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BuzzJack Music Forum _ News and Politics _ New policy match test

Posted by: Suedehead2 Mar 6 2015, 05:46 PM

There are bound to more of these in the coming weeks, but here is a site aimed at helping people decide how they ought to vote. I scored

Lab 42.9%
Lib Dem 42.9%
Green 14.3%

https://voteforpolicies.org.uk/survey/1/select-issues

Posted by: J▼hnkm Mar 6 2015, 05:53 PM

I did this a while back with the English parties as they don't have them for NI, but got this:

Crime: Conservatives
Economy: Conservatives
Environment: Liberal Democrats
Health/NHS: Labour
Welfare: Liberal Democrats
Democracy: Conservatives
Education: Greens
Europe: Labour
Immigration: Greens
Foreign Policy/Defence: Conservatives

Posted by: Danny Mar 6 2015, 05:58 PM

Greens 30%
Tories 30%(!!!)
Labour 20%
Lib Dems 20%

Crime - Lib Dems
Democracy - Labour
Economy - Greens
Education - Conservatives
Environment - Labour
Europe - Lib Dems
Foreign Policy - Conservatives
Health - Greens
Immigration - Conservatives
Welfare - Greens

Posted by: Suedehead2 Mar 6 2015, 05:59 PM

Just for a laugh, I plugged the current results into the electoral calculus predictor with the following result

Labour 317 seats
Greens 165
Lib Dem 124
Con 10 laugh.gif
UKIP 5

I didn't put in a figure for the SNP, so their figure (six) can't be taken seriously.

Posted by: April Mar 6 2015, 06:05 PM

50% Conservatives
25% Lib Dems
25% Green Party

Posted by: Brett-Butler Mar 6 2015, 06:34 PM

Same as John, no NI parties yet so plugged in to England. I got -

Conservatives - 40%
Green - 30%
Liberal Democrats - 20%
Labour -10%

Given that I always thought I was more in tune with Labour, I was taken a little bit aback by that.

By category -

Crime
Conservatives

Democracy
Conservatives

Economy
Labour

Education
Green Party

Environment
Conservatives

Europe
Liberal Democrats

Foreign Policy / Defence
Green Party

Health / NHS
Conservatives

Immigration
Green Party

Welfare
Liberal Democrats

Posted by: Chez Wombat Mar 6 2015, 06:35 PM

60% Liberal Democrats
30% Labour
10% Green

Crime: Liberal Democrats
Economy: Labour
Environment: Liberal Democrats
Foreign Policy/Defence: Liberal Democrats
Immigration: Green Party
Democracy: Labour
Education: Liberal Democrats
Europe: Liberal Democrats
Health / NHS: Liberal Democrats
Welfare: Labour

OK, so I suppose Lib Dems have some good policies I generally agree with, don't mean I can trust that they'll actually stick to them magic.gif

Posted by: Rooney Mar 6 2015, 07:01 PM

50% conservatives
20% lib dems
20% ukip
10% greens

Crime: Green
Economy: UKIP
Environment: UKIP
Foreign Policy: Conservative
Immigration: Lib Dems
Democracy: Conservative
Education: Lib Dems
Europe: Conservative
NHS: Conservative
Welfare: Conservative

Posted by: Doctor Blind Mar 6 2015, 07:13 PM

Liberal Democrats 40%
Green Party 30%
Labour 30%

I thought I was more Conservative on economic policy, but it turns out the Conservatives don't believe in free markets anymore.. so I guess not! biggrin.gif

Posted by: Harve Mar 6 2015, 08:28 PM

Liberal Democrats 40%
Labour 30%
SNP 20%
Scottish Greens 10%

Posted by: Suedehead2 Mar 6 2015, 08:43 PM

QUOTE(Chez Wombat @ Mar 6 2015, 06:35 PM) *
OK, so I suppose Lib Dems have some good policies I generally agree with, don't mean I can trust that they'll actually stick to them magic.gif

They've managed to implement more of their last manifesto than the party (and its predecessors) has managed for many decades tongue.gif

Posted by: Iz~ Mar 6 2015, 08:57 PM

Liberal Democrats 50%
Greens 30%
Labour 20%

Pretty much what I expected, and I think for most of the questions my second-preference was one of those three too. happy.gif

Crime: Lib Dems
Economy: Greens
Environment: Lib Dems
Foreign Policy: Greens
Immigration: Labour
Democracy: Labour
Education: Lib Dems
Europe: Lib Dems
Health: Lib Dems
Welfare: Greens

Posted by: LexC Mar 6 2015, 09:27 PM

Labour - 70%
Liberal Democrat - 20%
Green - 10%

Crime: Labour
Economy: Labour
Environment: Labour
Foreign Policy/Defence: Labour
Immigration: Green
Democracy: Lib Dem
Education: Labour
Europe: Labour
Health / NHS: Lib Dem
Welfare: Labour

So, essentially, Labour on all the important stuff.

Posted by: popchartfreak Mar 6 2015, 10:03 PM

wasted an hour on doing all of the options and then it went into an endless loop - just pick a few!

