Streaming | General Discussion - BuzzJack Music Forum

BuzzJack - Entertainment Discussion _ Music Charts _ UK Charts

Latest Site News

Hozier gets a second week at number one

Hozier climbs to number one

A chart double for Beyonce

16 Pages

< 1 2 3 4 > »

Streaming | General Discussion, FAQs, debates, etc.

Display modes

Track this thread - Email this thread - Print this thread - Download this thread - Subscribe to this forum

diamondtooth View member profile	23rd December 2015, 09:42 AM Post #21
BuzzJack Regular Joined: 13 July 2007 Posts: 302 User: 3,909	That's a bit crazy. If I am a premium Spotify user I thought whatever I listen to would count, whether that's online or offline. I just thought my offline streams might count when I go back online and maybe then apply the 10 listens per day rule, or whatever!


vidcapper View member profile	23rd December 2015, 04:02 PM Post #22
Paul Hyett Joined: 4 April 2006 Posts: 25,346 User: 364	Another thought - streaming makes it harder to judge fanbase size. e.g. If you're JB with 5,000,000 streams a week, there's no way of telling if that's 71,500 fans downloading 70 times a week, or 500,000 fans listening 10 times.


diamondtooth View member profile	24th December 2015, 07:12 PM Post #23
BuzzJack Regular Joined: 13 July 2007 Posts: 302 User: 3,909	^ that's very true about fanbase sizes Also if an album builds up streaming point of 0.9 (for example) by the end of a week are those points carried forward to the next week when it reaches a sale of 1 copy. Or would the points of 0.9 cancel back to zero at the start of a new week? I hope that question makes sense!


JosephBoone View member profile	24th December 2015, 07:14 PM Post #24
you never forget your first time... Pronouns: he/him Joined: 19 April 2011 Posts: 121,678 User: 13,530	QUOTE(diamondtooth @ Dec 24 2015, 07:12 PM) ^ that's very true about fanbase sizes Also if an album builds up streaming point of 0.9 (for example) by the end of a week are those points carried forward to the next week when it reaches a sale of 1 copy. Or would the points of 0.9 cancel back to zero at the start of a new week? I hope that question makes sense! I think I understand it but correct me if I'm wrong! So if an album has 0.9 sales in one week, it doesn't get carried forward, it counts to the week it was streamed in. The sales figures given out by Music Week are rounded chart sales - they actually go into decimals, particularly in the streaming era, it's how most ties are broken if they occur. It then resets to zero for the next week!


diamondtooth View member profile	24th December 2015, 10:02 PM Post #25
BuzzJack Regular Joined: 13 July 2007 Posts: 302 User: 3,909	QUOTE(JosephCarey @ Dec 24 2015, 07:14 PM) I think I understand it but correct me if I'm wrong! So if an album has 0.9 sales in one week, it doesn't get carried forward, it counts to the week it was streamed in. The sales figures given out by Music Week are rounded chart sales - they actually go into decimals, particularly in the streaming era, it's how most ties are broken if they occur. It then resets to zero for the next week! That does answer my question! Thank you! But it's might be a little unfair. Just say an (unpopular) album is getting a sale of 0.5 EVERY week, it's streaming sales would always remain at zero becaus it might never reach a sale of '1' within a particular week. Obviously my scenario about is just an example. Of course bringing sales to the level of decimal places is not very important. This post has been edited by diamondtooth: 24th December 2015, 10:02 PM


Liam.k. View member profile	25th December 2015, 03:27 PM Post #26
BuzzJack Idol Joined: 8 December 2010 Posts: 50,948 User: 12,472	Seems like the best place to ask - I'm currently listening to the continuous mix of Madonna's Confessions on a Dancefloor on Spotify, but it's more like an hour-long full song than an album, so does this have a streaming total that is separate to the streams of the actual album, and do you still only need to listen to 30 seconds worth of it for it to count as a stream, despite being an hour long?


sammy01 View member profile	25th December 2015, 03:35 PM Post #27
BuzzJack Platinum Member Joined: 16 November 2009 Posts: 7,600 User: 9,988	QUOTE(JosephCarey @ Dec 24 2015, 07:14 PM) I think I understand it but correct me if I'm wrong! So if an album has 0.9 sales in one week, it doesn't get carried forward, it counts to the week it was streamed in. The sales figures given out by Music Week are rounded chart sales - they actually go into decimals, particularly in the streaming era, it's how most ties are broken if they occur. It then resets to zero for the next week! Ok let's say an albums stream sales are 35.7 one week then 20.6 the next, is that 55 'sales' or 56 'sales' after the 2 weeks? Do they add the decimal sales together week after week?


