Postal workers are to stage two nationwide strikes next week in a bitter row over pay, jobs and working conditions, which will cripple mail deliveries, it has been announced.

 

About 42,000 mail centre staff and drivers will walk out next Thursday (October 22) for 24 hours, followed by another 24-hour stoppage on Friday (23) by 78,000 delivery and collection staff.

 

The Communication Workers Union said it had made a ''genuine offer'' to avert a national strike and accused the Royal Mail of rejecting it without proper consideration.

 

The union said it had "no choice" but to press ahead with naming strike dates after its peace offer was turned down by the Royal Mail.

 

Union members voted by 3-1 to take national industrial action following a spate of regional strikes in the long-running row.

 

Dave Ward, CWU deputy general secretary, said: "We made a genuine offer to Royal Mail that would have given space for detailed discussions without a strike.

 

"We were severely disappointed that within two or three hours the company rejected it, apparently without even affording it proper consideration. This comes on the back of several rejections of CWU offers and is a clear indication that they are not trying to reach agreement.

 

"Our offer included the opportunity for a three-year deal that would bring stability to customers, business and the workforce. This industry is crying out for stability and yet Royal Mail rejects out of hand a genuine attempt to deliver it.

 

"We reiterate that offer today and ask that Royal Mail look again. Making progress on some key elements of that offer would mean an immediate strike could be avoided."

 

The union said it was still prepared to explore third-party mediation, and revealed that talks with the Royal Mail had been held today.

 

The CWU also called on the Government to intervene in the dispute, warning that the Royal Mail's pension deficit was now expected to exceed £10 billion.

 

Mr Ward said: "This Government has recently intervened in the problems of Vauxhall and Lloyds Bank. They are the sole shareholder of Royal Mail and it is unbelievable that they continue to stand aside.

 

"If Royal Mail is not prepared to reconsider our offer and negotiate around that offer then we are strong, resolute and the strike will go ahead."

 

A total of 83 MPs have signed a Commons Early Day Motion calling on the Government and Royal Mail to support a peace deal.

 

Royal Mail's managing director, Mark Higson, said the CWU's decision to call a national strike next week was an "appalling and unjustified attack" on customers and showed a "reckless disregard" for everyone who depended on the company.

 

"Customers large and small have been hoping the CWU would lift the strike threats and focus on providing the service they need and want - instead the union has given them a slap in the face.

 

"The CWU's strike announcement simply shows just how dishonest the union's claim to embrace the need to modernise is, and underlines the union's opposition to simple changes such as its members working flexibly for all of the hours they are paid and using the equipment provided to do the job.

 

"Instead the CWU is demanding an absolute veto over future change and modernisation - and demanding more money - backed up with strike action which they know will drive customers away."

 

The Royal Mail accused the union of reneging on its commitments, repeating that the firm would be making no further changes to its operations this year.

 

"Since then the union has not only failed to deliver on a moratorium, but has called strikes in more than 150 delivery offices and has now announced a national strike which will further damage our customers and the entire postal service.

 

"The union seem to be in denial about the reality of the tough economic conditions facing everyone in the UK and the impact of competition, especially from email and the internet, which has helped drive mail volumes down by around 10% this year."

 

Source: Daily Telegraph

 

 

Will these strikes solve any problems within the Royal Mail, or will it just push both sides further apart?

The Postal Workers striking are like Turkeys striking because Christmas could be cancelled.

 

Having read a balance account for what both sides of the argument want and are agrieved about a few weeks ago in The Independent, my sympathy is with the Management (who by their very nature are to some degree out of touch with the real world because they are filled with careerist brown tongued ladder jumpers); because the Union's practises are shockingly outmoded belonging to the 1970s/early 1980s and hopeless out of touch with the real world of the private sector.

