Mushymanrob

No, There are like another 100 Documentarys that are exactly the same.

 

Its a shame people these days are so easily manipulated by the media.

 

They control you. Especially people such as yourself :)

lol... blind faith...

you fail to understand that if this programme (and the others) were so full of lies then they would be in court facing a slander lawsuit. the fact that no one has been prosecuted for 'spreading lies' , or even sent to trial, is proof enough that they ARNT LIES...

He was Proven Innocent, If he wasnt Proven Innocent, the verdict would have been Guilty, and It wasng it was Innocent.

 

Well, have a trot over to the Ofcom website and look at the amount of complaints the program got, they got numourous things wrong such as dates of events. they said the allegatiosns started in 1992, untrue, started in 1993, they said he was at the white house getting an award in 1987, not true it was 1984.

 

When I have chance to watch it again, I will disect it for you if you wish, and correct the program :)

he wasnt found not guilty, thats not 'proven innocent' it means they couldnt convict him. in america money talks, they are reluctant to convict 'stars', like oj simpson who got off with murder.

if he isnt guilty of sexual misconduct then how did that kid know what jackos genetalia look like? explain the porno mags, and the undisputed use of 'adult' language to kids?..

again (no one seems to be able to level this...i wonder why? lol) do you think its acceptable for a middle aged man to sleep with little kids who are no relation? ESPECIALLY after previous allegations of sexual misconduct?

of course ofcom has complaints... from the starstruck, blind, fans who will not accept the facts.

IF the makers of this go to court and get convicted of broadcasting lies then ill listen, otherwise you must accept that the programme broadcasted THE TRUTH.

the incorrect dates are irrelevant, 92, 93.. so what?

take your head out of the sand and accept that he is guilty of innappropriate misconduct towards kids, if that was me doing that would you still believe in my innocence?

absolutely disgusting, full of LIES, RUMORS AND NO EVIDENCE

 

people must be stupid to believe any of that.

people must be stupid to IGNORE it!

Only because I know its nothing but lies.

sorry, but WHAT lies?... the programme dealt with factual evidence. if that programme was so wrong, broadcasting untruths, lies, then they would already being issued with a law suit.

please take your blinkers off... you might like his music, but it doesnt make him 'innocent'.

it is a fact that as an adult male he slept in the same bed as numerous pre-pubescent boys, do you think thats the actions of a normal, well balanced adult?...

he wasnt proven innocent, he just wasnt proven guilty.

Well, yes I do actually.. There'd be hundreds of thousands MORE council houses for a start mate... And building programmes were curtailed, there's no question of that... The whole "opting out" of council ownership in favour of private landlords and housing associations also had an impact.....

 

The fact that council renting market contracted while private renting market expanded can be no coincidence....

........ but even if she hadnt sold them, they wouldnt be empty waiting for igor! :lol:

and house building was curtailed until about 10-12 years ago, its been booming ever since.

So, what you gonna do then, deny treatment for a tax-paying immigrant while at the same time bend over backwards for a waster who's never contributed a single penny into the system??? Fukk off, that's totally wrong and you know it.... I'll say again, if anyone should be chucked out the country it's those fukkin' chav wasters who contribute nothing other than spitting out brats every nine months that we have to pay for..... I've a damn sight more tolerance for a hard working immigrant and their family than I do a bunch of fukkin' wasters and their feral offspring - BOTTOM LINE.....

 

Get rid of chavs, NOT the hard working migrants.....

but thats not the argument! the point is that the migrants HAVE caused stresses upon the services, not 'who deserves it'... (i agree with you on that by the way)

the whole programme was rubbish, based on lies rumors and no evidence. i cant even be bothered to go into the amount of rubbish in the programme as my good fellow michael jackson fan friend sir.jack.croft has explained quite clearly how all those boys and their parents wanted was money

m8... if it was 'lies' then the makers would be in court..

