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> European Election Thread 2019, EU, baby.
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European Elections
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Brett-Butler
post May 27 2019, 12:11 PM
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Northern Ireland counting is still underway - as expected, Sinn Fein and the DUP have come 1st and 2nd and expected to be carried fairly early in the counting, but the 3rd seat looks like to have gone to Naomi Long of Alliance, which would see the UUP lose their seat.
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Iz~
post May 27 2019, 12:30 PM
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QUOTE(Andrew. @ May 27 2019, 11:43 AM) *
Yeah, all this adding up parties to get a leave/remain vote is a bit...silly, and I’m surprised actual elected officials have been doing it. Where the labour (and to a lesser extent the tories) vote goes for example is just down to however you want to spin it.


But most people that are adding up the results are specifically not including either Labour or the Tories.

Right here is how the BBC are presenting it. I think that's very fair to do.
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Chez Wombat
post May 27 2019, 12:47 PM
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Fantastic to see the Greens and Lib Dems do fairly well across the board (and almost on par with the Brexit Party if you're combining stances), Greens doing well around Europe is especially pleasing to see. Very pleased for London to go Lib Dems and Green got a seat as well, I was hoping they would get more but I'm glad to have helped them to that seat and no Tories festering there is bloody brilliant (even if the Brexit Party got two seats).

I guess a negative shows we're still very much divided and there's no clear stance about where the public want to go for Brexit even if it is just a small sample, just like the MPs :/ And ofc. the left wing parties surge will be completely pushed under the rug and just the Brexit Party alone will be used to determine the public's view on Brexit.
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Andrew.
post May 27 2019, 01:31 PM
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QUOTE(Iz~ @ May 27 2019, 01:30 PM) *
But most people that are adding up the results are specifically not including either Labour or the Tories.

Right here is how the BBC are presenting it. I think that's very fair to do.

The tories, which ran with the slogan that 'they were the only party which can deliver Brexit' in this election should be with leave though? It was a good result for remain parties and I'm glad, but the spin from other remainers has been questionable, which is the first time I can really say that compared to the leavers.


This post has been edited by Andrew.: May 27 2019, 01:34 PM
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Rooney
post May 27 2019, 01:43 PM
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QUOTE(Andrew. @ May 27 2019, 02:31 PM) *
The tories, which ran with the slogan that 'they were the only party which can deliver Brexit' in this election should be with leave though? It was a good result for remain parties and I'm glad, but the spin from other remainers has been questionable, which is the first time I can really say that compared to the leavers.


You can spin the results anyway really. Look at some of the cities like Liverpool/Manchester that we’re Remain, they also heavily voted Labour. Who knows really if that was because they were pro-EU or Leave. Truth is lots of people will vote Labour or stories because they have always done that. Labour have done the unique thing of alientating the working class and the lower middle-class with their Brexit stance. The Tories message was Leave but with the Withdraw agreement. No that is dead and buried we won’t know their stance until the leader is confirmed. Obviously they will still be Brexit, but what kind of Brexit will depend on their leader.

Only way you can really look at these results is clear a lot of the Tory/Labour voters have deserted them to either pro-EU or Leave at all costs parties.
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Popchartfreak
post May 27 2019, 03:26 PM
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QUOTE(Steve201 @ May 27 2019, 10:22 AM) *
On the one hand you say if ChUk had done a deal with the LDs they would have won more seats and been an even more gain to the bollocks to Brexit lot then you say they can sod off if 40% of 1/3 who voted for so called No deal parties. You can't interpret it both ways to fit your view.


I agree. Neither side has a ticket to anything because not enough voted. However, it's Farridge that is claiming the whole country wants a No-Deal Brexit, when in fact it's only been voted for by roughly one-third of one-third of the population - my Maths is shaky but I make that around 12-15% of the country, if we assume that everyone who voted FFC totally wants No Deal and accept that Farridge can read the minds of each and everyone. If everyone was that committed to it they should have turned up to vote for FFC, and obtained 52% of the vote. They didn't.

Of the rest of the nation, another 14-17% likely want a referendum, and the rest we haven't a clue. One way of finding out is to ask them to vote on the remaining option: No Deal or No Brexit. There are no other options left unless we start the whole process all over again for another 2 years.
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Rooney
post May 27 2019, 03:37 PM
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News coming out of the Labour camp is Corbyn is dithering around what to do, wanting to enter consultation until the next conference. They are going to get strung in any GE. I don't know who is advising him, but they are clueless. Hopefully the more conservative members of the party organise a coupe.
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Suedehead2
post May 27 2019, 03:47 PM
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I'm willing to give Corbyn some advice. Resign.
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Popchartfreak
post May 27 2019, 06:42 PM
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QUOTE(Rooney @ May 27 2019, 04:37 PM) *
News coming out of the Labour camp is Corbyn is dithering around what to do, wanting to enter consultation until the next conference. They are going to get strung in any GE. I don't know who is advising him, but they are clueless. Hopefully the more conservative members of the party organise a coupe.


It's his Far-Left matey obsessives that still cling to the vision of a pure Socialist utopia outside the corrupt materialistic bourgeois EU. Taking the plebs down the tube with your own country is of secondary importance to the goal they've always wanted and see as within their grasp if only Corbyn can hang in there until the Tories collapse and Labour can inherit the Crown.