I am totally, 100% behind the strike.... The "service" that the Royal Mail has provided over the past 5 years has been shockingly inept, and, funnily enough, it all began when they started making it a "business" rather than the PUBLIC SERVICE it actually should be considered... I blame the Government for this 100%, they had no business ending the monopoly, they had no business part-privatising it... Our mail service should be just that - A SERVICE..... Not a business.... Of course, these "top managers" have really just come in and made an absolute meal of things with their ridiculous plans... Christ, can anyone remember the time when they seriously considered permanently changing the name to "Consignia"?????? :lol: :lol: :lol: Yeah, that really took......

 

Rich you moan and bitch about the unions... Well, mate, without the Unions or proper workers representation, people get royally SHAFTED.... You just have to look at the Retail Sector, Hotels, catering, bar staff, etc, who are trapped on slavery wages and bad conditions, because they dont know who to turn to and have no proper workers representation to fight their corner.... You lot in the Private Sector gave up your fight and wimped out, so DONT moan about us in the Public Sector who actually have the guts to continue our struggle against unfair work practices and slave wages.... <_<

This is nothing short of a suicde note of posties, career suicide, more and more businesses will turn to private company's and businesses and more and more people will turn all the more to email and ecards and more and more the banks, internet company's and mobile phone company's will convert all of their customers to online billing so thanks to these union dinosaurs the Royal Mail will be virtually non existent in a decade

Will these strikes solve any problems within the Royal Mail, or will it just push both sides further apart?

 

I think it's pretty obvious that both sides are as far apart as you could possibly get... With the absolute intransigence of management to even consider deals and offers made by the CWU.. The management position is far more unreasonable than the workers, the CWU have been bending over backwards to try to come to resolution.... Even going so far as to try to get Govt involvement... I really dont know how the Govt, as the sole shareholder in Royal Mail, could just sit back.. It had no problems intervening when it came to Northern Rock and RBS and that cost the taxpayer a pretty penny or two, taxpayers would probably not mind their taxes being used to save their Mail service anything like as much as bailing out banks who made their own mistakes....

 

At the end of the day, the CWU is doing what a union is meant to do - look out for their workers' interests and represent them... The strike ballot isn't even CLOSE - it's 3 to 1 in favour of strike action, it's not like it's 51-49, so that in itself speaks volumes about the low morale and utter discontent within the company... Something is clearly VERY WRONG with the way Royal Mail is being run, and it's clear to me that the Govt has to stop sitting on the fence and actually TAKE SOME BLOODY ACTION...... Preferably to turn RM back into a real Public Service instead of just sucking up to the likes of TNT and the private mail firms....

 

so thanks to these union dinosaurs the Royal Mail will be virtually non existent in a decade

 

I find it hilarious that the likes of you and Richard call the Unions "dinosaurs" and "hark back to the 70s" or whatever... And yet, the two of you seem to favour a system of manager supremacy over all which harks back to the Industrial Revolution/Mill/Factory/Workhouse days where factory owners basically lorded it over everyone and workers had ZERO representation or decent rights, or indeed the early part of the 20th Century with Taylorism and Scientific Management in which workers were basically treated like cattle (er, a bit like the RETAIL SECTOR).... :rolleyes: Who's the real fukkin' dinosaurs here...?

I find it hilarious that the likes of you and Richard call the Unions "dinosaurs" and "hark back to the 70s" or whatever... And yet, the two of you seem to favour a system of manager supremacy over all which harks back to the Industrial Revolution/Mill/Factory/Workhouse days where factory owners basically lorded it over everyone and workers had ZERO representation or decent rights, or indeed the early part of the 20th Century with Taylorism and Scientific Management in which workers were basically treated like cattle (er, a bit like the RETAIL SECTOR).... :rolleyes: Who's the real fukkin' dinosaurs here...?

