BuzzJack
Entertainment Discussion

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register | Help )

Latest Site News
2 Pages V   1 2 >  
Reply to this topicStart new topic
> Extinction Rebellion block access to newspapers
Track this topic - Email this topic - Print this topic - Download this topic - Subscribe to this forum
Iz 🌟
post Sep 5 2020, 01:37 PM
Post #1
I'm a paragon so don't perceive me
*******
Group: Admin.
Posts: 37,390
Member No.: 12,929
Joined: 3-February 11
   No Gallery Pics
 


Extinction Rebellion's actions have been on occasion controversial (e.g. last week when their Twitter account declared that they were not a socialist organisation, immediately earning the ire of all of Left Twitter but that's not the topic today hence spoiler tags).

This week they've done something much more fun to talk about. Physically stopping the presses that print Murdoch papers (Sun, Times, and for good measure, the Telegraph and Mail as well) from making it to distribution.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-54038591

Is this a good and popular action, targeting papers that downplay the climate crisis and therefore play a huge part in burying it as an issue - making them culpable for planet destruction? Or is this an attack on the free press?

(guess which line the party Murdoch put into power in the UK has taken)
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
J00prstar
post Sep 5 2020, 01:46 PM
Post #2
there's nothing straight about plump Elvis
******
Group: AF Leader
Posts: 13,085
Member No.: 22,895
Joined: 21-January 16
   No Gallery Pics
 


I have zero issue with it, just getting that out the way.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Silas
post Sep 5 2020, 02:17 PM
Post #3
Queen of Soon
********
Group: Moderator
Posts: 74,015
Member No.: 3,474
Joined: 24-May 07
 


FINALLY an extinction rebellion action I can get behind
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Andrew.
post Sep 5 2020, 02:24 PM
Post #4
is in hibernation
******
Group: Banned
Posts: 11,385
Member No.: 21,161
Joined: 24-August 14
 


I'm not gonna complain at the Murdoch press getting restricted for one day only. If even a few people decide to permanently stop buying the Scum etc then it'll have been worth it.

Although on the whole I think Extinction Rebellion do more harm than good to the climate movement.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Iz 🌟
post Sep 6 2020, 04:43 AM
Post #5
I'm a paragon so don't perceive me
*******
Group: Admin.
Posts: 37,390
Member No.: 12,929
Joined: 3-February 11
   No Gallery Pics
 


QUOTE(Andrew. @ Sep 5 2020, 02:24 PM) *
I'm not gonna complain at the Murdoch press getting restricted for one day only. If even a few people decide to permanently stop buying the Scum etc then it'll have been worth it.

Although on the whole I think Extinction Rebellion do more harm than good to the climate movement.


Their actions over the past year have been on the whole less than effective (not that it's been an easy year for protests), though if they do more actions like this, which are clearly savvy enough to be supported by at least those not ensnared by the cult driven by these newspapers, then that will be better.

They've chosen a good target. They won't keep it up, but imagine if all of the UK was as free of this lot as Liverpool are of The Sun. I can only think of improvements.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Doctor Blind
post Sep 6 2020, 04:19 PM
Post #6
#38BBE0 otherwise known as 'sky blue'
******
Group: Moderator
Posts: 16,163
Member No.: 7,561
Joined: 27-October 08
   No Gallery Pics
 


Newspapers? I vaguely remember them, are people still buying them?

They'd have more impact blocking the manufacturers of VHS and Fax machines.

XR lost my support when they started jumping on tube trains outside Canning Town - literal green PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION - disrupting working class people, many of which were probably trying to get home after a night shift.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Chez Wombat
post Sep 6 2020, 04:37 PM
Post #7
The owls are not what they seem
*******
Group: Global Mod
Posts: 37,026
Member No.: 9,232
Joined: 11-July 09
   No Gallery Pics
 


I can get behind this one more than that utterly ridiculous delay of public transport a while back, especially as the only one it really hurts is Murdoch who I'm certainly not crying over.

