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the death of Jean Charles de Menezes 9 members have voted

  1. 1. how would you describe the death

    • Murder?
      3
    • Manslaughter?
      3
    • a Health and Safety problem?
      3

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The first anniversary of the death of Brazilian Jean Charles de Menezes is to be marked at the Tube station where he was shot by police.

 

A family vigil at Stockwell, in south London, will incorporate a minute's silence and the laying of flowers.

 

Mr Menezes was shot the day after a series of attempted bombings in London.

 

Prosecutors said on Monday that no officers would be charged over the shooting, which happened when police mistook him for a suicide bomber.

 

However, the Metropolitan Police are to be prosecuted under health and safety laws in connection with the death of the 27-year-old electrician, who was shot seven times in the head.

 

His family attacked that decision as "unbelievable" and "ridiculous".

 

The family vigil, which begins at 0930 BST, was due to be followed by a public meeting of relatives and supporters, but that has now been cancelled because of the Middle East conflict.

 

A family statement said: "We believe that the most fitting tribute to Jean's life is for you, your friends and family to take action for peace. We must prevent further conflict and bloodshed."

 

It added: "[Jean] had a strong belief in God, in humanity and in peace. He was a man who loved the very essence of life."

 

'No impunity'

 

Among those expected to show their support for the Menezes family is Mohammed Abdul Kahar, who was shot in the chest during an anti-terrorism raid by police at his house in Forest Gate, London, in June.

 

He was later released without charge.

 

He said he was very upset no police officer was to be prosecuted over the death of Mr Menezes.

 

"Every day I see my mum and my family going through pain. They're having counselling every day, and myself as well," Mr Kahar said.

 

"And I can't imagine how his mum's feeling."

 

Ahead of Saturday's vigil, Justice4Jean campaign organiser Asad Rehman said there should be no "impunity" for police officers.

 

"We do believe that individual officers do have to account for their actions," he said.

 

"It's very, very important that there is an opportunity for the evidence to be tested, for a jury to hear it, and to be able to give a verdict."

 

'Insufficient evidence'

 

Two reports by the Independent Police Complaints Commission into the Stockwell shooting have yet to be published.

 

The Crown Prosecution Service said there was "insufficient evidence" to prosecute any individual over the death of the electrician.

 

On 22 July 2005, a surveillance team had been monitoring a block of flats in Tulse Hill, south London, where Mr Menezes lived, in the belief that a man wanted in connection with the previous day's attempted suicide bombings in London resided there.

 

When Mr Menezes emerged from the flats, he was wrongly identified as the suspect and followed to Stockwell, where he was shot as he boarded a Tube train.

 

from the bbc :up:

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The police had no choice but to eliminate him, his death was a tragedy but the real killers of Menenez are the scumbags that tried to blow up tube trains the day before including one at the very same station, had they not done what they did Menenez would still be alive

 

It was a complete **** up by the intelligence services but once he had been positively identified as a suicide bomber there was really no choice but to take him down

 

His death was a tragedy but London was already very edgy and very on its toes from the events of the previous day and so were the police, the police should have taken action before he got on the tube though

The police had no choice but to eliminate him, his death was a tragedy but the real killers of Menenez are the scumbags that tried to blow up tube trains the day before including one at the very same station, had they not done what they did Menenez would still be alive

 

It was a complete **** up by the intelligence services but once he had been positively identified as a suicide bomber there was really no choice but to take him down

 

His death was a tragedy but London was already very edgy and very on its toes from the events of the previous day and so were the police, the police should have taken action before he got on the tube though

 

Bollocks. At least one surveillance officer on the ground categorically said that they did not think De Menezes was their suspect, and the officers did not receive the specific code word from superior officers to open fire and there is even evidence that the statement logs may have been tampered with. A clear cut case of Manslaughter and a cover up if ever there was one. And then the scandalous misinformation and lies that were told about him afterwords and continue to be propogated... The officers should be on trial, their superiors should be on trial and the security services should be on trial, simple as, even the Attorney General thinks so...

 

The internal Police investigation was a sham, a whitewash which, as usual, exonerates the Police (surprise surprise), the CPS, again, refuses to prosecute Police officers as they have done countless times, even in cases where Inquests have ruled a wrongful death in police custody (such as the schizophrenic chap who was strangled to death by police officers who claimed they were using "reasonable force" - again BOLLOCKS!!). It seems the Police can do no wrong in the eyes of the CPS and the families of the victims of police brutality and police c**k-ups are time and time again totally let down by the system. Shameful...

 

And now we have the ridiculous sight of the Met Police being prosecuted for breaches of Health and Safety... Is this some sort of JOKE!!!??? That's a bit like prosecuting Fred West for not paying the VAT on the cement or not obtaining planning permission from the council for crazy paving.....

