Was anyone really expecting anything frome Spirit to sell aswell as Bleeding Love. I was expecting Better In Time to peak higher and really the same for Forgive Me but both have sold well enough and really Forgive Me was really more for the US, just for some reason we got it before them.

I thought JLS's version of Hallelujah was better than Alexandra's.

However, I thought that overall, she was the best performer on the night.

"it certainly INSNT nonsense.... surely an emotion, a story, an example, a message is purer from the scource then from a second/third/forth/etc hand perspective?... VERY rarely is a cover of a track as good as the original, as covers are only acting the part, singing it karaoke style as opposed as from the heart. those x factor bints DO NOT sing from the heart... they are actresses, karaoke singers, copying someone elses emotion.

 

the best actors DO research their respective roles so as to get some understanding of the situation they are portraying... so thats a non argument.

 

singing may be a talent, although many can learn it, which isnt what a talent is! but without soul then its meaningless karaoke drivel... which is EXACTLY what the x factor provides.... another way of looking at it is like this... IF alex and leona were really that good, why havnt they already been signed up?... if it wasnt for the over hyped, x factor circus, theyd be no where.

 

congratulations to cowell.... he knows how to make money, at the contempt of the audience."

 

I agree that when a contestant performs on a show like X-Factor, it's not usual for everyone to convey pure emotion into the song. However, it's not the case with everyone. I'm totally against that argument. Hundreds of songs have different meaning to me and if I were able to sing better, I'm sure I show emotion. There's a difference with someone who's not "soulful". I don't think Leona's that soulful (i.e. Aretha Franklin, Alicia Keys etc.), but that doesn't mean she's not great at her craft.

 

Leona and Alex were (and are) still quite young and had plenty of time to get a contract. Leona was actually within the music industry originally, anyway. Alex would've had it harder to break through as her voice is not distinctive unlike Leona's.

 

Maybe it's ignorance but I can't see how a singer has to write their own material or play some kind of instrument for their work to be good. I can see the appeal and why it's only positive to do all of those things, but I think that way of thinking is most definitely ignorant.

I agree that when a contestant performs on a show like X-Factor, it's not usual for everyone to convey pure emotion into the song. However, it's not the case with everyone. I'm totally against that argument. Hundreds of songs have different meaning to me and if I were able to sing better, I'm sure I show emotion. There's a difference with someone who's not "soulful". I don't think Leona's that soulful (i.e. Aretha Franklin, Alicia Keys etc.), but that doesn't mean she's not great at her craft.

 

Leona and Alex were (and are) still quite young and had plenty of time to get a contract. Leona was actually within the music industry originally, anyway. Alex would've had it harder to break through as her voice is not distinctive unlike Leona's.

 

Maybe it's ignorance but I can't see how a singer has to write their own material or play some kind of instrument for their work to be good. I can see the appeal and why it's only positive to do all of those things, but I think that way of thinking is most definitely ignorant.

 

fair comment.

 

ok a singer doesnt have to have written it to give the best version or the most soulful version....... but it helps. i dont think that 99% of the time a karaoke contest winner can be anything other then that... just a singer. i believe that the best music is about more then being a competant singer, in fact many acts cant sing that well but their voices can portray the emotion of a track perfectly. johnny rottens vocals for eg, technically awful, not the most dulcet tones ever...lol,... but his snarl and anger fitted perfectly the mood/emotion of the song.

You have the likes of Will Young who came out of this show (and he's a hundred times more talented than your Metalica trash, you're an idiot if you can't face it).

And lots of the artists you love are playing the "we're banned from TV" card, and they would never accept to perform on the X Factor if they were invited (and then they would complain there ain't place for bands like them on such shows, the idiots...).

 

But it's funny you quote Evanescence and Mettalica as your "talented" references :lol: Especially considering the last act is just TRASH music without an inch of talent.

 

You cant even SPELL the band's name correctly, idiot... :lol: So, I'm sure not gonna take your opinions on them seriously..... :rolleyes: It's one 'T' and two 'L's by the way.....

 

And I seem to remember some years back Slipknot making a pretty legendary appearance on the Chris Evans show on C4, so it sure aint as if these bands DONT want to do TV, they do it in the US all the time, Slipknot were also at the MTV awards.... So, kindly shut the hell up about things you know practically bugger all about.....

 

Oh, and the list of artists of ALL genres who have refused to allow their material to be used on X-Factor is exponentially growing year by year.... :lol: Yeah, it's SUCH a credible show innit......?

5. I'd like to see any manufacted pop act release an album with no singles taken from it featuring 10 tracks all over 5 minutes long of original musical compositions; release the album without the support of TV & the media & go to #1 in 25 countries selling over 4.5 million copies to date. It's called real talent which is why they are regarded as one of the greatest live act around today.

