ITS SUCH A SHAME BECAUSE IF IT WAS still all phyisical sales they would be number 7,big dif in a number 7 and a numbe r32 hit

I never really gave Lacuna Coil a chance. For some reason I just find bands similar to Evanescence cheesy...

 

You're making the mistake that many Ev fans do with that statement... The facts are Amy and Ben borrowed off A HELL OF A LOT of genuinely groundbreaking British and European Gothic Rock/Metal bands.... Paradise Lost (first album in 1989!!!), Nightwish (first album 1996!!), Lacuna Coil (first album 1996), Within Temptation (who have done FOUR albums by the way, not two as you seem to mistakingly believe), HIM (first album 1998), Theatre of Tragedy (first album 1994), The Gathering (first album 1991), Tristania (first album 1996)..... I could go on, but I reckon you get my point... If you think any of these bands are 'cheesy' then you aint listening properly... I'm not a huge fan of Epica to be honest, I find them dull and rather uninspired, After Forever are much better...

 

And I think that it's a bit nonsensical to criticise Within Temptation for merely claiming back a sound that was always theirs... It would be a little bit like slagging off a new album by Paul McCartney for sounding a bit like Oasis, know what I mean.....?

 

But ultimately, Amy's real forebear is Siouxsie Sioux in many respects - her image, her style, all from Siouxsie (Siouxsie was doing the whole 'tutu and corsets' thing when Amy was still in nappies.... :lol: )

I never really gave Lacuna Coil a chance. For some reason I just find bands similar to Evanescence cheesy... I'm talking about Epica and maybe even Nightwish. Mother Earth may have influenced Amy but not as much Evanescence influenced the sophmore ("Stand My Ground"). Their new song really sounds like Ben Moody had something to do with, it's all BMTL/Linkin Park again. :lol:

 

I'm not really sure what you mean by the 'new WT song', they haven't actually realeased anything for ages ("Silent Force" is over two years old..) - but a new album IS on the way in March -, are you talking about "Stand My Ground"? Or "Memories" Or "Angels"..? You cant really compare any of these to "Bring Me To Life", for a start, no crappy male "rapping", and all three are musically superior to anything Ben Moody could ever do...

 

Anyway, listen and look at this pre-Evanescence WT video for their song "Ice Queen" to see who borrowed from who here.....

 

Within Temptation's new song leaked. "What Have You Done" and believe it or not, there's a lame guy part. Evanescence may have borrowed from them, but this is a complete and total rip-off. A mash up between Bring Me To Life (the "wake me up!" c**p), Farther Away and CMWYS. They might as well ask Amy to sing it for them. I know a lot of fans are disappointed.

 

I know Evanescence's isn't the first with this sound, but still... the other bands all sound like they lack something. Maybe it's because I prefer Ev's lyrics for the most part and Amy's voice is more convincing and really sets an atmosphere... like you get drawn into Lithium right after the first word she sings. Other rock bands like Evanescence are just less convincing, whether it's the cheesy lyrics or the unconvincing lead, or the Eurovision "rock" sounding music (Nightwish's "Elvenpath).

 

By the way. Didn't Evanescence start recording "Away from me" back in 1996? That's the Evanescence sound.

 

I don't think Amy was particulary/consciously influenced by all the bands. And if she was, she did a great job one-upping it. The song you posted doesn't sound like anything particular Ev's done. It's just a kind of genre. In fact, "Mother earth" didn't sound much like Ev, whereas "The Silent Force" partially has the Ev sound, and the new one is a major rip-off.

 

Just hear it for yourself...

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ve_d_MJiTzc

 

They were much more influenced by Ev than EV was by them.

Edited January 17, 200718 yr by Filthy or Gorgeous

 

I know Evanescence's isn't the first with this sound, but still... the other bands all sound like they lack something. Maybe it's because I prefer Ev's lyrics for the most part and Amy's voice is more convincing and really sets an atmosphere... like you get drawn into Lithium right after the first word she sings. Other rock bands like Evanescence are just less convincing, whether it's the cheesy lyrics or the unconvincing lead, or the Eurovision "rock" sounding music (Nightwish's "Elvenpath).

