits to Wales in Summer 2019 and told me Johnson was pretty idiotic and narcissistic and Corbyn was interested and knowledgeable about the local issues as well as being very friendly. Who on Earth should we believe?

Starmer doesn’t appear to be very nice at the moment. He should probably work on that.

Posted by: hinterland 30th May 2024, 02:17 PM

Corbyn has always struck me as a genuine, honest and good-natured individual.

the phrase 'miserable bitter old man' seems a charged statement as opposed to a constructive one, anyway...

Posted by: Jessie Where 30th May 2024, 03:06 PM

I mean, anyone could say "I have a family member that knows him"

This is why they say you shouldn't believe everything you read online

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 30th May 2024, 03:06 PM

100%

One is bitter evil and mendacious, a liar a conman a cheat, untalented, thick af and nasty nasty nasty. I have heard stories of him and he is never pleasant in any. One he made v bad comments about a person over and over again, in a posh schoolboy kind of wya. That's Blojo.

The other is a conpassionate gardener.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 30th May 2024, 06:22 PM

Another Conservative MP has decided to back Labour.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cd11kvk1je4o

Posted by: Steve201 30th May 2024, 08:13 PM

Ugh you must be in Vauxhall that was Hoeys old seat - she’s as bigoted as you get, shows how people can just chose a party in the Uk and not have any alignment at all.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 31st May 2024, 09:37 AM

Iain Dale abandons his attempt to become an MP after a clip of him slagging off the constituency he was going to run in goes viral.

https://x.com/RupertMyers/status/1795898114160681071

Posted by: Scene 31st May 2024, 03:34 PM

Diane Abbott can stand as Labour MP now, apparently

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 31st May 2024, 03:37 PM

I think this might be the first thing of the campaign to move the needle away from Labour - only by a few points though.

Posted by: Liam sota 31st May 2024, 03:58 PM

I think he managed to make the wrong decision on Diane, that Muslim woman and that Luke guy. All three should have been the opposite but don’t think it’ll make much of a difference. Kind of had no choice on Diane once his deputy said she should be allowed to run.

Posted by: Liam sota 31st May 2024, 04:44 PM

Rishi is actually hilarious I’m sorry

https://x.com/bestforbritain/status/1796565060892147762?s=46

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 31st May 2024, 04:53 PM

He just has no understanding of how to communicate with ordinary people.

It's not funny any more knowing this guy runs the country. Hopefully not much longer though. This election is gonna be a bloodbath for the Tories.

Posted by: Chez Wombat 31st May 2024, 05:41 PM

You can Google her name. Please avoid language like this, it's got very negative implications even if not meant.

There doesn't seem any valid reason Diane shouldn't be allowed to run apart from the fact that she doesn't fit in the centre of the party and the media don't like her (I'm not saying she's not said silly things, but she has apologised for it), especially as the investigation was cleared many months ago and wasn't reported. Her treatment is a really nasty representation of the institutional racism in the media and parliament, so many white men have done worse or similar yet got off completely scot-free...

Anyway, can Labour just get on with actually stating what they are gonna do to improve things and stop with this faction shit, this is media space that does not need to be taken up even with the lead they have.

Posted by: Hassaan 31st May 2024, 05:50 PM

It would probably be fair to say that Boris Johnson has done and said way worse, yet he gets the "he's just trying his best" treatment.

Posted by: Scene 31st May 2024, 06:35 PM

So he had enough time to stop for a photo but at soon as the guy challenged him, he was in a rush to leave seriously though, maybe he should do a year’s volunteering before enforcing it on others! I wait for the moment someone challenges him with that directly.

Posted by: Steve201 31st May 2024, 06:36 PM

I think we all know the media and everyone else make Labour as a party have much higher standards to set than the tories - I mean how many questions do the tories get about how they are going to pay for things?

Posted by: Steve201 31st May 2024, 06:38 PM

this! He can’t even debate with a teenager! They are all so scared of getting that moment caught on camera!

Posted by: Jessie Where 31st May 2024, 06:57 PM

I personally don't see how that's "funny", it just shows so transparently what an absolute dickweed he is.

Posted by: Iz 🌟 31st May 2024, 07:00 PM

On the contrary, this is the first good move (wr to relations with Labour's left flank) he's done in this campaign, it shuts it down as a talking point (should have been done ages ago) and shows the left that there is not necessarily a full purge. Just needs to apologise to the VERY HIGHLY QUALIFIED Faiza Shaheen and let her stand too.

Some of Labour's target seats (as in one volunteers are being directed towards) are ones you'd expect to be very safe for them, but they have a large percentage of Muslim and South Asian voters and so are in danger of losing votes. The party's starting to develop an awareness of tactics, and it's good because they need to shore up these votes less they make themselves vulnerable to losing hard in 2029.

Posted by: Smint 31st May 2024, 07:35 PM

Good on Angela Rayner (who also was cleared herself of the ultra dull trumped up Tory/Fail/Dan bloody Hodges expense scandal) for speaking up for Abbot. What a sorry episode it was and shows how ruthless the right wing of Labour party are.

Abbot should have been cleared months ago. Yes there are some in the UK that can't stand her but they aren't likely to be the ones who vote Labour anyhow. And its not like (for better or worse) that she has a chance of a Front bench position. Labour should stop being scared of its own shadow/ the rabid right wing press.