 

I am against exploitation which is why I support for example the minimum wage but posties are not being exploited money wise same as tube drivers aren't and tube strikes were a diabolical liberty too, the CWU must have Bob Crow as a consultant -_-

 

What the CWU seem scared of is modernisation, they do seem to be living in a timewarp where everything was done by hand and not computers and where there was no choice but to use the Royal Mail but those days are gone and the CWU have to realise it is 2009, there is no monopoly now so all action like this is going to do is drive more and more work to private mail firms and have more and more done online both of which will reduce the amount of mail posties will have to deliver in the future and will result undoubtedly and rightfully in a mass cull of postie jobs as there will be less mail for them to deliver

 

These hardcore socialist union barons are leading their workers down a cliff career wise

there is no monopoly now so all action like this is going to do is drive more and more work to private mail firms

 

Well, this is my whole point, there should BE NO privatisation of the Mail service as far as I'm concerned, it should be back in public hands.... Our Postal service should be like the US Mail, I mean, what does it say that even in AMERICA of all places, they still have a Publically owned Mail SERVICE which still has a monopoly on non-special delivery items such as first/second class mail......? :rolleyes:

 

The Govt sold out the Posties, simple as....

 

I am against exploitation which is why I support for example the minimum wage but posties are not being exploited money wise

 

There's a hell of a lot more to this than money Craig, in fact, I dont even see the CWU even mentioning money in this report..... You just see things in pounds and pence, like all Capitalists do, you see the costs of everything and the actual value of nothing.... This is actually more about preserving JOBS (I mean, come on, how can you effectively run a national mails service with about 15 or 20,000 less people....), it's about proper consultation, which clearly isn't happening either..... You dont get such a complete breakdown in communications between staff and managers without their being PRETTY BLOODY COMPELLING REASONS mate..... :rolleyes:

 

As for the tube drivers. Well, I applaud them for standing up for themselves frankly, Bob Crow is a hero as far as I'm concerned, he got his people a good deal, THAT'S HIS JOB AS A UNION MAN, if only there were a few more people who walked it like they talked it, then perhaps the pendulum would swing a bit more in favour of the Comman Man or Woman in this society...

 

More workers should do the same, and then we'd stop all Management exploitation....

There's a hell of a lot more to this than money Craig, in fact, I dont even see the CWU even mentioning money in this report..... You just see things in pounds and pence, like all Capitalists do, you see the costs of everything and the actual value of nothing.... This is actually more about preserving JOBS (I mean, come on, how can you effectively run a national mails service with about 15 or 20,000 less people....), it's about proper consultation, which clearly isn't happening either..... You dont get such a complete breakdown in communications between staff and managers without their being PRETTY BLOODY COMPELLING REASONS mate..... :rolleyes:

 

As for the tube drivers. Well, I applaud them for standing up for themselves frankly, Bob Crow is a hero as far as I'm concerned, he got his people a good deal, THAT'S HIS JOB AS A UNION MAN... More workers should do the same, and then we'd stop all Management exploitation....

 

When the volume of mail goes down then realistically the number of jobs have to too, the postal unions remind me of the print unions when they could not adapt to computers taking over much of the printing process and striked because they wanted the same number of printers in jobs despite computers doing much of the work thanks to Eddie Shah who bought computers into the printing process, ok computers can't deliver mail but my point is that thanks to computers people email Auntie Mavis now instead of sending a letter, mobile phone companies and banks do their billing online as opposed to sending out statements through the post, the likes of Amazon etc use private mail companies now so there is less for posties to do so I don't see why the number of posties should stay the same when there is less for them to do

 

When the volume of mail goes down then realistically the number of jobs have to too, the postal unions remind me of the print unions when they could not adapt to computers taking over much of the printing process and striked because they wanted the same number of printers in jobs despite computers doing much of the work thanks to Eddie Shah who bought computers into the printing process, ok computers can't deliver mail but my point is that thanks to computers people email Auntie Mavis now instead of sending a letter, mobile phone companies and banks do their billing online as opposed to sending out statements through the post, the likes of Amazon etc use private mail companies now so there is less for posties to do so I don't see why the number of posties should stay the same when there is less for them to do

 

Dude, I dont know of any utility companies who are doing completely 100% online billing ONLY... Many do both, but I still get a monthly bill at the end of the day from 02 or 3.... And this is another point, when companies (such as BT, British Gas, etc) switched from quarterly to monthly billing, that actually meant INCREASED volumes of mail, not less.... I know when I was working as a Postie (from '98 - 2003, so, it wasn't really that long ago..), I was delivering about two/three sometimes even four bags of mail in a day.... Which the old-timers assured me was considerably more than they were delivering when they actually started working 10/15/20 years before me.... So, I dunno where you're getting these "facts" from tbh.....

