former jam frontman and 60's revivalist paul weller has slated nirvana/grunge as fcuking rubbish..

 

from ds

 

Paul Weller has labelled Nirvana "f**king rubbish".

 

The former Jam frontman - due to scoop the 'Godlike Genius' award at the upcoming NME Awards - claimed that his mid-'90s resurgence in popularity during the Britpop years was infinitely better than the US-dominated music scene that preceded it.

 

Weller told NME: "You'd had all that shoegazing b*llocks and then the whole Nirvana thing, which I thought was f**king rubbish - it was just America catching up with punk rock 20 years too f**king late for me, you know.

 

"So to hear some English guitar music again was really refreshing."

 

He went on to say that the Britpop scene - which comprised bands such as Oasis, Blur, The Charlatans and Suede - was the only time in his career that he felt his music belonged to part of a wider movement.

 

He explained: "That was the first time ever that I'd felt any kinship with any musicians - even though they were all probably at least ten years younger than me."

 

tbh...i can see where hes coming from!!! as a person who never really got the grunge thing, i sypathise with his view!

 

over to you.... is he right or is he talking bollox?

 

 

Hard to say really. I don't really like artists slagging off other artists. I think its fine for fans to do it ... but not the artists themselves ... unless its Noel Gallagher talking about Robbie Williams ... because Noel is funny ... especially when asked for his opinions on the cheeky chappie. However, I loved The Jam and Paul Weller's music (not over fond of the man himself) and what I have heard of Nirvana ... I've not liked (bar one song). In general ... I sort of agree with the punk-rock comment ... but the age he is ... surely he's heard of The Ramones!

 

Norma

 

 

The reason Paul Weller hated "all that shoegazing b*llocks and then the whole Nirvana thing" was because he was seen as deeply uncool at the time and with good reason. His music was almost as f***ing awful then as it is now. Godlike genius? I guess he must be to have hung on to a career for some three and a half decades off the back of a handful of decent Jam songs.

The reason Paul Weller hated "all that shoegazing b*llocks and then the whole Nirvana thing" was because he was seen as deeply uncool at the time and with good reason. His music was almost as f***ing awful then as it is now. Godlike genius? I guess he must be to have hung on to a career for some three and a half decades off the back of a handful of decent Jam songs.

 

 

..... and even his good material with jam was very heavily 60's styled so it was hardly 'original'...

as much as I like The Jam, Weller is a cock, and tbh doesnt possess the artistic brilliance Kurt Cobain had.quite frankly Weller can f*** off.

I like him because he has a big mouth.

I've always hated Weller ever since his 'I'm voting Tory' comment, and musically he's been p*** poor since around 1981 except for the odd track here and there.

 

And in case he's forgotten the Americans created Punk as a musical genre long before we could claim to. We just gave it a cohesive movement. Think The Stooges, MC5, Blue Cheer, Count Five and New York Dolls in the late 60s and early 70s. Plus the Ramones, Blondie, Patti Smith and Television all had records out in '76 long before The Damned gave us New Rose or any other Punk band gained any level of fame. If anything Grunge was America reclaiming Punk from us.

 

And Nirvana were actually pretty good too

I've always hated Weller ever since his 'I'm voting Tory' comment, and musically he's been p*** poor since around 1981 except for the odd track here and there.

 

And in case he's forgotten the Americans created Punk as a musical genre long before we could claim to. We just gave it a cohesive movement. Think The Stooges, MC5, Blue Cheer, Count Five and New York Dolls in the late 60s and early 70s. Plus the Ramones, Blondie, Patti Smith and Television all had records out in '76 long before The Damned gave us New Rose or any other Punk band gained any level of fame. If anything Grunge was America reclaiming Punk from us.

 

And Nirvana were actually pretty good too

 

yeah and a pretty damned potent one at that. the americans might have invented the musical style, but punk became much more then that because our political climate here was ripe ... and it wasnt the first time 'we' took american music and made it oir own.. expending and creating far beyond the original material. (beatles and 60's r & B .)

yeah and a pretty damned potent one at that. the americans might have invented the musical style, but punk became much more then that because our political climate here was ripe ... and it wasnt the first time 'we' took american music and made it oir own.. expending and creating far beyond the original material. (beatles and 60's r & B .)

 

To be fair to the Modfather this is a classic (DigitalSpy?) bit of journalism taking a quote that Paul Weller made and taking it out of context.

 

What Paul Weller was saying in the lengthier piece is that British music should be primarily influenced by British music and write about things from a British perspective, which I don't think there is anything wrong with that view.

 

As Paul Weller was influenced by the likes of The Beatles; The Who; The Small Faces; The Kinks; Traffic; Cream; The Move; Nick Drake; etc then it is only natural that he holds a consistent view and is disappointed when British acts and the British public are influenced by American things.

 

As for Paul Weller v Kurt Cobain.