'no evidence'... then how did that little kid know what jackos genitalia looked like?

no one, even jacko, disputes that he shared a bed on many occassions with little boys... do you think thats acceptable?..

if i (jackos generation) did that, id be hung drawn and quartered! id be in prison (after a beating) faster then you could go *ow (a jacko noise)*.... what makes him immune?

exactly, Jark.

 

I'm sure in the 2nd case, the mother was undoubtedly a money-grabbing fraudster.... and she LOST that case. Jackson didn't WIN it. Her shocking few days in the witness box ensured the family could never win that case.

 

There are numerous other boys who have come forward (and been paid off, too). Were all these simply after Jackson's money?

 

Re. Jackson's 'billions' - With Jackson's string of unpaid debts - don't you think it a bit odd that a supposed 'billionaire' would let these bills slip? He has a huge family and a network of staff - surely he'd be able to pay these people he owes cash to, even if he himself 'forgot' the debts?

 

For the record, I think, from 1979 to 1984, Jackson was the world's greatest entertainer. Possibly greatest ever. I saw him live on the Bad tour - and he was shocking. AWFUL. The 'magic' had evaporated even back then. But in his day, he was a magnificent, unparallelled entertainer.

'Blind' fans make me smile, actually. They try to detract from the severity of the actual facts by throwing accusations of Jackson being 'hated' and 'victimised'. For these fans to stand up for him and simply say he's being accused of these crimes because he's a victim of a slur campaign by disgruntled ex-employees and avid journalists is nothing short of disgusting. He is being accused of these crimes because there are kids who have been damaged for life who are making sworn testimonies against him - some have recieved cash - many haven't.

 

The Jordy Chandler case will never go away. The evidence, as shown on the Smoking Gun website, is too severe, too detailed and too incriminating to ever go away. The fact that, to avoid a court case that would almost certainly have proved Jacksons' guilt, the accused paid the victim $21million..... you can run from justice, you can pay off your accusers.

 

But the cold hard facts of those statements, from many, many sources, from friends, acquaintances, employees, even family... they will never go away.

 

Like OJ and Tyson before him, Michael Jackson has proven that money, in America, can buy you anything - even freedom after committing terrible, gut-wrenching crimes against children.

lol.. i was looking to put my tuppence worth in, but this post by russ says it all.

You're just not listening to the facts are you mate...? The NHS is fukked because of incompetent management and the NHS "Trusts" completely and utterly mismanaging funds, money is disappearing down huge bureaucratic loopholes which have NOTHING to do with immigration.. Housing is fukked because the b/astard tories sold off a huge proportion of council housing stock and refused to allow councils to build new ones (Social Housing???? sounds a bit too much like "Social-ism" dunnit???? <_< ), again NOTHING to do with immigration... The schools are fukked because of obsessions with league tables, the false illusion of "parental choice" and the fact that not all state schools are being equally funded, again NOTHING to do with immigration....

 

In all cases here public services have suffered because of Govt dogma (whether Tory or Nu Labor....Oh, mind you, it's practically the same bloody thing innit....?), uncontrolled bureucracy and managerial incompetence... NOTHING TO DO WITH IMMIGRATION.....

 

Explain to me how the likes of France and Germany dont seem to be suffering anything like the problems we do with public services, and both countries have huge ethnic and immigrant populations also, a fact the right wing press and the BNP seem to forget about.... What also is being forgotten is the fact that the main reason why these extra billions are available to the NHS in the first place is more than likely because of tax revenue from migrant labour....

its YOU that isnt listening to the facts..

whilst i dont doubt that mis-management has caused trouble in the nhs, it is NOT the sole reason why certain districts are struggling to cope. immigration IS causing a strain on the resources the nhs has. if say cambridge has been allocated so much money to deal with an estimated number of illnesses and guess what, theres MORE people to treat then what was budgited for... of COURSE immigration has had an impact! this can be clearly seen as its the health services in areas where the immigrant population has boomed in recent years is at 'breaking point' whereas areas where theres not been a significant immigration explosion the hospitals are copeing well!