Suedehead2 View member profile	25th December 2015, 10:46 PM Post #28
BuzzJack Legend Joined: 13 April 2007 Posts: 36,668 User: 3,272	QUOTE(sammy01 @ Dec 25 2015, 03:35 PM) Ok let's say an albums stream sales are 35.7 one week then 20.6 the next, is that 55 'sales' or 56 'sales' after the 2 weeks? Do they add the decimal sales together week after week? Yes, the decimal sales will count towards the overall total. The OCC always report whole numbers, probably because reporting sales of, for example, 145,683.2 would confuse people.


ben08 View member profile	4th January 2016, 12:02 AM Post #29
BuzzJack Enthusiast Joined: 31 December 2007 Posts: 1,188 User: 5,152	Are the totals displayed in Spotify for tracks streamed more than 30 seconds or do they include tracks played for less than 30 seconds in their totals? Then OCC filters them out. From OCC this week. Official albums streaming chart Top 200 Pos LW Title Peak WOC 5 New THE BEATLES (WHITE) 5 1 (2,825 streams) 6 New 1 6 1 13 New 1967-1970 13 1 15 New YELLOW SUBMARINE - SONGTRACK 15 1 16 New THE BEATLES BOOTLEG RECORDINGS 1963 16 1 20 New THE BEATLES IN MONO 20 1 23 New ABBEY ROAD 23 1 26 New ON AIR - LIVE AT THE BBC - VOL 2 26 1 30 New THE BEATLES IN STEREO 30 1 32 New SGT PEPPER'S LONELY HEARTS CLUB BAND 32 1 37 New MAGICAL MYSTERY TOUR 37 1 43 New 1962-1966 43 1 46 New HEY JUDE 46 1 48 New REVOLVER 48 1 51 New YESTERDAY AND TODAY 51 1 61 New RUBBER SOUL 61 1 (559 streams) 63 New REVOLVER - U.S VERSION 63 1 68 New LET IT BE 68 1 75 New THE CAPITOL ALBUMS - VOL 2 75 1 81 New HELP 81 1 82 New TOMORROW NEVER KNOWS 82 1 87 New LET IT BE - NAKED 87 1 But 11 of these albums are not available on any official streaming service. Where do the streams come from? Beatles in Mono and Beatles in Stereo are not even in iTunes. Where are the Beatles US albums found for streaming? Do they come from 30sec previews in iTunes? Her Majesty on Abbey Road only lasts 26 seconds but yet Spotify says it has been streamed over 5,000 times. How can this be? This post has been edited by ben08: 4th January 2016, 12:05 AM


JosephBoone View member profile	4th January 2016, 12:10 AM Post #30
you never forget your first time... Pronouns: he/him Joined: 19 April 2011 Posts: 121,678 User: 13,530	I'd assume the stream total only includes those which lasted 30 seconds or more! I doubt there'd be a huge amount of less than 30 second plays anyway, at least in your typical chart hit. Are those Beatles albums definitely not on Spotify? Maybe they're on other services? I'm not sure if I'm totally honest! Sorry I can't be more help.


The Hit Parade View member profile	4th January 2016, 12:19 AM Post #31
BuzzJack Gold Member Joined: 24 March 2013 Posts: 2,134 User: 18,521	Beatles In Stereo has the same content as The Beatles Box Set available on iTunes, which possibly accounts for one thing. But there seems to be some sort of anomaly with Apple Music - I've never used it but I noticed the week they started (helpfully also the week Spotify data was AWOL) there were some very odd entries in the album streaming chart (ancient Elvis compilations, Oasis singles boxes etc) so I sort of imagine they report things differently from the others.


The Hit Parade View member profile	4th January 2016, 12:27 AM Post #32
BuzzJack Gold Member Joined: 24 March 2013 Posts: 2,134 User: 18,521	QUOTE(JosephMendes @ Jan 4 2016, 01:10 AM) I'd assume the stream total only includes those which lasted 30 seconds or more! I doubt there'd be a huge amount of less than 30 second plays anyway, at least in your typical chart hit. Are those Beatles albums definitely not on Spotify? Maybe they're on other services? I'm not sure if I'm totally honest! Sorry I can't be more help. Spotify only has the studio albums, Past Masters [which is a collection of non-album tracks] and some best-of sets. https://play.spotify.com/artist/3WrFJ7ztbogyGnTHbHJFl2 Everywhere else I've looked has the same but as I said in the other post, I don't have Apple Music. That selection also matches what's available to download from sites other than iTunes, BTW. Re short plays, the OCC said the limit was set at 30 seconds precisely because gave people time to skip if something they didn't like came up in a playlist, or they were just listening to a bit to see if they recognised the song, or they hit the play button my mistake or something. Or I suppose if they had to stop listening entirely but wanted to let the previous song finish. It's a pure guess but maybe Spotify might account differently for tracks that last less than 30 seconds so they aren't stuck on 0 forever.