Posted by: Rooney 31st May 2024, 07:48 PM

Doesn't this all have nothing to do with Starmer though and all to do with the NEC? Thought that was a ruling and the Leader was banned from selecting/de selecting candidates. Personally, still think Abbott should have been moved in the Lords and they should have stuck by the decision. Nothing to do with her faction wing, she is a liability, there's no way she still has the Labour whip by 2029. I think this great "left-wing purge" never really took effect, loads of left-wing candidates being allowed to stand and so they should! All that being said, it was definitely becoming a big distraction, so can understand the decision.

Posted by: Iz 🌟 31st May 2024, 08:51 PM

Yeah it is being lead by the NEC (some of whom are parachuting themselves in as candidates, the one who replaced Shaheen is on Labour's NCC which deals with disciplinary matters) but either way it was a stupid and avoidable misplay by the Labour right - they could have issued clarity immediately and showed support across the aisle but they assumed that the press wouldn't care about some left-wingers and they could get away with reducing opposition to themselves, which is setting themselves up for failure once they have hundreds of 'loyal' backbenchers jostling for limited ministerial seats. Public don't like to see outward hostility and there was a sense of unfairness going about with what happened to Abbott.

Posted by: Suedehead2 31st May 2024, 08:52 PM

I can’t see Dianne Abbott accepting a seat in the Lords.

Posted by: Steve201 31st May 2024, 09:14 PM

Was gonna say this!

Posted by: Steve201 31st May 2024, 09:15 PM

The NEC has a majority of right wingers and Starmerites now!

Posted by: Rooney 31st May 2024, 09:21 PM

Yeah they will be parachuting themselves in as candidates, but what's new? The same happened under Corbyn's leadership too when the likes of Begum and Tarry were parachuted in. I totally agree the leadership behind the scenes got this one wrong and it was becoming a political sideshow. I still stand by they tired to get rid of her as she is a liability to the Party, not sure keeping her on out of sympathy is the right move! But I also respect that she should make her own decison. I'm not sure it was totally faction motivated though.. I think if that was the case there was other people they would have got rid of (RLB, Burgeon etc.). Mix of some faction, but definitely something to do with capability too. The Akehurst one is fecking weird though, so I can see why people can connect a narrative.

Posted by: Suedehead2 31st May 2024, 09:43 PM

One of the many problems faced by the outgoing government has been the number of MPs who have been a total embarrassment. It is not surprising that Starmer, who will face a far more hostile press than the succession of Tory PMs, wants to avoid similar embarrassment.

Posted by: Brett-Butler 1st June 2024, 11:31 AM

Let’s have some fun with a quick election quiz!

Based upon a quick glance of this poster, which party do you think this MP is running for?

.

If you answered something other than the obvious, then congratulations, you’ve read the small print.

Pretty sure this could be in breach of electoral law.

Posted by: Scene 1st June 2024, 12:19 PM

Let’s report the fraudulent!

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 1st June 2024, 12:54 PM

Preach! Mendacios etonian toad

Posted by: Scene 1st June 2024, 04:48 PM

https://www.kentonline.co.uk/kent/news/amp/kent-tories-facing-massive-losses-at-general-election-307283/

Posted by: danG 1st June 2024, 04:54 PM

lol of course my town is being the second biggest for conservatives

although means I don’t need to think about tactical voting and I can just vote green knowing there’s pretty much no chance of labour winning the seat anyway

Posted by: Scene 1st June 2024, 05:05 PM

Hopefully they will update it regularly so we can see any shifts.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 1st June 2024, 05:12 PM

The Guardian looks like it might end up coming out as Lib Dem this election, quite a few hit pieces on Labour in the past few days.

Posted by: TheSnake 1st June 2024, 08:13 PM

Some of the right-wing papers might support Reform too?

Posted by: Scene 2nd June 2024, 12:29 AM

Another empty promise.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cv2289vk0n1o

Posted by: Suedehead2 2nd June 2024, 11:36 AM

I suspect the Guardian will go for Labour, but with a caveat that people should vote Lib Dem if they are best placed to beat the Tories.

Posted by: Liam sota 2nd June 2024, 12:26 PM

Hilarious, now she’s been offered easy money in the House of Lords suddenly she isn’t interested in being an MP anymore. Thought it was about the people of Hackney. Either way best for everyone if she doesn’t stand. Maybe Hackney can have an MP who tries to tackle their crime problem

https://x.com/steven_swinford/status/1797194478672859398?s=46

Posted by: Scene 2nd June 2024, 12:40 PM

Made the BBC: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c1eewd5xgjgo

Blatant breach surely.

Posted by: Steve201 2nd June 2024, 01:37 PM

His response is arrogance of the highest order, not doing anything wrong just using the word Labour and their colours to confuse people into garnering him votes!

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 2nd June 2024, 02:08 PM

She said ahe's being pushed into going. She's also in her 70s...

Posted by: T Boy 2nd June 2024, 03:32 PM

Or perhaps the way she has been treated has simply soured the experience?

Posted by: Scene 2nd June 2024, 04:04 PM

Right! And the tories saying there’s clearly an imprint. CLEARLY?? it’s in a size 8 font.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 2nd June 2024, 04:30 PM

Posted by: Steve201 2nd June 2024, 05:48 PM

Tories love their rules until they have to follow them too it seems!

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 2nd June 2024, 05:51 PM

It might turn out that is technically legal because of the text in size 8 font though.