 

Sorry it is no contest ... The Jam's back catalogue is better than Nirvana's IMHO ... and that is forgetting about the past 27 years. His last album 22 years is brilliant IMHO. For me he is doing a great job in turning into the new Van Morrison.

 

Whilst Nirvana were The Pixies rip offs. Surfer Rosa and Doolittle trump Nevermind and In Utero by a very lengthy distance & the Boston four-piece did it first and did it best.

 

But lets face facts in the same way that Cheryl Cole & Britney Spears sell a huge amount of records because of their pin up appeal not because of their musical talent, so Nirvana were always going to be way more successful than The Pixies because of their image.

 

I mean just compare Kurt Cobain with Frank Black in the looks department! :lol:

 

It has to be said Kurt Cobain = Jimi Hendrix = overrated, both acts would have nose dived in popularity had both protagonists lived a decade or more longer. I mean who cares about Pearl Jam now; and can you imagine how highly regarded Oasis would have been had they split in 1996 after their first two albums and playing Knebworth and not limped on until 2009.

It has to be said Kurt Cobain = Jimi Hendrix = overrated, both acts would have nose dived in popularity had both protagonists lived a decade or more longer. I mean who cares about Pearl Jam now; and can you imagine how highly regarded Oasis would have been had they split in 1996 after their first two albums and playing Knebworth and not limped on until 2009.

 

 

At last. I've been saying this for years. Nirvana would have descended into mediocrity (in parts of In Utero, they did), same with Jeff Buckley. It's not that I think we should dismiss their work. I just that I think Oasis should have stopped. So should the Manics and Suede. Blur did the right thing. Very rarely a band can maintain artistic excellence throughout their career.

Nirvana are possibly THE most overrated band of all-time. They released ONE, yes, just ONE great album, In Utero..... and a clutch of catchy rawk singles but, in all honesty, unless you were American or lived in some of the smaller Euro countries, Nirvana really meant fukk all to anyone else. And rightly so, too. For a band as musically generic and impotent as Nirvana to have spawned so many copycat bands and a supposed 'genre' in 'grunge' just goes to show not that the music was of any weight, importance or validity but that the musical climate it was born into was so bloody awful.

 

Nirvana were average average average... and anyone who falls at their feet really is looking through rose-tinted spectacles... or wasn't even born when this supposed 'classic' band were actually having (minor and few) hit singles.

 

You know what? Give me Hole anyday - at least Courtney Love has a personality.... and something to say other than 'poor me poor me'... yeah, pour me a fukkin drink, Cobain. zzzzzzz

 

As for Weller - he's about as valid as a five bob note, isn't he? And it just goes to show how drug-frazzled and hopelessly out of touch those poor hacks at the NME are to even think about giving him ANY kind of award, let alone this ridiculous 'genius' one. The man hasn't made a single record of any note since 'Wild Wood' - and even that was stodge. Then again, I think The Jam were colossally overrated, too. Apart from 'That's Entertainment', I found them banal, one dimensional lad-rockers in bad suits. There were far, far more interesting bands around at that time. And will someone PLEASE ask Weller to get that bloody hair cut... an old man with long lank hair - grey hair at that - and that long hangdog face of his...... the bloke looks like an Afghan hound.... get a grip, Weller. Just because Noel Gallagher is sucking at your toes every five minutes doesn't impress me much.

Nirvana are possibly THE most overrated band of all-time. They released ONE, yes, just ONE great album, In Utero..... and a clutch of catchy rawk singles but, in all honesty, unless you were American or lived in some of the smaller Euro countries, Nirvana really meant fukk all to anyone else. And rightly so, too. For a band as musically generic and impotent as Nirvana to have spawned so many copycat bands and a supposed 'genre' in 'grunge' just goes to show not that the music was of any weight, importance or validity but that the musical climate it was born into was so bloody awful.

 

Nirvana were average average average... and anyone who falls at their feet really is looking through rose-tinted spectacles... or wasn't even born when this supposed 'classic' band were actually having (minor and few) hit singles.

 

You know what? Give me Hole anyday - at least Courtney Love has a personality.... and something to say other than 'poor me poor me'... yeah, pour me a fukkin drink, Cobain. zzzzzzz

 

As for Weller - he's about as valid as a five bob note, isn't he? And it just goes to show how drug-frazzled and hopelessly out of touch those poor hacks at the NME are to even think about giving him ANY kind of award, let alone this ridiculous 'genius' one. The man hasn't made a single record of any note since 'Wild Wood' - and even that was stodge. Then again, I think The Jam were colossally overrated, too. Apart from 'That's Entertainment', I found them banal, one dimensional lad-rockers in bad suits. There were far, far more interesting bands around at that time. And will someone PLEASE ask Weller to get that bloody hair cut... an old man with long lank hair - grey hair at that - and that long hangdog face of his...... the bloke looks like an Afghan hound.... get a grip, Weller. Just because Noel Gallagher is sucking at your toes every five minutes doesn't impress me much.

