HYP - O - FCUKIN - CRIT

 

THIS is what gets me.... how those claiming the moral high ground stoop (and LOSE their argument) to the actions they accuse the bnp membership of!

 

ASTOUNDED!

 

VIOLENCE IS WRONG period.

 

there is NO justification whatsoever for violence, YOUD be the first one to shout 'foul' if the bnp members DID attack a 'non white'.. IT CUTS BOTH WAYS.

 

THEY WERE NOT VIOLENT FFS.

 

On all the accounts of the incidents happening inside tv centre, including one from Piers Morgan, the protesters were peaceful, it was the f***ing police being the violent ones. as always.

 

AND ANYWAY, BNP are far more violent than any of the protesters, I have heard more than one story of bnp members attacking non-whites, and that is a racial attack, not a protest against fasism and racists.

 

I have mentioned these thigns several time in this thread you just cant seem to get it into your head Rob.

 

 

And like Scott said, BNP deserve a good f***ing kicking anyway, the protesters could have been more violent, and they wouldnt have been as violent as the BNP are, if someone outright punched Griffin in the face it would be justifed, because of who he is and what he has said last night and in the past.

No-one's claiming teachers should be putting on simulations of gay sex to a class of 7-year-olds. What people are saying is that tolerance of homosexuality SHOULD be taught from a very early age, and that there's nothing "creepy" about seeing two men kissing, like Griffin thinks.

 

How is gay sex any more of a "niche sexual activity" than sex between a man and a woman?

 

The % of participants

 

What % of the UK are gay ? 5-10 ? probably about 5% so to me it is a very minority activity and that is what I meant by niche, heterosexual sex makes up about 90%

 

Homosexuality is not mainstream Danny given the % of people that are gay

The % of participants

 

What % of the UK are gay ? 5-10 ? probably about 5% so to me it is a very minority activity and that is what I meant by niche, heterosexual sex makes up about 90%

 

Homosexuality is not mainstream Danny given the % of people that are gay

 

So what? Why just because a smaller percentage of the population are gay does that make it worse than heterosexuality and not appropriate for schools?

 

Even though I've disagreed with your viewpoints many times on this forum, I'd never thought you were homophobic until now...

To be honest Craig you are coming across as quite homophobic.. Im SURE more than 5% of the UK is gay and the fact youre comparing it to swinging and saynig we sholdnt expose children to it's existence basically suggests you think children should be shown hetrosexuality is 'normal' and not exposed to the realities of society. If someone is gay, they are gay, and they should be made to feel like they can be who they are without a harsh judging from society..

I agree with james, homosexuality isnt (or supposedly isnt) frowned upon in today's society, why should kids not know homosexuality exists when they know heterosexuality exists?

 

 

I agree with james, homosexuality isnt (or supposedly isnt) frowned upon in today's society, why should kids not know homosexuality exists when they know heterosexuality exists?

 

 

So what? Why just because a smaller percentage of the population are gay does that make it worse than heterosexuality and not appropriate for schools?

 

Even though I've disagreed with your viewpoints many times on this forum, I'd never thought you were homophobic until now...

 

I am NOT homophobic, I am one of the few card carrying conservatives in this country that supports gay marriage as I have stated many a time on this board, if I am in favour of gay marriage how can I be a homophobe ? just about my closest offline friend is gay too, I also have 2 other gay friends, I have employed openly gay people, I don't even know why I need to justify myself the idea I am homophobic is a fantasy

 

I just don't think it is something that should be taught to schoolkids that does not make me homophobic in the slightest, someone is not converted from a straight to a gay people are born gay so I don't see the need to preach homosexuality to straight children as it is not going to give them a lifestyle choice so there is very little to say to kids on the subject other than telling them not to go about gay bashing

 

My example before of BDSM, it is said in a national survey that 12% regularly participate in some form of BDSM be it tying a partner up to a bed, wearing naughty nurses uniforms or even more hardcore stuff like whippings and punishment, should that be taught at school ? do you want kids taught whipping and bondage ? after all more people are into softcore or hardcore BDSM than are gay in the UK !

what does bondage have anything to do with homossexuality? :rolleyes: You're comparing two totally different things. Bondage is totally a fetish, not to mention an optional one. Homossexuality is something you are born with. Gay kids have sex around the same time straight kids have sex, why shouldnt they have the same sexual education as their their straight counterparts? Its ridiculous. Plus how do you know more people are into bondage than gay people? You have no idea at the vast amount of people that are in the closet... the true percentage will always be a mystery.

 

As for the topic itself, I thought free speech wasn't always protected, if it brought in prejudice and discriminatory points of view that could harm people in any kind of way.

what does bondage have anything to do with homossexuality? :rolleyes: You're comparing two totally different things. Bondage is totally a fetish, not to mention an optional one. Homossexuality is something you are born with. Gay kids have sex around the same time straight kids have sex, which shouldnt they have the same sexual education as their their straight counterparts. Its ridiculous. Plus how do you know more people are into bondage than gay people? You have no idea at the vast amount of people that are in the closet... the true percentage will always be a mystery.

