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Tafty³³³ View member profile	21st August 2023, 11:02 AM Post #1
I found the love, I found the love in me Pronouns: He/Him Joined: 13 December 2007 Posts: 87,457 User: 5,042	The serial-killer's sentencing is underway this morning. putting what she was found guilty of in spoiler tags as a caution because it is really disturbing - so read at own risk She was found guilty of attacking 13 babies, killing seven of them. Making her the most prolific serial killer of children in modern British history. The former director of nursing who is said to have ignored warnings about her, has been suspended from her current role. Dr Ravi Jayaram is one of the consultant paediatricians who tried multiple times to raise concerns about her... he was forced to attend meditation with her and then apologise to her. Not only that but a retired nursing chief said she "didn't have enough information" to remove Lucy from the unit despite a 400% increase in deaths & 7 consultants raising serious concerns about her. By far one of the most horrifying stories I've ever encountered. I hope she rots for eternity. I can't imagine she'll last a great length of time in prison before she's either in the prison hospital or the other way. However, she still has a level of power above the victims families as she was allowed to refuse to show up to court for her sentencing, meaning she gets to avoid hearing what they have to say about her, which I personally think is vile that that is even a thing? How do you feel about the case? What does this tell us about the system and how she got away with it despite various concerns and evidence pointing towards it all so much sooner? Will there be "Corporate Manslaughter" charges, due to their negligence and refusing to investigate extremely serious accusations? Should she/criminals even be given the choice to avoid their sentencing hearing?


Suedehead2 View member profile	21st August 2023, 11:10 AM Post #2
BuzzJack Legend Joined: 13 April 2007 Posts: 36,679 User: 3,272	She is almost certain to get a whole-life sentence, so there is no available sanction to force her to attend the sentencing. Therefore, there doesn't seem to be a lot that can be done. The case is, indeed horrific. The enquiry announced by the government is currently not a statutory enquiry. That means that nobody can be compelled to attend and give evidence. I hope that will change. One of the unanswered questions relate to the cases where she injected the babies with insulin. A normal insulin level is 200-300 units. These babies had levels of 4,500 units. I don't understand why the body that carried out the tests didn't contact the hospital immediately to alert them to these results. Instead, the alarm was only raised when one of the whistle-blowers was reviewing the evidence as part of the police investigation.


Herbs View member profile	21st August 2023, 11:11 AM Post #3
BuzzJack Platinum Member Joined: 14 March 2006 Posts: 5,729 User: 214	What the families must have gone through… Such a vile person. All those senseless murders and lives not lived - it is truly hearbreaking I’ve read the emails that were exchanged and it’s clear Lucy was trying to avoid suspicion. The fact that such a big increase went in-investigated is shocking. I know it’s not the same but it reminds me of the Stephen Port case (further victims could have been saved if initial suspicions were looked into)


Jessie Where View member profile	21st August 2023, 11:38 AM Post #4
Break the tension Joined: 7 March 2006 Posts: 89,022 User: 51	I'd followed this case from the beginning and it's been harrowing. The trial painted a picture of a very sadistic individual who more than enjoyed the grief she was causing, needed to involve herself in it and experience as much as possible (as evidenced by the sympathy card, Facebook searches etc). Just horrible and unfathomable. I hope those higher up who ignored concerns face very severe repercussions. I'll be astonished if she isn't handed a whole life order, and that's exactly what she deserves.


T Boy View member profile	21st August 2023, 11:45 AM Post #5
Radical Pink Troll Joined: 11 March 2006 Posts: 26,606 User: 177	It truly is a disturbing case. It’s disconcerting to me also as the Countess is more or less my nearest hospital, at least on the English side of the border. All speculation, but it seems to me that she very much played a personality and character to avoid suspicion and carry things out. Clearly she couldn’t fool everyone, but it does seem she played up to this ‘innocent white girlie her twenties’ image and could act the victim in order to get sympathy from those up top. I can’t even comprehend what she did and it’s disgusting she won’t attend the sentencing-which will surely be life. It feels like she is still playing the ‘I’m innocent’ card by appearing too distressed to attend-perhaps she should imagine how the parents of her victims feel? It has been reported throughout that she has claimed this whole thing has been a conspiracy against her and that she was being scape goated to cover up hospital failures. Speaking of hospital failures, I do hope heads will roll there given how many times doctors were ignored or forced to apologise for her. It’s definitely a symptom of where we are as people these days that covering up for the sake of reputation was more important than patient safety and that those who rock the boat in the interest of what’s right are the ones who get punished. It happens in a lot of industries (well in our government specifically) so if one good thing could come from this it would be that hopefully that culture will change.


Chez Wombat View member profile	21st August 2023, 11:51 AM Post #6
The owls are not what they seem Pronouns: He/him Joined: 11 July 2009 Posts: 37,133 User: 9,232	Sickening, hopefully rots in prison for life. I've said recently in another thread how horrifying Angels of Death can be and this is just about the worst thing that can be done. Every manager or higher up that ignored warnings and victimised other staff for raising concerns has blood on their hands and they should all rightfully be punished, in some cases, manslaughter is an appropriate charge. It really is an utterly sad state of affairs that in company in this day and age, serious concerns are still brushed aside or not investigated properly. This is just about the most serious you can get and reputation should never, ever come into it. Not sure if it's a reflection of the state of the NHS currently or just that we haven't progressed as much as we'd like to think


Jessie Where View member profile	21st August 2023, 12:06 PM Post #7
Break the tension Joined: 7 March 2006 Posts: 89,022 User: 51	She has been given a whole life order!


T Boy View member profile	21st August 2023, 12:16 PM Post #8
Radical Pink Troll Joined: 11 March 2006 Posts: 26,606 User: 177	QUOTE(Jessie Where @ Aug 21 2023, 01:06 PM) She has been given a whole life order! Fully deserved. It’s sickening that she refused to present herself. I think further investigations into the hospital management really need to be stepped up now. We need to hear why concerns were initially ignored.


Tafty³³³ View member profile	21st August 2023, 01:05 PM Post #9
I found the love, I found the love in me Pronouns: He/Him Joined: 13 December 2007 Posts: 87,457 User: 5,042	Excellent news! But yeah, I do think the pressure needs to be put on the higher ups now. Those who glossed over how serious this was and was continually ignoring everything.


Silas View member profile	21st August 2023, 01:16 PM Post #10
Queen of Soon Joined: 24 May 2007 Posts: 74,092 User: 3,474	Speaking from personal experience, the Countess of Chester is one of the worst places I’ve ever had the misfortune to step into. Our family has absolutely nothing positive to say about anything or anyone connected to that dive. It doesn’t surprise me that too management acted like they did, their not fit to run a bath unsupervised. I hope all of them end up on manslaughter charges as this is defo not the only blood on their hands. This hospital has directly or indirectly through negligence killed many people and there is a commie block in hell reserved for those responsible


neill2407 View member profile	21st August 2023, 09:55 PM Post #11
BuzzJack Enthusiast Joined: 22 September 2022 Posts: 805 User: 159,650	Reminds me of the Shipman case…absolutely shocking and terrible.


Suedehead2 View member profile	30th August 2023, 09:58 PM Post #12
BuzzJack Legend Joined: 13 April 2007 Posts: 36,679 User: 3,272	QUOTE(Suedehead2 @ Aug 21 2023, 12:10 PM) She is almost certain to get a whole-life sentence, so there is no available sanction to force her to attend the sentencing. Therefore, there doesn't seem to be a lot that can be done. The case is, indeed horrific. The enquiry announced by the government is currently not a statutory enquiry. That means that nobody can be compelled to attend and give evidence. I hope that will change. One of the unanswered questions relate to the cases where she injected the babies with insulin. A normal insulin level is 200-300 units. These babies had levels of 4,500 units. I don't understand why the body that carried out the tests didn't contact the hospital immediately to alert them to these results. Instead, the alarm was only raised when one of the whistle-blowers was reviewing the evidence as part of the police investigation. The enquiry will now be a statutory one, so witnesses can now be obliged to attend. A sensible u-turn by the government.


Tafty³³³ View member profile	15th September 2023, 06:02 PM Post #13
I found the love, I found the love in me Pronouns: He/Him Joined: 13 December 2007 Posts: 87,457 User: 5,042	She is now (shock horror) appealing her convictions. Vile woman. (Also, there are literal people out there asking to free her because she was used as a "scapegoat"! JFC!)


T Boy View member profile	15th September 2023, 06:13 PM Post #14
Radical Pink Troll Joined: 11 March 2006 Posts: 26,606 User: 177	The woman is dangerous if she honestly believes she didn’t do it.


crazy chris View member profile	15th September 2023, 09:32 PM Post #15
BuzzJack Legend Joined: 7 March 2006 Posts: 22,001 User: 53	QUOTE(T Boy @ Sep 15 2023, 07:13 PM) The woman is dangerous if she honestly believes she didn’t do it. Some eminent legal people actually think her conviction was unsafe as it was all based on circumstantial evidence.


T Boy View member profile	16th September 2023, 08:39 PM Post #16
Radical Pink Troll Joined: 11 March 2006 Posts: 26,606 User: 177	QUOTE(crazy chris @ Sep 15 2023, 10:32 PM) Some eminent legal people actually think her conviction was unsafe as it was all based on circumstantial evidence. The jury were quite thorough despite this. It’s not like they found her guilty of every charge.


Suedehead2 View member profile	16th September 2023, 09:38 PM Post #17
BuzzJack Legend Joined: 13 April 2007 Posts: 36,679 User: 3,272	She has the right to seek leave to appeal. That is a fundamental part of a fair justice system. Whether a judge grants her permission to appeal is a different matter.


Tafty³³³ View member profile	12th December 2023, 11:51 AM Post #18
I found the love, I found the love in me Pronouns: He/Him Joined: 13 December 2007 Posts: 87,457 User: 5,042	Wait... why wouldn't she automatically be taken off the nursing register immediately when she was convicted for a crime within the nursing sector???? It's making no sense why this is going to be a 2 day trial when it should automatically be in place, no? (Or am I genuinely missing something?)


spiceboy View member profile	12th December 2023, 09:55 PM Post #19
BuzzJack Platinum Member Joined: 6 September 2017 Posts: 11,848 User: 39,568	Why waste tax payers money!? For a start she is NEVER getting out of jail to be a nurse again, and even if she did which hospital is EVER going to hire her!? Don't even bother striking her off just let her rot in jail for the rest of her life.


Jessie Where View member profile	14th December 2023, 12:24 PM Post #20
Break the tension Joined: 7 March 2006 Posts: 89,022 User: 51	It seems like an extremely pointless formality, but I think these quotes I've found in a BBC article try and make sense of it as best they can: QUOTE Speaking after the hearing, the NMC's chief executive and registrar Andrea Sutcliffe said the body's "thoughts and sympathies... remain with the parents, families and children whose lives have been so terribly impacted by Lucy Letby's heinous and heartbreaking crimes". She said the NMC had "moved forward" with fitness to practise proceedings "as quickly as possible" following Letby's conviction. She added that the striking off order against Letby would "take effect in January [and]in the meantime, she remains under interim suspension from the register". An NMC representative said its regulatory processes were "guided by strict legislation, which sets out a process we must follow before we can impose a sanction". They said that includes "certain notice periods we need to allow for" and the council had "followed this process as quickly as possible" in respect of Letby's case. They said Letby would now be sent a letter "confirming the panel's decision", after which she would have 28 days to appeal. "If no appeal is received, the strike-off will take effect," they added. QUOTE Judith Moritz, North of England Correspondent Given the gravity of her offences, and the fact she will never leave prison, Lucy Letby's barring from the nursing profession may have seemed like a foregone conclusion. But the NMC's fitness to practice panel allotted two days for the hearing to determine her professional future. In the event, the formalities have moved along quickly and having refused to appear at her crown court sentencing, it was hardly a surprise that Letby also declined to appear at the NMC. Instead, she filled out the paperwork from her prison cell, accepting the proposal to strike her off the nursing register. She then added the first comments she has made anywhere about her case - writing that she does not accept her guilt, maintains her innocence, and is appealing against her convictions. Clearly, her focus is on the Court of Appeal, which is still considering her case. She will also have to prepare for the retrial on one charge of attempted murder which is expected in June. Also, my theory on why she's appealing her convictions is to try and save face with her parents who very obviously refuse to believe she's guilty.