http://au.news.yahoo.com/a/-/newshome/5099...-market-flawed/

 

What do you think? Is there a need to strike a balance between capitalism and socialism?

For a guy like that to admit something like this is quite astounding... He is correct to criticise the system, it is fatally flawed.... It was proven to be flawed in 1929, and has been proven again in 2008....

 

To answer the question posed, in a word - yes.... A mixture of Socialism and Capitalism is precisely the system we had in place post WW2 - the creation of the Welfare State, Public ownership of rail, buses, transport network, water, public utilities; we HAD a mixed economy, a very successful one, then Thatcherism came along and destroyed it all.. The assumption that the Market will solve every problem is an utter fallacy, and this has been proven with what has happened over the past few months...

 

We indeed NEED a mixture of Capitalism and Socialism, we NEED a return to the Mixed Economy of the 50s and 60s, the one would balance out the other... At the end of the day, when the chips were down, it was SOCIALISM (with the Nationalisation of banks, bail outs and unprecedented State intervention into the Markets) that prevented us all, particularly America, from facing a catastrophe of Wall St Crash proportions...

For a guy like that to admit something like this is quite astounding... He is correct to criticise the system, it is fatally flawed.... It was proven to be flawed in 1929, and has been proven again in 2008....

 

To answer the question posed, in a word - yes.... A mixture of Socialism and Capitalism is precisely the system we had in place post WW2 - the creation of the Welfare State, Public ownership of rail, buses, transport network, water, public utilities; we HAD a mixed economy, a very successful one, then Thatcherism came along and destroyed it all.. The assumption that the Market will solve every problem is an utter fallacy, and this has been proven with what has happened over the past few months...

 

We indeed NEED a mixture of Capitalism and Socialism, we NEED a return to the Mixed Economy of the 50s and 60s, the one would balance out the other... At the end of the day, when the chips were down, it was SOCIALISM (with the Nationalisation of banks, bail outs and unprecedented State intervention into the Markets) that prevented us all, particularly America, from facing a catastrophe of Wall St Crash proportions...

 

an economy run by the unions?... strikes here, strikes there... yeah the good old days... <_<

 

ive a customer, hes 86, he worked for the same firm from leaving school until he was 65 in a job he enjoyed and could do competantly. he didnt want to retire, his bosses didnt want him to retire, but the unions forced him to retire by threatening strike action if he didnt! ... yeah socialism was great wasnt it!.... blackouts, unemptied bins, the winter of discontent... ffs...

an economy run by the unions?... strikes here, strikes there... yeah the good old days... <_<

 

ive a customer, hes 86, he worked for the same firm from leaving school until he was 65 in a job he enjoyed and could do competantly. he didnt want to retire, his bosses didnt want him to retire, but the unions forced him to retire by threatening strike action if he didnt! ... yeah socialism was great wasnt it!.... blackouts, unemptied bins, the winter of discontent... ffs...

 

Yeah, yeah, blah, blah, always talk about that one small period of time in the late 70s to try and force the argument that workers rights was always nasty and evil and wrong.... :rolleyes: The question poses a MIXTURE of Socialism and Capitalism... Pillock... :P

 

OF COURSE there should be a mandatory retirement age FFS..... Otherwise you have bosses working people until they drop DEAD..... It's a principle dude.... And, sorry to be blunt, but the old has to make way for the young at some point, otherwise how do the young get the experience to carry on in the professions they want to get into..? How do things develop..? How do NEW ideas and fresh perspectives come in...? Yes, it's a bit hard on some individuals, but in the long-run it benefits the nation to have an injection of young blood into industry, you need that balance of experience and youth....

 

Yeah, yeah, blah, blah, always talk about that one small period of time in the late 70s to try and force the argument that workers rights was always nasty and evil and wrong.... :rolleyes: The question poses a MIXTURE of Socialism and Capitalism... Pillock... :P

 

OF COURSE there should be a mandatory retirement age FFS..... Otherwise you have bosses working people until they drop DEAD..... It's a principle dude.... And, sorry to be blunt, but the old has to make way for the young at some point, otherwise how do the young get the experience to carry on in the professions they want to get into..? How do things develop..? How do NEW ideas and fresh perspectives come in...? Yes, it's a bit hard on some individuals, but in the long-run it benefits the nation to have an injection of young blood into industry, you need that balance of experience and youth....

 

...... and YOU chose i small period in time (now) to discredit capitalism! :P

 

there should NOT be a mandatory retirement age, im shocked that you would suggest this... what about the rights of people to willingly work?.. why should they be MADE to pack it in?.. they should, in a free world, be able to retire whenever they want to.

For one moment, I do not believe that there should be a mixture of capitalism and socialism but there should be a balance between capitalism and regulation. Regulation that is timely and can cope with the technology that we have nowadays.

 

Regulations is where government can intervene to address market failure and that DOESN'T mean socialism.

