BuzzJack
Entertainment Discussion

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register | Help )

Latest Site News
7 Pages V  « < 5 6 7  
Reply to this topicStart new topic
> Possible second independence referendum
Track this topic - Email this topic - Print this topic - Download this topic - Subscribe to this forum
What would you vote?
You cannot see the results of the poll until you have voted. Please login and cast your vote to see the results of this poll.
Total Votes: 41
Guests cannot vote 
crazy chris
post Mar 17 2017, 04:13 PM
Post #121
BuzzJack Legend
*******
Group: Members
Posts: 21,996
Member No.: 53
Joined: 7-March 06
   No Gallery Pics
 


QUOTE(Silas @ Mar 14 2017, 09:57 AM) *
On what grounds? You got your economically fatal little racist vote that resulted in the murder of an MP. Why shouldn't Scotland, a country that existed for 1000 years before the union, get the option to choose its own path of self determination?



It's made that choice and the decision was to stay in the UK. They should at least wait a generation or at least 10 years for another vote. Sturgeon's just obsessed. No wonder she's got armed police protection now because of awful Twitter comments about her. Don't agree with those but she's annoying many people.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
PeaceMob
post Mar 17 2017, 04:16 PM
Post #122
BuzzJack Enthusiast
****
Group: Members
Posts: 527
Member No.: 21,342
Joined: 4-November 14
   No Gallery Pics
 


QUOTE(Suedehead2 @ Mar 17 2017, 04:04 PM) *
Would you like to explain what you mean by federalisation? By my definition, the two classic examples of a federal state are the USA and Germany. The federal constitution of Germany was written by British lawyers with the specific aim of limiting the power of central government.


The EU's aim is a federal state like the USA, that's why the euro currency was created and there is now talk of one European army replacing NATO. I'm totally against all of that, my nationality is British/English, not European (or whatever they'll call it).
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Suedehead2
post Mar 17 2017, 04:22 PM
Post #123
BuzzJack Legend
*******
Group: Veteran
Posts: 36,580
Member No.: 3,272
Joined: 13-April 07
   No Gallery Pics
 


QUOTE(PeaceMob @ Mar 17 2017, 04:16 PM) *
The EU's aim is a federal state like the USA, that's why the euro currency was created and there is now talk of one European army replacing NATO. I'm totally against all of that, my nationality is British/English, not European (or whatever they'll call it).

Are you aware of how much autonomy the American states have? The USA is a long way from being a centralised state.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Anita Hanjaab
post Mar 17 2017, 04:31 PM
Post #124
Buffy/Charmed
*******
Group: Members
Posts: 43,883
Member No.: 18,639
Joined: 18-April 13
   No Gallery Pics
 


I am European. Not a Little Englander.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Popchartfreak
post Mar 17 2017, 06:58 PM
Post #125
BuzzJack Legend
*******
Group: Moderator
Posts: 22,695
Member No.: 17,376
Joined: 18-July 12
   No Gallery Pics
 


May's argument is that Scotland can't vote until we know the terms of Brexit.

I'm happy to agree to this as long as the whole of the UK can have the same vote once we know all the terms of the agreement (or no agreement at all). David Davis is as thick as pig shit. He failed to answer almost all questions about preparing for Brexit, and it's his job to be prepared, he's had 9 months to work out what happens. (and 40 years)

Sadly, May seems to think a democratic vote won be a mere 4% means that they have permission to bypass Parliament, the british people (most of whom DIDNT vote for Brexit) and to cock up negotiations pursuing a hard brexit that wasn't on the ballot.

I'll also remind everyone that neither the PM nor her Chancellor had read their own Manifesto, before raising National Insurance, and then backing down when they upset their own interests. Talk about useless. I don't trust this shower to sort out organising a street market properly never mind complex subjects.

Talk about undemocratic, kettle calling the frying pan black arse. May's arse is blacker than anyone's, the hypocrite.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Suedehead2
post Mar 17 2017, 09:18 PM
Post #126
BuzzJack Legend
*******
Group: Veteran
Posts: 36,580
Member No.: 3,272
Joined: 13-April 07
   No Gallery Pics
 


May is clearly trying to demonstrate that she has been listening to the arguments against leaving the EU. Unfortunately, rather than drawing the obvious conclusion, she is simply deploying the same arguments against Scottish independence. After all, she was recently saying that Scotland would be mad to sever close ties with their closest trading partner. After all, what sort of idiot would do that? unsure.gif
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Silas
post Mar 18 2017, 12:17 AM
Post #127
Queen of Soon
********
Group: Moderator
Posts: 74,015
Member No.: 3,474
Joined: 24-May 07
 


QUOTE(Qassändra @ Mar 17 2017, 02:59 PM) *
Outskilled them...how? She's made the entire fate of the union contingent on the EU giving the UK a good deal. You're going to have to decide which enemy is actually an enemy at some point. It's not exactly going to be bloody difficult for the SNP to win a majority if there's a majority for Scottish independence by then, considering they won one at a time when there definitely wasn't and came a shade off getting another last year.