An inability to see reality is usually a giveaway that they've lost the plot, if they actually ever had it, pumped up in this case by incoming naive young folk who believed in the vision they were sold by a bunch of old long-time radicals who'd tried and failed before when the previous generation spotted them for what they are, but which they still blame the failure for on others instead of their own illogic and intolerance, and inability to convince. IMHO of course.
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TheSnake
post May 27 2019, 06:52 PM
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QUOTE
Northern Ireland counting is still underway - as expected, Sinn Fein and the DUP have come 1st and 2nd and expected to be carried fairly early in the counting, but the 3rd seat looks like to have gone to Naomi Long of Alliance, which would see the UUP lose their seat.
Alliance are strongly linked to the Lib Dems so that's another victory for them.

QUOTE(Popchartfreak @ May 27 2019, 07:42 PM) *

It's his Far-Left matey obsessives that still cling to the vision of a pure Socialist utopia outside the corrupt materialistic bourgeois EU.


Yes it seems to be a thing for the far-left to be eurosceptic, hence the aforementioned former revolutionary communist running for the Brexit Party.
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Steve201
post May 27 2019, 08:15 PM
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QUOTE(5 Silas Frøkner @ May 27 2019, 12:32 PM) *
Aware that Leanne isn’t leader anymore but farage isn’t the leader of the welsh faction that will go forwards at an assembly election either. Didn’t know the new PC guys name but let’s be honest that Plaid are only where they are because of Leanne. She started the journey. Wonder if like Salmond she’ll return for another go in the future

Not saying LWs leadership hasn't had an affect but it was Brexit again which had the biggest effect here as PC have been similar to the snp being hugely pro remain - if it wasn't for the LDs they'd have won even more votes.
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Iz~
post May 28 2019, 02:57 AM
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QUOTE(TheSnake @ May 27 2019, 06:52 PM) *
Yes it seems to be a thing for the far-left to be eurosceptic, hence the aforementioned former revolutionary communist running for the Brexit Party.


The EU is an opponent to far leftists just as much if not more than for far-right wingers because they couldn't really disagree with it more, economically. The right wing disagreement with the EU is more social and cultural in nature, although they might prefer the single market to be a bit freer.

An interesting thread I read on Twitter yesterday contains the point that these elections have been dictated a lot more by culture than by economy, which is why the left-wing right now is mostly supportive of the EU while the right-wing is against it.

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vidcapper
post May 28 2019, 04:49 AM
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QUOTE(Iz~ @ May 28 2019, 03:57 AM) *


I wouldn't describe the Brexit party as 'far right' as they are basically UKIP Mk2.
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Iz~
post May 28 2019, 05:01 AM
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And I wouldn't necessarily call Corbyn far-left, as he does either. He's obviously using them as relative ideological terms to categorise parties opposed to the centre though, as opposed to snarl words.

The trouble with the Brexit party right now is that they can evade being ideologically placed, so the statements of their new MEPs will be very important to place them. There is a distinction is that the Brexit Party is at this moment far more populist and less anti-immigration than Front National or Lega, which is precisely why they're in a different European Parliament grouping, they do seem to now be in the legacy UKIP position under the EFDD.
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Suedehead2
post Jun 2 2019, 03:04 PM
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Anne Widdicombe has said that science might one day find a "solution" to homosexuality. Didn't take long for the Farage fanclub to start showing its true colours, did it?
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Popchartfreak
post Jun 2 2019, 06:44 PM
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QUOTE(Suedehead2 @ Jun 2 2019, 04:04 PM) *
Anne Widdicombe has said that science might one day find a "solution" to homosexuality. Didn't take long for the Farage fanclub to start showing its true colours, did it?



me-thinks she doth protest too much.

She does love cats though.
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Tawdry Hepburn
post Jun 3 2019, 10:00 AM
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QUOTE(Suedehead2 @ Jun 2 2019, 04:04 PM) *
Anne Widdicombe has said that science might one day find a "solution" to homosexuality. Didn't take long for the Farage fanclub to start showing its true colours, did it?


I wonder if science could provide a "solution" for that old gorgon.
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TheSnake
post Jun 3 2019, 10:14 AM
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QUOTE(Suedehead2 @ Jun 2 2019, 04:04 PM) *
Anne Widdicombe has said that science might one day find a "solution" to homosexuality. Didn't take long for the Farage fanclub to start showing its true colours, did it?


This could be a headache for Farage and the Brexit party considering that's partly why Farage left UKIP - to try and escape the controversies created by some of its candidates. Will be interesting to see how Farage responds when questioned about Widdecombe's comments, will he do better than Batten at containing the fallout.


This post has been edited by TheSnake: Jun 3 2019, 10:17 AM
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mald487
post Jun 3 2019, 10:44 AM
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QUOTE(Suedehead2 @ Jun 2 2019, 03:04 PM) *
Anne Widdicombe has said that science might one day find a "solution" to homosexuality. Didn't take long for the Farage fanclub to start showing its true colours, did it?


I wonder if science will ever find a solution to nasty, old, racist, backward, homophobic see you next Tuesdays?
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