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The Guardian to go 'tabloid'?

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vidcapper View member profile	8th December 2017, 07:19 AM Post #1
Paul Hyett Joined: 4 April 2006 Posts: 25,346 User: 364	http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-51...d-new-year.html Editor-in-chief confirms switch to save money as the paper battles to break even Decision comes after it struck a printing deal with Trinity Mirror earlier this year The Guardian is to scrap its much-vaunted ‘Berliner’ format in the new year and become a tabloid. Editor-in-chief Katharine Viner confirmed she was making the switch to save money as the newspaper battles to break even by early 2019. ‘We have got the same amount of journalism. The cost-savings are all in production and printing processes rather than the journalism,’ she told the BBC. The change is a dramatic shift for the left-of-centre Guardian, which had spent £80million on Berliner presses and print works. It made a great fanfare of the format when it switched from a larger, broadsheet format 12 years ago. At the time, then-editor Alan Rusbridger claimed that the mid-sized Berliner was ‘much more convenient than a tabloid’ and represented a ‘quantum leap forward technologically’. He added that there were ‘lots of downsides for turning tabloid’ and that opting for the Berliner format felt ‘much bolder’. However, The Guardian has struggled to stem its losses, which stood at £45million last year, leading to hundreds of job losses. It has traditionally printed its newspaper itself, but earlier this year struck a deal to outsource the operation to Trinity Mirror – publisher of fellow tabloids the Daily Mirror, the Sunday Mirror and the Sunday People – from January. ********************************* I guess it's 'lefty-loving' style is not as popular as you would have me think...


Soy Adrián View member profile	8th December 2017, 07:43 AM Post #2
I'm so lonely, I paid a hobo to spoon with me Joined: 6 February 2010 Posts: 12,908 User: 10,596	What on earth is that supposed to mean?


vidcapper View member profile	8th December 2017, 07:53 AM Post #3
Paul Hyett Joined: 4 April 2006 Posts: 25,346 User: 364	QUOTE(Soy Adrián @ Dec 8 2017, 07:43 AM) What on earth is that supposed to mean? The article, or my comment?


Suedehead2 View member profile	8th December 2017, 08:58 AM Post #4
BuzzJack Legend Joined: 13 April 2007 Posts: 36,676 User: 3,272	This is old news. It was announced months ago.


vidcapper View member profile	8th December 2017, 10:40 AM Post #5
Paul Hyett Joined: 4 April 2006 Posts: 25,346 User: 364	QUOTE(Suedehead2 @ Dec 8 2017, 08:58 AM) This is old news. It was announced months ago. But will it mean their website becomes more user-friendly?


Soy Adrián View member profile	8th December 2017, 11:05 AM Post #6
I'm so lonely, I paid a hobo to spoon with me Joined: 6 February 2010 Posts: 12,908 User: 10,596	The website is already rather good, particularly compared to most of its competitors (Independent springs to mind as being disproportionately shit).


Suedehead2 View member profile	8th December 2017, 11:54 AM Post #7
BuzzJack Legend Joined: 13 April 2007 Posts: 36,676 User: 3,272	The design of the Independent website is indeed terrible. I have no idea whether the Guardian website will be overhauled.


vidcapper View member profile	8th December 2017, 12:14 PM Post #8
Paul Hyett Joined: 4 April 2006 Posts: 25,346 User: 364	QUOTE(Soy Adrián @ Dec 8 2017, 11:05 AM) The website is already rather good, particularly compared to most of its competitors (Independent springs to mind as being disproportionately shit). Leaving aside the issue of political slant, I prefer the layout of the Mail - you can simply scroll down the page to find the stories, rather than clicking through menus,


Popchartfreak View member profile	8th December 2017, 12:58 PM Post #9
BuzzJack Legend Joined: 18 July 2012 Posts: 22,851 User: 17,376	QUOTE(vidsanta @ Dec 8 2017, 12:14 PM) Leaving aside the issue of political slant, I prefer the layout of the Mail - you can simply scroll down the page to find the stories, rather than clicking through menus, plus you get scantily-clad women staring down at you enticingly....


vidcapper View member profile	8th December 2017, 02:42 PM Post #10
Paul Hyett Joined: 4 April 2006 Posts: 25,346 User: 364	QUOTE(Popchartfreak @ Dec 8 2017, 12:58 PM) plus you get scantily-clad women staring down at you enticingly.... Like the Kardashians? No thanks!