blame thatcher for the housing crisis?... c'mon man, that was over 20 years ago and has little if any impact upon todays housing problems. do you think things would be any different if they hadnt have been sold off?... (dont forget i was against it). theres been massive building programmes now in both the public and private sector for c12 years.

it aint rocket science... if theres a sudden and greater influx of immigrants then expected of COURSE theres going to be problems with housing/health/schools. or do you believe that by some strange co-incidence the immigrants only settled where the services were going to fail? :lol:

we cant continue having an open door policy, our island simply cannot cope... unlike france .. which is 4? 5? times bigger then the uk and has a smaller population! (i would definately support some birth control policy too, especially amongst skanky chav bints)

If ANY cchild had a relationship with a total stranger as intense and unusual as Michael Jackson did with Jordy Chandler, OF COURSE you would think it odd. It has NOTHING to do with one of them being famous but EVERYTHING to do with the fact that adults simply CANNOT have such close 'relations' with a minor.

yes you are. Totally and utterly.

No it wasn't - the case fell apart in the second instance - he was never declared innocent or guilty.

 

And in the first instance, of course, he paid off his accuser. TWENTY ONE MILLION DOLLARS.

I'm all for individuality and everyone following different paths. However, don't you think sleeping in the same bed as a young non-relative person of the same sex is stretching it slightly? Taking naked baths with them (as Jackson admitted they did)? Keeping semi-pornographic photographs of the children he befriended? Letting cancer-ridden children get drunk in his company?

 

Let me clarify this with you - are you saying that over 125 witnesses, most of whom gave SWORN STATEMENTS are lying - but Michael Jackson is telling the truth?

 

Really?

spot on russ! :)

Oh for f***s Sake!!!!!

 

Dont beleive the garbage, Everything in that program was UNTRUE!

 

Youd be stupid to beleive such an amatrue Program, that talked to the most distant contacts who are out for revenge!!

 

Really changed your opinion Josh? Really? BS!

 

Your a fool to beleive that!

 

Its just yet another Program, having yet another stab at an innocent man, People will not learn to leave him alone. This documentary can join the other 1000 Pertehtic attempts.

 

DONT BELIEVE THE RUBBISH!

oh god how i HATE blind fans....

the programme was FACTUAL, otherwise where are the lawsuits?

innocent?..like oj simpson?... fool... money talks

if you or me had slept with little boys we would be either in prison/hospital/coffin.... but because you like his music hes INNOCENT...

Immigration isn't the only cause of the increase in population and not necessarily the most worrying.

 

We are all living significantly longer, and so the proportion of elderly people in the population is growing, a significant issue for pensions / NHS etc. We don't have a particularly good ethos of our care for our elderly relatives as this is likely to be an increasing burden on the state.

 

This coupled with the increasing birth rate ...... decreasing rates of infant mortality and easy availabilty of benefits making breeding a national sport for the work shy.

 

but is easy to blame Johnny Foreigner - how very English!

id have thought that youve highlighted a very good reason to curb immigration ....

and yes we can blame johnny foreigner in this instance as the strain on services in some ares is directly because of the scale of sudden immigration.

detroit emeralds 'feel the need in me'

c'mon guys.... whats yours?

Sorry, but what is ‘mho’?

my humble opinion :)

More people in the UK also means more people to work in hospitals, surely?

it takes time to adjust to the number of people in the area. i think that the scale of migration has caught out the services from housing to hospitals, this is why they are under a strain.

Not necessarily 'invisible' actually.... Known associates of criminals dont necessarily have criminal records themselves, but they can still come onto the police radar... If the police were actually clever, they could cultivate some of these associates into confidential informants, they could offer financial incentives; but they wont gain trust or intelligence by just randomly stopping and searching people for no particular reason...

as i understand it thats basically whats proposed.