 

In the words of Punk Rock band The Dead Kennedys - "You can get away with murder if you've got a badge"...... <_<

 

Some of the aspects about the way the police handled the communication about the event were very poor but the officers on the ground had no choice, they could have tried disabling him but I am sure they had in their minds what happened to Spanish police who were blown to kingdom come when they tried to disable a suicide bomber so a few bullets to the skull eliminated the possibility of him setting off explosives, ok Menezez was not a suicide bomber but if he had been and the police had tried to disable instead of kill then hundreds could of died so Route 1 was the only choice in this situation, its better to take 1 life in the grand scheme of things than make a wrong call and lose 100

 

Faced with a similar situation again where the police suspect someone entering the transport network is a suicide bomber I think they should do the same thing again in order to protect hundreds of lives of passengers

 

The death was a tragedy but we all have the luxury of being wise after the event and playing monday morning quarterback, the cops had a split second decision to make and the wrong call could cost hundreds of lives

 

While I sympathise with the family of Menezez I still think given the circumstances at the time the police did the right thing

Some of the aspects about the way the police handled the communication about the event were very poor but the officers on the ground had no choice, they could have tried disabling him but I am sure they had in their minds what happened to Spanish police who were blown to kingdom come when they tried to disable a suicide bomber so a few bullets to the skull eliminated the possibility of him setting off explosives, ok Menezez was not a suicide bomber but if he had been and the police had tried to disable instead of kill then hundreds could of died so Route 1 was the only choice in this situation, its better to take 1 life in the grand scheme of things than make a wrong call and lose 100

 

Faced with a similar situation again where the police suspect someone entering the transport network is a suicide bomber I think they should do the same thing again in order to protect hundreds of lives of passengers

 

The death was a tragedy but we all have the luxury of being wise after the event and playing monday morning quarterback, the cops had a split second decision to make and the wrong call could cost hundreds of lives

 

While I sympathise with the family of Menezez I still think given the circumstances at the time the police did the right thing

 

I will NEVER agree with that and I'm sick of hearing people excuse the Police. They're only jumped-up civil servants at the end of the day and they need to be reminded that they only Police our streets because we the people allow them to....

 

It aint as if this is a one-off incident (far from it in fact...), there's been over 1100 suspicious deaths of people at the hands of the police since the 1970s, and no copper has ever been held accountable for any of it. The vast majority of these 'suspicious' deaths occurring at the hands of the Metropolitan Police. There is something rotten to the core about how London is policed, too many cover ups and too much lip service paid by the CPS...

 

If some doctor fukked up while doing open heart surgery and it cost you the life of your loved one, dont make out like you wouldn't want the surgeon to be prosecuted for malpractice, no matter how many lives he'd saved over the years and if the hospital lied about it and tried to cover up for him, you'd want heads to roll....

  • 2 years later...

Open Verdict at inquest, right decision for me

 

His death while tragic was right in the circumstances and ultimately the blame for his death must lie with the REAL 21/7 suicide bombers not the police on the ground

 

Yes Ian Blair covered things up and lied but the cops on the ground had no choice as if Menezes had been a real suicide bomber hundreds would have died on that train

lol.. gonna be difficult to get to the bottom of this. yep the police were gung ho, they paniced, but what if he WAS another bomber?... pity that situation couldnt have been sorted in a safer way.
Open Verdict at inquest, right decision for me

 

His death while tragic was right in the circumstances and ultimately the blame for his death must lie with the REAL 21/7 suicide bombers not the police on the ground

 

Yes Ian Blair covered things up and lied but the cops on the ground had no choice as if Menezes had been a real suicide bomber hundreds would have died on that train

 

Open Verdict was all they COULD actually deliver... The Coroner pretty much stopped the very idea of a "wrongful death" verdict.... And "wrongful death" is exactly what it is to me..... No one is ever gonna convince me that the Coppers did the right thing that day... They lied, changed their stories, covered up the facts, the passengers on the train TESTIFIED that they heard no warnings given that these people even WERE the Police (several passengers actually phoned the police to report that a crime had taken place....), in fact, many assumed that it was gang-related violence... The passengers felt more threatened by the police , whom they considered were more "acting suspiciously" than by Menezes.....

 

If they were so bloody sure that this guy was THEIR guy, then why let him get on a bus....?

 

Sorry, this verdict is a joke and another shameful example of how the Police can just get away with murder..... "British Justice"???? Fukk off....

yep the police were gung ho, they paniced, ...

 

On the contrary, they DIDN'T "panic" at all, they had one surveillance officer (code-named Ivor) there before the armed boys turned up... It was nothing more than cold-blooded execution.... De Menezes was followed from his building, the coppers actually allowed him to get on a bus which took him to Stockwell station, er, why if they were so sure, dont they think that suicide bombers blow themselves up on buses then...? :rolleyes: So, if they "panicked", then surely they would have done their "panicking" on the bus, and not on the tube...