Suffice to say I would bound to have come out as mostly Lib Dem with a hint of Labour and Green. that seems to be the general theme amongst people who are less Lib Dem than I.....

Posted by: Qassändra Mar 7 2015, 12:17 AM

Labour (60%)
Lib Dems (40%)

Crime: Liberal Democrats
Democracy: Labour
Economy: Labour
Education: Liberal Democrats
Environment: Labour
Europe: Labour
Foreign Policy / Defence: Labour
Health / NHS: Labour
Immigration: Liberal Democrats
Welfare: Liberal Democrats

Posted by: RabbitFurCoat Mar 7 2015, 09:07 AM

Labour - 70%
Lib Dem - 20% - Immigration, Europe
Green - 10% - Crime

Posted by: Grandwicky Mar 7 2015, 10:05 AM

Labour 80%
Green 20%

Posted by: Silas Mar 7 2015, 05:02 PM

100% SNP

Oops.

Posted by: Suedehead2 Mar 7 2015, 06:02 PM

QUOTE(Silas @ Mar 7 2015, 05:02 PM) *
100% SNP

Oops.

Have they summarised every SNP policy as "Blame the English"?

Posted by: popchartfreak Mar 7 2015, 06:55 PM

QUOTE(Suedehead2 @ Mar 7 2015, 06:02 PM) *
Have they summarised every SNP policy as "Blame the English"?


Surely that should read in brackets "but shhhh don't mention the Scottish Prime Minister/Chancellor who ran the country along with the English PM"

So, apart from democracy, public transport, subsidies, free health, free education, one of the fairest benefits systems in the world, old age pensions, equality legislation... what have the Romans ever done for us...?!


Posted by: Soy Adrián Mar 7 2015, 11:37 PM

I think it's more that someone's a little too clued up on the mainfesto.

Posted by: Harve Mar 8 2015, 12:03 PM

QUOTE(Soy Adrián @ Mar 8 2015, 12:37 AM) *
I think it's more that someone's a little too clued up on the mainfesto.

As long as you know that the SNP are a nationalist party who only run in Scotland, it was obvious whenever you were reading points from their manifesto. Unlike other parties they never used the word 'Britain' and always replaced it with 'Scotland' or 'Scottish', even when talking about external issues like the EU. It wasn't anonymous at all and Silas could've quite easily picked some Lib Dem, Labour or Scottish Green policies if he actually wanted to.

Posted by: Gage Mar 8 2015, 12:17 PM

Well this didn't help...


Posted by: Suedehead2 Mar 8 2015, 01:07 PM

QUOTE(Gage @ Mar 8 2015, 12:17 PM) *
Well this didn't help...


laugh.gif I'm guessing you won't be voting Green

Posted by: popchartfreak Mar 8 2015, 01:35 PM

QUOTE(Soy Adrián @ Mar 7 2015, 11:37 PM) *
I think it's more that someone's a little too clued up on the mainfesto.

cool.gif

Posted by: nickthenoodle Apr 6 2015, 05:11 PM

Green 62.5%
Labour 25%
Lib Dem 12.5%

Ooh I keep convincing myself I should vote for Labour but I'm just really not on board with them anymore :/.

Posted by: Davidson Apr 6 2015, 09:14 PM

Greens 60%
Labour 30%
Lib Dems 10%

Somehow I think I'm going to go with the second option, thanks.

Posted by: steve201 Apr 6 2015, 10:44 PM

QUOTE(Rooney @ Mar 6 2015, 08:01 PM) *
50% conservatives
20% lib dems
20% ukip
10% greens

Crime: Green
Economy: UKIP
Environment: UKIP
Foreign Policy: Conservative
Immigration: Lib Dems
Democracy: Conservative
Education: Lib Dems
Europe: Conservative
NHS: Conservative
Welfare: Conservative


What makes you UKIP on the economy & the environment but Greens on crime?!

Posted by: Qassändra Apr 8 2015, 01:11 PM

I've always thought something felt really off about these tests, but I think this nails it.

QUOTE
Who should I vote for? There’s (not) an app for that.

Why voter advice apps like VoteMatch and Vote for Policies mislead voters.

Ever been on one of those sites? The ones that tell you who to vote for? They’re called voter advice apps. They have helpful names like Votematch and Vote for Policies and are sold as people power cutting through politicians’ bullshit.

The problem is: they aren’t actually honest about how politics works. And that’s a problem if you sell your app as a tool for disengaged or first-time voters.

Here’s what I get when I try the 2010 VoteMatch app (the 2015 one isn’t out yet): “You agree 66% with the Labour party, 64% with the Green party, 49% with Plaid Cymru and 22% with the BNP.”

Now, I’m not a floating voter, and seven years on a council with Greens has inoculated me against their brand of uncosted left-lite preachy chicanery for life. So maybe you could dismiss me as just being irritated that I score high agreement with the Greens. But Plaid Cymru? And 22% agreement with the BNP? What’s that about? Shurely some mistake.

Usually parties supply a set number of statements on a list of issues put together by a well-meaning campaign group who think that neutral info stripped of politics will encourage the disengaged to engage.

