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 New Political party? |
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 Feb 4 2019, 06:37 AM
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#21
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 Paul Hyett
Joined: 4 April 2006
Posts: 25,346 User: 364 
 
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QUOTE(Harve @ Feb 3 2019, 04:06 PM)  The problem is not Corbyn though, and dumping him will create as many electoral problems as it would solve. The party won't dump him anyway. The problem is FPTP and we decided to keep that in 2011. Despite it being a footnote in history, I'll always remember that referendum as it was the first time I was politically engaged! Part of the problem was the choice offered - Alternative Vote was just about the worst of all the other possible systems. Not genuinely proportional at all.  QUOTE(Popchartfreak @ Feb 3 2019, 04:58 PM) both main parties need a rocket up the arse. Amen to that!  |
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Feb 7 2019, 06:45 PM
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#22
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 Howdy, disco citizens
Joined: 16 January 2010
Posts: 12,775 User: 10,455
   
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Owen Smith, who failed to unseat Corbyn as the leader of Labour, has suggested that he and other Labour members could leave over Jeremy Corbyn's Brexit stance. Coupled with other goings on in the party, including Luciana Berger having a vote of no-confidence put against her at her local party, we could see a new grouping much sooner than one might have expected (although I do remain somewhat sceptical).
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Feb 8 2019, 06:31 AM
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#23
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Paul Hyett
Joined: 4 April 2006
Posts: 25,346 User: 364
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QUOTE(Brett-Butler @ Feb 7 2019, 06:45 PM) Owen Smith, who failed to unseat Corbyn as the leader of Labour, has suggested that he and other Labour members could leave over Jeremy Corbyn's Brexit stance. Coupled with other goings on in the party, including Luciana Berger having a vote of no-confidence put against her at her local party, we could see a new grouping much sooner than one might have expected (although I do remain somewhat sceptical). Anyone see a potential major realignment of British politics? 
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Feb 8 2019, 07:47 AM
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#24
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Howdy, disco citizens
Joined: 16 January 2010
Posts: 12,775 User: 10,455
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QUOTE(vidcapper @ Feb 8 2019, 07:31 AM) Anyone see a potential major realignment of British politics? In a word, no. Although we could see a temporary realignment with various factions breaking away from the main parties, by the next election the electorate will gravitate back to the main two parties. One of the many drawbacks of FPTP is that is always benefits the established parties. |
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Feb 8 2019, 09:58 AM
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#25
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Paul Hyett
Joined: 4 April 2006
Posts: 25,346 User: 364
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QUOTE(Brett-Butler @ Feb 8 2019, 07:47 AM) In a word, no. Although we could see a temporary realignment with various factions breaking away from the main parties, by the next election the electorate will gravitate back to the main two parties. One of the many drawbacks of FPTP is that is always benefits the established parties. Too true - the last party that broke into the mainstream was Labour, a hundred years ago - and even that was due to franchising millions of new working class voters, rather than a sea-change in existing voters...
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Feb 8 2019, 10:21 AM
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#26
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BuzzJack Legend
Joined: 18 July 2012
Posts: 22,792 User: 17,376
 
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however a minor new party with a few seats could hold the balance of power, and if it's centrist could force the nuttier extremism of the left and right back to the centre - aware that the electorate will blame them for everything the bigger parties do, or course as they try to rewrite history at the next election. Like saying austerity was a Tory thing, when it was also a Labour thing, one just outbid the other on the severity of it, which happened under Labour watch after a decade in power.
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Feb 8 2019, 03:12 PM
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#27
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Paul Hyett
Joined: 4 April 2006
Posts: 25,346 User: 364
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QUOTE(Popchartfreak @ Feb 8 2019, 10:21 AM) however a minor new party with a few seats could hold the balance of power, and if it's centrist could force the nuttier extremism of the left and right back to the centre - aware that the electorate will blame them for everything the bigger parties do, or course as they try to rewrite history at the next election. Like saying austerity was a Tory thing, when it was also a Labour thing, one just outbid the other on the severity of it, which happened under Labour watch after a decade in power. At the time I think austerity was necessary, due to the economic climate, but perhaps it went on longer than was really needed. People seem to want action in the economy, rather than ticking along at a slow & steady, if safe, pace. |
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Feb 8 2019, 06:33 PM
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#28
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Howdy, disco citizens
Joined: 16 January 2010
Posts: 12,775 User: 10,455
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Nigel Farage has officially launched his new political party, the Brexit Party. Despite his rhetoric about getting thousands of defectors from the Tory ranks, I don't think it is going to amount to much.
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Feb 18 2019, 08:08 AM
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#29
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 ❤️❤️➕🟦
Joined: 3 June 2012
Posts: 22,246 User: 17,160
     
