Graham A

Just a few of the extremely complicated rules used by the OCC. 3.0: Singles Definitions Summary Product Format Dealer Price Maximum Playing Time and Content _______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ a. i) Digital Audio Track Audio Download Minimum £0.40 15 minutes (one audio track) ______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ b. i) Digital Single Bundle Audio Download Minimum £0.40 25 minutes and no more than four songs plus alternative versions of featured songs. Playing time of video tracks will not count towards total permitted playing time providing the video is cut to substantially the same mix as featured audio tracks or is the only commercially available video for the tracks. _______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ c. i) “1 Track” CD Compact Disc Minimum £0.60 15 minutes and no more than one audio track. No multimedia content. ______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ d. i) “1 Track+” CD Compact Disc Minimum £1.20 15 minutes and one audio track plus additional audio track OR video OR ringtone. ______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ e. i) “Maxi” CD Enhanced Compact Disc Minimum £1.79 25 minutes and no more than four songs (audio or video) plus alternative audio versions of featured songs. ii) “Maxi” DVD Enhanced DVD Minimum £1.79 Playing time of video tracks will not count towards total permitted playing time providing the video is cut to substantially the same mix as featured audio tracks or is the only commercially available video for the tracks. _______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ f. i) “Maxi” DMD Digital Memory Device Minimum £2.49 25 minutes and no more than four songs (audio or video) plus alternative audio versions of featured songs. Playing time of video tracks will not count towards total permitted playing time providing the video is cut to substantially the same mix as featured audio only tracks or is the only commercially available video for the tracks. Maximum memory capacity of 256MB. ______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ g. i) 7-inch Vinyl up to 7" Minimum £0.50 25 minutes and no more than three tracks. ii) 12-inch Vinyl over 7" Minimum £1.99 25 minutes and no more than four songs plus alternative versions of featured songs. _______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ or Remix Single (see below) _______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ h. Remix Single One song title and any number of remixes of that featured title to a maximum of 40 minutes applicable to “Maxi” physical or digital formats and 12” vinyl formats. One promotional video for lead track only. NOTES _____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ 1. Playing Time refers to the amount of recorded material irrespective of content. 2. A Track is a continuous piece of recorded material. 3. Digital Minimum Dealer Price £0.40p : Only tracks with a minimum PPD of 40 pence or more shall be eligible for the Official Singles Chart. In the event that a record company has an alternative business model for the sale of downloads (i.e., one not based on a published dealer price), the price charged to the online digital retailer should not be less than 32 pence per track. OCC will monitor sales to ensure they are 'genuine sales'. Where OCC judges sales not to be genuine, they may be excluded from the chart at OCC's absolute discretion. 4. Singles Multi-packs are not eligible for the Official Singles Chart 5. Featured Song is defined as the lead track nominated by releasing label and common to all formats 4.0 Combining Formats for Singles Chart DIGITAL The following digital formats may be combined for chart placing. _______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ d. i) Digital Audio Track Permanent Digital Download Unlimited digital variants or alternative versions of featured song may be combined for chart placing. _______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ e. ii) Digital Single Bundle Permanent Digital Download Maximum of 3 digital bundles may be combined for chart placing _______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ PHYSICAL In addition to the digital formats, sales of a maximum of 3 physical formats may be combined for a chart placing and purposes of chart publication. Note: A maximum of 2 formats from the Maxi Format section are chart eligible. Quantity of Format Type Permitted Per Single Release _______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ Standard Formats a. i) “1 Track” CD Compact Disc Any combination of formats from this section to the maximum ii) “1 Track+” CD Compact Disc of 3 physical formats iii) 7-inch Vinyl up to 7" iv) 12-inch Vinyl over 7" _______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ Maxi Formats b. i) “Maxi” CD (or Enhanced) or Vinyldisc Compact Disc 1 of each of the format types listed in this section are chart eligible, ii) “Maxi” DVD (or Enhanced) or Vinyldisc DVD to a maximum of 2 iii) “Maxi” Dualdisc Dualdisc iv) “Maxi” DMD Digital Memory Device _______________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ There are even more of these rules on the OCC website. They will invent some more soon no-doubt as they make up the chart to suit the record industry and the BBC.