Problem is, I feel it will again get twisted and get every single newspaper here (who clearly have a lot of mates high up) against them which will again, botch their overall message if their seen as an 'organised crime' group. I do support what they're going for here, but I have to agree their methods do more harm to the cause than good.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Andrew.
post Sep 6 2020, 04:49 PM
Post #8
is in hibernation
******
Group: Banned
Posts: 11,385
Member No.: 21,161
Joined: 24-August 14
 


I do hope this kind of thing isn't a long term strategy. As I said, restricting the Sun is fine for one day or a weekend but any more than that and it's completely playing in to the Centre/Right's hands regarding free speech.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Klaus
post Sep 6 2020, 08:53 PM
Post #9
❤️❤️➕🟦
*******
Group: Entertainment Mod
Posts: 22,245
Member No.: 17,160
Joined: 3-June 12
   No Gallery Pics
 


Yeah, especially after that public transport protest, I have no respect for them. They have no idea what they’re doing, and every action they take is completely counter-productive.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Iz 🌟
post Sep 7 2020, 04:20 AM
Post #10
I'm a paragon so don't perceive me
*******
Group: Admin.
Posts: 37,390
Member No.: 12,929
Joined: 3-February 11
   No Gallery Pics
 


You know, I'd find it pretty easy to forgive an organisation whose top stated aim is 'stopping us all dying', especially if it were a decentralised organisation without much control over the actions of its members, and which denounced the individuals responsible for that specific faux-pas.

Especially if they'd literally just shown that their action had smartened up in the intervening year by directly targeting those actually causing the problems by downplaying the crisis. And it's not inconveniencing any members of the public, and as the state of British newspapers is so dire, it's surely one of the most popular targets they could have chosen. This is exactly the sort of action they should be taking and the only negative press they'll get out of it is because they're targeting the literal press.

Are they the most effective organisation? Certainly not. But they're a very useful existing structure for direct action to take place, and sometimes that is very much needed. I'd love to hear what any of you think would be a more effective way to tackle the problem that climate change narrative is easily downplayed by the media.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Doctor Blind
post Sep 7 2020, 05:33 AM
Post #11
#38BBE0 otherwise known as 'sky blue'
******
Group: Moderator
Posts: 16,163
Member No.: 7,561
Joined: 27-October 08
   No Gallery Pics
 


So because they are taking ANY action, no matter how ineffective or counterproductive, we're supposed to just support them because we've not done anything different?

I do not think you win arguments simply by silencing your opponent, and blocking the Murdoch press (though I fully support it) plays exactly into the hands of those they are trying to defeat. I said exactly the same thing for those involved with the defacing of Churchill's statue, as well as the cenotaph during the Black Lives Matter protests, and this way of putting your argument across ties in with the recent trend of no-platforming as a way of effectively only allowing free speech for people whose opinion you agree with. It plays entirely into the false narritive peddled by those on the right that well-meaning liberals are against free speech and gives the opponents an easy way to completely deflect the original purpose of the protest, and I'd argue is actually worse than not doing anything in the first place. I mean newspapers are hardly the most dominant form of media anymore and likely haven't been since the early-mid 2000s with readerships dwindling and basically nobody under the age of 30 ever having bought one. I mean most people get their news from social media..

I think... building a movement around a pre-existing political party that commits fully to tackling climate change, supports those businesses and industries that act and make every effort to become green, and boycotts those that don't has a lot more chance of succeeding.

If you want to win people round, and that I'd suggest is more effective than just highlighting your cause, then XR need to stop being so hostile, so condescending, and be understanding of those who they don't agree with in order to bring them on side. Right now they're coming across as a load of middle-class entitled brats who haven't done a days work in their life and think they know better than everyone else.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Iz 🌟
post Sep 7 2020, 08:11 AM
Post #12
I'm a paragon so don't perceive me
*******
Group: Admin.
Posts: 37,390
Member No.: 12,929
Joined: 3-February 11
   No Gallery Pics
 


I would indeed wholly prefer it if we could trust Labour (as the only relevant choice) to create a more palatable green program.

However while XR exists, we should be able to use it, as an organisation with a low barrier to entry, to create the sort of protests and visible mood that will indicate to those politicians making up policy in Labour that a green policy is something that cannot be ignored. I think we have to be able to judge them on the merit of each individual action rather than dismissing them because of past misjudgements. And this action is far more preferable than other actions they've done in the past.

