Severin

It got bigger. Feels like half the city has turned up. There's a least 2000 now

There's currently a stand off between the far right and at least 200 residents near the station in Brighton. The police are keeping everyone separated. No significant trouble as yet For context there are no more than 10 of them on the other side

It may well be that a 1 year contract is all he'll get offered by anyone though. I think if he takes a year off again he's unlikely to return given his age so he may have little choice but to accept it. I don't see him being willing to drop further down the grid again either.

There's a lot of reasons for Max to go to AM though - Adrian Newey (seems all but confirmed at this point) Honda Dan Fallows Good infrastructure in place Red Bull on the other hand - Certainly look to be about to hit a decline The relationship with Christian Horner is problematic recently New engine is a big question mark The only other obvious option is Mercedes and that doesn't look like it interests him all that much. Toto has been making passes at him all year with no apparent reciprocation and the team or Toto seemed unwilling to risk breaking Antonelli in at the sharp end. Alonso would give them a year or two respite with that IF they can get passed the history. But I could see Alonso at Red Bull. Decline or not they should remain competitive and top 4. As for Perez and Ricciardo, there's still a lot of talk about Checo being out by the end of the year but they're waiting until after the Mexico GP for obvious reasons. Danny is being talked up as the replacement rather than Liam, if nothing else but because the car is so finely balanced and Ricciardo's driving style is a match to Max's so he should be able to show his talents in it. Horner's a big fan too, it's Marko and Mexican money that is preventing it.

I'm still quite sceptical on the second part of this but I'm hearing a lot of talk about Adrian Newey having agreed terms with Aston Martin, set to be announced ater the summer break. Obviously, this isn't surprising at all as it was the most likely move from the beginning, besides retirement. However, now there's increasingly loud rumours of Vertsappen joining him there. How that might play out would very interesting. Max will understandably want #1 status and yet would not be concerned about Lance but Fernando could be a dealbreaker as he'll rightly see it as his last chance for a title. That pairing would of course be incredible but it could be dynamite. I would love to see it play out. Two of the very best ever, one potentially at the height of his powers and king of the world versus the wily old master, with plenty of guile, a stackful of tricks up his sleeve and a serious point to prove. And if Alonso is the casualty, despite their shared history, Mercedes arguably becomes his and their best option in terms of driver ability. Where would that leave Red Bull though? I'm guessing Ricciardo would be the natural fit alongside Perez (mainly for financial reasons) or preferably Lawson, with Tsunoda and one other at RB. Alonso of course could wind up alongside either Perez, Ricciardo or Lawson at Red Bull

The Clash were always gonna be high on my list. It's not for nothing that they were nicknamed 'The Only Band That Matters' . They were the most intelligent and accomplished of all the first wave of UK Punk bands, London Calling is one of the greatest albums of the 70s and White Man (In Hammersmith Palais) is arguably the UK's best ever Punk single, even if God Save the Queen is the most iconic. A perfect band if Sandinista! was trimmed to a single LP and as long as we forget the last album. I have to admit I quite enjoyed seeing you querying their presence in a few posts earlier in the thread.

Yeah, about 50 of them from all over the country. Many are just advice centres and lawyers' offices.

As do we all, but if nobody stands against them they'll only be more emboldened. At some point they need to be faced down. The sooner they see they're not welcome the sooner they'll go back in the shadows. It won't make them go away completely but it will allow the public to get back to some kind of normality and for the police to concentrate on identifying the ringleaders.

I've been sent a list of a number of towns and cities on the list for Weds night at 8pm, including Brighton. The counter protest is already mobilising.

The EDL have targeted Brighton several times before. The first time they were roundly ignored so they came back and started causing trouble in Kemptown and attacking gay people. 3rd time they came they were faced with a large contingent of locals facing off against them. They returned with ttwice the number a few months afterwards and were basically run out of town with the police having to protect them. Oh yeah, then they cancelled the next one they announced in 2015 Brighton really doesn't like fascists. Even the ones that live here know to keep their mouths shut and their heads down. Would have been funny to see them try it on the weekend just gone, with Pride in town.

3 good ones there. Had the pleasure of seeing Garbage live a couple of weeks ago. They've lost none of their fire and Shirley is still a absolute force of nature. Duran Duran I like up to a point. After Notorious they go downhill pretty quick but the Wedding Album in the early 90s was a brief return to glory. Human League are another that had some interesting early albums before going very Pop with Dare (which is a classic of its time) but then got steadily less interesting as the years went on. They too had a brief rennaisance in the mid 90s.

faith no more - midlife crisis GD - TEWL

Touchy was a step too far for me and I didn't listen to anything by them for years after that, until a friend told me Summer Moved On was pretty decent. I will always adore I've Been losing You though. That's a high quality Pop song.