 

EXACTLY..... "Death Magnetic" is one of the greatest albums of 2008 without a doubt... And is one of the best Rock/Metal albums of the past decade.... It is a glorious return to form, probably their best since "Master of Puppets".... I agree that they were treading water for much of the 90s though, and their last album wasn't exactly great either.... But, this is them going back to basics, the music being more important than the hype, and considering the sales and the reception it's received, I'd say it's worked out extremely well for them....

 

And indeed they are one of the greatest live bands on Earth.... There is NOTHING that Cowell or his talentless puppets can possibly do to match with the Mets.....

 

You cant even SPELL the band's name correctly, idiot... :lol: So, I'm sure not gonna take your opinions on them seriously..... :rolleyes: It's one 'T' and two 'L's by the way.....

 

And I seem to remember some years back Slipknot making a pretty legendary appearance on the Chris Evans show on C4, so it sure aint as if these bands DONT want to do TV, they do it in the US all the time, Slipknot were also at the MTV awards.... So, kindly shut the hell up about things you know practically bugger all about.....

 

Oh, and the list of artists of ALL genres who have refused to allow their material to be used on X-Factor is exponentially growing year by year.... :lol: Yeah, it's SUCH a credible show innit......?

 

and to establish on this...

 

i couldnt be arsed to find Bert's comment to quote but Slipknot and Metallica do loads of major TV every year, infact this year Slipknot have been on TRL, played the MTV awards and at one of their London shows this year there was filming for MTV.

 

as for Metallica this year they have done a MTV performance in the US i believe, a chat show (David Letter man i think, maybe Jimmy kemmel, im not sure there all the same) and played Jool's Holland.

 

and as for them being untalented thrash... just LOL.

So you're telling me that people like Leona and Alex aren't talented?

 

Those people you mentioned as being talented are only in your opinion. There are other people like me who think that that type of music is just complete rubbish. And obviously it must be quite a lot of people, hence the reason those bands you mentioned and their genres aren't the mainstream. And hence the reason they're indie and not signed. A lot of these bands don't want to conform to what they believe is just mainstream rubbish, and I value that opinion, but there are risks with that i.e not getting the recognition that all the pop bands and singers are getting.

 

Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying....

 

They have a "technical ability" to sing, but that is NOT the same thing as having a talent.... It's like an interior designer could do a good job of making your house look pretty, but could they do something like The Sistine Chapel...? Er, I dont think so..... There's a difference between "Artisan" and "Artist".....

Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying....

 

They have a "technical ability" to sing, but that is NOT the same thing as having a talent.... It's like an interior designer could do a good job of making your house look pretty, but could they do something like The Sistine Chapel...? Er, I dont think so..... There's a difference between "Artisan" and "Artist".....

:rolleyes: So then whats your idea of talent then?

 

 

The one thing I hat about these music "Purists/snobs" or whatver you call yourselves is the fact that you think that your opinions are the definitive opinions. I mean seriously, all these people going on about how Alexandra doesn't get the song/sing it with the right emotion or whatever - what makes them think that they know how the song is meant to be sung and the right emotions which should be portrayed when singing it? The fact is these are all different interpretations and should all be accepted, you may not like it, and you're free to say what you feel is wrong, but it doesn't mean that what you say is gospel and the word of God.

:rolleyes: So then whats your idea of talent then?

The one thing I hat about these music "Purists/snobs" or whatver you call yourselves is the fact that you think that your opinions are the definitive opinions. I mean seriously, all these people going on about how Alexandra doesn't get the song/sing it with the right emotion or whatever - what makes them think that they know how the song is meant to be sung and the right emotions which should be portrayed when singing it? The fact is these are all different interpretations and should all be accepted, you may not like it, and you're free to say what you feel is wrong, but it doesn't mean that what you say is gospel and the word of God.

 

Talent is, ironically, actually having that quality known as "the X Factor", Lennon/McCartney had it, Jagger/Richards, Daltrey/Townsend, Johnny Rotten, Morrissey, Jarvis Cocker, Liam and Noel, Kate Bush, Madonna, Michael Jackson (pre-surgery...), Kurt Cobain, Chuck D, Robert Smith, Aretha Franklin, James Brown, Jeff Buckley, Dusty Springfield, Alison Goldfrapp, Beth Gibbons, Neil Hannon, Bjork, Joe Strummer, and others WAY too fukkin' numerous to mention all had or still have it..... NOBODY "MANUFACTURED" THEM..... Some, may have been helped along in their careers by producers, mangers, moguls, etc, but they did things their way. Aretha Franklin, a black woman brought up in an age of segregation and racism in the deep South of the US during the 50s and 60s gets up there and DEMANDS "RESPECT" from White America... What the fukk does it matter if she actually wrote those words, she bloody well made them hers and this is just a potent symbol of Black power as Chuck D saying "Fight The Power" or James Brown saying "Say it LOUD, I'm Black and I'm proud"... What the fukk do Leona or Alexandra actually have to say for themselves to compare to that.....? :rolleyes:

 

And, hell yeah, you better believe that the likes of Metallica, Amy Lee and Slipknot have this "X-factor" as well....