 

Machines can only do so much, there has to be a lot of manual sorting done as well, machines cant do the specifics that a person does....

 

Dude, I dont know of any utility companies who are doing completely 100% online billing ONLY... Many do both, but I still get a monthly bill at the end of the day from 02 or 3.... And this is another point, when companies (such as BT, British Gas, etc) switched from quarterly to monthly billing, that actually meant INCREASED volumes of mail, not less.... I know when I was working as a Postie (from '98 - 2003, so, it wasn't really that long ago..), I was delivering about two/three sometimes even four bags of mail in a day.... Which the old-timers assured me was considerably more than they were delivering when they actually started working 10/15/20 years before me.... So, I dunno where you're getting these "facts" from tbh.....

 

Machines can only do so much, there has to be a lot of manual sorting done as well, machines cant do the specifics that a person does....

 

Even if that is the case now I think it highly likely that strikes will lead to those companies ending paper billing and moving entirely to online billing or emailed invoices and bypassing the postal system altogether, trust me its just a matter of time and these strikes will speed the day that happens significantly and then the posties will only have themselves to blame when there are mass layoffs as nothing for them to deliver

Edited October 16, 200915 yr by B.A Baracus

Even if that is the case now I think it highly likely that strikes will lead to those companies ending paper billing and moving entirely to online billing or emailed invoices and bypassing the postal system altogether, trust me its just a matter of time and these strikes will speed the day that happens significantly and then the posties will only have themselves to blame when there are mass layoffs as nothing for them to deliver

 

You kind of assume that everyone is online Craig... I can assure you over half of the country probably isn't, especially older people.... You also assume that everyone would even want online billing.... A lot of people dont particularly like to enter their details online because of things like ID theft and online fraud...

 

You kind of assume that everyone is online Craig... I can assure you over half of the country probably isn't, especially older people.... You also assume that everyone would even want online billing.... A lot of people dont particularly like to enter their details online because of things like ID theft and online fraud...

 

hmmmm true but if say BT, the High St banks, O2/Orange/ T-Mobile/Vodafone and the ISP's said "if you want paper billing option we are going to charge you £5 a month otherwise register online" I would imagine the majority of customers will register for online billing, if the post office gets more and more disrupted through strikes it really would not shock me for the Royal Mail to be purely a low class free service for pensioners and the poor in a few years time

Bob Crow is a hero as far as I'm concerned

 

The same Bob Crow who was a member of the Communist Party of Great Britain and then the Communist Party of Britain after the CPGB's dissolution, between 1983 and 1995, when he left to join Arthur Scargill's Socialist Labour Party (SLP).

 

In the 2005 general election, he endorsed Robert Griffiths, the Communist Party of Britain's candidate in Pontypridd, calling him "a champion of workers' rights".

 

In short the very embodiment of a left of left wing scialist "dinosaur" who belongs to the 1960s/1970s.

 

Whilst all those postal workers are happy to have as their representative a man whom I regard as the enemy of the state (whichever bunch of money grabbing liars are in power at Westminster), I have zero sympathy with those workers, or should I say comrades.

The same Bob Crow who was a member of the Communist Party of Great Britain and then the Communist Party of Britain after the CPGB's dissolution, between 1983 and 1995, when he left to join Arthur Scargill's Socialist Labour Party (SLP).

 

In the 2005 general election, he endorsed Robert Griffiths, the Communist Party of Britain's candidate in Pontypridd, calling him "a champion of workers' rights".

 

In short the very embodiment of a left of left wing scialist "dinosaur" who belongs to the 1960s/1970s.