ben08 View member profile	4th January 2016, 01:07 PM Post #33
BuzzJack Enthusiast Joined: 31 December 2007 Posts: 1,188 User: 5,152	Thanks for these replies. If Beatles In Stereo is not even a digital download on iTunes, Amazon, Google Play how can it be streamed if only the studio albums plus 4 compilations are available on the 9 streaming services? TOMORROW NEVER KNOWS was an iTunes exclusive but is not on Apple Music. How does it appear on the OCC chart? Alan Jones did not explain this. Does iTunes reports 30 second previews as streams to Apple Music? Any theories how Beatles Her Majesty (26 seconds) appears on Spotify as 7,297 plays? I am really baffled.


ben08 View member profile	4th January 2016, 01:42 PM Post #34
BuzzJack Enthusiast Joined: 31 December 2007 Posts: 1,188 User: 5,152	QUOTE(The Hit Parade @ Jan 4 2016, 12:19 AM) Beatles In Stereo has the same content as The Beatles Box Set available on iTunes, which possibly accounts for one thing. But there are separate entries for Beatles In Stereo (no. 30) and Beatles In Mono (no. 20). If you can't buy Beatles in Mono on iTunes how could you possibly stream it? How could they confuse Beatles Box Set with Beatles in Stereo in the chart listing as Beatles in Stereo can't be digitally downloaded anywhere? Beatles in Mono only has 10 albums as opposed to 14 for Beatles in Stereo.


Bjork View member profile	4th January 2016, 05:43 PM Post #35
BuzzJack Legend Joined: 13 November 2015 Posts: 33,241 User: 22,665	I think the OCC does the capping not Spotify those Beatles albums must be on Apple, think they have things in there to listen that are not on itunes for sale


ben08 View member profile	4th January 2016, 07:11 PM Post #36
BuzzJack Enthusiast Joined: 31 December 2007 Posts: 1,188 User: 5,152	^ That's what I originally thought but a poster on UKMix states, QUOTE Apple Music just has the same 17 albums as the rest of the streaming services. Any other ideas how you can stream an album that does not exist?


vidcapper View member profile	8th January 2016, 03:11 PM Post #37
Paul Hyett Joined: 4 April 2006 Posts: 25,346 User: 364	Am I alone in thinking that the streaming component of the chart needs tweaking a bit? The current rules allow 70 streams a week, but the counter is reset each week. ISTM that there should be a 100 stream total limit per track, thus being a direct equivalent of buying it once. Of course, that wouldn't stop people listening via more than one streaming service, or streaming different mixes of the same song, but that would just be the same as downloading different versions once.


ben08 View member profile	8th January 2016, 07:10 PM Post #38
BuzzJack Enthusiast Joined: 31 December 2007 Posts: 1,188 User: 5,152	And the Albums chart is also affected by streaming. Beatles 1 is no. 46 on downloads, no. 32 on physical but no. 6 on audio streams to give an overall chart position of no. 21.


PumpedUpKicks View member profile	8th January 2016, 07:13 PM Post #39
BuzzJack Regular Joined: 19 September 2012 Posts: 424 User: 17,593	To quote myself from elsewhere on Buzzjack: QUOTE(PumpedUpKicks @ Jan 8 2016, 08:06 PM) See I think there are arguments for and against. Against, streaming means it's now taking forever for songs to exit. In a way the chart is now more similar to the Billboard charts in America which have songs hang around forever. This weeks chart still has Lean On, Where Are U Now, Shut Up and Dance etc, the chart takes forever to refresh. However, streaming allows slow-burners and songs that bubble under to have slow ascensions into the charts. Never Forget You was originally a flop OA/OS, but it slowly climbed thanks to streaming. Now we're seeing songs like When The Bassline Drops, Light It Up, All My Friends make it due to streams.


JosephBoone View member profile	8th January 2016, 07:17 PM Post #40
you never forget your first time... Pronouns: he/him Joined: 19 April 2011 Posts: 121,678 User: 13,530	I think that's a good way of looking at things PumpedUpKicks. We just have to alter our expectations. Newer songs will climb in later on, rather than being a flop in week 1. This is why the shift to OA/OS is important too, because with held-back releases, their peak tends to be considerably lower.