Shows how desperate they are that they're going for these tactics five weeks from the election though.

Posted by: Steve201 2nd June 2024, 05:55 PM

Indeed, for me no matter the legals it just proves the laws an ass!

Posted by: ElectroBoy 3rd June 2024, 02:22 PM

Posted by: Scene 3rd June 2024, 02:31 PM

Labour stable, Cons declining and Lib Dems increasing.

Posted by: Scene 3rd June 2024, 03:08 PM

Nigel Farage is making an announcement now! Oh Christ he's becoming leader of Reform.

Posted by: ElectroBoy 3rd June 2024, 03:10 PM

I mean its a non-announcement really as he already was really the only reform person to be wheeled out 30p Lee aside

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 3rd June 2024, 03:16 PM

Paahahhahaa!!

That will further crush Tory numbers!!!

Posted by: ElectroBoy 3rd June 2024, 03:17 PM

Farage coming for Clacton

Posted by: Hassaan 3rd June 2024, 03:25 PM

What's actually the point of Reform UK? What's their whole thing?

Posted by: Smint 3rd June 2024, 03:30 PM

This. He was and is everywhere so might as well be open about it. He's standing in Clacton. Hope him and Conservatives fight for same votes and let Labour through.

Prob has loads of dodgy money behind him too but again that's nothing new.

Posted by: Suedehead2 3rd June 2024, 03:53 PM

So Farage has appointed homself as leader of the party, having said he didn’t want the job, and has also selected himself as candidate for Clacton, having said he wouldn’t stand. Don’t you just love honesty and democracy Freedom UK style?

Posted by: Scene 3rd June 2024, 04:05 PM

Tories won the Clacton seat by a landslide in 2019. It would be interesting to know the current predictions in the area.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 3rd June 2024, 04:08 PM

Far right shenanigans

Posted by: ElectroBoy 3rd June 2024, 04:30 PM

Posted by: Brett-Butler 3rd June 2024, 04:36 PM

Prior to this announcement, the Tories were predicted to win with c32%, with Labour and Reform neck and neck on c24%, so any Farage boost likely wouldn’t hit Labour, unless it rallies the local Labourites. Interestingly Clacton is the only constituency UKIP ever won in a General Election, which is likely why Farage is trying his luck there.

Posted by: ElectroBoy 3rd June 2024, 04:38 PM

I didn’t think UKIP ever won any seats? Didn’t someone just defect from the Tories?

Posted by: Brett-Butler 3rd June 2024, 04:56 PM

Two members defected from the Conservatives in 2014 and held their seats for UKIP in by-elections. In the 2015 General Election one of them (Douglas Carswell) held his seat. He later resigned from UKIP following the Brexit vote and stood down as an MP ahead of the 2017 election.

Posted by: Liam sota 3rd June 2024, 05:00 PM

The most interesting poll today showed the majority of GBNews viewers intend to vote Labour. There is no space anywhere that has any hope for the Tories. They literally have nothing they can do to turn this around at all. Nigel Farage probably was told his TV appearances would be cut short and decided to find a way to get more airtime he isn't gonna win that seat or effect much. Might lose the Tories a few more seats that's the only impact he can have this time around.

Posted by: Scene 3rd June 2024, 05:01 PM

I'm so happy I booked July 5th off work! This could be a historic moment.




Another seat bites the dust.

Posted by: ElectroBoy 3rd June 2024, 05:04 PM

Ah ok; I must’ve been in ignorant bliss and wanting to believe Farage’s party has never won a seat

Posted by: Steve201 3rd June 2024, 08:39 PM

Farage has never won a seat which may continue on 5th July!

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 3rd June 2024, 09:43 PM

Farage returning to the fray will undoubtedly make this a more unpleasant election to follow sadly.

To be honest I'm likely to not follow it as in depth as I otherwise would have if he's going to be turning up at leadership debates.

Posted by: Hassaan 3rd June 2024, 09:51 PM

Is "racist party" a fair description?

Posted by: Steve201 3rd June 2024, 09:58 PM

The Lib Dem’s are seemingly just going into this election to try and stay in the headlines with these daily stunts aren’t they?

Posted by: TheSnake 3rd June 2024, 10:01 PM

Yeah I don't like the Ed Davey stunts, reminds me too much of Boris on the zipwire.

Posted by: Scene 4th June 2024, 05:58 AM

So who is going to be watching this evening’s TV debate?

Posted by: ElectroBoy 4th June 2024, 07:19 AM

Watch Sunak Gaslight and lie for an hour... i'm good thanks

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 4th June 2024, 07:43 AM

Definitely not me.

Posted by: Steve201 4th June 2024, 08:14 AM

I will be watching as I like a robust debate where they have no where to hide. One reason why its better to have some debates with only the 2 main contenders to be PM debating.

Couldnt find STV on my sky box lastnyt to watch the Scottish debate.

Posted by: Scene 4th June 2024, 12:21 PM

Glad I’m not the only one on here. though I’m sure I’ll be raging at it at some point.

Posted by: Scene 4th June 2024, 02:58 PM

Re: TV debate

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-politics-69088663

Posted by: Scene 4th June 2024, 03:26 PM

Posted by: Smint 4th June 2024, 03:38 PM

Hate Farage but that's counter productive in gaining him stmaothy votes and just encourages abuse of politicians on all side.

Posted by: Hassaan 4th June 2024, 03:42 PM

I'm no Farage fan but it's just more publicity for him and I don't think throwing things at politicians is a good thing, regardless of who they are.

Posted by: Iz 🌟 4th June 2024, 04:18 PM

It's very funny though. We used to be a proper country re: eggings in the 80s.

Honestly while in previous elections he'd creep me out and stunts like this indeed wouldn't help, now he's an irrelevance and will only take votes off the dying Tories. A problem for Clacton and going to be an annoying loudmouth for a bit longer but he'll just cannibalise the right vote now so I haven't been dooming about him.

Posted by: T Boy 4th June 2024, 04:24 PM

Wouldn’t be at all surprised if the milkshake attack was a staged publicity stunt.

Posted by: Brett-Butler 4th June 2024, 04:28 PM

I will quote what I said five years ago the last time that "milkshaking" became a thing, as it still holds up (unfortunately even more so now, given that there's been a murder of another MP during the last parliament sitting).

Note that this occured a few weeks before Farage's last "milkshaking" in the run up to the European Elections in 2019 which is why I didn't mention him. And what happened then? The Brexit Party went from nowhere to winning the European Elections.

Also, the same year someone lobbed an egg at Jeremy Corbyn. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-47691606. And rightly so.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 4th June 2024, 04:33 PM

Nope. He's fash. Don't tolerate fash. He destroyed this country with brexshit. It eill be very very hard to recober from that.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 4th June 2024, 04:34 PM

I love Corbyn, but 28 days for an egg? Really?

Posted by: Hassaan 4th June 2024, 05:17 PM

There's many ways to not tolerate him than throwing stuff at him.

Posted by: Chez Wombat 4th June 2024, 05:25 PM

It's amusing in theory as it would be pieing a pantomime villain, but let's be honest, if it were a Lib Dem/Green MP and the Tories were laughing about it, the reaction would be pretty different on here. It just ultimately doesn't solve anything and gives him yet more ammunition to spout more of his bullshit about how 'they're all out to get me' and more front pages in the tabloids, given they would give attention to him opening an envelope.

Y'know what would really be funny? His face if/when he loses x

Posted by: Liam sota 4th June 2024, 05:30 PM

Its trash actions from trash people. Should be a year in jail for that kind of thing to deter it

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 4th June 2024, 06:08 PM

This Labour party 'ive always voted tory' advert really just confirms to those of us who previously felt at home with Labour that we've been abandoned by the party under Starmer.

Posted by: Iz 🌟 4th June 2024, 06:15 PM

Not denying it would be funny but he's been defeated at the ballot box what? 8 times already - and yet he's possibly the most successful politician of the last few decades in getting his ideas implemented, despite being objectively an unpopular man. The media giving him outsized influence and credence is on them as much as it is him. I can't derive too much pleasure from him being defeated the proper way, he won.

I would not encourage anything like this to become part of our politics as much for its ineffectiveness as its risks, but it represents a strength of feeling that is felt against that kind of politician. Milk just doesn't register as violence to me, because it isn't really, the only lasting damage is a stained suit. It's quite different to the dangerous assaults on politicians that come from actual violently minded people.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 4th June 2024, 06:17 PM

Apologies for the quintuple post. Phone froze while I was replying.

Posted by: Iz 🌟 4th June 2024, 06:17 PM

It's surely basic maths and worrying that I haven't seen this addressed by any of the Labour party leadership. 10 million people voted for Labour last time. That's not a small number. Labour are chasing the ~3-6 million voters they need to swing from the Conservatives or elsewhere by emphasing that The Labour Party Has Changed. It'd be quite understandable for those people who voted Labour last time to say 'if the Labour party has changed, do you still want my vote'?

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 4th June 2024, 06:27 PM

I think they're banking on the reality that most of us will vote for them out of a sense of loyalty or the fact they're better than the Tories.

The reality is most of us who feel that way live in safe seats anyway so might see a reduced turnout in safe seats. It just feels distasteful to be so brazenly chasing people who voted for the Conservatives after Cameron, May, Boris and only now think somethings wrong because the government is effecting them due to Truss's disastrous budget and the cost of living crisis. The worst excess of the Tory party were fine to these people until stuff they did directly affected them all through the Cameron years and the Brexit years. We really want to vote for a Labour party that's palatable to lifelong Tory voters? I don't.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 4th June 2024, 06:39 PM

Yeah no. That's authoritarian nonsense.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 4th June 2024, 06:41 PM

100%

A quick reminder that thlse voters, under Labour, COMPLAINRD and switched back to Tory because ... NHS waiting lists ... WERE TOO SHORT! And they eanted more time between an appointment and a consultarikn.

Posted by: Jessie Where 4th June 2024, 06:57 PM

So, today lactose met intolerance

(Again)

Posted by: Liam sota 4th June 2024, 07:11 PM

So what? You can't have such a thing continue to happen, wont be long before its acid.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 4th June 2024, 07:27 PM

Slippery slope argument isn't valid. It's an egg. There have bern eggings in politics for yeaars.
.

Posted by: Liam sota 4th June 2024, 07:27 PM

I saw that advert and wondered what reaction it would get. Have no real strong feelings on it but it kind of continues the theme of Starmer taking Labour votes for granted and targeting Tories which is a good strategy as this election is in the bag and its just about racking up the numbers. Could irk your base but lets be real, these people will still vote labout 9 times out of 10.

The parachuting in of certain candidates most of whom are from think tanks or have sketchy links is the most disappointing thing for me as you already know these are soulless individuals with no care on the world for the average person. That Luke guy should not be there given his previous statements and links to awful people.

Ultimately there is a huge pool of voters who traditionally were labour but went tories with Boris and there is no real political place for them given lib Dems probably have the wealthiest voters then tories traditionally posh and greens for a certain brand of well off hippy, so labour is advertising for their vote but bringing in all these think tankers shows its not actually going to be a party for these people at all.

Anyway looking forward to the debate despite the fact it'll probably be a dullfest

Posted by: Suedehead2 4th June 2024, 08:34 PM

For Farage, all publicity is good publicity. That's why he went for the "I'm not standing" / "Actually, I am" nonsense. Two occasions when he makes the headlines. Today's story puts him up front again. If broadcasters, apply the impartiality rules properly, that should be the last we hear of the frog-faced fascist in this campaign.

Posted by: Iz 🌟 4th June 2024, 08:36 PM

Debate so far is being hindered by the moderator not letting anyone the chance to finish a sentence - particularly Starmer, who hasn't been able to parry Sunak's ridiculous lie of £2000 of tax.

otherwise he of course seems the more sane of the pair but fuck the media man

Posted by: Hassaan 4th June 2024, 09:01 PM

Bring on 4th July, honestly...

This government must surely be one of the most disastrous ever?

Posted by: Liam sota 4th June 2024, 09:07 PM

Wow terrible moderation the whole way. Some infantile questions “raise your hand if you're going to raise taxes” but Starmer was not good for a large chunk of it. Got better towards the end but he didn't handle the questions about what he'd do on various issues well. He was clearly over prepared on pointing out what the Tories did bad or Liz truss but was a bit lost on his own plans. Not a great look. Overall nobody cane out of it well especially not the moderator. Will be interesting if a company has one of those post debate snap polls

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 4th June 2024, 09:10 PM

Didn't watch it because I can't stand Sunak, but it looks from online comments Starmer hasn't handled it well. He can really announce policies because of the way Labour's manifesto making process works - it's created by collaborative rather than policies made up by Tory spads. I reckon Starmer will do better on the second debate, after the manifesto has been published.

Posted by: Smint 4th June 2024, 09:22 PM

YouGov poll said Sunak won by 51/49. Didn't watch it myself but shows Starmer needs a bit of work getting his points across about why vote Labour.

Posted by: Brer 4th June 2024, 09:54 PM

Well that's 70 minutes of my life I'm never getting back - it's not changing my vote obviously but honestly I think the 'who won the debate' poll coming out near 50/50 is fair and with a gun to my head I probably would say Rishi "won" the debate for what it's worth. He obviously came in with the plan of hammering home 'Labour will increase everyone's taxes by £2,000' and whether or not that's total bollocks, I don't think Starmer did a good enough job refuting that and that'll probably scare some people off. Too many platitudes and non-answers on both sides especially near the start (what did I expect?) Starmer did get better and had a few good moments here and there later on but disappointing overall. Moderation was horrible as well (what did I expect? [2])

Posted by: Chez Wombat 4th June 2024, 09:59 PM

Labour really need to start revealing more policies and why they are the change needed, I know the polls mean they can take their time and their process is a bit different, but we've barely heard from them so far apart from the Diane Abbott scandal and the morning news seemingly has a new desperate, culture war inflamed Tory policy every day ('protection' of biological sex in the Equality Act even though it already is, capping migrant visas etc). I didn't watch the debate as I can't handle a whole hour of dancing around questions and not answering them but seems Starmer may have struggled because of this x

Posted by: Rooney 4th June 2024, 10:01 PM

This also shows why it’s counter productive for people to vote for other parties and ignore voting for Labour as “they’ll win” such as Owen Jones and the ilk. Nobody is under any illusion that a Starmer government will make things better immediately, but it will be better than the Tories. And we will have capable politicians in offices of the State.

Not seen anything to do with the debate and tbh I think there’s so much time to go it doesn’t really matter. But if people really want change then no matter what your beliefs, you’re far more likely to get it under a Labour government than a Tory one with the current politics.

Posted by: Steve201 4th June 2024, 11:07 PM

Yeh it’s not that Starmer did poorly Sunak was able to spout more nonsense about taxes increasing repeatedly which will break through to the idiots who don’t know much because it’s hard to explain in simple ways to the people at home why it’s untrue. I also cringed with Starmer said he would indeed send people to Rwanda if it was proven to work 🙄 making him look shifty.

Posted by: Jessie Where 5th June 2024, 12:22 AM

It begs the question, was it really wise of Starmer to agree to this debate if he was bound by how much he could reveal policy-wise?

Posted by: My... WAP?? 5th June 2024, 02:25 AM

It's the old perfumed shit.

The tories are the stinking dog shit. Labour under Starmer is the shit who's foul odour is well disguised by sweet smelling perfume. Certainly the preferable of the two if you had to have one sat in your house. But both are essentially still shit.

I will be expressing my vote through the medium of a spoiled ballet paper. It won't matter in real terms, live in a seat that's been safe Labour for donkeys years, but will have made my opinion noted.