Doctor Blind View member profile	8th December 2017, 03:34 PM Post #11
#38BBE0 otherwise known as 'sky blue' Joined: 27 October 2008 Posts: 16,173 User: 7,561	QUOTE(Soy Adrián @ Dec 8 2017, 11:05 AM) The website is already rather good, particularly compared to most of its competitors (Independent springs to mind as being disproportionately shit). It disappointed me greatly what happened to the Independent - that was the last paper I bought (shortly before it went online), Amol Rajan tore up the, still eminently insightful IMO, print edition and said 'oh it'll all go online' - when what actually has happened is it's become a shadow of its former self and disproportionately difficult to navigate without losing the will to live. Meanwhile Amol Rajan has buggered off to become the BBCs Social Media Editor for a lot more money now that he's destroyed what was a decent paper. Not too bothered about the Guardian going over to Tabloid format to be honest, I no longer buy newspapers but it is good to see them still putting out good (but often typo-ridden! ) journalism into what is frankly depressing print market.


Brett-Butler View member profile	8th December 2017, 06:30 PM Post #12
Howdy, disco citizens Joined: 16 January 2010 Posts: 12,775 User: 10,455	It was going to happen sooner rather than later. The Guardian, in both its print forms and online, has been haemorrhaging money for many years now (they made annual losses of £33m in the last financial year, and £71m the year before that), so it's not surprising to see it trying to cut costs in some shape or form. The reason that they can continue at all despite making such massive losses is that their direct holding company, Guardian Media Group, has massive reserves of assets, including investments in lots of different companies, that can more than sustain the losses borne by the paper. Once that ebbs away though... On one level, it's a shame to see it ditch the broadsheet, as it carries a level of gravitas that you don't get from the tabloid format, and with this it will leave only the FT and The Telegraph as the only British broadsheets left. On the other hand, broadsheets are incredibly cumbersome, you need a lot of space to read it which is rather awkward, especially on a train when you don't want to bump into someone every time you change the page, so for ease of reading it's a good move. It also goes into the big question as to whether it's a further sign of the slow death of the newspaper industry. Circulation has been in terminal decline, with only The Telegraph & The Times making any increases in recent times, and there hasn't been a successful, mainstream national paper to launch since "i" over 10 years ago, although whether you could launch one now is another question - remember "The New Day"? The only ones that have been successful in recent years have been the hyper-partisan ones that only appeal to one key demographic niche, ie The New European or The National. Maybe I'm just nostalgic, but there's a level of gravitas you get from a newspaper that you just can't get from reading it online. Interestingly enough, there's still demand for current affairs and news magazines, as opposed to newspapers, as we've seen The Spectator, Private Eye & The New Statesman enjoy record circulation in the past few months (albeit there's been some controversy over the numbers, as it is counted twice in the circulation numbers) when you subscribe to both the magazine & the website, so if there is a future in print news, it's likely to be in weekly/fortnightly magazines, rather than in daily newspapers. I've been formulating an idea in my mind for a new type of newspaper that I would like to launch, which I would hope would bring about a complete change in news, especially when it comes to making sure you can trust what you read. If you'd like me to, I'll tell you all about my idea.


Suedehead2 View member profile	8th December 2017, 07:40 PM Post #13
BuzzJack Legend Joined: 13 April 2007 Posts: 36,676 User: 3,272	The New Day failed because it was a terrible product. Oh, and the i launched in 2010 so it's not a decade old yet. Of course, as a standalone product (rather than being the Mini Indy) it is even younger. Would the budding Murdoch like to share his idea?


Brett-Butler View member profile	8th December 2017, 08:46 PM Post #14
Howdy, disco citizens Joined: 16 January 2010 Posts: 12,775 User: 10,455	QUOTE(Suedehead2 @ Dec 8 2017, 08:40 PM) Would the budding Murdoch like to share his idea? Very well The paper will be called "The Centre". The paper will have have news, and only news (although a crossword and cartoon page will be permissible). There will be no opinion journalists or columnists of any stripe - no Owen Jonses, no Richard Littlejohnses, no Polly Toynbees, no Katy Hopkinses - no-one. Any stories that feature two sides will obtain statements from two sources of an equitable stature on both sides of the argument for balance. To ensure impartiality at all times, the paper will not take any political positions, and journalists must not be registered members of political parties, or have been one in the past 3 years, nor or any organisation that could result in "undue influence" over any stories featured. And my most important feature - The Corrections Page - page 3 of the paper will be solely handed over for any corrections, errors & clarifications that have appeared in prior issues of the paper, so if there are none, page 3 will be completely blank. This will ensure whenever we get anything wrong, we can put our hands up and admit it, which will help to regain trust in an industry where people are becoming increasingly sceptical of whether the news they are receiving is honest or not. Of course, I doubt that something like this could get off the ground, as everyone to some extent has some biases that will make their way into the pages, even if your paper's outlook is to remove it entirely.