 

Whilst all those postal workers are happy to have as their representative a man whom I regard as the enemy of the state (whichever bunch of money grabbing liars are in power at Westminster), I have zero sympathy with those workers, or should I say comrades.

 

You seem to think that the Communist Party shouldn't have a right to exist, whereas you'll probably happily defend the BNP's "legitimacy"..... Hypocrite... I dont exactly see Communists or Socialists calling for what is pretty damn close to "ethnic cleansing".... :rolleyes:

 

If Bob Crow's attitutes belong to the 60s/70s (which were decades of SOCIAL PROGRESSION in case that passed you by you idiot.... <_< You know stuff like Black Civil Liberties, Feminism, anti-Vietnam, The Paris Revolution in '68, the Equal Pay Act, Race Relations Act, Homosexuality legalised, etc), then yours almost certainly belongs to the era of Workhouses or Taylorism in which management supremacy over all its workers was embodied in the WORST working regimes and conditions that this country has ever seen....

 

How the fukk do you think that stuff like Equal Pay, Race Relations, Anti-Discrimination Laws in the Workplace, and decent Health and Safety Codes all got passed...? It was because of the Unions and people LIKE Bob Crow putting pressure on Govts.... So, yeah, you'd better believe I regard them as working class heroes.. Say what you like about these acts, without them, we'd be back to the fukkin' days of child labour and probably have a Sweatshop economy like Malaysia or Mexico, where people are making clothes for Multinational Companies such as Nike, Gap and Reebok for about $8 PER DAY..... Personally, I know which I prefer..... <_<

I have zero sympathy with those workers, or should I say comrades.

 

Spoken like a true "Daily Mail" reader..... :rolleyes: I'm betting you probably had "zero sympathy" for the Miners either..... You're a Neo-Thatcherite mate.... Off you pop and kiss Cameron's ring..... <_<

Royal Mail will hire 30,000 extra workers to beat strike

 

Royal Mail bosses have escalated their dispute with staff ahead of a national strike by taking on tens of thousands of temporary workers to "keep the mail moving" during the stoppage.

 

Union leaders reacted with fury yesterday after it emerged that the Royal Mail was planning to take on double its usual number of seasonal staff, and earlier than usual, to help with the Christmas rush this year.

 

Labour MPs warned that the move could turn the dispute into a full-blown industrial crisis, and urged ministers to intervene immediately – or at least to encourage both sides to turn to the Advisory Conciliation and Arbitration Service (Acas).

 

Source: The independent

 

Talk about waving a red flag at a bull!

Royal Mail will hire 30,000 extra workers to beat strike

 

Royal Mail bosses have escalated their dispute with staff ahead of a national strike by taking on tens of thousands of temporary workers to "keep the mail moving" during the stoppage.

 

Union leaders reacted with fury yesterday after it emerged that the Royal Mail was planning to take on double its usual number of seasonal staff, and earlier than usual, to help with the Christmas rush this year.

 

Labour MPs warned that the move could turn the dispute into a full-blown industrial crisis, and urged ministers to intervene immediately – or at least to encourage both sides to turn to the Advisory Conciliation and Arbitration Service (Acas).

 

Source: The independent

 

Talk about waving a red flag at a bull!

 

Oh great. Hiring a bunch of clueless, untrained scabs is really gonna work innit..... :rolleyes:

 

It was the hiring of cut-price Agency staff which caused the beginnings of Royal Mail's problems in the first place.... I mean, do they actually think we've forgotten those documentaries Channel 4 made....? The ones where these poor sods from Nigeria, practically straight off the plane, were basically just given a bag of mail, a pat on the back and told "off you pop lads...."...... <_<

 

Well, I guess I can expect my Xmas cards to end up in High WYCOMBE as opposed to High GATE this year then..... :rolleyes:

I don't suppose these riff-raff will be considering, the knock on effect to, the businesses who depend on the post, nor the jobs their actions could cost?