Indeed I haven't seen all that much pushback from the media outside of the initial free speech salvo and a protestation from the Sun that they actually had an environment-positive article in the edition that was delayed, I think if they push the anti-XR narrative too hard on this one, it will become too obvious to their readers. Optics is definitely a good point and one I'm constantly concerned with, though at this point the most we can do against big media without them twisting the narrative against us is complain really loudly on Twitter and even then sometimes...

I definitely take your point about newspapers not being so dominant, I wonder if that was deliberate to avoid inconvenience? Not that I think XR have hackers in their ranks ready to go but while hacking websites would have been far more effective, it would have got so so much more 'stop protesting you're inconveniencing our lives' pushback and at that point I'd actually say the free speech warriors had a valid argument. This way it's more of a symbolic siding against them.

Oh and definitely several elements of XR are entitled and out of touch, I do think climate protesters need to be working with other activists and try not to come across so hard on one issue. Outreach to get on media programmes, make the 'your profits will be in danger if the environment collapses' arguments as well as criticise media conduct.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Doctor Blind
post Sep 8 2020, 12:16 PM
Post #13
#38BBE0 otherwise known as 'sky blue'
******
Group: Moderator
Posts: 16,163
Member No.: 7,561
Joined: 27-October 08
   No Gallery Pics
 


I didn't specifically mean the Labour Party, the Green Party could quite easily become the replacement for them as the progressive left in the next decade such as the SPD have been overtaken by the Green Party in Germany for example.

If they wanted to target the media they'd have been better going for the BBC - already a target of hate for the right - who are supposed to be a public service broadcaster but have an absolutely shocking record on political journalism (Laura Kuenssberg spreading fake news during the 2019 GE for example) and aren't much better on scientific journalism. They always put some nutjob climate denier up against climate scientists on discussions and debates as though this is some sort of balance, when there is a rare thing in science, a consensus that man-made climate change is happening and the opposite opinion is just crank nonsense. This isn't America, the general public do actually have some awareness of what's going on!! They are also the bottom feeders of what is so-called journalism these days with their constant use of 'churnalism' - meaning much of their output is led by the papers, owned by the billionaires who therefore set the agenda.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Rooney
post Sep 20 2021, 01:48 PM
Post #14
WINTER IS COMING
*******
Group: Global Mod
Posts: 45,571
Member No.: 88
Joined: 7-March 06
 


Any chance of there being a different group rather than XR taking on the climate change debate?

I applaud the message but it's really offputting the actions they're taking and it's not bringing people on board.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Smint
post Sep 20 2021, 05:11 PM
Post #15
BuzzJack Gold Member
*****
Group: Members
Posts: 3,492
Member No.: 124,514
Joined: 21-February 21
   No Gallery Pics
 


I'm not sure that stopping people going to hospital for life saving operations is a good look no. That said protests have to be disruptive in order for them to work - the People's Vote brought in the numbers but it did nothing. I liked the one stopping the Mail and other newspapers publishing their filth for a day. biggrin.gif
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Chez Wombat
post Sep 20 2021, 05:27 PM
Post #16
The owls are not what they seem
*******
Group: Global Mod
Posts: 37,026
Member No.: 9,232
Joined: 11-July 09
   No Gallery Pics
 


Yeah, they're not perfect, but frankly, this isn't something we can just shrug off. For people to realise what a crisis we're in, it has to make a big impact, and it's not like the government or big corporations are gonna do anything in response to harmless placards and signs. People won't like being disrupted, but it should give a hint of the sort of things that need to change.

The tube hold up thing years back was undeniably woefully misguided and put me off them, but as the crisis was worsened they seem to be making better moves and picking better targets as there is literally no one else doing what they're doing, it's hard to write them off entirely.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Silas
post Sep 20 2021, 05:53 PM
Post #17
Queen of Soon
********
Group: Moderator
Posts: 74,015
Member No.: 3,474
Joined: 24-May 07
 


God I loathe XR

They are fond of blocking the street outside the transport ministry and the energy ministry here (either side of a small park on the same street and they then camp out in said park) and I wonder how many people die as a direct result of their inconvenience. The road is an access route to two of the cities largest hospitals, they tie up hundreds of cops. And for what. As if the CDU gives a f*** about what XR has to say.