 

Nevertheless, Alan Greespan said that he didn't expect investment bank managers to act in their self-interest. How silly. Has he ever heard a thing called "agency theory" in the field of accounting?? =P

...... and YOU chose i small period in time (now) to discredit capitalism! :P

 

Really...? One "small" period... The Great Depression basically fukked everyone in the US for over a decade (and we weren't exactly immune to it either, remember the Jarrow Marches..?), then you had the MILLIONS of unemployed during Thatcher's "greed is good" reign and consigned to living on the dole for the rest of their lives, the destruction of the mining and shipping industries; then Major's "boom and bust" which resulted in Black Wednesday, negative equity, etc, and now THIS utter shambles initiated by banks while politicians who should have KNOWN better had their eyes off the ball and their tongues up the arse of the American Neo-Cons. .... Unfettered, socially irresponsible Capitalism is absolute rank stupidity as far as I can see it which creates nothing but cycle after cycle of 'boom and bust' leading to millions of ordinary people suffering....

 

Considerably MORE than one 'small' period in time.... The two biggest financial disasters that have happened in the 90s and now are absolutely, without question the fault of unfettered, uncontrolled Capitalism....

For one moment, I do not believe that there should be a mixture of capitalism and socialism but there should be a balance between capitalism and regulation. Regulation that is timely and can cope with the technology that we have nowadays.

 

Regulation....?? Are you kidding me....? The powers that "Regulators" actually have at the moment are a joke, certainly having nothing like the resources that the speculators and the banks have at their disposal, or indeed the armies of clever accountants....

 

It took a hell of a lot more than "regulation" to counter the current economic crisis, it took SOCIALISM. Like it or not, this is exactly what the DIRECT State Intervention and the Nationalisation programmes are in effect..... The Govt now is a majority shareholder of several major banks in the UK.... Er, sounds like Socialism to me..... :P

Regulation....?? Are you kidding me....? The powers that "Regulators" actually have at the moment are a joke, certainly having nothing like the resources that the speculators and the banks have at their disposal, or indeed the armies of clever accountants....

 

It took a hell of a lot more than "regulation" to counter the current economic crisis, it took SOCIALISM. Like it or not, this is exactly what the DIRECT State Intervention and the Nationalisation programmes are in effect..... The Govt now is a majority shareholder of several major banks in the UK.... Er, sounds like Socialism to me..... :P

 

Are you kidding me? Socialism? To me, socialism is the equivalent of communism and mind you, there will never be TRUE socialism because laws in the US and UK prohibits government from taking over private property, such as land and equipment. If that law is repudiated at any time, by the state, then we will have TRUE socialism.

 

If you want one example of better regulation, look at Australia. -_-

The US and UK are more "mixed" than they'll ever admit. Protectionist policies protect millions of farmers and manufacturers. Europe is no better with massive subsidies, especially agricultural ones. The problem is then the West demands total, 100% free markets from developing countries, giving them short term loans to prevent bankruptcy and then dumping billions in overproduction commodities which put local farmers and manufacturers out of business. They end up in even deeper debt. How do you think the Asian Tigers developed? With very selective capitalism, free trading in some industries but protecting many others.

 

Capitalism works but only when mixed with healthy doses of state intervention. It's a shame that neo-liberal ideologues will never admit this. Reagan and Thatcher have been proven wrong again and again and yet their influence still plagues major financial, political and development institutions. Their arrogance has led to many hardships in the US and UK -- but far worse, many deaths in the developing world.

Any systems that puts the pursuit of money at the root of its achievements is fataly flawed. That is capitalism. Nowadays on the news we hear thousands die in a natural disaster, and then we are told what the financial cost of it is. Who cares how much it costs, what we really should care about is how to make the lives of billions more comfortable, after all if large corporations stopped fleecing us all and we shared the wealth much more fairly the world would be a much better place

laws in the US and UK prohibits government from taking over private property,

 

Well, that's just complete cr@p actually, never heard of "compulsory purchase orders" then, that Local Authorities enforce all the time....? :rolleyes: Usually done for commercial reasons, to build a new bypass, or a new airport runway, or some new fukkin' shopping mall like sodding White Fields, etc, ie, CAPITALISTIC reasons...

 

But, presumably, this would be all okay by you wouldn't it...? God forbid that a derelict property or a property where there was an absentee landlord was put under a Compulsory Purchase order to build a school or a hospital... Why, that would be positively SOCIALIST wouldn't it.....? :rolleyes:

The US and UK are more "mixed" than they'll ever admit. Protectionist policies protect millions of farmers and manufacturers. Europe is no better with massive subsidies, especially agricultural ones. The problem is then the West demands total, 100% free markets from developing countries, giving them short term loans to prevent bankruptcy and then dumping billions in overproduction commodities which put local farmers and manufacturers out of business. They end up in even deeper debt. How do you think the Asian Tigers developed? With very selective capitalism, free trading in some industries but protecting many others.

 

Capitalism works but only when mixed with healthy doses of state intervention. It's a shame that neo-liberal ideologues will never admit this. Reagan and Thatcher have been proven wrong again and again and yet their influence still plagues major financial, political and development institutions. Their arrogance has led to many hardships in the US and UK -- but far worse, many deaths in the developing world.

