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[Iz 🌟]

great job on editing as I quote you, this stuff takes some time to reply to but I'm going to keep updating it because it just gets better and better each time:

Left wing media is factually incorrect and deceitful many times, so that applies to any source depending on what you believe in. But official government sources do not support most of the things organizations like BLM love to shout out as factual. You have moderate liberals like Tim Pool on youtube who go over inumerous news sources, and debunks a lot of the left wing media lies. 2020 is a mess, but the veil has been lifted on left wing hypocrisy, and also their true agenda for the world.

BLM doesnt need to be a political party in power if its already a branch of the democrat party. Its already in power, more so than ever. Donations to BLM go to ActBlue, the money is going to rich people in power like Bernie Sanders. So much for helping black people... This is the same DNC that supports antifa rioters and insurrectionists, I can't be much more disappointed in the new left that will do anything and protect any criminal to stay in power. BLM openly supports rioters and looting cause apparently that is "reparations" to them. The toppling of statues, which the media made it seem like it was just "problematic" people even though reviewing past historic figures and applying them a 21st century moral code is highly dubious and pervasive way to revise history, they also toppled abolitionists and teachers.

Of course you dont need a revolution if you indoctrinate several generations and these generations get into power. They already have those beliefs and impose them on others. A quick look at Teen Vogue's twitter feed for example, and how they want to abolish police, prison, capitalism and private property, all while praising Marx, says it all really. Marxism's end goal is always to bring upon the revolution, whether peacefully through indoctrination, or by force. It reduces the individual to their designed group. It didnt work with the working class, but seems to be working a lot better with the post modernism critical theory applies to it, to pit everyone against everyone. George Soros must be proud on how well he's doing, by how much he's been funding corrupt DA's that are dropping charges against insurrectionists and criminals, such as Kim Foxx, I can even link you the documents. No wonder these cities are dying and people are fleeing. If you think this wont lead to a communist regime, then you're terribly naive. It's been the plan all along. Venezuela was also said to be very stable and look at how fast it tumbled. When your enemy gives you inside information to their agenda, you better believe it.

Okay, let's start with your final point ('Seems like this is just a far left-wing echo chamber nowadays') as I think it's underpinning the rest of your points. Much of what you are seeing as far-left, isn't. There's a great deal of debate here between left-leaning members like me and Jupiter, and more centrist (Klaus, Brett) or even centre-right leaning posters like say, Rooney (let me know if that's an unfair assessment of any of you but there's a wide variety of viewpoints in here and it certainly isn't all left voices). Some of us are 'woke', some are not. The shifting of discourse in general has gone sharply towards the right, and why wouldn't it? That's the direction that allows people with capital to continue making money. That Overton window movement helps explain your worldview, where everyone left of Reagan is bunched together in some abnormal power-sharing structure with the cultural reach to match. We then have people who think of themselves as "centrists", like it seems, yourself, but are showing solidly right views (anti-communism as an obsession, others, but we'll get to those), but the centre of the right is still very much the right. And then what passes itself off as an American right-leaning government is a far-right one in power that meets most of Umberto Eco's 14 points of Fascism. Which, by the way, is a valuable metric that I use when I label something as fascist, and in doing so, I can feel pretty comfortable in labeling Trump's America as a fascist regime.

And back up to the top. Of course, no one is immune to propaganda, but surely you can tell me these things that BLM people 'shout out as factual'? Get specific. All I can say about Tim Pool is that he is a very unimpressive person who has never shown me any evidence that he's a liberal and has shown me a lot of evidence that he just the same as every other dumb conservative. He constantly talks about a "coming civil war" which is a very hard tell that he's actually a right-winger, concern with the collapse of civilization and dividing people into groups to be fought isn't very liberal. Unfortunately, I don't think people are yet realising that we are being lied to and it is rubes like him that are paid to run defense for racists that are part of the problem in directing people's attention away from the real evil.

The Democrat party doesn't control the Presidency or the Senate, at least not yet I suppose. We can only hope that when they are in power that BLM can be listened to to push for equality. And why is Bernie Sanders your pick for a rich person? I mean, when all the planet-destroying, worker-exploiting, billionaires are right there... but I've checked your claim that BLM donations go to the DNC and... it's false, they go through that ActBlue platform which is a platform for distributing it to the intended targets. Saying the left will do anything to protect criminals to stay in power is hugely rich when you have the biggest criminal of them all in the White House, but if there are criminals on the left, get them the f*** out too - I wouldn't be sorry to see Bill Clinton gone, not that he's much of a leftist anyway but that's always the big one that conservatives like to bring up.

Statues do not represent history. They represent veneration. Few people deserve to be venerated. No one is changing the history books.

This article is very important so I'm giving it its own line. Antifa 'terrorism' does not murder anyone. Right-wing extremism does. Please, no one ever listen to Andy Ngo again.