 

:rolleyes: So then whats your idea of talent then?

The one thing I hat about these music "Purists/snobs" or whatver you call yourselves is the fact that you think that your opinions are the definitive opinions.

 

its about supporting REAL music, not some manufactured garbage, and us old buggers have lived through times when 'real' music was popular, i believe it matters that each generation has its own identity... this one doesnt as its being lead by old men!!!! YOUTH should create its own identity and lead the way for business to follow.

its about supporting REAL music, not some manufactured garbage, and us old buggers have lived through times when 'real' music was popular, i believe it matters that each generation has its own identity... this one doesnt as its being lead by old men!!!! YOUTH should create its own identity and lead the way for business to follow.

 

Spot on... I suppose it makes the likes of Rena feel a bit better to dismiss us as "snobs" or whatever... But, let's face it, they just couldn't even comprehend the sort of breadth of artistes which exist in my collection (and probably yours as well.....)... I've got over 10,000+ albums stored in my PC hard-drive (yeah, it IS a MASSIVE hard-drive, well, actually two, a 300gig 'master' and a 200 gig 'slave' drive.....LOL), and frankly, Rena, it would blow your mind to check out what's actually on it.... And, er, this doesn't include the well over 1000 vinyl albums and tapes I have stored back home in Dundee.....

 

The only thing I dont like is blandness, lack of imagination, lack of identity or false emotion..... And, indeed, youth SHOULD be dictating the terms of whatever the direction of contemporary popular music is, but it's not, it's being completely dictated by OLD MEN like Cowell, Walsh, etc.... You all bang on about us "old gits", but, hey, you're perfectly happy to listen to so-called "music" that's being created by these other old gits....

 

Irony anyone.....? :rolleyes:

 

I enjoy the X Factor and a few years ago I would have defended it until I was blue in the face but I feel it's now getting out of hand. I'm not going to get high and mighty about the cover of Hallelujah being sacrilegious etc, because I don't really care about that. But just the whole format seems to have gotten silly. The show's function is now so blatantly not about 'finding raw talent' but about making Simon Cowell more money. And I suppose it's always been that way but at least in past years they hid it better. Yes, I'm going to have to agree with the 'old gits' on this one. ;)

 

Someone actually told me that Simon Cowell has bought the rights to this song. Is that true? So all of these people who are "making a stand" and buying Jeff Buckley's version are just making more money for Simon? I'm not sure if that's true but LOL if it is.

Diana's version is better.

Diana's version is better.

:rofl:

I think this calls for a Monica quote:

"Oh thank god its only [Diana Vickers], i thought someone was banging a bag of cats against a brick wall"

Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying....

 

They have a "technical ability" to sing, but that is NOT the same thing as having a talent.... It's like an interior designer could do a good job of making your house look pretty, but could they do something like The Sistine Chapel...? Er, I dont think so..... There's a difference between "Artisan" and "Artist".....

 

Yikes, same old English elitist bull$h!t. It'll never tire ;)

Talent is, ironically, actually having that quality known as "the X Factor", Lennon/McCartney had it, Jagger/Richards, Daltrey/Townsend, Johnny Rotten, Morrissey, Jarvis Cocker, Liam and Noel, Kate Bush, Madonna, Michael Jackson (pre-surgery...), Kurt Cobain, Chuck D, Robert Smith, Aretha Franklin, James Brown, Jeff Buckley, Dusty Springfield, Alison Goldfrapp, Beth Gibbons, Neil Hannon, Bjork, Joe Strummer, and others WAY too fukkin' numerous to mention all had or still have it..... NOBODY "MANUFACTURED" THEM..... Some, may have been helped along in their careers by producers, mangers, moguls, etc, but they did things their way. Aretha Franklin, a black woman brought up in an age of segregation and racism in the deep South of the US during the 50s and 60s gets up there and DEMANDS "RESPECT" from White America... What the fukk does it matter if she actually wrote those words, she bloody well made them hers and this is just a potent symbol of Black power as Chuck D saying "Fight The Power" or James Brown saying "Say it LOUD, I'm Black and I'm proud"... What the fukk do Leona or Alexandra actually have to say for themselves to compare to that.....? :rolleyes:

 

And, hell yeah, you better believe that the likes of Metallica, Amy Lee and Slipknot have this "X-factor" as well....