 

 

I cant disagree more with this paragraph to be honest, Lacuna Coil in particular have a frontwoman who can wipe the floor with Amy in a live setting particularly... I've seen Ev live and was SPECTACULARLY underwhelmed by them, I've seen Lacuna Coil six times, each time was an utterly amazing experience, lacking absolutely nothing (not even when Christina was fighting a bad flu, most lesser bands would see that as an excuse to postpone a gig..).... Amy's stage presence leaves a lot to be desired, Christina and Andrea on the other hand are a double-barrelled nuclear blast of a live combo..... Sharon Den Adel's live vocals are absolutely superb as well, she's a vastly more talented technical vocalist, ditto for Tarja Teruenen... And I think to criticise European rock bands for sounding European is just daft tbh.... Should they bloody sound American..??? You have a very false impression of Continental European rock music and a very obvious pro-American bias (but of course you're not alone in this, American Rock music is hammered into us in the UK whereas European rock/metal music has up til now just been ignored or treated as a joke)... "Elvenpath" is a very, very old Nightwish song, they progressed way beyond that with successive albums...

 

The one thing I will agree on though - "The Open Door" is a heavier, more musically daring album than "Silent Force" for sure, but SF still trumps "Fallen" in my book....

 

Just hear it for yourself...

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ve_d_MJiTzc

 

They were much more influenced by Ev than EV was by them.

 

I'd say it was closer to Lacuna Coil to be honest (as Ev themselves are, and always have been, please wake up to this fact....), the male vocal is similar to Andrea Ferro's style of singing, and Sharon is sounding a LOT like Christina Scabbia as well.... I dunno about this to be honest, I'll have to judge it within the context of the album...

 

Are you sure this aint actually a Lacuna Coil out-take from the 'Karmacode' sessions.....? :lol: :lol:

 

Having a male vocal is nothing new for WT either, their early stuff is almost split 50/50 with Sharon and the male guitarist... Although it has to be said, the male vocals at that point were of the more 'growly', Death Metal variety....

 

There's nothing intrinsically wrong with a band changing styles, Dutch band The Gathering's progression from sub-Death Metal growlers to boundary-pushing Rock experimentalism is really quite staggering (if you can get your head round the fact that they quite radically alter their style with each album they release, while still actually maintaining a certain continuity between the albums...), but it has to be about creativity, having a musical vision and pushing the envelope as opposed to just saying "Oh, will doing this mean we get heavy rotation on MTV...?"... Which is why "Fallen" to "The Open Door" - good thing..

I cant disagree more with this paragraph to be honest, Lacuna Coil in particular have a frontwoman who can wipe the floor with Amy in a live setting particularly... I've seen Ev live and was SPECTACULARLY underwhelmed by them, I've seen Lacuna Coil six times, each time was an utterly amazing experience, lacking absolutely nothing (not even when Christina was fighting a bad flu, most lesser bands would see that as an excuse to postpone a gig..).... Amy's stage presence leaves a lot to be desired, Christina and Andrea on the other hand are a double-barrelled nuclear blast of a live combo..... Sharon Den Adel's live vocals are absolutely superb as well, she's a vastly more talented technical vocalist, ditto for Tarja Teruenen... And I think to criticise European rock bands for sounding European is just daft tbh.... Should they bloody sound American..??? You have a very false impression of Continental European rock music and a very obvious pro-American bias (but of course you're not alone in this, American Rock music is hammered into us in the UK whereas European rock/metal music has up til now just been ignored or treated as a joke)... "Elvenpath" is a very, very old Nightwish song, they progressed way beyond that with successive albums...

 

The one thing I will agree on though - "The Open Door" is a heavier, more musically daring album than "Silent Force" for sure, but SF still trumps "Fallen" in my book....

I didn't mean European sounding Rock music, I said Eurovision... meaning poppier, cheesier. Like trying so hard to be "Rock" that it's just not it. Kinda hard to explain, just hear the rock song that won in the Eurovision. But maybe they've progressed, it's the feel of their songs (those that I've heard) that leaves me uninterested in the rest of their material.