 

lol.. you wont think much of my haircut then! :lol: (although im not grey).

 

i think the jam were overrated to a point, the point being that he/they drew heavily on 60's culture and passed it off as their own. as for the 'modfather' tag ... thats ridiculous and highlights how this 70's star has usurped 60's culture. if anyone should be refered to as the modfather it should be ray davies, or roger daltrey.

To be fair to the Modfather this is a classic (DigitalSpy?) bit of journalism taking a quote that Paul Weller made and taking it out of context.

 

What Paul Weller was saying in the lengthier piece is that British music should be primarily influenced by British music and write about things from a British perspective, which I don't think there is anything wrong with that view.

 

As Paul Weller was influenced by the likes of The Beatles; The Who; The Small Faces; The Kinks; Traffic; Cream; The Move; Nick Drake; etc then it is only natural that he holds a consistent view and is disappointed when British acts and the British public are influenced by American things.

 

As for Paul Weller v Kurt Cobain.

 

Sorry it is no contest ... The Jam's back catalogue is better than Nirvana's IMHO ... and that is forgetting about the past 27 years. His last album 22 years is brilliant IMHO. For me he is doing a great job in turning into the new Van Morrison.

 

Whilst Nirvana were The Pixies rip offs. Surfer Rosa and Doolittle trump Nevermind and In Utero by a very lengthy distance & the Boston four-piece did it first and did it best.

 

But lets face facts in the same way that Cheryl Cole & Britney Spears sell a huge amount of records because of their pin up appeal not because of their musical talent, so Nirvana were always going to be way more successful than The Pixies because of their image.

 

I mean just compare Kurt Cobain with Frank Black in the looks department! :lol:

 

It has to be said Kurt Cobain = Jimi Hendrix = overrated, both acts would have nose dived in popularity had both protagonists lived a decade or more longer. I mean who cares about Pearl Jam now; and can you imagine how highly regarded Oasis would have been had they split in 1996 after their first two albums and playing Knebworth and not limped on until 2009.

 

 

yep it was digital spy (hence the 'from ds' at the begining).

 

i agree with his sentiments regarding british music. the times of greatest musical creativity here was when the youth of the day took music and made it their own... again a 60's era and punk era referance. i hate chavs trying to be 'ghetto', and thats why i never really understood why middle class white boys should be into american hip hop, rap, etc... whilst musically its credible, i cant see really the connection between that and 'us'. mod, britpop, indie, call it whatever, it is intrinsically english (british) in style and pertains to us.

 

interesting point regarding oasis .... but i dont agree that hendrix was overrated, its easy to get hung up on his gimicks and overlook his genius.

lol.. you wont think much of my haircut then! :lol: (although im not grey).

 

I'm sure your hair is as silky as Silky the Silkworm's Soft Silky Pyjamas!

 

i think the jam were overrated to a point, the point being that he/they drew heavily on 60's culture and passed it off as their own. as for the 'modfather' tag ... thats ridiculous and highlights how this 70's star has usurped 60's culture. if anyone should be refered to as the modfather it should be ray davies, or roger daltrey.

 

I don't think it's quite fair to say that they 'passed it off as their own'.

 

Norma

 

 

Weller is full of sh"t, simple as... Honestly, I've never been more bored in all my life than when I was listening to Paul Wellar's solo material... I mean, he's slagging off Nirvana and the Americans for "catching up to Punk" too late of whatever, well, clearly, he doesn't seem to realise that Nirvana, Mudhoney, etc, never really claimed to be "punk" as such in the first place, and he seems to have totally missed the mark that Americans have ALWAYS had Punk Rock bands - Dead Kennedys, Fugazi, Bad Brains, Black Flag, Minor Threat, and we can go back further to include the likes of Iggy and the Stooges and MC5 (I do believe that even the Sex Pistols regularly covered Iggy's "No Fun", so let's not kid ourselves here).....

 

And Russ, your vendetta against Nirvana is frankly ridiculous, you clearly never saw them live, I did, they were one of the most exciting bands I've ever seen in my life, I'll never forget that night in a small venue in Glasgow in 1991, or indeed Reading '92... They were a breath of FRESH AIR in the early 90s, god knows we needed something to rid us of the wretched likes of Duf Leotard, Poison, Extreme and Motley fukkin' Crue, and yes, old has-beens like Wellar who themselves were just regurgitating Mod over a decade after the fact (pot calling kettle black Mr Wellar)..... Nirvana, Mudhoney, Tad, Babes In Toyland, Hole, Smashing Pumpkins, Soundgarden, etc, almost certainly provided that.... What did Wellar give us in the 90s - Dad Rock...... Cheers mate.... -_-

 

Fukk you Wellar, you're full of it, The Jam (although a good band) were hardly "original" themselves, I'll have The Buzzcocks any day frankly...