vidcapper View member profile	9th December 2017, 06:47 AM Post #15
Paul Hyett Joined: 4 April 2006 Posts: 25,346 User: 364	QUOTE(Brett-Butler @ Dec 8 2017, 08:46 PM) Very well The paper will be called "The Centre". The paper will have have news, and only news (although a crossword and cartoon page will be permissible). There will be no opinion journalists or columnists of any stripe - no Owen Jonses, no Richard Littlejohnses, no Polly Toynbees, no Katy Hopkinses - no-one. Any stories that feature two sides will obtain statements from two sources of an equitable stature on both sides of the argument for balance. To ensure impartiality at all times, the paper will not take any political positions, and journalists must not be registered members of political parties, or have been one in the past 3 years, nor or any organisation that could result in "undue influence" over any stories featured. Who will the intended readership be?


Brett-Butler View member profile	9th December 2017, 03:13 PM Post #16
Howdy, disco citizens Joined: 16 January 2010 Posts: 12,775 User: 10,455	QUOTE(vidsanta @ Dec 9 2017, 07:47 AM) Who will the intended readership be? My intended audience would be those on both the left and the right who have lost faith in the honesty and integrity of the traditional media industry, and who are likely to drift to the more "out there", unreliable non-mainstream sources (be they Breitbart on the right, The Canary & Skwawkbox on the left) if there isn't an outlet with more integrity that they can rely on. As well as this, people who are willing to listen to news that are outside their own particular bubble would be within my target, as my aim to ensure that each news story hears both equitable sides means that whilst each story may confirm your own biases to some extent, you will get to hear a similarly strong argument from the other side, so even if you don't agree with what they say, at least you will learn to understand where they are coming from. I do recognise that such an outlet would be hard to get running, and finding those sort of audiences would be challenging - by nature we are more likely to gravitate to media that confirm our own views wholly (and believe me, I am not exempt from such a thing), so a newspaper that is likely to challenge that may have difficulty getting an audience. Then again, I'm firmly of the belief that there are some good ideas coming from people on both the political "left" and the political "right", and that being able to listen to each others' ideas without falling back into partisan biases is the best course of action for the good of humanity going forward.


Silas View member profile	9th December 2017, 03:24 PM Post #17
Queen of Soon Joined: 24 May 2007 Posts: 74,088 User: 3,474	I'd buy it. Especially if it was quite I like in that it's concise and treats you like you aren't a total idiot.


Suedehead2 View member profile	9th December 2017, 04:12 PM Post #18
BuzzJack Legend Joined: 13 April 2007 Posts: 36,676 User: 3,272	There are often more than two sides to an argument! When the Independent started they set out to make unbiased reporting their USP. The difficulty they faced was making the reporting interesting as well as impartial. There is still a big gap to be filled between the red-tops at one end and the upmarket papers at the other end. The i is partly aimed at that market, but it is still dominated by two very right-wing titles. It would be interesting to see whether a newspaper with no opinion pieces could succeed. Would you also exclude a letters page? You would also need to decide where to draw the line between analysis, perhaps including some historical context, and opinion. As an example, a journalist with the expertise to write a background piece on the Middle East would probably have their own opinions. Trying to avoid letting those prejudices creep into the analysis would be difficult.


vidcapper View member profile	9th December 2017, 04:24 PM Post #19
Paul Hyett Joined: 4 April 2006 Posts: 25,346 User: 364	QUOTE(Suedehead2 @ Dec 9 2017, 04:12 PM) It would be interesting to see whether a newspaper with no opinion pieces could succeed. Would you also exclude a letters page? Nearly half the comments I post to the Mail seem to go AWOL - I didn't think I was that controversial.


Popchartfreak View member profile	9th December 2017, 07:53 PM Post #20
BuzzJack Legend Joined: 18 July 2012 Posts: 22,851 User: 17,376	QUOTE(vidsanta @ Dec 9 2017, 04:24 PM) Nearly half the comments I post to the Mail seem to go AWOL - I didn't think I was that controversial. Newspapers delete comments that may contravene uk legislation and lead to court. Why am I not surprised....?