Boy - The Unforgettable fire - The Joshua Tree - Achtung Baby Love the early Post Punk sound of Boy and it where I began with them but Joshua Tree is their most accomplished work

Be angry. Be outraged. The alternative is to be scared and that's what they want but screw them. This is your country as much as it is their's and they don't get to decide how it's run. They're a backward thinking minority. Be careful, be vigilant and stay safe, but don't let them win by hiding away. The British people have been facing down this type of scum since Cable Street in 1936 and will continue to do so. Maybe direct action isn't for you. Absolutely fair enough, but rest assured the huge majority stand with you.

I don't think the comparison with 2011 is all that accurate. 2011 started out as an angry lashing out at the killing of an individual. Rightly or wrongly, much of that anger was genuine outrage, even if opportunists quickly used it as an chance to loot and vandalise. What we're seeing now isn't the same, it's extreme right wing groups using the murder of three children as cover for a targeted series of attacks on non white groups - particularly muslims. Personally, the 2011 riots were definitely larger, more widespread and more extreme. This has bigger parallels with the campaigns seen by the National Front, Combat 18 and others back in the 80s and 90s, except this time the use of social media is enabling it to be better organised and more prolonged. Obviously these... people are a stain on this country and we can only hope they are shamed enough to go back in to hiding soon (preferably in jail, but we'll never erase racism). And it goes without saying that I hope everyone stays safe out there.

I've had a cursory look over the list and there are at least 40 songs I'd like to give points to, and almost everyone is from a very specific time frame. I don't imagine I'll be alone in this either. I suspect, this rate could end up with a large number of songs on zero or minimal points

As you wish - Heart of Stone Play With Fire As Tears Go By Tell Me Under My Thumb Mother's Little Helper She's A Rainbow 2000 Light Years From Home Gimme Shelter Midnight Rambler Let it Bleed You Can't Always Get What You Want Wild Horses Sister Morphine Rocks Off Doo Doo Doo Doo Doo (Heartbreaker) Hang Fire To be honest that's a pretty brilliant compilation alone! I've probably forgotten something obvious

Only 25! Jeez that's gonna be hard

The problem with classifying the EDL as a terrorist organisation is that it no longer formally exists. There's no leader, no official members, no network of groups under the banner. They all splintered years ago and operate as individual groups under varying identities and unless they formalise it, which would be counterproductive right now, they will be very hard to target.

Jon Savage hit the nail on the head when he described the UK music scene, or at least the public's taste as having a pendulum like pattern where it swings back and forth between UK acts and US acts. Think back to say the 50s, Rock n Roll is king before the British invasion, then Motown and Psych Rock being US led, then Glam Rock (UK), before big American MOR stuff like the Eagles dominates, then UK Punk happens, then Disco (US led), then New Romantic (UK), then the likes of big US acts like Jackson, Prince, Madonna and Springsteen, replaced by Acid House and Madchester (UK), Grunge, then Britpop, the Britneys, Christinas, post punk revival and so forth, the UK came back with Garage and 'landfill indie' and so on. It's probably quite extreme now but it'll come back soon enough

Actually, if you look back at your posts your weren't specific at all. You made a vague, slightly sweeping connection between football and this outbreak of violence, which is probably why you got the reaction from some that you did. You added the lone word hooliganism as an explanation but gave no greater context to your argument Anyone on here, I'm sure understood you're meaning but I'd perhaps suggest it could have been worded better as it was likely to provoke a response otherwise. I personally don't see the need to draw that connection given we're talking such a small subset of people that like football. It's distracting from the real issue and is at best a vague connection which is based too much in speculation and preconceived ideas rather than fact.

When I think The Beautiful South the first songs that come to mind would be A Little Time, Song For Whoever and Don't Marry Her. Rotterdam would be way down the list. Is it beloved of a particlular radio station or something?

At a rough calculation, just under 900,000 people go to watch a football match across all of the leagues in England every weekend, and you rarely hear of any significant violence at matches these days. Approximately 31% of the population also consider themselves football fans. Given such high numbers and such a large proportion of the population involved, to make the correlation between 'football fans' and the violence we've seen recently, feels like quite the stretch, and falling prey to a lazy, outdated stereotype, when we really should be calling these individuals out for what they are - racists and fascist thugs, who are very often directed by supposedly respectable individuals such as Mosley or Farage. Otherwise we're just perpetuating the demonisation of a largely innocent group and allowing the real scum to continue orchestrating the narrative.

I fully second this. I very much expect this will all calm down soon, the families can grieve in peace and the fascist scum will go back to hiding under a rock until next time. The perpetrator will be news for his 15 minutes before the wider public forgets his name like they have Lee Rigby's killer. This isn't any great escalation or start of a race war, this is just British society playing out its worst aspects in the same way it has done for decades. Sadly both the ANL and AFA are both now defunct, and they were very effective organisations back in the 70/80s and 90s but if people want to do something positive about things Hope Not Hate is worth looking at.