Posted by: Steve201 5th June 2024, 06:58 AM

You’d certainly think he will do better when the manifestos come out but he was vague as he can’t say much which says it all really and why I don’t believe the polls that think the tories will be down to below 150 seats.

Posted by: Liam sota 5th June 2024, 07:05 AM

All Starmer had to do was refute he was going to add 2k in tax for everybody including poor struggling families(which sounded absurd in the first place) and really add what Labour would do to what the Tories have done. But everytime Rishi claimed 2k in tax Starmer would look shifty or talk about Liz truss and it gave the impression he really was adding 2k in tax. I had to check myself. It was a really big misstep because given the Tories record this should be a slam dunk. Rishi is coming to the debate disliked, not trusted and with a woeful record it should be a formality but Starmer made him look more viable.

He definitely needs to work on answers and be clearer for Labour’s vision next time. I'm hindsight he should have gave the debates a miss and let deputies do it. Too far ahead nothing to gain at all really, only potentially messing it up and he did to a tiny extent.

Posted by: ElectroBoy 5th June 2024, 07:59 AM

Posted by: ElectroBoy 5th June 2024, 08:00 AM

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 5th June 2024, 08:18 AM

Good to see that Starmer's relatively poor performance still won the debate going by those polls.

I think 4 July is gonna be a coronation.

Posted by: Smint 5th June 2024, 08:43 AM

Phew - as the early poll and the usual tedious right wing papers lead with Sunak winning (not that they are that influential any more it seems, giving Labour's gargantuan poll lead). And hopefully Starmer will prepare better for the next one.

Posted by: ElectroBoy 5th June 2024, 08:44 AM

Be interesting to know how many people actually watched... I can't imagine the ratings being that high

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 5th June 2024, 09:30 AM

4.8m. Down on the 6.7m the first Corbyn v Johnson debate got.

But still a relatively high figure given overall ratings have fallen in general in the 5 years.

Posted by: Steve201 5th June 2024, 09:51 AM

It looks more shifty if you wont debate Sunak imo!

Posted by: Steve201 5th June 2024, 09:53 AM

The debates wont matter too much anyway as peoples opinions of the leaders are already concrete imo.

Posted by: ElectroBoy 5th June 2024, 09:55 AM

Yeah that is a lot higher than I expected!

Posted by: Scene 5th June 2024, 12:05 PM

Yep, like Theresa’s no-show back in 2017.

Posted by: Scene 5th June 2024, 09:28 PM

Upcoming TV events for those interested:

7 June - BBC election debate (7.30pm)
12 June - Sky Leaders' Special Event (7pm)
13 June - ITV multi-party debate (8.30pm)
20 June - BBC Question Time Leaders' Special (8pm)
26 June - BBC head-to-head debate (9pm)

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c877v0e86vko

Posted by: Suedehead2 5th June 2024, 09:35 PM

Some people have suggested that Starmer’s failure to contradict Sunak over tax was a deliberate ploy. By allowing Sunak to repeat it several times, any c;claim that it was a “slip of the tongue” loses all credibility. Unfortunately, I suspect the right-wing press will not find the space to report that the Civil Service has also disputed Sunak’s claim about how the figures were calculated.

Posted by: Steve201 6th June 2024, 09:19 AM

The debate on Friday will be a nightmare with 7 of them shouting over each other. Like the QT leaders special and the bbc Head to Head on the 26th!

Posted by: Smint 6th June 2024, 09:59 AM

Ghastly right wing Labour stooge Luke Akehurst,parachuted into a safe Labour seat at the last minuge, has been caught on video saying about (left wing Jewish Labour members) - "They have abandoned very much of their Jewish identity. They don't go to shul at all. It's become a purely cultural thing around a bowl of chicken soup."

I would strongly hope that Starmer suspends him immediately as he has suspended several candidates for far, far less.

Posted by: Liam sota 6th June 2024, 10:41 AM

He’s the exact kind of person who should not be in politics. Real shame people like this always seem to gravitate into powerful roles and positions.

Posted by: Steve201 6th June 2024, 11:50 AM

He’s just a fixer ffs.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 6th June 2024, 09:00 PM

So - night before the general election nominations deadline and my seat still has no confirmed Conservative candidate...

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 6th June 2024, 09:02 PM

Just means they'll use emergency rules to parachute a party favourite in

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 6th June 2024, 09:03 PM

I don't think any party favourites are gonna want a Labour safe seat.

Posted by: Steve201 6th June 2024, 09:06 PM

Plenty of them currently 😁

Posted by: Liam sota 7th June 2024, 07:05 AM

Latest Sunak disaster he left Normandy early to record an interview which hasn’t gone down well with anybody now he has made a lengthy apology. Just a mess and the Tories getting under 100 seats has never seemed more likely

Posted by: Iz 🌟 7th June 2024, 07:54 AM

He's so bad at this part 867

That's a gift for any room temperature IQ leader in the middle of an election campaign, show up and look stately at an important event. He can't even do that on top of most reputable media calling him a liar the past few days.

Posted by: ElectroBoy 7th June 2024, 08:10 AM

Sunak should just hide in a fridge for the rest of the month

Posted by: Jessie Where 7th June 2024, 08:17 AM

Found the perfect one for him!

Posted by: ElectroBoy 7th June 2024, 08:30 AM

Although the hiding in a fridge strategy worked for Johnson last time around

Posted by: Rooney 7th June 2024, 08:47 AM

There's evidence floating about that Sunak was not even going to attend Normandy in the first place! Such a bad look, and an easy open goal for Labour/Reform here. I don't know who is advising Sunak, but this is just another example of showing how out of touch he is.

Anyone watch QT last night? Thought it was a pretty poor performance from everyone. Labour struggled, the Tories did terrible and The Greens have seemingly moved on to the magic money tree.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 7th June 2024, 08:55 AM

The magic money tree dismissal is beginning to irk me - the only way to rescue our public services is with more borrowing - borrowing invested properly will grow the economy. The state budget needs to be looked at more likely a business than a household one. The Tories forcing Labour so far to the right they now accept this household budget/balance the books narrative since 2010 is the reason this country is in such a dire state. If you invest in the economy with borrowed money you promote growth and can then raise more money in taxes - only the Greens and other socialist parties seem willing to say this. We need infrastructure projects that will create jobs as well as investment in public services. If you need to borrow money you need to borrow money, cutting more and more until there's nothing as the two main parties have agreed to do is not the answer.

Posted by: Rooney 7th June 2024, 10:09 AM

Except we've already borrowed a load of money and can't pay it back, unless the money is properly accounted for with guarantees of how we will raise it, the Markets will have a field day and crash our economy again. This whole "oh we will tax the rich even more" policy is so dumb. Yes in theory it works, but how many people do we really think will stick around and not find a tax loophole, rendering the whole thing pointless.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 7th June 2024, 10:41 AM

You can borrow without spooking the markets if it's invested properly. Improved infrastructure from investment is a economic bonus.

The problem with Truss was that she wanted to borrow to cut taxes rather than to invest which was insane.

Posted by: Scene 7th June 2024, 10:49 AM

Yep wasn’t great all round - the Labour lady didn’t answer questions directly though good on her for continuing to speak whenever Fiona kept interrupting. Carla from Green spent a lot of time talking about nothing. Maybe nerves but she seemed a bit out of her depth at times. I think the Plaid Cymru lady made some great points, especially regarding social care funding and the burden of tax falling on the broadest shoulders in society.

Posted by: Rooney 7th June 2024, 10:49 AM

Problem is when you forecast the borrowing, the actual spend is likely to be far higher, that's even without the current borrowing rates we have at the moment. It's great on paper and does make sense, but the reality is far different.

Posted by: Rooney 7th June 2024, 10:54 AM

Labour definitely struggled, it might have been harder because it was Chester and clearly some Welsh specific issues, but some really woolly answers and not sure they did very well to capture any swing voters. I thought it was interesting the Brexit question came up again, although I totally get why Labour are playing that down during this election cycle, it's the right political play. As I said about above, the Greens were just talking about nothing, all very flimsy and then when challenged there were some dreadful answers. Also agree that Plaid Cymru came off best!

Posted by: Liam sota 7th June 2024, 11:03 AM

The Greens really had a big opportunity to capture that whole Corbyn wing of Labour but they have had a lot of false equivalent statements on Gaza and just don't seem interested in being anything more than a small 1-3 seat party who don't do much. Their plans are reliant on wishful thinking so inevitably you make all these pledges to be funded by ‘taxing the rich’ who usually find a way to avoid most of it so instead they have to tax regular people for the ‘greater good’ and it all becomes messy quickly. Theyve been useless in fact. I would like a party that was primarily heavy on the environment and green type issues without the kind of people who always represent the greens. They have no political savviness or ambition to get anywhere or branch out. Its very stagnant. They had a chance to be bold on Gaza which was a slam dunk for the people attracted to them anyway and still messed it up somehow.

If you look at it in right and left terms. Brexit party/UKIP/Reform they've got somewhere, they have ambition, it mostly can fail but they seem like they want power or truly want to affect things even if it gets them relegated, the Greens just seem happy to be mid table in the premier league.

Posted by: Scene 7th June 2024, 11:08 AM

It made me laugh when the Green lady said something like "can you let me finish?" and then a few long seconds of silence. Her debating skills definitely need brushing up.

Posted by: Smint 7th June 2024, 11:41 AM

Sunak getting loads of flack for this now from all quarters - some are even saying it could be a resignation matter. Even though I'm happy that's destroying the Tories chance of government even more, I am slightly uncomfortable about this over promoting Patriotic/War issues more than every other issue going. Yes it was a disrespectful, ceremonial gaffe but it does create a trap for the incoming Labour government in the future to appear ultra "patriotic" at all times. Still short term gain though.

Posted by: Scene 7th June 2024, 11:50 AM

I’m here for more Sunak gaffes tbh.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 7th June 2024, 12:15 PM

The Tory journos had measuring tape out to check the length of Corbyn's tie and how deeply he bowed at memorial day, so...

To protect Blojo at election time, as the ENTIRE state was against Corbyn to protect the status quo, BBTory replaced the footage of Blojo's gaffe at the cenotaph. He placed the wreath the wrong way, so BBTory used footage from the year before. It's always been highly political.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 7th June 2024, 01:14 PM

It's going to be interested to see the polls that have been taken today and tomorrow when they come out - i.e the ones that factor in D-Day. The Conservatives could well be behind Reform, at that point seat distribution at the election is anybody's guess.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 7th June 2024, 01:16 PM

The one where Brexshit country destroyer piggy Cam got in, the Lib Drms were supposedly ahrsd of Tories at one point. Just endrd up getting higher sests thsn normal, but nothing unudually high

Posted by: Smint 7th June 2024, 01:27 PM

In 2010 Clegg's Liberal Democrats actually lost seats (although gained votes) from Charles Kennedy's high watermark in 2005 (where the Iraq war was a bit of a factor).

