Tomoe

Just to correct you, the "douze point" went to Lucy, the Bulgarian member of the group and jury of Bulgarian "Pop Idol". Since it's the TV show with highest rating in the country now, the kids who watch it were systematically manipulated by the hosts to vote for Lucy in Eurovision. Most Bulgarians are not familiar with NO ANGELS' songs, and don't even know the names of the other members.

No, not for that reason. Simply there are more powerful Eastern countries in ESC now (I don't mean powerful in terms of politics) who influence their neighbours easily. As far as I know, Estonia has never qualified since the semi-finals were introduced. Lithuania is doing poor too. Eastern Europe would still prefer Dima over those two guys that won it back in 2001, if they competed now.

AGAIN, there were not so many Eastern countries in 2001. Nobody in East would vote for Estonia and those two now (although the song was pretty nice).

That they send "schlagger", which is obviously a term for "old pop music". Norway made it into top 5 simply because Maria had a R&B ballad, and R&B is kind of modern now. However, if Europe (or at least its Eastern part which decides the winner) likes American-type of modern songs like Dima's one, then Nordic schlaggers are doomed. No matter how good some of them are (like Iceland this year).

Yes, but Western in terms of "modern American". It's not Western like British, Swedish or anything of the sort. Especially the Nordic countries nowadays send something that may be good, but is neither "American", nor "modern".

Still, there will be at least 2-3 more Eastern countries to send similar "star entries", and the votes will go for them, not for UK. Give up, guys, I like your songs, I liked Andy, the entire Bulgarian jury liked it, but you're not gonna make it anymore with this voting system. :(

I think you're missing something very important here. The same year you're talking about there was no Armenia, Georgia, Ukraine, Bulgaria, Belarus, Montenegro, Serbia, Moldova, Albania, Azerbaijan and Czech Republic in the contest. Now, did you count already? That makes 11 (eleven) Eastern countries NOT taking part and NOT voting! ESC was hardly as Eastern-oriented as it is now. It's 2008 and you have all those 11 Eastern countries in now, so a good place for UK again is only possible with a jury intervention.

France will NEVER do that. :wacko:

As I said already, I think this is the first step towards finding the new "Big 4" among Russia and Ukraine, and making them sponsors of the contest, which is eventually going to be an Eastern one.

Don't cry, UK. :) Bulgaria just revealed the points of its back-up jury, and they look like that: 12 - Sweden 10 - Ukraine 8 - United Kingdom That's what I mean when saying that juries should vote. ;)

Your country's great song finishing last is a proof of the joke voting system.

Croatia, Moldova and Portugal. :)

Here's the last Terry Wogan interview before he left Belgrade: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/7419477.stm

Yeah, the show is Bulgarian version of "Pop Idol"/"American Idol". Besides, she's popular here. And she's Bulgarian, although she said right in front of camera that she WON'T vote for Bulgarian song. >_<

Exactly, now that Germany sent its top-selling stars and got one of the last places, all your arguments about Big 4 not sending quality stuff disappear *puff~~*. Please, UK, send Spice Girls or Robbie next year, and I can assure you that you'll get the same result. :D

No, results will be no Western countries at all anymore. Only 6 countries will win from now on, under these rules: Russia, Serbia, Greece, Turkey, Ukraine and Armenia. The only one that hasn't got its victory yet is Armenia and it will happen next year, mark my words! Then the cycle will be renewed: again Turkey, Ukraine, Greece, and so on.

Yeah, and the same info came out for Netherlands.

Greece didn't have worse draw! And don't tell me Norway came 5th just because they performed last. Honestly, that theory about voting for similar musical taste is blah-blah. I don't blame you, because you don't live here in the Eastern part of Europe and thus you can't get any idea of how it works. ex-Yugo countries were once one big country - Yugoslavia - and ex-USSR countries all were linked to USSR (Bulgaria and Romania as well, though distantly). People who vote now are mostly elderly persons who still remember that Croatia and Serbia were one country in the past, that Russia and Belarus was one, and these people consider the neighbouring countries their "brothers". It's not only about similar musical taste and culture; there are strong political grounds.

I heard UK had the worst ratings in years.

You get what I mean, don't you? Germany's neighbours are not the same ethnic/cultural group. When I say "neighbours", I don't mean actual ones. Rather "friends".

That's exactly what I mean. Russia didn't even win its semi-final, let alone the rivalry with the songs from other semi-final. There's nothing right in being 3rd (among 19 only!) one day, and 1st (among 25) two days later.

That's another joke. Portugal's song this year was similar to "Molitva", yet it didn't gain anything.

If finalists only voted, the result would have been the same. The problem is not the number of countries voting in the final, but number of Russia/Greece/ Ukraine/ Turkey/Armenia/ Serbia supporters, who will be the same even if you make only 10 countries vote. That's because those country have most neighbours/diasporra. Only solution is adding jury to the televotes, and setting a ratio of 50/50 or 70/30 to the results.

You see, the ridiculous point here is, that we from Eastern/Balkan region, who benefit the most from such voting, understand and clearly admit that, while UK people still think it's all fair and voting is ok. :lol:

I don't agree, and didn't even bother to read all of it. It's not about the winner solely - he will indeed be different every year, but within the same choice range. If you say that having THE SAME countries in Top 10 every year is ok, I guess the discussion is meaningless. If you think it's ok for Portugal to end 2nd in semifinal, then 13th in final, and Russia vice versa, then you're "Believing" it too much. I find no fun in a contest which is so predictable. I could say the points of all 43 countries last night before they even announced them. And I got them right. And please don't tell me I don't understand how ESC works, because I understand it pretty well. As you see, I come from an Eastern, Balkan country, and I can assure you everyone here thinks ESC voting is a political joke, everyone thought so even when we got our 5th place last year. I understand most of you dislike your singer Andy (and preivous entries as well), but that should not make you have such illusions about the contest.