 

And that to me just totally underlines the sheer hypocrisy of the Western Capitalist system.. Spot on Consie.... We protect ourselves at the expense of the Third World, which we just exploit and sh!t over.. Things have changed very little since Imperialism if you ask me, the only difference is we dont send armies any more, we send Multi-National Corporations.... Look at Shell in Nigeria and their involvement in the Ken Saro Wiwa affair.... Absolutely shameful... <_< Also the trade in "Conflict Diamonds"... But this is what Western Capitalism does....

 

dumping billions in overproduction commodities which put local farmers and manufacturers out of business.

 

FULL TRUTH..... I worked in a supermarket while a student... The amount of perfectly good food that was thrown out every day is absolutely obscene... The ONE supermarket where I worked was throwing out well over £1000 worth of "expired" food every day, multiply that by 365 days in the year and the tens of thousands of supermarkets all over the country and you end up with a figure which wouldn't be much shy of £1billion of food wasted in UK every year...... Utterly obscene, but this is the "wonders" of unfettered Capitalism for you.... -_-

 

Contrast this with the thousands and thousands of local shops, traders and markets whose waste is a tiny fraction of this because they only buy in what they actually need...

 

The answer is simple - Support your local Traders where possible.....

 

Really...? One "small" period... The Great Depression basically fukked everyone in the US for over a decade (and we weren't exactly immune to it either, remember the Jarrow Marches..?), then you had the MILLIONS of unemployed during Thatcher's "greed is good" reign and consigned to living on the dole for the rest of their lives, the destruction of the mining and shipping industries; then Major's "boom and bust" which resulted in Black Wednesday, negative equity, etc, and now THIS utter shambles initiated by banks while politicians who should have KNOWN better had their eyes off the ball and their tongues up the arse of the American Neo-Cons. .... Unfettered, socially irresponsible Capitalism is absolute rank stupidity as far as I can see it which creates nothing but cycle after cycle of 'boom and bust' leading to millions of ordinary people suffering....

 

Considerably MORE than one 'small' period in time.... The two biggest financial disasters that have happened in the 90s and now are absolutely, without question the fault of unfettered, uncontrolled Capitalism....

 

NOW.... i said in brackets NOW, meaning the last year or so....

And that to me just totally underlines the sheer hypocrisy of the Western Capitalist system.. Spot on Consie.... We protect ourselves at the expense of the Third World, which we just exploit and sh!t over.. Things have changed very little since Imperialism if you ask me, the only difference is we dont send armies any more, we send Multi-National Corporations.... Look at Shell in Nigeria and their involvement in the Ken Saro Wiwa affair.... Absolutely shameful... <_< Also the trade in "Conflict Diamonds"... But this is what Western Capitalism does....

 

Have you seen the documentary Life and Debt? It's about how the World Bank and IMF have burdened Jamaica with "structural adjustment" programs that have wiped out local industries and led to increased debt and poverty. It's incredibly interesting. If you have an hour, the whole thing is online:

 

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5277094596195828118

 

It's also a rather devastating critique of Western tourists (mostly North Americans) who visit impoverished third world countries. Highly recommend this!

Well, that's just complete cr@p actually, never heard of "compulsory purchase orders" then, that Local Authorities enforce all the time....? :rolleyes: Usually done for commercial reasons, to build a new bypass, or a new airport runway, or some new fukkin' shopping mall like sodding White Fields, etc, ie, CAPITALISTIC reasons...

 

But, presumably, this would be all okay by you wouldn't it...? God forbid that a derelict property or a property where there was an absentee landlord was put under a Compulsory Purchase order to build a school or a hospital... Why, that would be positively SOCIALIST wouldn't it.....? :rolleyes:

 

Sorry since I don't live in the UK, I don't know what's going on with your property but at least in Australia, governments have to negotiate with whoever is the owner of that property if they want to build some c**p there.

 

Any systems that puts the pursuit of money at the root of its achievements is fataly flawed. That is capitalism. Nowadays on the news we hear thousands die in a natural disaster, and then we are told what the financial cost of it is. Who cares how much it costs, what we really should care about is how to make the lives of billions more comfortable, after all if large corporations stopped fleecing us all and we shared the wealth much more fairly the world would be a much better place

 

So tell me how do you spread the wealth more fairly? Through tax reform or more spending by governments?

Have you seen the documentary Life and Debt? It's about how the World Bank and IMF have burdened Jamaica with "structural adjustment" programs that have wiped out local industries and led to increased debt and poverty. It's incredibly interesting. If you have an hour, the whole thing is online:

 

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5277094596195828118

 

It's also a rather devastating critique of Western tourists (mostly North Americans) who visit impoverished third world countries. Highly recommend this!

 

I've not seen this particular documentary, but have seen similar things and have read around the issue plenty, esp in the non-mainstream press, peer-reviewed journal articles, etc...

 

Will certainly check this out though... :)

but at least in Australia, governments have to negotiate with whoever is the owner of that property if they want to build some c**p there.

 

Yeah, I've read in history books about how your ancestors "negotiated" with the true occupiers of the land in Australia..... -_- Presumably your Govt has stopped going in en masse with troops and herding people like cattle, or slaughtering them in their tens of thousands like they did with the Aboriginies....

 

But, hey, that's Capitalism too in a way innit....? :rolleyes: