November 13, 200618 yr I agree, Rob... but the Muslim Council of Britain seem to have drawn a veil of silence over the fundamentalists and the terror attacks - surely it's their job to condemn these attacks, and as loudly as possible? Without a very loud message of disassociation - the rest of Britain will continue to believe ALL Muslims are people of terror.
November 13, 200618 yr Author I agree, Rob... but the Muslim Council of Britain seem to have drawn a veil of silence over the fundamentalists and the terror attacks - surely it's their job to condemn these attacks, and as loudly as possible? Without a very loud message of disassociation - the rest of Britain will continue to believe ALL Muslims are people of terror. Only ignorant, racist people believe that Russ.... I dont really know what more you expect to be honest, PLENTY of moderate Muslim reps have disassociated themselves with people like Abu Hamza and those who commit acts of terror... But the Media's and the Govt's idea of 'terrorist' seems to be extending to people who take part in Demos, Protests, etc.. Sir Ian fukkin' B-Liar (another piece of lying sh!t....) actually had the temerity to call for flag and effigy burning to be classified as criminal offences, who the fukk does he think he is? I dont remember voting for this maggot, he wont be happy till this country is a fukkin' POLICE STATE.... <_< Haven't the Police got better things to do than to arrest someone for setting fire to a bit of fukkin' CLOTH...... <_< Like, perhaps bringing in Tony and his cronies to answer questions related to the 'Cash for Peerages' scandal, as well as war crimes.....?
November 13, 200618 yr Author thats abit strong scott, i dont think russ is an ignorant racist. I dont think he is either, but he certainly seems to be falling for the hoary old Right-Winger arguments.... Back in the 70s/80s it was everyone with an Irish accent that was fair game which led to dreadful miscarriages of justice, now it's everyone who goes to a Mosque or goes on an Anti-American demo.... And mark my words, exactly the same sh!t is gonna happen... Well, it already HAS done actually, the Brits who ended up being 'rendered' to Guantanamo by the Yanks when they'd done fukk all.... And I aint in the least bit convinced by the arguments for keeping people in custody for more than 28 days either.... And neither is David Davies the Shadow Home Secretary by the way.....
November 13, 200618 yr Thanks, Rob. Scott - whether you can accept it or not - we are in the unenviable position in the UK of being a country who lets basically ANYBODY in willy-nilly, we're ridiculously generous with benefits for these people, with social care, healthcare, you can do just about whatever the hell you want whilst you're here and even our justice system is leniant to the point of being a joke if they get into mischief..... we're even cancelling bloody Christmas to accommodate people of other religions this year..... The chant of 'racist' for pointing all the above out is a lazy, boring and predictable one. For too long the British people (of all races and religions) have kept schtum about the crazy flow of immigrants to this country for the threat of being labelled racist..... the time is now, I'm afraid, for the people who live here, whether they were born here or not, to say - enough is quite enough. The BNP votes are nothing more than protest votes, nobody takes them seriously as a political party. But whilst our own Government fails to take its own people seriously and take notice of the huge upset the influx of immigrants to Britain is causing (and it's going to get worse - much, much worse) - then of course the BNP will keep getting more and more and more of these protest votes. And if these BNP votes finally make this shoddy Government wake up and start listening to the people who voted it in for a change (which it will, mark my words)... then I'm afraid I can only feel it's a good thing, however vile I personally find the British National Party.