 

As for the topic itself, I thought free speech wasn't always protected, if it brought in prejudice and discriminatory points of view that could harm people in any kind of way.

 

Aside from heterosexual sex if you are going to teach other things then you have to cover EVERYTHING IMHO including fetishes

I just don't think it is something that should be taught to schoolkids that does not make me homophobic in the slightest, someone is not converted from a straight to a gay people are born gay so I don't see the need to preach homosexuality to straight children as it is not going to give them a lifestyle choice so there is very little to say to kids on the subject other than telling them not to go about gay bashing

 

People are not saying homosexuality as such should be taught; people are saying that TOLERANCE of homosexuality should be taught, to firstly reduce homophobic bullying in school and secondly so that kids don't feel ashamed if they are gay. Even if you're not intending it, what you're saying is implying that you think being gay is wrong, or at the very least that being straight is preferrable. And that's exactly the type of attitude that schoolkids should not be taught, which is exactly why tolerance of homosexuality DOES need to be taught from an early age.

 

My example before of BDSM, it is said in a national survey that 12% regularly participate in some form of BDSM be it tying a partner up to a bed, wearing naughty nurses uniforms or even more hardcore stuff like whippings and punishment, should that be taught at school ? do you want kids taught whipping and bondage ? after all more people are into softcore or hardcore BDSM than are gay in the UK !

 

But this is a completely different issue. Again, no-one's saying teachers should be perfoming simulations of gay sex at the front of the class. I don't remember being taught positions even for the "mainstream" "non-niche" heterosexual sex in sex education classes either. With the internet, kids are more than capable of finding out this type of stuff for themselves, but that doesn't mean tolerance of homosexuality shouldn't be taught.

 

what does bondage have anything to do with homossexuality? :rolleyes: You're comparing two totally different things. Bondage is totally a fetish, not to mention an optional one. Homossexuality is something you are born with. Gay kids have sex around the same time straight kids have sex, why shouldnt they have the same sexual education as their their straight counterparts? Its ridiculous. Plus how do you know more people are into bondage than gay people? You have no idea at the vast amount of people that are in the closet... the true percentage will always be a mystery.

 

As for the topic itself, I thought free speech wasn't always protected, if it brought in prejudice and discriminatory points of view that could harm people in any kind of way.

 

I was 13 when I knew that BDSM was for me, I had been caned a number of times at school and started enjoying getting caned and it reached the point that I was deliberately naughty so that I could be caned and I have been into BDSM both softcore and hardcore for 30 years so if I was getting BDSM urges at 13 which is the same age as kids are generally shagging these days then why not cover that lifestyle choice in schools ? I was IMHO born with a BDSM gene same as gays are born gay so it IS the same

Homossexuality isnt a fetish. You're comparing totally different things. There's heterossexuality and homossexuality, which are the basis of sexuality, along with bisexuality. Anything else doesnt fall under sexual orientation. I think teaching kids about homosexuality should be allowed, not only because there are plenty of gay kids who iniciate sexuality at an early age (just like straight kids), who should have the right to have the same information about their own sexuality, how to protect themselves, etc. Bondage is hardly a sexual orientation.

People are not saying homosexuality as such should be taught; people are saying that TOLERANCE of homosexuality should be taught, to firstly reduce homophobic bullying in school and secondly so that kids don't feel ashamed if they are gay. Even if you're not intending it, what you're saying is implying that you think being gay is wrong, or at the very least that being straight is preferrable. And that's exactly the type of attitude that schoolkids should not be taught, which is exactly why tolerance of homosexuality DOES need to be taught from an early age.

But this is a completely different issue. Again, no-one's saying teachers should be perfoming simulations of gay sex at the front of the class. I don't remember being taught positions even for the "mainstream" "non-niche" heterosexual sex in sex education classes either. With the internet, kids are more than capable of finding out this type of stuff for themselves, but that doesn't mean tolerance of homosexuality shouldn't be taught.

 

Tolerance should be preached yes but I don't think that homosexuality should be taught itself, tolerance of religions and races should be taught too

I dont particuarlly want to know Craig is into BDSM. *cringe*.

Homosexuality shouldn't be taught in schools IMHO be it male or female,

 

You cant "teach" someone to be a homosexual Craig.....

 

What you actually mean is teaching AWARENESS of it.... And, well, what's wrong with that...? We teach kids awareness about the Nazis and what they did.... No subject should be taboo in a place of learning, as it only leads to bad "facts" being circulated....

