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BuzzJack Music Forum _ News and Politics _ Zimbabwe Military takeover
Posted by: Chez Wombat 15th November 2017, 01:46 PM
Big news this morning. Avoiding the word 'coup' though it very much seems that way.
Mr Mugabe told Mr Zuma in a phone call that he was fine, the South African leader's office said.
Troops are patrolling the capital, Harare, after they seized state TV and said they were targeting "criminals".
The move may be a bid to replace Mr Mugabe with his sacked deputy, Emmerson Mnangagwa, BBC correspondents say.
Mr Mnangagwa's dismissal last week left Mr Mugabe's wife Grace as the president's likely successor.
Heavy gun and artillery fire could be heard in northern parts of Harare early on Wednesday.
Mr Mugabe, 93, has dominated the impoverished country's political scene since it gained independence from the UK in 1980.
Reason given so far is that they are targeting 'criminals around (Mugabe) who are committing crimes... that are causing social and economic suffering in the country'. I hope the Zimbabwean people are OK, but really if anywhere is in dire need of a change of leadership, it's here.
Posted by: Suedehead2 15th November 2017, 01:59 PM
There are strong suggestions that this is designed to prevent Mugabe's wife succeeding him. It's hard to think anyone could do a worse job than Mugabe, but we've tough that before about other countries.
Posted by: Brébino 15th November 2017, 02:28 PM
From what I've read his wife is even crazier than he is so it's probably a good thing if they're trying to block her from being his successor (not that I have much hope their chosen successor will be much better than him either). Been keeping an eye on the news about this all day. I'm shocked at him (seemingly) going out this way after so long, thought he would have just ended up dying in office.
Posted by: Suedehead2 15th November 2017, 02:42 PM
It may be that the organisers of the putsch suspect he won't live much longer and are, therefore, pre-empting an attempt to install Mrs M in power.
Posted by: Popchartfreak 15th November 2017, 02:53 PM
she's reportedly out of the country. I'm sure that must just be co-incidence....
Mugabe blames Tony Blair for Zimbabwe's troubles, I hear. Momentum must quite torn at that... 
Posted by: 5 Silas Frřkner 19th November 2017, 08:45 PM
Mugabe is refusing to step down, his party have removed him as leader in favour of the former Vice President. Although that really solves no problems as it's basically Mugabe the second.
Posted by: Brébino 21st November 2017, 03:56 PM
He has just resigned now apparently (he was all but certain to get impeached anyway).
Posted by: Suedehead2 21st November 2017, 04:21 PM
This means that the search for someone who is sorry to see him go can begin. His wife doesn't count.
Posted by: Brett-Butler 21st November 2017, 06:43 PM
Another tyrant leaves the stage then. Interestingly, I didn't realise that Mugabe seized power as a Marxist, and still identified as a socialist until recently. I'm guessing he believed in a socialism of 1.
As good news as this might be, the fatalist in me still has a feeling that whomever takes over Zimbabwe will end up being just as bad, or even worse, than Mugabe ever was. I had the same feeling when the Arab Spring happened when people were cheering the democratic steps there (which with minor exceptions failed to materialise), and I have a feeling that the same will happen here, especially if a power vacuum opens up. I'd love to be proved wrong, of course.
Posted by: Klaus 21st November 2017, 07:04 PM
*enter Common Sense stage right*
Posted by: Brett-Butler 21st November 2017, 07:16 PM
The BBC managed to find someone about 20 minutes ago. They had a pan-African on who praised Mugabe for his "redistribution of farms", and chastised Nelson Mandela for not doing the same in South Africa.
Posted by: Brébino 21st November 2017, 07:34 PM
Wasn't this (a big part of) what led to Zimbabwe getting into such a bad state economically in the first place?
The army's favoured replacement for Mugabe is the ex vice president Emmerson Mnangagwa who doesn't seem like he'll be a great deal different to Mugabe (he is a long-time ally).
Posted by: 5 Silas Frřkner 21st November 2017, 08:51 PM
As in understand it, yes. There was some criticism that land was given to people without the skills or capability to manage and farm it properly so they failed. A good idea in principle but poor execution. There needed to be an education programme along side it to upskill the people that were getting the land so they could prosper.
The flip side is that a lot of highly skilled people left Zimbabwe en masse with no one really able to replace them immediately.
I do get the feeling that this is more of an internal power struggle over his replacement rather than a change of ideology. Can’t see much changing, especially as the new leader has mainly lead the opposition crack down!
Posted by: Chez Wombat 21st November 2017, 09:18 PM
Well, it's always good to see a power hungry tyrant ousted. I don't have an awful lot of confidence that Emmerson Mnangagwa will be much different seeing as they worked together for such a long time, I suppose at least it's not his own choice of replacement?
Posted by: The Diplomat 21st November 2017, 09:31 PM
Should have all the white farmers been replaced though, a small proportion equal to the percentage of the white minority in the general population would have been a better idea to let keep their farms in order to keep a fair balance and stop racial tensions, with the rest of them distributed to black farmers.
I suppose it still probably would have caused tensions displacing ANY of the white farmers after independence anyway, but it was definitely needed to replace at least a good lot of them in order for the black majority to reclaim the country from colonialism.
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