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 7th June 2024, 01:47 PM

So just over an hour to go until nominations and my seat has 4 candidates known - Labour, Lib Dem, Green and minor party Alliance for Freedom and Democracy.

No known candidates for WBGP, Reform, Conservative yet. Will be interesting to see when the candidate list comes out if there's any paper candidates for those parties.

Posted by: Rooney 7th June 2024, 01:50 PM

Nationalism is a key piece of any leader (and not the far-right version). This is super basic stuff - we're remembering 80 years ago, one of the most momentous occasions where the Allied forces came together to help liberate France, where millions of people lost their lives. You've got photo opportunities with other Allies and the world's media is covering it.. this is just a real basic gaffe. Sounds like Sunak wasn't even interested - so this whole "put your country first piece" becomes ridiculous, as the own Conservative leader can't even be bothered to do that!

Posted by: Iz 🌟 7th June 2024, 02:01 PM

It's possibly the biggest unforced error so far. Pretty much every Conservative/Reform-oriented voter will disapprove of this and it's been near total condemnation. There's no precedent for resigning during a general election campaign but if it were outside of that it'd be on the cards.

Sunak is really starting to exhibit all of the worst qualities of recent PMs all put together. At least Truss, TRUSS, would have gone and at least done her best to look solemn and statesmanlike (not that she can but I am certain she wouldn't have screwed this particular thing up).

Quite. What's the end goal of low growth, careful careful spending? More tortured pain for years and years with ordinary people feeling the pinch all that time and sure you won't spook the markets initially (and if your plans were solid they'd react well!) but eventually you're downgrading yourself. Other countries don't do this, they have long-term prospects to grow jobs and the size of the economy to match its needs.

There needs to be investment - now some parts of the Labour policies so far are somewhat encouraging in that they speak of baby steps in the right direction - new towns, rail nationalisation, energy provision - but they're being hamstrung by any attempt at looking like you're spending money being ruthlessly questioned as if it's a waste of money. Not all policies are equal and so don't need to undergo the same 'costing' interregations. The Truss crash was just as much about the plans not bringing in income as it was spending money, in fact probably more so.

Posted by: Hassaan 7th June 2024, 02:04 PM

Chances of Sunak doing a Truss in a year's time and complaining about the establishment being against him or something?

I'm glad that there's less than a month left...

Posted by: Liam sota 7th June 2024, 02:08 PM

Funny this sentiment because I seen a tweet of a 90 yr old lifelong Tory saying she wont vote Tory after this and all the quote tweets were Labour or similar people stating “this was the final straw? Really?” or “it wasn't hating immigrants or not giving free meals to school kids” its just like duh those people vote for them FOR that stuff. They don't agree with you on those issues.

This issue is one that hits primarily Tory voters, its not even a gaffe its a catastrophic insight into a persons pysche. This guy just showed he doesn't have the same values as his core voter base. This will be it. The Tories will skip to 15% or less. He may even announce he will 100% step down after the election win or lose in a desperate attempt to keep some voters. This stuff is much more significant than other issues as you can just change your stance on most issues you can't undo what he just did. He has shown he is not one of them and they won't trust him or his judgment ever again.

Posted by: Smint 7th June 2024, 02:09 PM

Where do you get this up to date information about who is standing in your seat? Interested to know.

Posted by: DoBelieveTheHype 7th June 2024, 02:16 PM

It's not up to the minute but it's update regularly on https://whocanivotefor.co.uk/

The big broadcasters will have full lists out at some point tonight I think. But looks like the Tories may not stand in all constituencies.


On an unrelated note - the Tories have lost the Torygraph and going by the comments they're going to Reform. Worrying times.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/06/07/rishi-sunak-has-disgraced-our-d-day-veterans/

Posted by: Iz 🌟 7th June 2024, 02:20 PM

To add on to what others have said about nationalism, it's entirely possible and in fact desirable to promote nationalism that isn't nationalism in the way we think of it with flag-ragging, making the country a better place because you want it to be so, which can easily jive with the nationalist crowd. It's not really hard to swing them by appearing respectful to things they care about without bringing other nations or peoples down or promoting a small inwards-looking Britain.



@TomorrowsMPs has a good running commentary, or yes check www.whocanivotefor.co.uk.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 7th June 2024, 02:22 PM

That sad little slimy (and now slippery) weasel would never rrsign. Ever. Like Blojo, he thinks he was born to rule.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 7th June 2024, 02:30 PM

Yup, THIS being the final straw, not chronic mismanagament, or purposefully destroying the nhs in order to make it more expensive than the usa's terrible system, so that private industry can run in and "fix it", after already selling off the most profitable parts of it.

Posted by: Hassaan 7th June 2024, 02:57 PM

He's not as bad. I doubt Sunak will say something like "I'm going to remain in power for 20 years" and he doesn't have the cult following. The kind who constantly said of BJ "he's just doing his best" during the pandemic.

I say that, if - sorry, when - he's ousted, he may well go off the deep end.

Posted by: Doomsday Dong 7th June 2024, 03:22 PM

Uff did blojo say that?! Tinpot wannabe