November 13, 200618 yr Author Thanks, Rob. Scott - whether you can accept it or not - we are in the unenviable position in the UK of being a country who lets basically ANYBODY in willy-nilly, we're ridiculously generous with benefits for these people, with social care, healthcare, you can do just about whatever the hell you want whilst you're here and even our justice system is leniant to the point of being a joke if they get into mischief..... we're even cancelling bloody Christmas to accommodate people of other religions this year..... The chant of 'racist' for pointing all the above out is a lazy, boring and predictable one. For too long the British people (of all races and religions) have kept schtum about the crazy flow of immigrants to this country for the threat of being labelled racist..... the time is now, I'm afraid, for the people who live here, whether they were born here or not, to say - enough is quite enough. The BNP votes are nothing more than protest votes, nobody takes them seriously as a political party. But whilst our own Government fails to take its own people seriously and take notice of the huge upset the influx of immigrants to Britain is causing (and it's going to get worse - much, much worse) - then of course the BNP will keep getting more and more and more of these protest votes. And if these BNP votes finally make this shoddy Government wake up and start listening to the people who voted it in for a change (which it will, mark my words)... then I'm afraid I can only feel it's a good thing, however vile I personally find the British National Party. Yeah, and...? As I look at it, anyone is free to go anywhere they like in the world and make a life for themselves... There are around 2 million Brit Ex-Pats living in Spain, and loads more in the rest of the EU also US, Canada, Austrailia, New Zealand, of course this doesn't get quite as much column inches as the immigration hysteria..... No one makes a fuss out of it....... Is it only okay for white, anglo saxon people to move freely round the world then....? Bollox it is... Face it, the concept of 'Nation State' means next to sod all in a world where travel is so fast, cheap and opportunities are plentiful... I reserve the absolute human right to travel wherever I damn well want to to build a life for myself.... And just what the hell are you talking about Christmas being cancelled....? Take a trip down to Oxford Circus mate, Christmas is all over the bleedin' place and has been for about the past sodding MONTH!!! <_< Cancelled..? Are you joking.....? It's more 'in your face' these days than it has EVER been....
November 13, 200618 yr Thanks, Rob. Scott - whether you can accept it or not - we are in the unenviable position in the UK of being a country who lets basically ANYBODY in willy-nilly, we're ridiculously generous with benefits for these people, with social care, healthcare, you can do just about whatever the hell you want whilst you're here and even our justice system is leniant to the point of being a joke if they get into mischief..... we're even cancelling bloody Christmas to accommodate people of other religions this year..... The chant of 'racist' for pointing all the above out is a lazy, boring and predictable one. For too long the British people (of all races and religions) have kept schtum about the crazy flow of immigrants to this country for the threat of being labelled racist..... the time is now, I'm afraid, for the people who live here, whether they were born here or not, to say - enough is quite enough. The BNP votes are nothing more than protest votes, nobody takes them seriously as a political party. But whilst our own Government fails to take its own people seriously and take notice of the huge upset the influx of immigrants to Britain is causing (and it's going to get worse - much, much worse) - then of course the BNP will keep getting more and more and more of these protest votes. And if these BNP votes finally make this shoddy Government wake up and start listening to the people who voted it in for a change (which it will, mark my words)... then I'm afraid I can only feel it's a good thing, however vile I personally find the British National Party. that just about sums up what most of us are thinking russ, spot on! :) scott, immigration is getting out of hand, our TINY island just cant cope indefinately. the reason alot are emigrating is simply because its not the england they once knew. take that cockney geezer off 49up last year, after following him around every 7 years since '64 hes now left the uk. simply because his bit of london just isnt what it was. its barmy that teachers are needing to learn new languages in order to comunicate with their new pupils. and as you well know as i complained about it last year... my daughter told me that where she was living in london last year the crimbo lights WERE talken down after complaints from non christians! also stamps now cant have any christian icon on them this year, people cant wear crosses. now im no christian, i detest the religion, but like it or not it is the one us brits have been brought up on, and the brits here who want to display christian iconography must be free to do so. if immigrants are offended by this countries traditions then maybe they ought to eff off elsewhere! or shut up and accept them, like most of us are doing with theirs.
November 13, 200618 yr Russ FAR more Eastern europeans like Poles, Czechs, Bulgarians, Macedonian's etc came to live in this country last year than blacks and muslims, do you have any objection to them coming here and receiving healthcare and housing or is it just those with dark skin you object to ? while I do not believe you to be a racist I think you are somewhat gullible in the sense that you swallow everything the Murdoch press tells you as fact, I can draw no other conclusion from your posts because yu seem to believe that it is mostly blacks and muslims coming to live here and not white Easten Europeans who make up the bulk of new immigrants Edited November 13, 200618 yr by Kimi Räikkönen
November 13, 200618 yr Kimi - once again, I put your Murdochcomment aside as it's misguided, ill-informed and totally off the mark. As for the Eastern Europeans coming to live in the UK - do they demand their own religious schools? Their own places of worship? Do they demand we close public swimming pools on certain nights to solely accommodate them? Do they demand we poduce possibly the ugliest Christmas stamps we've ever had because we can't include ones with Christian images, do they demand we take off adverts that display Christian messages for Christmas, do they demand we make exceptions for them with rules of dress and uniform.... do they demand special priveliges whilst working for the armed forces...... do they demand the killing of anyone non-Eastern European...? I could go on... but I think you get the message.... My point is simple - if this country is so obviously unpalatable for some of these people, and our age-old customs and traditions offend them so greatly - regardless of colour - then the world's a big place.... integrate or emigrate. Simple choice, really....