The only reason our society is so "advanced" is because of our exploitation of the third world... Mind you, it aint just us that's done that, places like France, Belgium, Spain, etc are guilty of it as well. One African guy that I know said to me "In my country we have diamonds, gold, copper, but it all ends up here in Europe, my people have nothing"... Spot on if you ask me, and being Scottish and having your bloody ENGLISH TORY B/ASTARD GOVERNMENT come up and nick all our North sea oil and gas wealth and spirit it away to give tax breaks to rich scum in the south east of England, an attitude I can definitely relate to.... The facts are obvious to me, we take from the third world to enjoy our cushy existences, and now we b**ch about people who might want to actually see a little bit of it back.... Our Govts and Corporations take FAR more from these people (and not just in monetary terms, basic dignity is also something we have robbed them of...) than they take from us, simple as... Places like Sierra Leone, The Ivory Coast, Nigeria etc would be as rich as the OPEC nations if their Govts got organised... But of course, that wont happen because of the corruption that's cultivated and funded by western corporations like Shell, De Beers, Exxon, etc. It aint in their interests to have organised labour movements, or indeed strong, democratic governments and institutions (too many rules, regs getting in the way of p***ing on the poor <_< )... People like you living in the 'burbs just have no clue of what's really going on out there mate, well i actually talk to these people, and I see the truth....

 

And frankly, I would argue that thanks to the decades of Thatcherism and Blairism, we are a soulless b/astard country like America, seeing as how we're continually up America's arse....

since when did scotland own the north sea? besides a good proportion of the oil/gas is in english waters.... and it was discovered by englishmen :P

but i generally concur.

Yeah, I'm just SOOOOO living in the past innit...? Whereas you're the one in favour of reintroducing antiquated, discredited "sus laws" from the 70s and 80s which did NOTHING positive to actually prevent crime, only in p***ing off a lot of people....

 

I'm in favour of intelligence led operations using surveillance, modern tech to target KNOWN INDIVIDUALS and their associates... I dont believe for a second that the police dont actually have a pretty good idea of who the gangsters and dealers are in any given area.... Target those people, target the people supplying the guns... A lot of the guns on the streets are actually replica firearms which have been modified to fire live ammo, and most of these weapons are being bought ONLINE.... Howabout the police actually start monitoring who is buying and who is selling these weapons through credit card purchases and then setting up surveillance on those individuals, howabout the Govt gets off its fukkin' arse and actually BANS the sale or purchase altogether of replica firearms... ?

 

Cut off the head of this problem and the body WILL DIE....... No need to inconvienience the general public. Target the CRIMS, not the majority of law abiding people....

problem is that until the kid gets convicted then hes invisible to the police. young people are committing these crimes so do you think they should be left to get on with it until they are caught? i see nothing wrong with stopping and searching genuine suspects. the point is that unlike the 70's 80's the police have a REASON to search certain people.

The Stephen Lawrence case certainly was not in the 70s or 80s was it....? More accountability...?? Puh-leeeeeeze.... The scumbag coppers responsible for that one were NEVER held accountable, NEVER stood trial for perverting the course of justice or suspected corruption, NEVER lost their jobs due to gross incompetence and/or being on the fukkin' take (as I suspect they damn well were.....). No, these b/astards are still out there, with their jobs intact, still allowed to police our streets.....

 

And now we have this nonsense "inquiry" into the De Menezes killing, with coppers being able to retain anonymity, covering each others arses (they've certainly had long enough to get their stories straight haven't they...?), giving evidence that directly contradicts what the civilian eye-witnesses to the shooting said in the immediate aftermath... No prizes for guessing how this one will turn out..... <_<

 

Accountability my arse.....

that was in the early 90's... 92? man things have changed since then. the point is that black on black violence is on the rise and it needs to be stopped.

ive always considered 'never gonna cry again' their best track, but thats mho...

But has it really though? All this c**p about millions of immigrants draining everything out of our economy but Britain's population has been around 60m for as long as I can remember. So if they're all drained now surely they're no more drained that 15 years ago? After all, there's the same number of people here. It's not as if we actually have any more people to police, treat in hospitals, house, educate... If anything it just proves how c**p all of the services the Gov't provide are.

it was well documented on the news this week... not only cambridge but all over. the problem is that population increase has been greater then funds to upgrade the services, they were here taking out of the economy before they were putting anything in.