Though it's true that most sales do indeed come from iTunes, sales are very close to each other, so a number one on that site plus the others will push a record such as this one keeping it higher, even though the iTunes buyers are getting fed up of it. Most buyers anyway will buy from the download site charts, they don't like to search for records. So if a record is on one of these sites top 100 you can bet it's selling better than a new record not on a top 100. Personally I wouldn't buy anything from iTunes.

If the play.com chart is anything to go by it won't be soon. Since it's still number one there! Overall it's been top there since it went to number one. Mind you it is a weird chart. It's currently got Anne Murray's You Needed Me at number 4!

Here's the missing one! 19-4-79: Presenter: Dave Lee Travis (NEW) GORDON GILTRAP – Fear Of The Dark (5) MILK & HONEY – Hallelujah (13) M – Pop Muzik (NEW) DUSTY SPRINGFIELD – I’m Coming Home Again (19) WINGS – Goodnight Tonight (video) (4) THE JACKSONS – Shake Your Body (Down To The Ground) (danced to by Legs & Co) (27) GONZALEZ – I Haven’t Stopped Dancing Yet (NEW) CHILD – Only You (10) THE THREE DEGREES – The Runner (1) ART GARFUNKEL – Bright Eyes (video)

I don't know about anyone else but I often view a track on YouTube for less than 30 seconds or 1 minute max, because it's either a crap (quality wise) or the wrong thing! Presumably such things count as a view. Is it the same with streaming sites. Does a 30 second listen count as a view? Could the charts be fixed by doing that?

Imagine is not listed on 45 worlds. In fact only 3 John Lennon cassette singles are on. Two of them being Woman (the other the euro version). The only other Lennon track being Watching The Wheels all on the Geffen Label and from 1981. If uses haven't been to the site it's well worth a visit. 45 Worlds Tape section You can narrow any search down by using the filter option. For example just select cassette single. I was really impressed with the Reel to Reel tapes. The Beatles albums must be worth a packet :huh:

I ran each of the UK number ones before John Lennon till the first cassette single, on the Tape database of 45 Worlds and you are right Robbie none of them appeared as a Cassette Single. So John Lennon is the first cassette single number one.

I've loads of old cassettes dating right back to 1978. Sadly some of them won't play. What happens is that you put them in the cassette machine press play and they might play for a while, then all of a sudden the tape slows down and stops playing then drops out of play mode. The tape gets that tight it just can't move it. Some commercial tapes suffer from this problem, but the blank tapes you bought to record on are worse. The brand made by EMI I have found to be the worst offenders. Sadly there's not a lot you can do when the tape goes like that. I understand it's caused by the lubricants used on the tapes. Originally these were whale products. When they switched to man made substitutes they just were not as good. So earlier forms of tape will still work now. Some people might think it was their cassette deck to blame, if they have only one deck. Because the tape makes a terrible squeaking noise and often has very bad wow and flutter, which sometimes can be caused by the deck. But I have put the tape in other decks with the same response. To give you a scale of how bad the problem is, so far I have lost between 20 and 30 tapes to this!

Dire Straits up from 1,722 to 354 on Amazon downloads as a direct result of last nights show!