November 13, 200618 yr Kimi - once again, I put your Murdochcomment aside as it's misguided, ill-informed and totally off the mark. As for the Eastern Europeans coming to live in the UK - do they demand their own religious schools? Their own places of worship? Do they demand we close public swimming pools on certain nights to solely accommodate them? Do they demand we poduce possibly the ugliest Christmas stamps we've ever had because we can't include ones with Christian images, do they demand we take off adverts that display Christian messages for Christmas, do they demand we make exceptions for them with rules of dress and uniform.... do they demand special priveliges whilst working for the armed forces...... do they demand the killing of anyone non-Eastern European...? I could go on... but I think you get the message.... My point is simple - if this country is so obviously unpalatable for some of these people, and our age-old customs and traditions offend them so greatly - regardless of colour - then the world's a big place.... integrate or emigrate. Simple choice, really.... But how many are complaining ? I know several muslims (probably around 20 or more through my work) and not one has ever complained about xmas not one has ever said stamps or religious regalia be banned etc, just because one senior cleric or whatever stamps his feet and demand things be banned then they are banned out of political correctness but I have never come across a single muslim who objects to the kind of things you listed, if there had been mass rallies in the street by muslims and effigys burned in the street in a demo of 100,000 muslims demanding xmas stuff be banned then what you say would have some credence but it has not happened usually its one person complaining and the cowardly council giving into them And then next day the big headline in Daily Mail "OUTRAGE AS MUSLIMS BAN XMAS" And it turns out in one sentence on paragraph 14 that there was 1 complaint by a Mr Mohammed Sadiq of Tower Hamlets but by which time anyone seeing the paper is saying "****ing muslims" Edited November 13, 200618 yr by Kimi Räikkönen
November 13, 200618 yr Author and as you well know as i complained about it last year... my daughter told me that where she was living in london last year the crimbo lights WERE talken down after complaints from non christians! also stamps now cant have any christian icon on them this year, people cant wear crosses. Well, that must be about the only time in HISTORY that a bunch of politicians acted on what ordinary people actually wanted them to do.... :lol: I'm not sure I buy it tbh... I reckon it's more like the typical hand-wringing by middle-class liberals responding to what they think ethnic minorities might be offended by and not bothering to actually find out whether they really care about it or not... I dont know of a single non-Christian person who has huge ideological issues with the X-mas lights (well, beyond the usual gripes of it being too BLOODY EARLY every single year, but that is a different issue...). But what do the Christmas lights actually have to do with Christianity anyway...? Take a look at the lights in Oxford Street/Regent Street, absolutely NOTHING to do with Christianity whatsoever, you've got cartoon characters, snowflakes.... Nothing related to the Nativity at all... Can't say I really give a sh!t about the stamps either, I dont remember the stamps being particularly 'religious' for a long time, I dont even look at 'em, it's a stamp, who cares...?
November 14, 200618 yr Well, that must be about the only time in HISTORY that a bunch of politicians acted on what ordinary people actually wanted them to do.... :lol: I'm not sure I buy it tbh... I reckon it's more like the typical hand-wringing by middle-class liberals responding to what they think ethnic minorities might be offended by and not bothering to actually find out whether they really care about it or not... I dont know of a single non-Christian person who has huge ideological issues with the X-mas lights (well, beyond the usual gripes of it being too BLOODY EARLY every single year, but that is a different issue...). But what do the Christmas lights actually have to do with Christianity anyway...? Take a look at the lights in Oxford Street/Regent Street, absolutely NOTHING to do with Christianity whatsoever, you've got cartoon characters, snowflakes.... Nothing related to the Nativity at all... Can't say I really give a sh!t about the stamps either, I dont remember the stamps being particularly 'religious' for a long time, I dont even look at 'em, it's a stamp, who cares...? its the principal of it though scott.... crimbo lights/imagery on stamps... shouldnt be an issue.
