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 The lovely discussion of all things EU and/or Brexit, Part V |
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 26th January 2019, 09:16 PM
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#421
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 BuzzJack Enthusiast
Joined: 1 June 2013
Posts: 527 User: 19,091 
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QUOTE(Common Sense @ Jan 26 2019, 09:10 PM)  What makes you think you'll have to leave the country? Another scare story. Mrs. May said that no Europeans will have to leave. Am sure you'll be able to stay here. You've got in the wrong way around. I'm British living abroad. We do not know what will happen yet after March 29th. If(and it's a BIG if at this point) theres a deal, then there will be transition period which will last until December 2020, during this time we'll be able to apply for residency. That is only in the event of a deal. If there is no deal, then we literally don't know at this point what will happen. Take a look on the government website. It explains this clearly. So excuse me if I have little time for your nonsense. This post has been edited by mald487: 26th January 2019, 09:18 PM |
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26th January 2019, 09:24 PM
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#422
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 Queen of Soon
Joined: 24 May 2007
Posts: 74,088 User: 3,474
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Thanks for answering my question there Chris. You don’t have an answer because there is no justification for racism
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26th January 2019, 09:28 PM
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#423
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nabad
Pronouns: he/him
Joined: 13 February 2013 Posts: 28,374 User: 18,316
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QUOTE(Common Sense @ Jan 26 2019, 09:04 PM) I resent the personal insults. I am unable to work due to illness and am not one of these workshy scroungers who just want to linger on benefits. Oh please. Nobody's insulting you; merely pointing out the facts and how absolutely ridiculous your thoughts on how brilliant leaving the EU is. You say you're not a scrounger and don't want to be on benefits, yet almost all of your judgement on EU immigration in the UK stems from assuming they may also be on benefits, draining resources, etc. You've tried to argue however many times over the impact that certain outcomes would have on your benefits, so clearly you're expecting yourself to be in receipt of benefits for a good while without actively job-seeking or finding the help that you might need. |
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27th January 2019, 06:40 AM
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#424
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 Paul Hyett
Joined: 4 April 2006
Posts: 25,346 User: 364
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QUOTE(Suedehead2 @ Jan 26 2019, 04:42 PM) What money saved? Nearly all the forecasts suggest that the net effect of leaving will be negative. The UK's net contribution (after allowing for the rebate and grants for various projects) will be more than wiped out by the impact on the economy, including the impact on trade. At the moment that's just speculation. QUOTE(Rooney @ Jan 26 2019, 05:05 PM) Chris surely at this moment you are just trolling. Nobody voted for No Deal. We also didn't not vote for No Deal - it simply wasn't an option. QUOTE(Common Sense @ Jan 26 2019, 05:44 PM) Well am proud to be a Brexiteer and have nothing to hide. Quite so - why should we be ashamed for putting the priorities of our our country ahead of others? QUOTE(T Boy @ Jan 26 2019, 08:44 PM) And I’m proud that I put not just what I wanted first, but what was best for our country. You seem to have put only your selfish reasons first since your yet to tell us what we’re going to gain from any of this. You don't think Brexiters also believe we are putting the interests of our country first?  The only difference is that we are looking long-term at the bigger picture, rather than at short-term economics.