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A group of Labour MPs are set to resign this morning according to Laura Kuennsberg
eeeek.... |
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Feb 18 2019, 10:20 AM
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#30
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❤️❤️➕🟦
Joined: 3 June 2012
Posts: 22,246 User: 17,160
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Luciana Berger, Mike Gapes, Ann Coffey, Chris Leslie, Angela Smith, Chuka Umunna, Gavin Shuker all resigned to form the Independent Group.
Bit of a silly name as it takes away from the actual Independant MPs who don’t stand with a party. There’s rumours that they will stand for re-election in marginal constituencies rather than their current omes |
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Feb 18 2019, 11:50 AM
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#31
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 I'm a paragon so don't perceive me
Joined: 3 February 2011
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By itself it's pretty small. If certain Tories followed them, or they joined up with the Lib Dems (something that they have ruled out right now), then it could be something not totally insignificant on a national scale.
I understand why they did it, from what I know of them, particularly Luciana and Chuka, their interests aren't aligning with the party and haven't for some time, but if it doesn't force anything further, it will turn out to be a large mistake. |
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Feb 18 2019, 12:52 PM
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#32
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 Break the tension
Joined: 7 March 2006
Posts: 88,842 User: 51
 
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Why don't they just call it "Chukavision"?
I did laugh at what the BBC commentator said earlier: "7 MPs might be enough for a dinner party, but not necessarily a new political party". |
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Feb 18 2019, 12:53 PM
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#33
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 there's nothing straight about plump Elvis
Pronouns: they/any
Joined: 21 January 2016 Posts: 13,129 User: 22,895 
  
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Self serving traitors imo.
Everything they claim to feel so strongly about, if that was really the case you think they'd have stood up then and there rather than waiting for a politically expedient time that just *happened* to coincide with their own knterests coming into conflict with party policy, and their constant attempts to drag the party to the right and/or seize leadership control being continually rebuffed. Good riddance if you ask me. |
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Feb 18 2019, 02:58 PM
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#34
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BuzzJack Legend
Joined: 18 July 2012
Posts: 22,792 User: 17,376
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errr when you get members of the party (Hi Boy Owen!) doing their utmost to get rid of anyone that doesnt toe the party line a la Corbynism (who was happily tolerated for decades despite not being aligned with mainstream Labour) then it's not at all surprising that MP's made to feel alienated and unwanted do what they've been pressured to do for the last couple of years by the same people now hypocritically slagging them off for leaving after telling them to leave over and over again.
What goes around comes around and if the intolerant shoe fits..... |
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Feb 18 2019, 03:42 PM
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#35
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 BuzzJack Legend
Joined: 13 April 2007
Posts: 36,647 User: 3,272
 
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The Labour response to this is boringly predictable. It's exactly the same response that we've heard every time an MP chooses to leave their party. No doubt we will hear exactly the same response if a batch of Tories finally decide that they can no longer stomach being in the same party as Jack Mogg.
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Feb 18 2019, 03:51 PM
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#36
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 BuzzJack Enthusiast
Joined: 21 March 2006
Posts: 570 User: 294 
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Both Labour and the Conservative parties could do with splitting. They have both reached the stage where they simply cannot contain the wide variety of views on certain key issues any longer. FPTP forces these bloated parties trying to be all things to all people.
I would have some respect for "the 7" is they triggered by elections and gave their constituents a "people's vote" on them, but it seems they won't be doing so- probably because they know they would all lose. |
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Feb 18 2019, 04:05 PM
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#37
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Paul Hyett
Joined: 4 April 2006
Posts: 25,346 User: 364
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QUOTE(Esmerelda @ Feb 18 2019, 03:51 PM) Both Labour and the Conservative parties could do with splitting. They have both reached the stage where they simply cannot contain the wide variety of views on certain key issues any longer. FPTP forces these bloated parties trying to be all things to all people. It seems that voting reform is the one thing we virtually all agree on QUOTE I would have some respect for "the 7" is they triggered by elections and gave their constituents a "people's vote" on them, but it seems they won't be doing so- probably because they know they would all lose. They're only delaying the inevitable until the next GE though.
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Feb 18 2019, 04:37 PM
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#38
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BuzzJack Legend
Joined: 13 April 2007
Posts: 36,647 User: 3,272
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The fact that the seven haven't formed another party may be because they hope to be able to rejoin the Labour fold at some point. Of course, they may find that their constituency party has gone ahead and selected a new candidate by then.
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Feb 18 2019, 06:13 PM
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#39
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Howdy, disco citizens
Joined: 16 January 2010
Posts: 12,775 User: 10,455
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New Party Day! This is one of my favourite "once in a blue moon" days, alongside new Pope day.
It will be interesting to see what happens with them. Although SDP comparisons will abound, it's worth noting that unlike them, none of the 7 would have been household names, with the possible exception of Chuka Umunna. And if it means that more people will realise that the SDP are still going, then all the better. If there are other further defections, only in the Tory camp, Anna Soubry, one of the most pro-Remain Conservatives, could be amongst them. However, I still maintain that come the next election, things will once again rebalance in favour of the Big 2. |
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Feb 18 2019, 07:07 PM
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#40
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I Drink Wine
Joined: 12 April 2015
Posts: 10,484 User: 21,753
 
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I've signed up to support them and ready to be selected as a candidate in the June election x
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