It’s an interesting theory of change, as Sir Humphrey might say, if he worked for a modern NGO.

Why?

What the parties don’t say is as important as what they do say
Since 1992’s tax bombshell campaign, there has been a huge electoral downside to revealing too much before the election. So parties only reveal part of their plans — rightly or wrongly. Perhaps the Conservatives’ £12bn unspecified welfare cuts might interest VoteMatchers, but since it’s an absence of policy rather than a policy, and since the Conservatives won’t submit it for inclusion, no-one gets to use it to decide who to vote for. And lists of policies can’t cover issues that haven’t arisen yet: for obvious reasons the 2001 manifestos are silent on whether or not to invade Iraq, the defining issue of the 2001–05 parliament.

2. The weighting that parties give issues matters — but that’s completely unclear in the apps

Presenting lists of questions — now the housing question, now the NHS question, now immigration — makes it appear that all parties concentrate equally on all issues. But that isn’t the truth at all: take housing, which is likely to be a few sentences in the Conservative manifesto but several paragraphs in the Labour one. The VoteMatcher who cares desperately about housing won’t see that it’s an afterthought for the Tories but central for Labour — they’ll just see two policies of similar length, in black and white.

And this is where the irrelevance of telling me my agreement with Plaid Cymru and the BNP comes in. As I don’t agree with the key issues for those parties — independence for Wales and racism, respectively — my agreement with them the NHS or welfare or education is completely irrelevant. The voter apps assume all policies are equal, and proceed blithely from there — with no thought as to the priorities and narrative of the parties in question.

And more than that: presented blandly, without context, a voter gets no sense of the place of a policy within the party’s offer. Did it represent a hard-fought compromise between chancellor and prime minister? Is it a u-turn on a previous position? Is it counter-intuitive and designed to make a point — like protecting NHS spending for Cameron in 2010? All these might influence how a VoteMatcher might view a policy — unless they don’t know.

3. Politics is about trade-offs — but voter advice apps pretend it’s not

Politics is about the art of the possible. Any aspiring government needs to make choices — most importantly about spending priorities. What you have to give up in order to get a policy is rarely clear in voter apps — and there appears to be no penalties for promising the moon on a stick. “We will do X” is an entirely different policy from “we will do X paid for by Y” because politics involves trade-offs, and pretending it doesn’t, and everything is possible and affordable, misleads voters.

4. It’s not just policies that matter

Voting on policies alone, divorced from who proposes them, relates to a world that doesn’t exist, where no party has a brand, record, core constituency or people who represent it.

To give an example: the Conservatives’ record on lesbian and gay rights before 2010 was pretty poor. LGBT people may view same-sex marriage as evidence that the Conservatives have changed, or the Conservative leader’s inability to deliver a majority in his party for it as evidence that they haven’t. But still, a policy promise from the Tories in 2015 on LGBT rights is meaningless without the context and the history of the party in question. How this then influences a voter’s decision is up to them.

Policies should be set within the context of party brand, values and history — otherwise it’s hard to recognise why a cut in inheritance tax is “same old Tories, only for the rich” or a promise to repeal the bedroom tax is “same old Labour, the welfare party”. If voter apps seek to inform, why should voters be denied that information about party brand, so crucial to understanding modern politics? Not least as both parties spend considerable time trying to confound their brands — whilst being unable to escape them, as they contain a core truth.


(Slide from this fascinating poll by ComRes, showing that party brands do mean something.)

5. It’s really not just policies that matter

Government isn’t just about policies: it’s about the ability to implement a programme and cope with the inevitable crises. And that’s why caring about who leads and seeks to represent that party isn’t silly or superficial. Nor is finding out about the views and background of candidates: commentators argue that in 2010 the pre-election beliefs of Conservative PPCs were more useful in predicting Conservative policy in government — small-state, socially liberal, eurosceptic, not wedded to the NHS — than the 2010 manifesto.

6. Policies should be tested in battle

Policies aren’t really until they have been fought over — on the Today programme, at a party conference, on twitter. When I read a policy, I want to know why the other parties think it’s nonsense, where the holes are, and what the party proposing it is avoiding saying. I don’t get that with bald prose on a webpage. Policies without rebuttal is like a premier league match with no fans, no pundits and no commentary.

Conclusion — so who should I vote for, then?

Voter apps are written by people who don’t understand politics. They presume that voting choice can be reduced to a list of policies, disconnected from one another — that an election is just a million shopping lists, aggregated. For the voter app, politics has no ideology, no values, no brand, no compromise, no arguments — and no participants.

That’s a pretty big way to mislead those disengaged voters whilst telling them you’re empowering them.

The world according to the voter apps doesn’t exist. There is no perfect, scientific method to pick the party or candidate you should vote for. Policies don’t exist in a vacuum, and not all “facts” can be “checked”.

So instead, try this: talk to people you know. Seek out people that you don’t think you’ll agree with. Ask them how they’ll vote, and why. Listen to the leaders’ debates. Read the newspapers. Argue with people. Form your own opinion. Take anything into account that matters to you. Ignore stuff you don’t care about.

There isn’t a right answer to the question. Who you should vote for is your call.

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