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 Intolerance - a double-edged sword? |
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 13th August 2017, 07:43 AM
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#21
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 Buffy/Charmed
Joined: 18 April 2013
Posts: 44,100 User: 18,639 
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As popchart said, please look at Charlotesville for what happens when intolerance is tolerated.
 The world still has racists, sexists, Nazis, white supremacists, homophobes, many of whom hide behind cartoon frogs. Now is not he time to tolerate and therefore validate their 'non PC' opinions because some older people MIGHT POSSIBLY take exception with the pronoun someone uses.
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13th August 2017, 08:26 AM
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#22
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 BuzzJack Legend
Joined: 18 July 2012
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QUOTE(vidcapper @ Aug 13 2017, 06:47 AM)  It is Kim Jong-un whose been making the threats - all Trump has done is show he will not be intimidated. No. Off-topic, and in any case both parties are threatening nuclear war with outrageous language. It has come to something when China and Russia are preaching calm heads and statements of reason to the USA. |
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13th August 2017, 08:32 AM
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#23
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BuzzJack Legend
Joined: 18 July 2012
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QUOTE(vidcapper @ Aug 13 2017, 07:07 AM) The defensive reaction I've engendered by linking political correctness to child abuse, mostly by Muslim men, illustrates perfectly the point I've been trying to make. Namely that many people inured to PC are more concerned about not painting minorities in a poor light, than the victims of crime perpetrated by them. Obviously I realize that 99.9% of people, from whatever group they belong to, are law-abiding - but I do not make excuses for the other 0.1% on cultural, ethnic, religious, etc. grounds. You have to live by the laws of the country you live in, and accept that where cultural traditions are incompatible with local laws, the latter must take priority. And, if you read what I said more carefully, that is what any sane person believes. No-one is in any way making excuses for rapists and child-molesters. All I'm doing is blaming the police and authorities who failed to act (for whatever reason, whether you choose to believe it was PC-gone-mad a la Farage or for other reasons is irrelevant, and a feeble excuse for the inexcusable) - I repeat, other police forces/authorities act according to the law. YOU are choosing to blame PC because useless people turned a blind eye to it. That's how all injustice works, people turning blind eyes to anything because it suits them to. |
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13th August 2017, 09:24 AM
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#24
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 BuzzJack Legend
Joined: 13 April 2007
Posts: 36,675 User: 3,272
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QUOTE(vidcapper @ Aug 13 2017, 06:47 AM) It is Kim Jong-un whose been making the threats - all Trump has done is show he will not be intimidated. So promising "fire and fury" the like of which has rarely been seen before is not a threat? What is it then? |
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13th August 2017, 10:38 AM
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#25
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 Paul Hyett
Joined: 4 April 2006
Posts: 25,346 User: 364
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QUOTE(Suedehead2 @ Aug 13 2017, 10:24 AM) So promising "fire and fury" the like of which has rarely been seen before is not a threat? What is it then? It sounds like two blowhards pissing into the wind... |
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13th August 2017, 10:48 AM
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#26
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Buffy/Charmed
Joined: 18 April 2013
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Wait, are we talking about Trump's presidenxy or intolerenance??
The only way the two are linked is he fact he has an ... um ... 'alt righter' in the White House, refused to condemn the vile alt-right hate speech, and just called the DEBATE between the two sides 'sad'. |
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13th August 2017, 11:04 AM
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#27
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Say that hiss with your chest, and...
Joined: 24 May 2016
Posts: 18,470 User: 23,308
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QUOTE(MoistSummerFruit @ Aug 13 2017, 11:48 AM) Wait, are we talking about Trump's presidenxy or intolerenance?? The only way the two are linked is he fact he has an ... um ... 'alt righter' in the White House, refused to condemn the vile alt-right hate speech, and just called the DEBATE between the two sides 'sad'. Also of course Trump recently banned transgender people from being in the military of course, another example of intolerance in his policies. I am sure that was to shore up the support of the conservative alt righters who support him. Still bizarre though that someone supporting the military like Trump would want to weaken it by banning a particular demographic from joining it, but support from hardline conservatives must matter more to him. |
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13th August 2017, 11:10 AM
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#28
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Paul Hyett
Joined: 4 April 2006
Posts: 25,346 User: 364
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A follow-up question : Does opposing political correctness make someone a bigot?
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13th August 2017, 11:17 AM
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#29
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Say that hiss with your chest, and...
Joined: 24 May 2016
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QUOTE(vidcapper @ Aug 13 2017, 12:10 PM) A follow-up question : Does opposing political correctness make someone a bigot? I think it does, unless it is opposing more extreme political correctness, like the banning of the nursery rhyme Baa Baa Black Sheep. |
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13th August 2017, 11:56 AM
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#30
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Queen of Soon
Joined: 24 May 2007
Posts: 74,087 User: 3,474
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"Opposing political correctness" is short hand for "why can't I use the N word or call the Chinese takeout the C word or call the ethnically owned corner-shop the P shop or tell gay people who disgusting they are"
So yes, it's bigotry. Anyone who rails against PC is doing so because they can no longer be bigoted without getting heat for their bigotry. Get with the 21st century or get used to being called a bigot. |
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13th August 2017, 11:57 AM
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#31
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Buffy/Charmed
Joined: 18 April 2013
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QUOTE(5 Silas Frøkner @ Aug 13 2017, 11:56 AM) "Opposing political correctness" is short hand for "why can't I use the N word or call the Chinese takeout the C word or call the ethnically owned corner-shop the P shop or tell gay people who disgusting they are" So yes, it's bigotry. Anyone who rails against PC is doing so because they can no longer be bigoted without getting heat for their bigotry. Get with the 21st century or get used to being called a bigot. This!! |
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13th August 2017, 03:45 PM
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#32
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Paul Hyett
Joined: 4 April 2006
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QUOTE(5 Silas Frøkner @ Aug 13 2017, 12:56 PM) "Opposing political correctness" is short hand for "why can't I use the N word or call the Chinese takeout the C word or call the ethnically owned corner-shop the P shop or tell gay people who disgusting they are" So yes, it's bigotry. Anyone who rails against PC is doing so because they can no longer be bigoted without getting heat for their bigotry. Get with the 21st century or get used to being called a bigot. But there is another side to it - while we would all agree that using derogatory terms against minorities is wrong, false accusations of “racist,” “sexist,” “homophobe,” “anti-Semite,” “bigot,” etc. can destroy careers, or at very least be used to stifle debate. |
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13th August 2017, 03:50 PM
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#33
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Buffy/Charmed
Joined: 18 April 2013
Posts: 44,100 User: 18,639
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When?