Posted this elsewhere, but there's no reason members here should miss these few words of wisdom! The Village People with their first hit had managed to pull the wool over the eyes over much of the USA, as regards the sexuality of the band and it's associations with gay culture. However "In The Navy" pushed a bit too far and it became obvious! Shortly after this the USA would turn away from anything Disco. Nevertheless it wasn't only the anti-gay and Christian lobby that went off the band. Gay activists themselves didn't like the stereotypes being presented by the band. The band responded with less gay songs - such as Can't Stop The Music, which was also an attack on counter disco culture of the USA, but it was too late. In The Navy did go on to inspire producer Ian Levine, together with FGTH Relax, he put the two together and created the sound of High Energy which was a hit for Evelyn Thomas. The band itself was formed by French producer Jacques Morali, from an assortment of actors, dancers and session singers. Featured on the longer version... Billy Idol (of Generation X) who's real name was William Broad, was an English Literature student at Sussex University when Punk started. One of the novels he studied was a Douglas Coupland book called Generation X. The Film and novel references continued with that single. The title also happens to be a Russ Myer film, many of his films being famous for women with big breasts. Valley of The Dolls, I believe being one of them. Jools Holland again appears smoking a cigar on the Squeeze track. Even on the video's the band did he smokes the cigar! The two girls reminded me of Sharron and Tracy from Birds of A Feather! The Jam made it's mark on Paul Weller's school, quite literally! The word could be seen carved in school desks all over the place! Paul says the name came from Jam sessions he used to do with lads at school and saying that to his mother! But when you consider that the bands Bread and Marmalade were big at that time, it doesn't take much to put Jam in-between them! By 1975 they had been working the club circuit and one such club performance saw the wife of one of the chaps from EMI put them in touch with her husband at EMI. However it all came to nothing. It wasn't till the Sex Pistols broke when the record company A&R people became interested in this type of band. Chris Parry of Polydor was after the Clash, but CBS offered them a better deal. So Chris went with the Jam. Paul clearly used to much polish on his mirror in that song Strange Town, for he sings " I look in the mirror and what do I see? A great big layer of Mr Sheen starring back at me".

I wouldn't bet on any album released this way being out on any other retailers. Most of them rejected Beyoncé's album. You still can't download it on most download sites. Releasing an album this way is one certain way to piss off all the other sellers!

As a regular Amazon user I have not seen any download track available for pre-order. They are very common on iTunes. You can pre-order DVD's, but you pay upfront, I have currently got 12 Years A Slave on pre-order, it was paid for to pre-order it. Any price reduction is paid back to you when the DVD becomes available. Other tracks on iTunes are album only. If you agree to purchase the album you can have the specific track now for the price stated. So you have paid for the song and can download it. The system seems to be only on iTunes. Amazon do not use this method as far as I can tell. They have never mentioned it in any promo e-mails they send out anyway! In some cases you can purchase these Album tracks on the other download sites without buying the album. iTunes seems to be very privileged when it comes to the Record Industry and will often get records to download that no other site can get hold of. Some download sites don't seem to be able get some tracks that iTunes have at all, even ones that are available to other sites. Release dates are often different too, between sites. It seems that iTunes can get the cream of the crop sometimes. However some of the other download sites have reacted badly to this iTunes bias. Most notably when Beyoncé did her album there. Many download sites, with the exception of Amazon, are still refusing to stock the download album.

The Beatles Taxman comes to mind here :nono:

Oh Dear! Well take plenty of painkillers and get well real soon fchd. You have done a great job so far by the way.

Any of them could return to the top if an artist were to die. Perhaps with the exception of the likes of Mr Blooby. There could even be a Facebook campaign to stop the X-Factor number one with any of them, except of course an X-Factor number one.

The BBC fund the Official Chart, so it's a lot to do with them. The BBC has very strict guidelines on what is considered advertising. iTunes being a commercial organisation would break these rules. Radio One would look like a commercial radio station and that isn't allowed under the BBC charter. As it would be just a free plug for iTunes. That would have applied in the past so had the chart looked like the HMV chart, the BBC would have pulled the plug on the chart show. There are more rules than I have hot dinners with the chart and how it is presented on TV and Radio. Take the Chart Show Presenters, they are not allowed to do a lot of work which would compromise their status as being the chart show presenter. Other examples taken from an official BBC Guide: Here on some guidelines that the BBC use: The BBC should not partner with religious bodies, political organisations, pressure groups or lobby groups. ■ The BBC must not work with companies involved or associated with tobacco, pornography, guns, escort or marriage agencies, gambling, promotion of the occult, family planning, pharmaceuticals. ■ The BBC must not partner with fast-food or unhealthy food companies or products when children’s programmes or brands are involved. A commercial company even using the BBC logo must adhere to certain standards on how the logo is used. The BBC have always had a problem with the charts and playing records. They are in-fact plugs to make you purchase a record. This is why there is so much live music on BBC TV and radio. The BBC keeps a fine balance on the need to promote music for selling purposes and the need to play music that is just popular with the public. You might recall that a few years ago the OCC got into some trouble with the BBC over the use of Cola firm being used to sponsor them.

