If radio support picks, up and video released, Cry, stands a better chance of doing well outside the opening few days of sales. Radio and video play would help streaming, these factors combined with actual sales would all help Cry become the hit it deserves.

I imagine the video will be released next week. I've seen a clip which I wasn't too keen on but the overall video may turn out to be much better. I wonder if any stations have play listed Cry yet?

It will be a big blow if radio stations dont get behind this.

I wouldn't pay any attention to the idiots slating Gary, Sigma or Mark and Howard...point is it's a bloody good song and a lot of people like it!

Listened to it in full a few times,it def could have been a sigma and Gary Barlow single. Look for me it's not bad,would Ilike a new take tthat album full of this style,definitely not,is it a classic take that song,its certainly not. Fair play they are trying something new which is great,and for them to be still creative with their sound has to be aplauded. I am slightly worried they have lost their sound,and I miss the take that of beautiful world and the brilliant circus era but everything changes,I loved the these days sound and still love that song but progress and three are albums that won't be getting played infull for me long term where beautiful world and eespecially the circus are classic albums for me.

Cry is the record of the week starting today on Radio 2, which means they will playlist it for sure. It remains to be seen whether R1 and Capital will do the same.

 

It looks like Cry will get to #3 on iTunes today, which makes me really happy, cause it means people are growing to like the song and it increases its chances of charting high come next Friday.

 

I have listened to Cry lots of times already and I still haven't got bored. For me, it has all the ingredients of a hit. I wouldn't mind 2 or 3 tracks in this style on the next TT album. It's actually a direction I enjoy.

The song is doing amazingly well, considering it's only been played 5 times: 3 times by R1 or twice by R2: http://comparemyradio.com/tracks/Sigma/Cry_(feat._Take_That)

The song is all about the production. What happened to the great songwriting that we witnessed with songs like Back for Good, Forever Love and Rule the World? It's not a bad song at all, and above average IMO for Take That, but not a song to connect with at deep level. I mean the "cry" theme doesn't work as an upbeat chorus. There is no pain or sincerity in the "cry." It is very immature at that level, but it is a strong single for radio play.

 

I think it will stay top ten for several weeks and a great way of keeping Take That relevant. But where are the other two from Take That? It is hard to believe Sigma couldn't have given the chorus to Howard Donald and Mark Owen. Yes, they are collecting their paychecks, but why do the other two guys from Take that accept that they are reduced to something even less than backing singers for Gary Barlow.

 

Not to take any credit away from Gary Barlow. Forever Love was the reason I first noticed who Gary Barlow was, but I thought the reason Robbie Williams left was because Barlow was greedy and not often willing to share vocals. Yes, Robbie Williams deserved better as he is extremely talented, but Howard Donald and Mark Owen have both displayed that they can carry a song to number one without embarrassing themselves, so at least let them provide backing vocals where you can tell it is them.

I don't understand where this misconception that upbeat equals cheery comes from. The song has quite some dark undertones and the upbeat chorus only emphasizes a certain frenzy associated with intense feelings. From my point of view, it works quite well and the song is very well written.

 

I can see that most objections come from people who'd like to hear Mark or Howard more. Outside their fanbase, I doubt anyone cares too much about this aspect - all people care about is whether they like a song or not. And, so far, the general public seems to be enjoying the single.

 

I'm a bit tired of Gary getting the grief for Mark and Howard being left out. I sincerely doubt he's proclaiming himself the lead singer and taking the lead vocals by force or tyranny.

 

And blaming Gary for Robbie leaving the band in the 90s...well, I think some people need reminding that Gary was the only one who had the courage to stand up to Nigel and who protested when Robbie wasn't being credited for the rap on Sure.

 

I swear I get the feeling, sometimes, that being more talented than others is a crime nowadays and it's our duty to help others try to better themselves instead of supporting those who are already better.

I don't understand where this misconception that upbeat equals cheery comes from. The song has quite some dark undertones and the upbeat chorus only emphasizes a certain frenzy associated with intense feelings. From my point of view, it works quite well and the song is very well written.

 

I can see that most objections come from people who'd like to hear Mark or Howard more. Outside their fanbase, I doubt anyone cares too much about this aspect - all people care about is whether they like a song or not. And, so far, the general public seems to be enjoying the single.

 

I'm a bit tired of Gary getting the grief for Mark and Howard being left out. I sincerely doubt he's proclaiming himself the lead singer and taking the lead vocals by force or tyranny.

 

And blaming Gary for Robbie leaving the band in the 90s...well, I think some people need reminding that Gary was the only one who had the courage to stand up to Nigel and who protested when Robbie wasn't being credited for the rap on Sure.

 

I swear I get the feeling, sometimes, that being more talented than others is a crime nowadays and it's our duty to help others try to better themselves instead of supporting those who are already better.

 

 

If I were to see BLT sandwiches for sale, even though I'm a vegetarian, I'd expect them to contain bacon, lettuce and Tomato--all three ingredients, not just the bacon. If it was just a bacon sandwich, then call it for what it is--a bacon sandwich, and don't package it as if the other two are in it!

 

Well, if people keep buying the sandwich even if it's mislabelled, then who is to blame? :P

Firstly, Gary is the lead singer, always has been and always will be given he's the best vocalist. Those focusing on Gary's dominance need to undertake some research as the 2006 comeback has resulted in greater parity in terms of lead vocal on their albums. Although not a fan first time around I think I'm correct in saying that Mark and Howard had fewer leads in the 1991 - 1996 era in terms of the albums.

 

Secondly, Howard has stated that he prefers BV and isn't keen to take on too many leads (Jay had the same mind set) I can't comment on Mark but he has a limited vocal range and in my view his vocals for Cry would have been a disaster. It is difficult to hear the two on backing vocals for Cry, although the more one listens the clearer Howard's vocals become. When performed live I think their contribution will be greater.

 

To some extent I have to agree with Bond Bug and Aphrodite. I think Cry is a fab, catchy song but is it in the same realm as BFG, Patience, RTW and so forth? Definitely not in my view. They have lost their direction and trademark sound and they haven't been producing classical pop songs which will stand the test of time. I do applaud them for trying different sounds and I would be happy to hear some songs in the vein of Cry on their next album. That said, BW and Circus are streaks ahead of any of their subsequent albums in terms of quality.

 

I've seen many comments on Twitter over recent times commenting on the lack of classic TT and I think the only way their sales will improve is for them to return to this sound. However, it maybe that the best years are behind them in terms of their song writing output. The period 2006 - 2009 was the benchmark for TT and to date they haven't been able to replicate that.

If I were to see BLT sandwiches for sale, even though I'm a vegetarian, I'd expect them to contain bacon, lettuce and Tomato--all three ingredients, not just the bacon. If it was just a bacon sandwich, then call it for what it is--a bacon sandwich, and don't package it as if the other two are in it!

 

Very well put BB! And in a very witty context too! :D I still don't see why Gary doesn't just cut himself off and go 100% solo and make all collaborations i.e., [insert flavour of the day] featuring Gary Barlow. Having said that - I wish Mark and Howard would have the dignity to say - look Gary - we've done our bit - we've managed to get you back into the public eye - but we've made a packet and we'll now leave with dignity. Instead - they seem to be happy to be a totally unnecessary pair of earrings on a buffalo - and they're not even gold earrings. I think this is why Jay left - he saw what is now clearly obvious.

 

 

Kath, I think you're being very, very unfair. Howard is pivotal in live shows. His BV are of the highest quality and an essential ingredient in the overall TT sound. Howard only sung one lead first time around and that was NF, so it isn't as though he's been side lined now. As for Mark he's central to the song writing process and is a visionary when it comes to their show productions - so they all play a vital role in one way or another.

 

I think to suggest that they are somehow being undignified and have no pride is wrong on every level. Mark and Howard both love music and performing and have every right to follow their passion.

 

I also take issue with you..' we've managed to get you back in the public eye.' We all know your position regarding Gary but I think that comment is uncalled for. Gary has every right to pursue his passion and love for music and guess what, if someone is popular then indeed that does bring them back into the public eye. Do I think Gary's primary concern is to remain in the 'public eye', no. I think his primary aim is to have his work listened to by as many people as possible and the 'public eye' element is a naturally by product of this.

 

As for the comment regarding buffalo earrings I wont dignify it with a response, other than to say you must have little regard for either Howard or Mark.

Edited May 21, 20169 yr by dylan62

I can quite clearly hear Howard's distinctive falsetto on the chorus so he wasn't left out at least as is being suggested.

I'm expecting top5 / maybe top3 new entry for this. Loving it.

I also take issue with you..' we've managed to get you back in the public eye.' We all know your position regarding Gary but I think that comment is uncalled for. Gary has every right to pursue his passion and love for music and guess what, if someone is popular then indeed that does bring them back into the public eye.

 

I don't think that is uncalled for. Can you honestly, hand-on-heart, say that (as brilliant a song as it was) Patience would have troubled the chart if it had been released by Gary alone? The thing that brought Gary back into the public eye was the brand Take That - and that had to be Jason, Howard and Mark as well as Gary. And I have no doubt at all that Gary wouldn't have been able to sell out at Southport's Floral Hall Pavilion - let alone Wembley Stadium.

 

I actually have great respect for Howard and Mark (moreso Mark) but I have immense respect for Jason - he knew when the job had been done.

Dylan, you are being very diplomatic and unnecessarily fair, when the opposite party isn't showing the same courtesy.

If this is the terms we're discussing in, then why not admit once and for all that Mark and Howard, but Mark especially, owed Gary to "bring him back in the public eye"? They would have remained forever anonymous had it not been for Gary's talent and Nigel building TT AROUND GB. As soon as TT was over, Mark was walking all over Gary, mocking him publicly with Robbie, yet Gary was still generous enough to call him a friend and to help him write 4 Minute Warning, the only solo song Mark still plays. Even the 2nd time around, Mark and Howard wouldn't have enjoyed any lasting success, had it not been for Gary. If people overlooked Mark's cheating scandal and Howard's domestic infidelities and issues and bribery attempts - and why not, even the tax scandal -, it was because of Gary's popularity. So, I say that, if they accept this "undignified" position they're in, as you put it, it's because they're aware of how much they owe Gary.

 

Is there something Gary isn't to blame for?

I still don't understand why he's taking the punches for what Mark and Howard do.

 

And, at the end of the day, when Mark and Howard's fans regard them as "lettuce and tomatoes", while Gary is being perceived as the "bacon", then what are we even fighting about?

By your own admission, Gary is the main attraction, while the others are just side flavors.

 

PS: Jay knew when to jump ship with the money. As far as I'm concerned, his morality is in question even moreso than Mark's and Howard's. But that's just me.

Edited May 21, 20169 yr by milly

Kath, that's not the point. Whether Patience would, or would not have been successful without the others isn't something we can prove one way or the other, although to nail my view to the debate I don't think it would have been successful as a Gary project. The tone of the statement is what I object to: the way its worded is very much around ... we know Gary wanted to be back in the public eye (being a self serving publicist ) so the others did him a favour and gave him a heads up.

 

That's not what it was all about Kath. They decided that they wanted to return (Jay's reluctance aside) that they missed music and thought they had something musically to contribute - and how right they were. Your comments suggests that Gary was self serving and the others his naïve side kicks ready to support his ego ridden return to the top. I think it shows a level of contempt and disrespect towards all of them and little recognition of their contributions.

 

It seems it's ok for other artists to achieve a level of success but not Gary. Where's the level playing field? Gary has shown such appreciation of Mark and Howard's input and is very aware that if it wasn't for them he may have remained at the fringes of the music scene. He's remained loyal to TT and said numerous times that the band is his primary focus. Now some people may say ' well he knows that being in the band will keep him in the public eye.' I prefer to think that he loves being part of the band, considers Mark and Howard his friends and loves making music with them. Maybe that's just me, but on balance I like to think the best of people. I simply see three men loving what they do and appreciating everything that comes their way. If that makes me naïve then so be it.

 

And Kath, I'm not backing down on this one - your buffalo comment was uncalled for.

Had Patience been a Gary project, it probably wouldn't have done as well as it did, but not because Patience isn't an extremely good pop song, but because of its association with Gary. Had it been released as an anonymous track, on radio, it would have exploded, just like it did with TT.

People needed to see the 2005 documentary to realize how unfair they had treated Gary. Without that documentary, anything Gary would have released would have flopped, including RTW.

So, in that respect, you are right, Kath.

But it's all about context, let's not forget that!

 

Going by some of the comments on these forums, you'd think Gary is some cold blooded, calculated monster! Jeez!

 

You know what, I'd actually prefer it if Gary left TT and all the other boys were free to continue as they please. Then we'd see if they really can carry the TT brand.

I'm sure Gary wouldn't be out of work for the near future, so, for Gary's fans, it's all the same if he stays in TT or not. Personally, I've loved way more his solo projects lately than the ones with TT - although I really enjoyed III and think it's one of the best TT albums. The question is: would it be the same for Mark and Howard's fans?

 

If it were up to me, TT would continue in this formula til they dropped dead, but, when I see so many unfair comments targeting Gary unjustly, I really wish they did this little experiment. I just fear none of the people protesting at the moment would really like the outcome.

Edited May 21, 20169 yr by milly