 

I was 13 when I knew that BDSM was for me, I had been caned a number of times at school and started enjoying getting caned and it reached the point that I was deliberately naughty so that I could be caned and I have been into BDSM both softcore and hardcore for 30 years so if I was getting BDSM urges at 13 which is the same age as kids are generally shagging these days then why not cover that lifestyle choice in schools ? I was IMHO born with a BDSM gene same as gays are born gay so it IS the same

 

who says gays are born gay?

 

I dont think there is a BDSM gene tbh Craig, scientifically I dont think people are born in that way.

 

I dont think I was born straight tbh.

 

 

anyway, we didnt really need to know about your BDSM fetish and the history of it Craig.

 

we really have gone off topic aswell.

 

unless Craig wants a homosexual bdsm relationship with Griffin on the set of question time.

You cant "teach" someone to be a homosexual Craig.....

 

What you actually mean is teaching AWARENESS of it.... And, well, what's wrong with that...? We teach kids awareness about the Nazis and what they did.... No subject should be taboo in a place of learning, as it only leads to bad "facts" being circulated....

 

then again we teach about the Nazi's so the sick $h!t isnt repeated yet the scum that is the BNP exsist.

Tolerance should be preached yes but I don't think that homosexuality should be taught itself, tolerance of religions and races should be taught too

So all you're saying is that the actual "mechanics" (for want of a better word, lol) of homosexual sex shouldn't be taught? Then I would probably agree with that, but then when have schools ever provided graphic explanations of any sexual activity, be it for straight people or gay people? It would be unnecessary and not appropriate - it would be completely embarrassing for both teacher and class.

 

But anyway, back to the topic, Nick Griffin certainly doesn't want schools teaching tolerance of "creepy" gay people.

Edited October 23, 200915 yr by Danny

THEY WERE NOT VIOLENT FFS.

 

On all the accounts of the incidents happening inside tv centre, including one from Piers Morgan, the protesters were peaceful, it was the f***ing police being the violent ones. as always.

 

AND ANYWAY, BNP are far more violent than any of the protesters, I have heard more than one story of bnp members attacking non-whites, and that is a racial attack, not a protest against fasism and racists.

 

I have mentioned these thigns several time in this thread you just cant seem to get it into your head Rob.

And like Scott said, BNP deserve a good f***ing kicking anyway, the protesters could have been more violent, and they wouldnt have been as violent as the BNP are, if someone outright punched Griffin in the face it would be justifed, because of who he is and what he has said last night and in the past.

 

Exactly.. I've been on Anti-Fascist demos... And I know exactly who these people are, and what they are... They are not civilised, they will NOT respond to reasonable argument. God knows, we've tried that... We've also tried legal methods to censure them... The court case against Nick Griffin SHOULD have seen him and his organisation disbanded and consigned to the dustbin of history, just like Oswald Mosely... But, it did not, he was protected... Obviously Abu Hamza doesn't have Griffin's contacts in the establishment, or he'd've probably been spared prison as well..... :rolleyes: It's not remotely hypocritical to say that when the law is proven to be inadequate to deal with the likes of Griffin, then the decent citizenry should be able to take matters into their own hands, particulary with regards to people who have delusions of grandeur like he has, the average p**** or scrote doesn't want to run the country and start ethnically cleansing non-white, non Christian populations, so, I would say there is a greater legitimacy to assassinate someone like Griffin than there is to assault some pathetic little scrote on the Sex Offenders register, if someone had killed Hitler or Stalin before they could cause any trouble, well, wouldn't the world have been a better place, we now have the opportunity to STOP another Hitler before he gets started, I say, someone should take it, they'd get a pat on the back from me that's for sure... The law is supposed to be there to protect ALL the innocent and punish the guilty... Griffin is one of the Guilty... Guilty of being hateful, guilty of inciting violence, his organisation is guilty of inciting Terrorism in the 90s with the Soho Pub bombing and the bombing of the Asian market in the East End... He is GUILTY, end of...

 

And, Rob, if you honestly believe that Nick Griffin and his lot are representative of "English Culture", then frankly, "English Culture" aint worth having.... Say what you like about Alex Salmond or John Swinney... They're not 100% completely repugnant, racist cretins..... You show me the acceptable face of English Nationalism, because, frankly all I see in the streets are a bunch of fat, lardy, loud, stupid, St George Cross waving football scum who wallow in racism and xenophobia....

Craig, there's a difference. BDSM is exclusively to do with sexual ACTIVITY, whereas homosexuality is not at all...

 

Plus, you seem to assume that ONLY gay people embark on sexual activity. While 10% of all people in the UK are gay or bisexual, at least half (and probably up to 75%) have at least SOME form of homosexual experience in their lives (whether willing or unwilling), hence why we need education on tolerance and the fact that it exists from a young age...plus, a substantial percentage of men (known as MSMs) identify as straight but enjoy sexual relations with other men (I'm not sure on numbers here but altogether at least 15-20% engage in homosexual relations in their lives...not an unsubstantial minority).