I think that the industry doesn't want to use streaming for albums as it would kill the sales even more than they are now dying. Besides it's the BBC that are pressing for the streaming change. I keep saying this because they don't like broadcasting the iTunes top 40, which is what the UK top 40 singles chart has become. It's too commercial for them. I bet they were not happy when AC/DC getting so high at Christmas and matched were it was in the iTunes site, despite the fact the sales chart is supposed to be a combination of ALL selling places. It's not just a one off either. Even in the current chart Beyoncé's tracks are doing much better, despite the fact that you can only get them on iTunes and Amazon. If iTunes had less than half the market in downloads and the rest was split up between a dozen sites, then the people at BBC Radio would not be pressing for the introduction of streaming. But the Music Industry has let iTunes rule the roost. It was obvious to me that sooner or later someone would put an end to the iTunes gravy train, just didn't think it would be the Beeb!

You have to be thick to vote!

Isn't the official chart just a copy of the iTunes sales for the week? You can even predict the top 3 each Sunday just by looking generally at an iTunes chart for Monday, Wednesday and Friday. That just takes the fun out of it. Plus who really cares about the charts, when the chart is filled with records that won't go away just because somebody at iTunes keeps lowering the price of certain records to 59p for a few weeks then shoving the price back up to 99p, killing the song, till they repeat the price drop a month later and the song comes back into the chart! I think that's why the BBC want streaming in the chart, to stop it looking like iTunes!

So when will the OCC count pub jukebox plays? :heehee:

Radio airplay wouldn't make slightest difference to me buying a record since the only time I listen to the radio is if I get in someone's car or a Taxi and they have a pop station on. That doesn't happen much either. I fell out big time with radio when they did away with local sales charts, plus when they separated stations into two - creating a top 40 station and classic one, which got shunted to AM radio.

The BBC are a public broadcaster, therefore has to meet the requirements needed to do that. It can't just broadcast what's in the charts, because the charts are the commercial arm of the Music Industry. They are also not very representative of the taste of what is popular in music. Even commercial radio has problems broadcasting what's in the charts at times. Going back in the past Punk caused both the BBC and ILR big problems. Simply because most of it's listeners didn't want to listen to noisy rubbish. From day one of Radio One, Tony Blackburn chose not to open with the number one, because the number one would appeal to mums not kids. Even today I bet a great deal of Radio One DJ's would not choose to play a lot of the records in the top 40 - given a choice! I bet all of them were not keen on playing Sam Bailey! "Surely at least commercial stations want to attract as wide of a range of demographics as possible?" Not necessarily so! They might want to attract only certain persons to listen, this can be worked out from adverts between the shows who is listening. For example hair and beauty products would mean young females are being targeted.

How is it not feasible? They get 1,000 people from all over the country to listen to records. The same way they get a few people to do it now. Plus I have just seen on BBC Look North that the BBC are wanting people to be on the audience panel, which is unpaid, though expenses are covered. It sounds almost like the same thing. It's not to difficult, all they would need is the person to have internet access and complete a short survey for each record.

The solution is to find out what the youngsters want. For example to have the playlist decided by say 1000 people of the target range would be a start. Not by someone aged over 50 who thinks they know what young people like. The same could be applied to the station as a whole. Does Radio One have its own forum? That might encourage debate, they could even prevent anyone over 30 joining the forum too. Is the choice of DJs correct? If all THEY want to play is dance then, unless they are restricted in what they have to play, they are not going to give the time of day to other music. Overall I suspect that the policy at Radio One is not to do what the commercial stations are doing, but no clear policy of what it should be doing.

The Jessie J track was the inspiration for the use of OAOS by other record companies, I believe the Chipmunk record suffered from being delayed. The Roberts single was after them, people that know me know that I'm not a fan of James Masterton, but he also sited the Nicola Roberts track as being affected by being OAOS, he should know he works in radio! Mind you he did say that the Zedd record wasn't affected by the cover version in his last podcast. So he does get things wrong from time to time. On the chart peaks, the record companies like to think that holding back and gaining lots of airplay helps a record to enter higher, so letting it start slow would be wrong.