November 14, 200618 yr The point is though that muslims do not want xmas banned and xmas displays banned and stamps banned and that sort of thing it is almost always politically correct WHITE council leaders who think they should not do something INCASE it might offend muslims or blacks or women or lesbians or whatever, the average muslim in the street has no interest in things being banned and it is always ALL muslims that get blamed and get stereotyped when stuff does get banned
November 14, 200618 yr Author But how many are complaining ? I know several muslims (probably around 20 or more through my work) and not one has ever complained about xmas not one has ever said stamps or religious regalia be banned etc, just because one senior cleric or whatever stamps his feet and demand things be banned then they are banned out of political correctness but I have never come across a single muslim who objects to the kind of things you listed, if there had been mass rallies in the street by muslims and effigys burned in the street in a demo of 100,000 muslims demanding xmas stuff be banned then what you say would have some credence but it has not happened usually its one person complaining and the cowardly council giving into them And then next day the big headline in Daily Mail "OUTRAGE AS MUSLIMS BAN XMAS" And it turns out in one sentence on paragraph 14 that there was 1 complaint by a Mr Mohammed Sadiq of Tower Hamlets but by which time anyone seeing the paper is saying "****ing muslims" Exactly... Personally, I've not seen very many Anti-Christmas demos on the streets of London... It just illustrates the sheer stupidity and fukked-upness of the political establishment in this country though - 2 MILLION people of all races, creeds, colours, religions and social classes went on an Anti-War in 2003 and were promptly ignored by B-Liar, Hoon, Campbell, one bloke in Tower Hamlets gets a bit huffy about the Crimbo lights going up too early and the local politicians (and I do believe the Council in question was Nu Labour controlled at the time)... actually listen to what he has to say.... Stop blaming the actual people, and blame those who actually take the decisions at local and national level.. I think you'll find these people tend to be white, middle-class, and from a Christian background.... Muslims have next to zero political influence, the Jewish community has far more influence on Govt policy.... In short Rob, Russ - You're blaming the wrong people.....
November 14, 200618 yr Exactly... Personally, I've not seen very many Anti-Christmas demos on the streets of London... It just illustrates the sheer stupidity and fukked-upness of the political establishment in this country though - 2 MILLION people of all races, creeds, colours, religions and social classes went on an Anti-War in 2003 and were promptly ignored by B-Liar, Hoon, Campbell, one bloke in Tower Hamlets gets a bit huffy about the Crimbo lights going up too early and the local politicians (and I do believe the Council in question was Nu Labour controlled at the time)... actually listen to what he has to say.... Stop blaming the actual people, and blame those who actually take the decisions at local and national level.. I think you'll find these people tend to be white, middle-class, and from a Christian background.... Muslims have next to zero political influence, the Jewish community has far more influence on Govt policy.... In short Rob, Russ - You're blaming the wrong people..... sorry, there shouldnt be ANY anti christian demos.... it isnt the church thats causing the racism trouble.
November 14, 200618 yr sorry, there shouldnt be ANY anti christian demos.... it isnt the church thats causing the racism trouble. I wasn't aware there had been any :unsure:
November 14, 200618 yr I wasn't aware there had been any :unsure: according to scotts post above there has....
November 15, 200618 yr Author sorry, there shouldnt be ANY anti christian demos.... it isnt the church thats causing the racism trouble. Eh...? I think you and Craig misunderstand... I was being a bit sarcastic.... I've not seen ANY anti-Christmas demos.... Or anti-Christian ones either.... On the other hand though, couldn't Richard Dawkins' progs be considered a bit 'anti-Christian'.....? :lol:
November 15, 200618 yr Eh...? I think you and Craig misunderstand... I was being a bit sarcastic.... I've not seen ANY anti-Christmas demos.... Or anti-Christian ones either.... On the other hand though, couldn't Richard Dawkins' progs be considered a bit 'anti-Christian'.....? :lol: oh , i see. yes i misunderstood... easy with cold text type. but richard dawkins is anti religion, christian, islam, pagan, anything! the point being that immigants must know what to expect when they come here, therefore they should accept it or not come!
November 15, 200618 yr Author the point being that immigants must know what to expect when they come here, therefore they should accept it or not come! I dont see why anyone should accept unnacceptable actions of a Govt (and there is a difference here, between a country and its Govt..), especially when those actions involve killing people's relatives or their fellow countrymen for no reason other than to arse-lick the fukkin' Yanks.... <_<
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