Colour me sceptical. If this is based on that YouGov poll which said an "anti-Brexit Lib Dems" would beat a "pro-EU Labour" then that seems to me a prime example of a leading question.

Nah, not based on that. More just that I think Labour will have an even more incoherent, unbelievable position than normal (they're heading straight for a full-on anti-immigration position which...I don't see Corbyn being a particularly credible carrier for). As pissing off all sides to the extent neither believes the position goes, I think it's got a good chance of making the immigration mugs look like a storm in a teacup.

(Leaving aside the merits of Brexit economically there too, but obviously a. I'm inclined to think it won't go well, and b. the way the party approaches things now I bet it could go so disastrously that there was STARVING IN THE STREETS AND SEVERAL HORSES OF THE APOCALYPSE ROAMING WILD and you'd still have most Labour MPs holding to the line of "but it's important we aren't seen to be overriding the NATIONAL WILL and VERY REAL CONCERNS about immigr-*blender noise*")

As I've said before, I think Brexit is going to completely smash pretty much everyone. Sure, it's not a pretty case to make, but there is an argument that in exchange for the pain for a comparative few you can on balance help the least off overall by, say, committing to a welfare cap with a Labour government. (Not one that works out if people don't really believe you either way, which is why I don't think Labour's going to pull off this immigration position too well.) The sum economic benefit we're going to get for subjecting everyone to a likely pretty severe recession via Brexit is...not immediately obvious. I don't think it's all that much of a moral quandary to choose to die in the ditch of fighting against the majority of the people in the country being made worse off.

The other side of it is that I think the anti-Brexit side will be vindicated. There are a few reasons for that, but the one most likely to not get me told off for talking Britain down (or something) by the likes of PeaceMob is that the deal Theresa is aiming for (pay more than we pay for EU membership to begin with to keep single market access for a few select sectors) is going to go down like a cup of cold sick among a lot of Brexit voters, even besides how the economy's doing by that stage. And it's pretty much the best we could hope for the EU to agree to.

Even if this DOES happen, I really don't think that's going to mean people want to rejoin the EU. They will quite possibly blame May and the government for "not doing what we told you" and might well be open to other parties promising to "negotiate a better Brexit deal", but for Jo(e) Public to actually say s/he doesn't want to leave the EU would be for him.her to admit to themselves they got the decision in the referendum wrong -- and, to the state the obvious, very few humanbeings like to willingly admit they were wrong about something. It's not even like Iraq, where people who were vaguely in favour of it in 2003 were later able to convince themselves that they were never really in favour of it, and thus avoid thinking "I got it wrong".

May will do pretty much anything to make sure people don't feel the effects in obvious ways like prices going up, even if it means tanking the economy in ways they won't notice.

Now maybe you see why so many Labour members, myself included, felt so strongly about the ridiculous lengths some Labour MPs were taking the "electability is more important than principles" mantra to

Even if this DOES happen, I really don't think that's going to mean people want to rejoin the EU. They will quite possibly blame May and the government for "not doing what we told you" and might well be open to other parties promising to "negotiate a better Brexit deal", but for Jo(e) Public to actually say s/he doesn't want to leave the EU would be for him.her to admit to themselves they got the decision in the referendum wrong -- and, to the state the obvious, very few humanbeings like to willingly admit they were wrong about something. It's not even like Iraq, where people who were vaguely in favour of it in 2003 were later able to convince themselves that they were never really in favour of it, and thus avoid thinking "I got it wrong".

My biggest wonder with all this is how much the average person will actually be aware of it when we inevitably get a bad deal. May will do pretty much anything to make sure people don't feel the effects in obvious ways like prices going up, even if it means tanking the economy in ways they won't notice. It's the same problem that Labour has in pointing out that the Tories have failed to reach every deficit reduction target they've set themselves - the figures themselves are entirely abstract and the message doesn't cut through unless people are prepared to listen.

Basically you can see how the era of spin led pretty much seamlessly to post-truth politics.

...how?! I mean short of literally paying to subsidise imported good, I'm not sure how she gets around that 20% currency drop.

The other side of it is that I think the anti-Brexit side will be vindicated. There are a few reasons for that, but the one most likely to not get me told off for talking Britain down (or something) by the likes of PeaceMob is that the deal Theresa is aiming for (pay more than we pay for EU membership to begin with to keep single market access for a few select sectors) is going to go down like a cup of cold sick among a lot of Brexit voters, even besides how the economy's doing by that stage. And it's pretty much the best we could hope for the EU to agree to.

As long as Theresa May ends freedom of movement and the UK has complete control over our borders, the European Court of Justice can no longer overrule the UK's laws and decisions, and we no longer pay towards the EU budget then I think the British people will be more than happy with the Prime Minster and the government. If she fails on any of this, Brexit voters won't see her as a traitor because she did vote to stay in the EU but she will be absolutely hated, far more than Thatcher could ever dream of, and it will throw the 2020 election wide open.