It is exactly the same formation we played at the Euros, with Cleverly playing the Rooney role. He's expected to play as a second striker when we have the ball, and drop off in to midfield when we don't have the ball. Except it's a lot easier said than done - especially for someone who is not used to playing that role. Hodgson plays a defensively compact rigid 4-4-2. Nicky is right, to play that right and get away with it you need a target man. Ukraine we're good, but come on they're hardly amazing. We should be beating them, especially at home. A point is not a good result, especially in such a good group as ours. The link-up play is not good enough, and although we were on top for all of the second half we had no clue how to break Ukraine down. The central players are not good enough to work the ball and run in to pockets of space. Having Carrick might have been different, but Gerrard and Lampard as a midfield too is just asking for trouble. Neither can dictate tempo, and Carrick can (albeit not brilliantly). Save for Leighton Baines fantastic run to put the ball over the crossbar, we'd have been well beaten. None of the central players are good enough on the ball when we have it. To sum it up we can play that formation well, just not with the players we play.

 

How often did you see Gerrard and Parker pouring past Young/Welbeck/Rooney when they played in that Number 10 role during the Euros? Given how deep Cleverley often was I'd have called it a 4-3-3 or a 4-5-1. It's difficult to make a case for him playing as the Number 10 unless he's able to score and provide some penetrative passing in the final third, I'm pretty sure that's why Hodgson played both Lampard and Gerrard behind him as they're both goal threats.

 

With Carrick and Welbeck instead of Gerrard and Cleverley I'd have thought our build-up play would have been a bit more coherent.

How often did you see Gerrard and Parker pouring past Young/Welbeck/Rooney when they played in that Number 10 role during the Euros? Given how deep Cleverley often was I'd have called it a 4-3-3 or a 4-5-1. It's difficult to make a case for him playing as the Number 10 unless he's able to score and provide some penetrative passing in the final third, I'm pretty sure that's why Hodgson played both Lampard and Gerrard behind him as they're both goal threats.

 

With Carrick and Welbeck instead of Gerrard and Cleverley I'd have thought our build-up play would have been a bit more coherent.

 

Both Gerrard or Parker rarely attacked at the Euros, at least not the extent they should have been. Because we were set up so deep as a rigid 4-4-2 they did not attack/make runs as much as they should have done. If they did we were caught out on the counter attack. Cleverly was definitely playing the role Welbeck etc. played in the Euros, as a link-up man. I have no idea why Hodgson played him there instead of the other two who are more of a goal threat. The fact is our midfield is just not good enough at keeping the ball when we don't have a target man. The thing was yesterday we were at home, we were expected to attack. If we were in Ukraine, Gerrard and Lampard would have not made as many runs forward. Both players can not play together next to each other. Eight years on and mangers still don't see this. Bemusing.

I don't understand the logic in playing Cleverley in a number 10 role. I would have played Carrick instead, which would have given Gerrard and Lampard more defensive support to get forward

 

It's laughable that we're even playing Gerrard and Lampard in a midfield two when it's been proven time after time that it doesn't quite work

 

and Wales are a shambles defensively. What has Chris Coleman done to this promising team? I watched the first 30 minutes or so and Serbia were made to look like world beaters despite not being that great

Wales aren't that good, Gary Speed had them on a good run against average-half decent teams but I always thought they were a bit overrated. Granted 6-1 is woeful but you're not telling me that the team they played last night is anything like a match for the Serbia team they faced? Especially when it doesn't include the likes of Collins, Taylor, Bellamy and Collison... Steve Morison and Simon Church as a front two is dire.

John Terry retires from international football

John Terry retires from international football

 

Must have a big ban coming up from the racism enquiry

"I feel The FA, have made my position with the national team untenable."

 

Yes John, it's THEIR fault.

Must have a big ban coming up from the racism enquiry

Yep. Can't see why else he would retire

 

Probably thought he could jump in first and play the victim card

The one time in the last decade where we might actually struggle for decent centre backs as well.

Maybe England will win the upcoming world cup.....

anyone going to the games?

England squad for San Marino and Poland:

 

Goalkeepers: Fraser Forster (Celtic), Joe Hart (Manchester City), John Ruddy (Norwich)

 

Defenders: Leighton Baines (Everton), Gary Cahill (Chelsea), Ashley Cole (Chelsea), Kieran Gibbs (Arsenal), Phil Jagielka (Everton), Glen Johnson (Liverpool), Joleon Lescott (Manchester City), Ryan Shawcross (Stoke), Kyle Walker (Tottenham)

 

Midfielders: Michael Carrick (Manchester United), Tom Cleverley (Manchester United), Steven Gerrard (Liverpool), Adam Johnson (Sunderland), Aaron Lennon (Tottenham), Frank Lampard (Chelsea), James Milner (Manchester City), Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain (Arsenal), Theo Walcott (Arsenal)

 

Forwards: Andy Carroll (West Ham), Jermain Defoe (Tottenham), Wayne Rooney (Manchester United), Danny Welbeck (Manchester United)

Ashley Cole on twitter:

@TheRealAC3: Hahahahaa, well done #fa I lied did I, #BUNCHOFTWATS

 

Well I completely agree with the hashtag, but probably not so wise. Baines for left-back?

Ah, so this is why they picked three left backs :P

Ah, so this is why they picked three left backs :P

Yes

 

Hodgson can see into the future! The guy is a genius :lol:

He's already apologised. Puts a damper on John Terry's appeal now, if he goes ahead with it.

Cole: "I was really upset and tweeted my feelings in the heat of the moment."

 

Surprised he didn't go for "some hacked my account"

Am I the only one who's not surprised that Ferdinand isn't getting a look-in? The press seem to be shocked, I thought it was obvious that he was over the hill.

The fact Cole may come out without punishment proves him right really.

Am I the only one who's not surprised that Ferdinand isn't getting a look-in? The press seem to be shocked, I thought it was obvious that he was over the hill.

 

He's a complete liability. An excellent defender in his day, and he can still read the game very well, but that's not enough for modern footballers. The press are only shocked because he's a big name player, they did the same when Owen was first omitted from the England squad. He's been abysmal for Manchester United this season.

He's a complete liability. An excellent defender in his day, and he can still read the game very well, but that's not enough for modern footballers. The press are only shocked because he's a big name player, they did the same when Owen was first omitted from the England squad. He's been abysmal for Manchester United this season.

 

As you say, it's not enough when you haven't got the legs to keep up with anyone. Spurs' second goal on Saturday was a perfect example, he got drawn out of position and a combination of Rafael and Nani on Bale is never going to provide enough protection.