 

I think I'll give Lacuna Coil a chance. Nightwish is so cheesy, as is Epica (Epica is also horrid lyrically) and most other similar bands. What LC song should I listen to first?

 

As for the first part of your post, Amy wasn't good live during the "Fallen" era but times have changed. She's much better now, she actually does the opera parts in WOTW. I can't find a link on youtube they must have removed it, just listen to the "Almost Christmas" performances of Imaginary and Weight Of The World. I was talking about studio recordings anyhow, Amy's voice is haunting and sets an atmosphere. She doesn't have to try hard, she just has it in her whenever she starts singing. Ev's songs flow so much better than other songs from similar bands that I've heard because of that too. As for the technically better singing, I don't care for that at all. It means nothing. Could Christina Aguilera sing "Like You" emotionally the way Amy does?

Edited January 18, 200718 yr by Filthy or Gorgeous

I didn't mean European sounding Rock music, I said Eurovision... meaning poppier, cheesier. Like trying so hard to be "Rock" that it's just not it. Kinda hard to explain, just hear the rock song that won in the Eurovision. But maybe they've progressed, it's the feel of their songs (those that I've heard) that leaves me uninterested in the rest of their material.

 

I think I'll give Lacuna Coil a chance. Nightwish is so cheesy, as is Epica (Epica is also horrid lyrically) and most other similar bands. What LC song should I listen to first?

 

As for the first part of your post, Amy wasn't good live during the "Fallen" era but times have changed. She's much better now, she actually does the opera parts in WOTW. I can't find a link on youtube they must have removed it, just listen to the "Almost Christmas" performances of Imaginary and Weight Of The World. I was talking about studio recordings anyhow, Amy's voice is haunting and sets an atmosphere. She doesn't have to try hard, she just has it in her whenever she starts singing. Ev's songs flow so much better than other songs from similar bands that I've heard because of that too. As for the technically better singing, I don't care for that at all. It means nothing. Could Christina Aguilera sing "Like You" emotionally the way Amy does?

 

Frankly, the Lordi song, I just saw as a laugh tbh... There's a better version of that song on the album "The Arockalypse"... But the chorus part is very similar to Alice Cooper's "Poison", and we both know that AC is an American act.... :lol: :lol: Nightwish are not cheesy, they're just very Scandinavian... Kinda hard to explain what I mean by that, you have to have listened to a lot of bands from that part of the world to get what I mean...

 

As far as Lacuna Coil goes, blimey take your pick... The "Comalies" album (thier third) is the place that I would send anyone off to who was interested in checking them out, "Karmacode" (the most recent one) is great as well, but not for the novice fan...

 

Bottom line - I like Ev's new direction (here's hoping they stick to it and Amy doesn't listen to the idiots putting about the false perception that TOD is somehow a 'failure' because of it not 'shifting enough units'. And, to be honest, I reckon Ev should ditch their almost entirely bloody useless record company and go off to a PROPER Rock/Metal label like Century Media or Roadrunner, where they might get supported to the degree that they deserve...); maybe I will give the live aspect a second chance, I was just so unbelivably disappointed with them when I saw them, only playing a set that lasted an HOUR!!! Bloody cheek, using so much DAT playback as well (for keyboard, second guitar and backing vocal parts..), didn't really seem like a live show at all.... I was far more impressed with Slipknot, what you hear on their album is what you got at a live show....

 

 

 

Nobody is saynng TOD is a failure... this week the album is #15 in the world chart acording to mediatrafic. Still much ahead of other mainstream releases who came out at the same time, like Aguilera, the Killers, etc. They´ll never beat the sales of their 1st album tough, because these days it´s almost impossible for an album to sell 10 million... Even blockbuster albums struggle for sales of 5 million worldwide. This album is doing very well for the current state of music industry.

Nobody is saynng TOD is a failure...