*in a parliamentary system designed to prevent majorities. Support for independence doesn't equate with support for the SNP though there is a very high correlation. The Greens have seen a rise in popularity thanks to their pro-indy stance so there is majority support in Holyrood.

QUOTE(PeaceMob @ Mar 17 2017, 03:53 PM) *
The majority of the Scottish people do not want a second referendum so soon, Theresa May anticipated what Nicola Sturgeon would do and by refusing this referendum the PM knew that she would have the majority of Scotland backing her to refuse this referendum, that's why all this bluster from the SNP is just laughable, they look like a massive joke party. Now Theresa May has shown Scotland that a Conservative Prime Minster DOES listen to Scotland, and the SNP only represents themselves.

And no I don't see the EU as the enemy, not when the UK will be out of the EU soon and we will be mostly just a trading partner with it. The EU can go ahead with their federalisation of one European nation just as long as the UK is well away from that nonsense.

This is a miscalculation by May. To suggest it's a victory is woefully naive and shows that you have not one iota of understanding of Scotland, it's people nor Scottish politics.

Support for Indy is already at 50%. Support for May is much lower than in England. Much lower.

The Scottish intensely dislike being dictated to by anyone but especially by Tory PMs.

May makes the assumption that she will retain the support of the many who say "not pre-brexit" with this. This is a miscalculation. A majority support the right of the Scottish parliament to determine timing.

This is a complete political gift to Sturgeon as it gives the Indy campaign a great platform to campaign on until they get their vote and given some of the language used, 2 years of hearing May say that over and over while watching a Hard Brexit like a slow motion car crash will make the result very firmly for independence.

Also, a vast majority support the single market. Even many of Ruth's tories. So the hard brexit shows explicitly she doesn't care one f*** about Scotlands democratic nor political wishes so no one will read this as May listening to Scotland.

QUOTE(Suedehead2 @ Mar 17 2017, 09:18 PM) *
May is clearly trying to demonstrate that she has been listening to the arguments against leaving the EU. Unfortunately, rather than drawing the obvious conclusion, she is simply deploying the same arguments against Scottish independence. After all, she was recently saying that Scotland would be mad to sever close ties with their closest trading partner. After all, what sort of idiot would do that? unsure.gif
It's so absurd it's actually hilarious.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
lotita
post Mar 18 2017, 12:33 AM
Post #128
feminist icon (she/her)
*******
Group: Site Empress
Posts: 25,340
Member No.: 21,777
Joined: 21-April 15
   No Gallery Pics
 


QUOTE(PeaceMob @ Mar 17 2017, 04:16 PM) *
The EU's aim is a federal state like the USA, that's why the euro currency was created and there is now talk of one European army replacing NATO. I'm totally against all of that, my nationality is British/English, not European (or whatever they'll call it).


why do you feel so threatened by the idea of an european nationality/identity? federalism isn't some big scary thing, in fact imo it could make the EU more democratic. i'd personally be a supporter of moving towards a federal europe, not that i ever see it happening sadly.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Suedehead2
post Mar 18 2017, 11:48 PM
Post #129
BuzzJack Legend
*******
Group: Veteran
Posts: 36,580
Member No.: 3,272
Joined: 13-April 07
   No Gallery Pics
 


QUOTE
“..if Brexit isn’t fatal to the European Union, we might find that it is fatal to the Union with Scotland. The SNP have already said that in the event that Britain votes to leave but Scotland votes to remain in the EU, they will press for another Scottish independence referendum.

'And the opinion polls show consistently that the Scottish people are more likely to be in favour of EU membership than the people of England and Wales.

“If the people of Scotland are forced to choose between the United Kingdom and the European Union we do not know what the result would be.

"But only a little more than eighteen months after the referendum that kept the United Kingdom together, I do not want to see the country I love at risk of dismemberment once more.

"I do not want the people of Scotland to think that English Eurosceptics put their dislike of Brussels ahead of our bond with Edinburgh and Glasgow.

"I do not want the European Union to cause the destruction of an older and much more precious Union, the Union between England and Scotland…

“We should remain in the EU.”


The words of Theresa May from April 2016, a little under a year ago. She is now claiming that the SNP are somehow being sneaky in trying to hold another referendum. So sneaky that even Mayhem had already spotted their tactics a year ago.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Popchartfreak
post Mar 19 2017, 10:01 AM
Post #130
BuzzJack Legend
*******
Group: Moderator
Posts: 22,695
Member No.: 17,376
Joined: 18-July 12
   No Gallery Pics
 


I love it when one can throw a politicians words back at themselves, because the only response they can have is "cos I say so"....

Hypocrite May.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post


7 Pages V  « < 5 6 7
Reply to this topicStart new topic

1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:


 

Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 28th March 2024 - 05:57 PM