Friday saw Greenpeace, an organisation just as bad, scale central station and unfurl a giant banner. Harmless you’d think. Coz they scalled a tall building we had half a dozen cop vans, a climbing apparatus from the fireys, a fire engine and an ambulance all sat there for HOURS until they came down. As if we can afford to tie up vital life saving emergency services for an entire morning for an ego trip

QUOTE(Doctor Blind @ Sep 8 2020, 02:16 PM) *
I didn't specifically mean the Labour Party, the Green Party could quite easily become the replacement for them as the progressive left in the next decade such as the SPD have been overtaken by the Green Party in Germany for example.

It’s amazing what 12 months can do!
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Rooney
post Sep 20 2021, 08:04 PM
Post #18
WINTER IS COMING
*******
Group: Global Mod
Posts: 45,571
Member No.: 88
Joined: 7-March 06
 


QUOTE(Smint @ Sep 20 2021, 06:11 PM) *
I'm not sure that stopping people going to hospital for life saving operations is a good look no. That said protests have to be disruptive in order for them to work - the People's Vote brought in the numbers but it did nothing. I liked the one stopping the Mail and other newspapers publishing their filth for a day. biggrin.gif


Are they working though? From the outside it just turns the outside off from their cause. BuzzJack is super liberal & left-wing, but I think you'd find lots of people here agree climate change is an issue, but don't agree with that XR are doing. I'm all for one's that don't disrupt people's daily lives, the tube stuff was ridiculous and sitting in the middle of the M25 is also frigging stupid.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Smint
post Sep 20 2021, 08:17 PM
Post #19
BuzzJack Gold Member
*****
Group: Members
Posts: 3,492
Member No.: 124,514
Joined: 21-February 21
   No Gallery Pics
 


QUOTE(Rooney @ Sep 20 2021, 09:04 PM) *
Are they working though? From the outside it just turns the outside off from their cause. BuzzJack is super liberal & left-wing, but I think you'd find lots of people here agree climate change is an issue, but don't agree with that XR are doing. I'm all for one's that don't disrupt people's daily lives, the tube stuff was ridiculous and sitting in the middle of the M25 is also frigging stupid.


I'm not saying I have the answers but Stonewall (LGBT rights), Sufragettes (Vote for Women) and various black power movements used violence and disruption and helped changed society People's votes and the anti Iraq War demos drew unprecedented numbers to the streets but were peaceful and 100% ignored. Peaceful protests and demonstrations rarely change anything.
Whether XR works or not is open to debate though. I'd like to think they keep the issue in the public eye. I met someone who was heavily involved and said that he wished he didn't have to do it but there was no other option for his conscious. Personally I don't agree with holding up traffic as that could prevent someone from getting the surgery they need so not one of their better ones.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Rooney
post Sep 20 2021, 08:59 PM
Post #20
WINTER IS COMING
*******
Group: Global Mod
Posts: 45,571
Member No.: 88
Joined: 7-March 06
 


QUOTE(Smint @ Sep 20 2021, 09:17 PM) *
I'm not saying I have the answers but Stonewall (LGBT rights), Sufragettes (Vote for Women) and various black power movements used violence and disruption and helped changed society People's votes and the anti Iraq War demos drew unprecedented numbers to the streets but were peaceful and 100% ignored. Peaceful protests and demonstrations rarely change anything.
Whether XR works or not is open to debate though. I'd like to think they keep the issue in the public eye. I met someone who was heavily involved and said that he wished he didn't have to do it but there was no other option for his conscious. Personally I don't agree with holding up traffic as that could prevent someone from getting the surgery they need so not one of their better ones.


While I understand that point, I just often fear there is something off about white-middle class kids and adults trying to tell us about climate change. I think some of the protests just miss the mark, even the manure stunt which was funny, who cleaned that up? Not the papers. While they can't get any worse than the Tube stunt, I just feel that particular stunt lost the public and now they need to change tact. Just feel I have more sympathy with some poor sod whose not going to be able to get to work to put food on the table, rather than the protestors themselves.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post


2 Pages V   1 2 >
Reply to this topicStart new topic

1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:


 

Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 29th March 2024 - 08:45 AM