 

A few people on this very Forum have said pretty much that JJN... I do believe someone actually used the words "nothing can save the album now..", implying the album is a failure... I wasn't saying the album was a failure (and it certainly is NOT in musical terms, it is, in fact leaps and bounds beyond its predecessor..), I was talking about a perception that some people seem to have that it is just cos it's not "Fallen part 2".... And frankly, why the fukk should it even be that anyway....?

The Open Door is down 15 places to #66 in the midweeks too. :(

Well it has another 20k or so to go until it reaches platinum.

I have said from the start as long as it goes platinum in the UK I would be happy. We all knew it would never top 'Fallen' but it has done better than expected with over 3,000,000 copies sold across the world and still selling.

We all knew it would never top 'Fallen' but it has done better than expected with over 3,000,000 copies sold across the world and still selling.

 

Exactly... Three million albums sold is hardly the disaster that some on this Forum would have us believe.... The album was released, when...? In August/September...? Three million albums sold in about 4/5 months is NOT a a failure by any stretch of the imagination....

 

 

 

The Open Door is down 15 places to #66 in the midweeks too. :(

 

I don´t trust the midweeks, last time it was #105 on midweeks and ended up # 43 on the actual chart.

I don´t trust the midweeks, last time it was #105 on midweeks and ended up # 43 on the actual chart.

 

Sometimes I get the impression that some people actually want this album to fail by quoting all these pretty dubious facts and figures, y'know....?

 

Exactly... Three million albums sold is hardly the disaster that some on this Forum would have us believe.... The album was released, when...? In August/September...? Three million albums sold in about 4/5 months is NOT a a failure by any stretch of the imagination....

It is not a mindblowing success like Fallen either. It's not flopping but it's underperforming.

It is not a mindblowing success like Fallen either. It's not flopping but it's underperforming.

 

In comparison to 'Fallen' though.

For an album of this genre and type I am astonished it has done so well everywhere. 'Fallen' was so mainstream and it was the breakthrough album for them/ Many acts nowadays have a massive selling album and then struggle to keep up the momentum with the next release.

I'll be honest and I say that I perfer 'Origin' and 'Fallen' to 'The Open Door'. I can't get into it no matter how many times I listen and only 3 or 4 of the tracks actually standout for me.

It is not a mindblowing success like Fallen either. It's not flopping but it's underperforming.

 

Please STOP comparing it to "Fallen"...... "Fallen" is, as far as I'm concerned, an aberration, an album by a totally different band.... Ben Moody's band, not Amy's band.... TOD is the real Evanescence, and TOD is the album that should have followed on from "Origin"..... The fact that Ben Moody is now pratting around with mainstream Pop Stars these days should really tell you all you need to know....

 

 

In comparison to 'Fallen' though.

For an album of this genre and type I am astonished it has done so well everywhere. 'Fallen' was so mainstream and it was the breakthrough album for them/ Many acts nowadays have a massive selling album and then struggle to keep up the momentum with the next release.

I'll be honest and I say that I perfer 'Origin' and 'Fallen' to 'The Open Door'. I can't get into it no matter how many times I listen and only 3 or 4 of the tracks actually standout for me.

The Open Door is a grower. What songs do you like?

 

Grimly, I don't like Ben although he is a great writer. Amy and Ben are a great combination when it comes to writing. The Open Door isn't very diferent fron Fallen except lyrically maybe... yet yu're making it seem like I'm comparing a Pink Floyd album to a Paris Hilton album. :lol: You'd probably like Going Under, Tourniquet, Hello (which is BRILLIANT lyrically, better than Like You), Taking Over me, etc. if they were on TOD. Most songs on this album are VERY Evanescence.

Edited January 31, 200718 yr by Filthy or Gorgeous

The Open Door is a grower. What songs do you like?

 

The Open Door isn't very diferent fron Fallen except lyrically maybe... yet yu're making it seem like I'm comparing a Pink Floyd album to a Paris Hilton album. :

 

I was thinking more a 'Smashing Pumkins' or 'A Perfect Circle' album to a 'Rasmus' or MCR album to be honest mate.... There are very obvious differences musically, TOD is a heavier, more musically complex album than "Fallen", with much better riffs, I honestly dunno how you cant see that....