What Paul Weller was saying in the lengthier piece is that British music should be primarily influenced by British music and write about things from a British perspective, which I don't think there is anything wrong with that view.

 

Name me one British Indie band of any note that hasn't been influenced either directly or indirectly by The Velvet Underground Rich.....

 

Joy Division, The Cure, The Smiths, Echo and the Bunnymen, Jesus and Mary Chain, My Bloody Valentine, Primal Scream... Every single one of 'em has cited VU as an influence.... It's blatantly obvious when you listen to the music.... And most of today's Indie acts (particularly those of the darker hue) are being influenced by those bands, ergo, it's going back to VU eventually anyway....

 

"Quintessentially British"?? Nah, not a bit of it...

 

At the end of the day, it REALLY all goes back to The Blues if you wanna be seriously thorough.... One of Kurt's biggest musical influences (probably the single biggest actually) - Leadbelly.....

For a band as musically generic and impotent as Nirvana to have spawned so many copycat band

 

 

Isn't that a contradiction? I would argue that they were very potent because of the copy cat bands. And you dismiss their catchy singles....why? Most bands would kill for singles are great as Nirvana managed. Do you seriously think they are rawk in the same way Guns and Roses or Bon Jove are? There was nothing rawk about them at all. I'm not a big Nirvana fan but you have done them a disservice.

 

 

And you say that Kurt Cobain had nothing to say apart from poor poor me? He was a great supporter of gay rights. You dont like them. I dont like them. The difference is that I chose not to dismiss them for not being weighty, important or valid as you put it. Surely they were really bloody valid in 1991?

 

Also, the mixing Andy Wallace did on Nevermind was ground-breaking.

But lets face facts in the same way that Cheryl Cole & Britney Spears sell a huge amount of records because of their pin up appeal not because of their musical talent, so Nirvana were always going to be way more successful than The Pixies because of their image.

 

I mean just compare Kurt Cobain with Frank Black in the looks department! :lol:

 

Well, we'll never know with the Pixies, because they upped and split on us before they could actually achieve anything as big as Nirvana did.... Actually, it was looking like Sonic Youth for a while if you'll recall, but then Thurston Moore and Kim Gordon gave Kurt and Co a leg up by persuading them to sign to Geffen, and because Kurt had so much respect for Thurston and Kim, he saw it as a good idea at the time... I think it's really a bit ridiculous talking about Kurt Cobain in the same post as Cheryl fukkin' Cole and Britney Spears, Nirvana weren't manufactured for a start.... People forget about the first album that came out in 1988, 'Bleach', they forget that Nirvana were on the same record label as Mudhoney, Green River and Soundgarden (ie, Sub Pop) for several years, they forget that Kurt and Kris were so broke that they could only spend about $500 recording the album and they had to borrow that off their original guitarist, Chad Channing....

 

Nah, people forget the extremely humble origins of Nirvana, they didn't appear on a fukkin' Reality show or the Disney Club, they had to work to achieve their success and get anywhere.... And fukk anyone who says otherwise, especially a cock like Paul Wellar....

Isn't that a contradiction? I would argue that they were very potent because of the copy cat bands. And you dismiss their catchy singles....why? Most bands would kill for singles are great as Nirvana managed. Do you seriously think they are rawk in the same way Guns and Roses or Bon Jove are? There was nothing rawk about them at all. I'm not a big Nirvana fan but you have done them a disservice.

And you say that Kurt Cobain had nothing to say apart from poor poor me? He was a great supporter of gay rights. You dont like them. I dont like them. The difference is that I chose not to dismiss them for not being weighty, important or valid as you put it. Surely they were really bloody valid in 1991?

 

Also, the mixing Andy Wallace did on Nevermind was ground-breaking.

 

My only problem with "Nevermind" was that it was over-produced.... The songs live sounded absolutely KILLER... I tend to think "In Utero" was their best work... They got a producer, Steve Albini, who understood them.. I always thought it was a real pity that Kurt bowed to record company pressure and allowed the singles off that album to be "tidied up"...

 

Nirvana were always at their best with a minimal amount of production and as raw and authentic-sounding as possible.... I mean, just listen to "About A Girl" on "Bleach"... Come on... Tell me that needed anything more done to it in terms of production.... Nah, it was simple and perfect.....

 

Nirvana were hugely influential, to underestimate their importance is utter stupidity.... You just have to listen to bands like Ash or Placebo to see Nirvana's obvious influence....

Well, we'll never know with the Pixies, because they upped and split on us before they could actually achieve anything as big as Nirvana did....

 

 

It depends on what you mean by achieve. What do you mean? Sounds like you think the Pixies didn't fulfil their potential and that they split prematurely.