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13th August 2017, 03:52 PM
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#34
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Brown cow, stunning!
Joined: 7 December 2009
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Newsflash: there is no debate. If you are being racist, homophobic, transphobic or any equivalent that is on you, there isn't a debate to stifle and it's not political correctness. Yes they can destroy reputations or careers but people should think about that before they say things like that...
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13th August 2017, 05:30 PM
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#35
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Queen of Soon
Joined: 24 May 2007
Posts: 74,087 User: 3,474
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Liam has it spot on, there isn't a debate here. You're either on the right or wrong side of history
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13th August 2017, 05:33 PM
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#36
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Queen of Soon
Joined: 24 May 2007
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I'm yet to see people using racist, sexist, nazi et al wrongly. Just look at America the other night. That was straight up racism and nazism brought on by a psycho White House filled to the rafters with white supremacists. We can say that about the White House because it's true. People too scared to confront that and weak republicans thrilled at being in power have allowed what happened last night to happen. That was disgusting scenes for any country, never mind one of the worlds most advanced democracies
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13th August 2017, 07:15 PM
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#37
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BuzzJack Legend
Joined: 18 July 2012
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QUOTE(vidcapper @ Aug 13 2017, 04:45 PM) But there is another side to it - while we would all agree that using derogatory terms against minorities is wrong, false accusations of “racist,” “sexist,” “homophobe,” “anti-Semite,” “bigot,” etc. can destroy careers, or at very least be used to stifle debate. and in that case again it's not political correctness that is the problem, it's defamation. Someone who is innocent should not be destroyed by false accusations. If they said it, they said it, if they didn't say it someone is lying and they should be taken to court. It's fairly cut and dried, PC folk are not lynch mobs - unlike the racist fascists at work in the USA, back again after a 50-year break to start-up the burning torches and hatred. You seem to have a pet peeve about PC-ness, when you should be livid like the rest of us about racism and bigotry and actual murder. |
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15th August 2017, 08:56 AM
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#38
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Paul Hyett
Joined: 4 April 2006
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QUOTE(popchartfreak @ Aug 13 2017, 08:15 PM) and in that case again it's not political correctness that is the problem, it's defamation. Someone who is innocent should not be destroyed by false accusations. Tell that to those whom Joseph McCarthy falsely accused of being communists in the 1950's. http://www.coldwar.org/articles/50s/senato...ephmccarthy.asp QUOTE You seem to have a pet peeve about PC-ness, when you should be livid like the rest of us about racism and bigotry and actual murder. Have I ever said I wasn't angry about those things? This post has been edited by vidcapper: 15th August 2017, 08:58 AM |
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15th August 2017, 12:02 PM
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#39
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BuzzJack Legend
Joined: 18 July 2012
Posts: 22,851 User: 17,376
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QUOTE(vidcapper @ Aug 15 2017, 09:56 AM) Tell that to those whom Joseph McCarthy falsely accused of being communists in the 1950's. http://www.coldwar.org/articles/50s/senato...ephmccarthy.asp Have I ever said I wasn't angry about those things? 1. Communist witch hunts were not due to PC, they were due to establishment right-wing figures turning left-wing/liberals into figures of hate. the complete opposite of what we are talking about, and exactly what is going on right now with the fascist/Nazi movement who wish to bring white supremacy back. 2. No, I don't recall you ever mentioning them at all. Feel free to denounce them instead whingeing about political correctness, because, as is becoming pretty clear in the USA and the UK, if you don't stand up against injustice then you are condoning it through silence. It's very easy to say "murdering so and so is wrong and the people who do things like this bunch of so and so's are not democratic and tolerant". "so and so" can apply to Nazi muderers, Russian state political murderers, religious extremists, the leader of North Korea, anyone really. |
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15th August 2017, 02:14 PM
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#40
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Paul Hyett
Joined: 4 April 2006
Posts: 25,346 User: 364
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QUOTE(popchartfreak @ Aug 15 2017, 01:02 PM) 1. Communist witch hunts were not due to PC, they were due to establishment right-wing figures turning left-wing/liberals into figures of hate. the complete opposite of what we are talking about, and exactly what is going on right now with the fascist/Nazi movement who wish to bring white supremacy back. So you accept that demonising people for their beliefs is wrong? QUOTE 2. No, I don't recall you ever mentioning them at all. Feel free to denounce them instead whingeing about political correctness, because, as is becoming pretty clear in the USA and the UK, if you don't stand up against injustice then you are condoning it through silence. It's very easy to say "murdering so and so is wrong and the people who do things like this bunch of so and so's are not democratic and tolerant". I don't believe that 'not unequivocally condemning injustices' automatically means you support them - that's an absurd position. |
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