And for violent protests, they are seriously being overrepresented in coverage, most protests are still ongoing and as I did say towards the start of this thread, the sad reality is is that peaceful protests will be comparatively ignored even when they're ongoing for months. Anyway, let's take Portland, which has been the focus of 'violent protests' lately. This article gives the extent of what's been reported, and I'd say that's a pretty generous take to the right-wing from the NYT based on what I've heard, so I'm going easy on you, here's another. Portland has some police officers injured with rocks, but most protesters are peaceful, some protesters injured with pepper spray, a relatively even split on both sides. And this is the city that Trumpists are pointing to as the epicentre of lawless violence. This is as good as it gets for their argument that there are violent protesters. A city where federal agents have been sent and have started committing violence themselves on the protesters. And they have the power of the federal state backing them up. Which of course the protesters do not.

And Soros? Are you seriously bringing the conspiratorial theory of him secretly funding every left-wing cause going for the past two decades up (and may I say, this one has always seemed quite anti-semitiic to me). He hasn't directly funded any protest movements. And what he does fund is set against nearly every other billionaire funding their own conservative interests. And to put this in the same paragraph where you're pushing the idea of Marxism indoctrinating us all given how Soros himself used his influence to bring down parts of the Eastern Bloc? Please, do link me the documents, I'd be very interested to see them.

Not that anyone is actually indoctrinating anyone. The idea of Marxists imposing their beliefs on anyone in the modern day is laughable, there aren't enough of them, though some of them are very good advocates because it's a good theory. And there's nothing wrong with that, and nothing wrong with bringing on a peaceful revolution, in fact that would kind of be the preferable idea. A world without masters, without corporate dictatorships, with no poverty because we've redistributed wealth to save people's lives, an economic system that is beyond what we've been able to conceive of before because we're shackled into the capitalistic way of thinking, where productivity and labour is valued, not who happened to say 'I own this' first. I don't see what is wrong with aiming society towards that.

'Reducing the individual to their designed group' - this is getting philosophical but that is... the opposite of Marxism? That's conservatism, where everyone has their socially ordained station in life, Marxism is supposed to free the individual by giving them the power and therefore self-actualisation to control the production of their work and therefore their social expression when not working.

But then you have this idea that there's a Soros-funded Marxist plot that's you repeatedly refer to in this section? To turn the West into a Communist regime that would then subsequently collapse into Venezuela (because of course it does, can't do anything left of centre these days without a conservative screaming about Venezuela, a mess that the US bears at least some responsibility for)? I cannot stress enough that no one who is left wing has the political power right now to do anything of the sort in the entire Western world! None of the news media is left-wing, the most left in say America is CNN or MSNBC and they would routinely disaparage Bernie Sanders for being unrealistically left... and he was running on a social democratic campaign aimed primarily at giving people healthcare so they don't die for being poor. That in itself illustrates my point that there is no left institution. At least in comparison to the right. All of the major governments are right-wing. The few left politicians we have are set upon by the media if they so much as make a slip-up. Right now, there is no revolution coming and no support for it in institutions of power, which is necessary for it to succeed, you can't manufacture consent among the populace if none of the institutions support what you believe.

That isnt free speech though. Its one thing to threaten someone with physical violence, its another to censore speech that you might find offensive. Who dictates what's offensive? Today we're even censoring online the word "women" cause it might be offensive to some people. Where does it end? Everyone walking on eggshells and self censoring, and even if you mess up, you still pay the price. Regardless if that mess up was now or 10 years ago. And its funny that places like twitter only censor right wing vitriol, but not the same effort is done to silence the left. Seems very hypocritical. I've never received more hatred online than from the far left BLM types. Nasty people with nasty behavior. First it was just censoring far right, then it was conservatives, now even moderate centrists are being centrist. The purge is real and its a never ending black hole of cancel culture and ostracization. But good luck with allies like Danielle Muscato flying your flag for diversity and inclusion, while promoting online harassment and bullying at the same time.

https://www.salon.com/2020/08/07/a-new-repo...ight-wing-bias/

and I thought that they were supposed to be censoring conservatives

But to be serious on this point, right wing vitriol attacks people for who they are in a way they cannot change, it denigrates women, it makes (in America and Britain) non-whites feel unsafe, it attacks LGBT people for the temerity to exist. Left wing vitriol is focused on people exploiting others... for exploiting others. The two are not equivalent, and that's why conservatives are more often banned than left-wingers.

Intersectionality to me functions as a religious cult. Black women are the priestesses. Bonus points if they're trans or muslim. They hold the most power, so they get the most say in any situation. Even when they talk shit and are factually wrong, it doesn't matter, because they are the ones that need to be heard. And if you're a black women who doesn't agree with the insane stuff some of them speak, you're ostracized and demonized, accused of being a nazi and fascist - talk about devaluing words... so I don't believe or comply with their systems of oppression designed to divide and conquer. Most people don't want to go back to segregation, but it seems like that is the way BLM wants the new world order to return to that, but shuffled with different people in power positions.