Madonna? Ok, LOL.

 

But yeahhh, I get what you're saying, I really do, but I just think that someone like Alexandra shouldn't be criticized before she's even got into the studio to record her stuff. I mean, those people you listed are the exceptions, why? Not because there are so little individualists, but because such a high percentage of them FAIL before we even hear of them. As I said before, at the end of the day its all about luck, and taking every opportunity you get, however much you want to say you hate the X Factor, and I agree with you on that front, its Alex's and Leona's future careers, dreams and lives at stake. Are you telling me that if you were a talented singer with a dream, a massive dream and things weren't going your way at all you would rather give up, than compete for a golden opportinity to win a recording contract worth $1m?

 

Both Leona and Alex are people who have tried to break into the industry left, right and center. Apparently failing horribly each time, so how can you diss either one fo them for having to resort to going onto the X Factor? As I said before, Alex hasn't even released her first record and yet you're dissing her already. She seems like a very driven girl, someone who knows where she wants to go in life and isn't gonna take $h!t from anyone. She's already talked about wanting to have a massive creative input in her album and she says that she is already a songwriter... I think we should wait to see what her first album looks like and her input in her first album before labelling her incompetant or whatever.

 

I really do understand what you're saying and some of these manufactured artists are getting out of control. Like Miley Cyrus... But im a big fan of Jojo and you look at video's of her on youtube and shes been on every talent show you can imagine trying to make a name for herself and get into the business. But I think its about what you do after you get discovered, she was approached to be hannah montana, but she turned it down. Because she herself didn't want to be a manufactured artist. Her third album is due out anytime now and shes assumed almost complete creative control of it, shes written and composed virtually every track on it apart from probably one or two and has produced a lot of them too probably. She only turned EIGHTEEN like yesterday. Shes always making controversey when she echos your views and talks about how she hates the career paths of her contemparies like Miley, Britney and Hilary Duff among others and they way they just directed eft right and center and just sing what is put in front of them. But basically what im trying to say is that the music industry has changed now and yes the producers now have a big say in it but I think you shouldn't just turn your backs on singers like Leona and Alex, nowadays in a lot of cases it takes time before a singer can properly show their individuality and I think you shouldn't turn your back on them, I think that they're talented and could go on to become the two most globally famous British singers we have had in DECADES. But I dunno, all im saying is just try to keep a more open mind. :)

 

Wow that was such a long post, I just wrote everything that was in my head after I read your post. :o

 

But its interesting hearing other people's views considering I agree with a lot you're saying. :)

 

I enjoy the X Factor and a few years ago I would have defended it until I was blue in the face but I feel it's now getting out of hand. I'm not going to get high and mighty about the cover of Hallelujah being sacrilegious etc, because I don't really care about that. But just the whole format seems to have gotten silly. The show's function is now so blatantly not about 'finding raw talent' but about making Simon Cowell more money. And I suppose it's always been that way but at least in past years they hid it better. Yes, I'm going to have to agree with the 'old gits' on this one. ;)

 

Someone actually told me that Simon Cowell has bought the rights to this song. Is that true? So all of these people who are "making a stand" and buying Jeff Buckley's version are just making more money for Simon? I'm not sure if that's true but LOL if it is.

 

erm... do we know you by another name?... ;)

. Are you telling me that if you were a talented singer with a dream, a massive dream and things weren't going your way at all you would rather give up, than compete for a golden opportinity to win a recording contract worth $1m?

 

Both Leona and Alex are people who have tried to break into the industry left, right and center. Apparently failing horribly each time, so how can you diss either one fo them for having to resort to going onto the X Factor? As I said before, Alex hasn't even released her first record and yet you're dissing her already. She seems like a very driven girl, someone who knows where she wants to go in life and isn't gonna take $h!t from anyone. She's already talked about wanting to have a massive creative input in her album and she says that she is already a songwriter... I think we should wait to see what her first album looks like and her input in her first album before labelling her incompetant or whatever.

 

its not quite like that though, yes you need talent, but you also need charisma, you need to have something to say and the ability to convert it into pleasant music. you need to be a talented individual. theres hundereds and thousands of people who can sing competantly, some can even compose or play instruments, but without that 'x factor' ...(:lol:) you are just another person.

 

sometimes you just arnt good enough.

erm... do we know you by another name?... ;)

 

oh yeah! just checked your profile! how are you doing? good to see you, hope all is well :)