This post has been edited by vidcapper: 27th January 2019, 06:41 AM |
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27th January 2019, 08:02 AM
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#425
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Radical Pink Troll
Joined: 11 March 2006
Posts: 26,606 User: 177
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QUOTE(vidcapper @ Jan 27 2019, 06:40 AM) At the moment that's just speculation. We also didn't not vote for No Deal - it simply wasn't an option. Quite so - why should we be ashamed for putting the priorities of our our country ahead of others? You don't think Brexiters also believe we are putting the interests of our country first? The only difference is that we are looking long-term at the bigger picture, rather than at short-term economics.Then can you finally reveal what the bigger picture is? And none of this ‘political freedom’ nonsense, I want actual detail. What benefit will I see from me struggling in the near future? |
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27th January 2019, 08:19 AM
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#426
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Paul Hyett
Joined: 4 April 2006
Posts: 25,346 User: 364
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QUOTE(T Boy @ Jan 27 2019, 08:02 AM) Then can you finally reveal what the bigger picture is? And none of this ‘political freedom’ nonsense, I want actual detail. What benefit will I see from me struggling in the near future? I'm sorry that you don't think political freedom is worth anything - and how do you *know* you will be struggling? NB There can be no specific detail for a relatively abstract concept like political freedom, at least none that I know by experience that Remainers would accept. |
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27th January 2019, 08:40 AM
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#427
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BuzzJack Legend
Joined: 18 July 2012
Posts: 22,851 User: 17,376
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QUOTE(vidcapper @ Jan 27 2019, 06:40 AM) At the moment that's just speculation. We also didn't not vote for No Deal - it simply wasn't an option. Quite so - why should we be ashamed for putting the priorities of our our country ahead of others? You don't think Brexiters also believe we are putting the interests of our country first? The only difference is that we are looking long-term at the bigger picture, rather than at short-term economics.1. The government's own stats and the Bank of England, and business and economic experts the world over all say it will be worse, so we can speculate that the sky will turn pink tomorrow but the reality is that it will almost certainly be blue. Grasping at straws because you don;t like the evidence. 2. All the people in the Liar Leave campaign said there would be a deal for definite. People believed them. Trying to rewrite recent history again cos you don;t like reality. 3. Remainers are also putting the priority of the country first - that YOU choose to think we are and will be worse off is your choice, but that doesn't mean remainers are some self-destructive species of lemmings. That is how we see Leavers, so stop trying to claim moral higher ground again, both sides think the same. 4. Remainers also look to the long-term, and in fact demonstrate an ability to look at consequences, both long-term and short-term, in a way that leading brexiters don't and can't other than make vague unsubstantiated promises that they fail to carry out. Can't even deliver on things they promised 3 years ago, never mind 40 years from now. |
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27th January 2019, 08:55 AM
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#428
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 BuzzJack Legend
Joined: 13 April 2007
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Davy Davey promised that we would get “the exact same benefits” as we currently get from membership of the Single Market. When it was suggested that that was only possible by remaining a member of the SM, he just ignored the point - as did all his fellow Quitters. It should be clear to anyone that that promise cannot possibly be met by crashing out without a deal.
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27th January 2019, 09:06 AM
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#429
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#38BBE0 otherwise known as 'sky blue'
Joined: 27 October 2008
Posts: 16,173 User: 7,561
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Well as Sir Vince said: Years of economic pain justified by the 'exotic spresm' of leaving the European Union.
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27th January 2019, 10:24 AM
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#430
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Radical Pink Troll
Joined: 11 March 2006
Posts: 26,606 User: 177
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QUOTE(vidcapper @ Jan 27 2019, 08:19 AM) I'm sorry that you don't think political freedom is worth anything - and how do you *know* you will be struggling? NB There can be no specific detail for a relatively abstract concept like political freedom, at least none that I know by experience that Remainers would accept. It’s not that I think it’s not worth anything, it’s more that I can’t see that we don’t have it now. And it’s a pretty much certainty that everyone bar the richest of the rich will struggle with No Deal. Again, you’re unable to actually answer any question about the benefits of leaving. |
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27th January 2019, 11:23 AM
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#431
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Bitch of t seet
Joined: 2 April 2012
Posts: 27,396 User: 16,660
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Not the Brexiteers actually admitting that there was no vote for or against a No Deal therefor making their own argument of the peoples vote void 😂😂😂
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27th January 2019, 11:59 AM
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#432
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Paul Hyett
Joined: 4 April 2006
Posts: 25,346 User: 364
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QUOTE(T Boy @ Jan 27 2019, 10:24 AM) It’s not that I think it’s not worth anything, it’s more that I can’t see that we don’t have it now. Again, you’re unable to actually answer any question about the benefits of leaving. 1. Not as much as I'd like. 2. Not *unable* |
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27th January 2019, 12:16 PM
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#433
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BuzzJack Legend
Joined: 18 July 2012
Posts: 22,851 User: 17,376
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QUOTE(vidcapper @ Jan 27 2019, 11:59 AM) 2. Not *unable* "I'm keeping my well-supported views secret just as I have been doing for 3 years but I'll keep repeating the same phrases over and over until you annoying people with facts and reason and truth shut up and accept the lies that have been spread by rich foreigners and rich Tories and believed by millions" BTW I see Mr May getting involved in the discussion today instead of sticking with his own day-job of generating money for rich people by storing it in tax havens and investments and clever financial instruments. I wonder why he's so keen on getting it sorted out before the EU rules on open-ness come into force later in the year? |
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27th January 2019, 12:48 PM
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#434
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Radical Pink Troll
Joined: 11 March 2006
Posts: 26,606 User: 177
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QUOTE(vidcapper @ Jan 27 2019, 11:59 AM) 1. Not as much as I'd like. 2. Not *unable* 1. Not as much as you’d like. Enlighten me as to what this extra freedom is that we don’t have please. 2. Perhaps you are able but you’ve refused to do so. And now it feels like I’m talking to one of my students. |
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27th January 2019, 03:04 PM
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#435
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Paul Hyett
Joined: 4 April 2006
Posts: 25,346 User: 364
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Is it any wonder I refuse to post my reasons, when *every single time* I try, they get dismissed as Leave propaganda, and myself treated like a re**** for believing them...
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27th January 2019, 03:13 PM
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#436
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 WINTER IS COMING
Joined: 7 March 2006
Posts: 45,604 User: 88
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QUOTE(vidcapper @ Jan 27 2019, 03:04 PM) Is it any wonder I refuse to post my reasons, when *every single time* I try, they get dismissed as Leave propaganda, and myself treated like a re**** for believing them... I completely respect your views Vidcapper's and Chris' as well. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions. I think from both sides there is propaganda and fear, not all of it likely to be true. But a strong country is built on a strong economy. By all accounts, it will take years and years for our economy to prosper -this is not short term economics, it's not even medium term economics, it's long term economics. Crashing out with No Deal and then trying to negotiate deals is just quite frankly the most short sighted thing our country could possible do. Esentially we are creating a decision that will benefit absolutely nobody that is able to vote as most of us will be pensioers or dead by the time any economic grand master plan comes to fruition. I can see the argument for leaving the EU but I cannot see the argument for leaving the EU without a deal because there is not one. Not one person has come up with an argument that is any good and there's a reason the majority of the politicians are so against a No Deal bar the usual loonatics - because they know we are commiting economic suicide. |
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27th January 2019, 03:28 PM
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#437
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BuzzJack Legend
Joined: 13 April 2007
Posts: 36,676 User: 3,272
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N nobody has even put a convincing case for long-term economic benefits. Leavers have been asked many straightforward questions, but they haven't even attempted to answer most of them. For example, why would a country give an island of 65m people a better trade deal than the one they'd give a bloc of 500m?
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27th January 2019, 03:40 PM
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#438
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WINTER IS COMING
Joined: 7 March 2006
Posts: 45,604 User: 88
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QUOTE(Suedehead2 @ Jan 27 2019, 03:28 PM) N nobody has even put a convincing case for long-term economic benefits. Leavers have been asked many straightforward questions, but they haven't even attempted to answer most of them. For example, why would a country give an island of 65m people a better trade deal than the one they'd give a bloc of 500m? This is what I don't get either, we have no poker face and no strong negotiation points. How do people expect we're going to get good Trade Deals? Of course everyone is going to want to trade with us because they see a great opportunity to get a great deal for themselves and because we have zero leverage and we need to negotiate deals we're going to get screwed over. It's just pig ignorant and if anyone belives that the USA is going to offer us a fantastic trade deal, because they are not. Right now are they are in true isoloationism and see an opportunity to make a great deal that benefits themselves. |
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27th January 2019, 03:44 PM
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#439
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BuzzJack Legend
Joined: 7 March 2006
Posts: 22,001 User: 53
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This is the latest then. From The Guardian online. Light at the end of the tunnel at last?
Jean Claude Juncker has reportedly told Theresa May in a private phone call this morning, Sunday, that shifting her red lines in favour of a permanent customs union is the price she will need to pay for the EU revising the Irish backstop. Without a major shift in the prime minister’s position, the European commission president told May that the current terms of the withdrawal agreement were non-negotiable. Details of the call, contained in a leaked diplomatic note, emerged as Juncker’s deputy, Frans Timmermans, said there had been no weakening of the resolve in Brussels in support of Ireland, and accused the Tory Brexiters of a “cavalier” approach to peace. |
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27th January 2019, 03:56 PM
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#440
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BuzzJack Legend
Joined: 13 April 2007
Posts: 36,676 User: 3,272
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The hardline Quitters won’t be happy with that.
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