It does function as a cult. You have commandments (doctrine), the sins (privilege), redefining words like racism, censoring others that were never offensive to begin with to the majority of the population, and using many buzzwords that only the woke left use, which is typical of a cult - most of these people spew them, like they're reading a script they've been taught, which is why when you disrupt their chain of thought, they have a brain fart. Every time something negative is done to a minority, its because they're a minority, and not because of some other reason. A black man killed by a white man? Racism of course. Only possible explanation. It's also why being racist, sexist, or whatever towards a majority group is now not only acceptable, but even encouraged. And there are too many examples these days of how the media sweeps it under the rug. No way would people be supporting this movement if they knew their full agenda and goals, especially black America.

Thank god I've broken free from those chains in my mind. I mean you do you, but I'm glad not be part of the new "woke" left. Felt like I dropped 100 pounds of regressiveness and constant misery. No more victim mentality and putting my sexuality first. We're living in the part of the world that gives us the most freedom and where we have the most tolerance and acceptance. I'm not oppressed whatsoever. I find myself far happier in the center of the political spectrum these days. Hopefully you people will allow me to stay here in the middle, who knows, with how censorship is going, we're all labelled nazis these days, so I might be censored and exiled.



I mean this guy goes into far more detail and explains far better than I do on how we got here, and where we came from. I could post a bunch of images of what is being promoted in name of BLM, NMAAHC, but what's the point. Seems like this is just a far left-wing echo chamber nowadays. We just have fundamentally different ways of viewing the world. I think marxism and especially neo-marxist mixed with post modern critical race theory is the most racist lense to view life. And dehumanizing too. But I guess according to BLM, me valuing the individual over the collective is white supremacy, so what do I know... clearly they are so morally superior to me.

That's... not how intersectionality works. In fact, there's quite a lot of people still mad that so many of the most prominent left voices are still white men. Look in any leftist space, you will see more diversity than conservatives but there's still a lot of white men in there. And that's good, we shouldn't want to get them out at all. If a black woman talks rubbish, we will rebut them. But black, trans, muslim, whatever, they are who need our help right now, and when it comes to their issues, let them have the leading voices. Ideally we'd move past this idea where people look at someone's identity before judging what they're saying, but the conservatives and the liberals still have it ingrained in their psyche so all we can do is push forward the realities of where different groups are and make them equal. I mean, what's the alternative, treat all black people as though they've had the same experience with racism? Obviously they have not.

For example, you misinterpreting privilege as a sin... recognising and correcting for society's unconscious biases against minorities isn't to be likened to sinning and giving penance, it's just restoring balance. Could you give me an example of a word that was never offensive to begin with being censored? Because on that point pretty much everything that is coming to mind is something with a long and troubled history that should have been stopped a long time ago as its usage can never be anything other than unkind.

So when we say that George Floyd was killed because of racism, it's because he was. Police killings of black men in America are unquestionably to do with the institutional racism in that system. Studies have shown that lighter-skinner inmates are treated as more trustworthy. And if a black man, who is treated as less trustworthy, is injured or killed by police acting on that unconscious bias, then racism played a role in his injury or murder. There can be more than one reason for a police killing.

I listened to a little bit of that guy, James Lindsay, as much as I could, I've seen his name around, much like Tim Pool, I haven't been particularly impressed. I'd like to link this Twitter thread where he claimed 'the woke won't debate you' and then when numerous 'woke' people showed up in the comments to indicate that they would indeed debate him, he danced around the point a little before deciding not to do any debates. But actually, like I said with the Soros documents and any other materials you have, I will listen to whatever evidence you would like to post. I will probably research its background and where it comes from but I'm happy to concede points where the evidence you provide is good.

Finally, I'd like to begin to sum up by addressing these chains you reference. I'm afraid you're not going to find too much there. Leaning into conservatism is having to invent reasons why it is morally justifiable that the less fortunate suffer. You can't get away from that. There are limits to conservatism, and the limits are fascism. I'm not being hyperbolic there either, same hierarchical structure, same in-out groups, just a bit more murder and less democracy. It doesn't seek to fundamentally change the system, so it can't have imagination. The beauty about being left-leaning is for me, there's so many ways you can take it. You learn to question everything you've been told, and when you do that, you open up possibilities everywhere, maybe I can reject all Marxist theories if a better way of organising economies is found, maybe we can decentrally plan a society to limit oppression. Leftism is, as the revolutionary side (rather than the reactionary side), is filled with alternate theories of potential societies.

I don't want to focus too much on you, as you can believe whatever, but I would caution you that it seems like you are being led by conservative, anti-communist demagogues. Your posts display traits of conspiracism, McCarthyism, you seem to show a preference for keeping things as they are, institutional racism and all, and at no time in that long post did you show any concern for the black people who actually are being murdered - you are using your dismissal of their struggles as a springboard for your beliefs. Now in responding to you I've had to move away from that topic at times but I hope that all reading this know that defending them and movements in their name is what I am aiming to do. Are you not concerned that there is racism out there acting against these people? It just doesn't seem that way from your posts so concerned with painting them as the vanguard of neo-Stalinism.