 

Contrast this botch job with the way West Midlands police eventually brought in the suspects... ie, ALIVE, and without turning a housing estate into a fukkin' shooting gallery.... <_<

Undoubtedly the verdict will be interpreted by some as "unlawful killing but you told us we couldn't say that". The biggest problem all along is that the officers at the time acted on the supposition that he was a suicide bomber. Therefore they interpreted his every move in that light and didn't consider for a moment that de Menezes' behaviour could also have been that of a perfectly innocent man. This applies in particular to when he got off the bus, changed his mind and got back on again.

 

After the incident, the police should have acted far quicker to stop the stories coming from supposed eye-witnesses which they will have known to be untrue.

 

For example, "the man jumped over the ticket barrier". No he didn't. That was one of the police officers. De Menezes used his Oyster card.

 

"He was wering a thick puffa-jacket style coat". No he wasn't. He was wearing a light denim jacket.

 

"He looked nervous". How would you feel with several guns pointing at you?

 

"There were wires coming from his clothes". No there weren't. This is just a typical example of a witness convincing themself that they had seen what they would have expected to see if he was a suicide bomber.

Undoubtedly the verdict will be interpreted by some as "unlawful killing but you told us we couldn't say that".

 

Which is my whole problem with this supposed "inquest".... One of the options was taken away from the Jury.... How the fukk can that be considered "justice" for Jean Charles or his family...? Answer - it is emphatically NOT.... It is a gross fukkin' INSULT to the family, Jean Charles' memory and an insult to the intelligence of us all..... It's patently LUDICROUS to call this justice, to call this a fair judicial proceeding... It is NOT, it is a whitewash, a clean bill of health to the police who can now shoot to kill with impunity anyone they consider a "terrorist".... We are living in times of DNA databases, biometric ID cards, and times when opposition MPs can be arrested, and have their offices and homes ransacked just for telling the country the truth about what the Govt is doing, and now it seems, our Police can shoot to kill any one of us with little consequence or censure or accountability.... Oh, and Sir Ian fukkin' B-Liar gets to waltz off with a nice golden handshake to the tune of half a million quid and a nice, huge Police Pension... Trebles and Chamapagne all round in the Met Bar.... <_<

 

Welcome to Police State Britain folks, hope you enjoy it, I am now very seriously considering quitting this fukked-up joke of a country and moving abroad.... I truly now HATE everything this country has come to stand for in the past 30 years.... Nu Labor and the Tories have between them destroyed everything that was ever "great" about Britain..... It wasn't immigrants that destroyed it, it was fukkin POLITICIANS, the MEDIA and the bloody POLICE..... <_<

Hmmm, interesting, now more people are saying it was murder..... :rolleyes:

 

To be generous to the Police, I would say maybe more "manslaughter", which I said in my original post on the subject.... The lies, mendacity and cover-ups that have subsequently occurred though is nothing short of an outrage..... I just do NOT get why people aint rioting on the streets about this as they are in Greece over the pigs there shooting a 15 year old kid in cold blood..... Even the Americans were less apathetic in the Rodney King verdict, and boy did THEY get p!ssed off.....

Passengers can make stuff up though thats even if they were passengers at all, anyone with an anti police agenda can concoct a story that De Menezes was murdered in cold blood by police or say they were on the train that day when they weren't, many so called witnesss only came out of the woodwork months after the event

This whole inquest and police witchunt shouldn't have taken place

 

Now next time there could well be a REAL suicide bomber on a train and the cops will hesitate or not shoot because of fears of a public and media vendetta and hundreds on the train will die

 

 

Passengers can make stuff up though thats even if they were passengers at all, anyone with an anti police agenda can concoct a story that De Menezes was murdered in cold blood by police or say they were on the train that day when they weren't, many so called witnesss only came out of the woodwork months after the event

 

What an absolute pile of CR@P!!!!! Oh, so anyone who says anything that contradicts the fukkin' POLICE side of things has an "agenda" yeah....? What fukkin' CR@P!!!!! You, as usual making apologies for the fukking FILTH who shot a man for no reason and then lied through their fukkin' teeth to cover it up..... <_< Sorry, I believe the passengers anyday because THEY were consistent from DAY ONE..... The Police talked a load of sh!t and changed the story CONSTANTLY.... And, sorry mate, but I myseld SAW people who were on the train being interviewed on TV on day one of this sh!t.... And they told EXACTLY the same story then as they did at the inquest......

 

Fukk you Craig....

This whole inquest and police witchunt shouldn't have taken place

 

Oh p*** off you idiot.... So now, in our "democracy" we shouldn't be able to call the Police to account for when they make fukk ups that cause innocent people to DIE.... I think that this is just a little more important than some fukkin' posh bint in an accidental car crash in Paris dont you....? <_<

 

You think that this is the only "suspicious death" that the Police have been responsible for....? You have GOT TO BE KIDDING!!!!!! Try actually doing some bloody research some time.... Then you'd find out that the British police have been responsible for the deaths of over 1100 unarmed civilians in this country.... Ranging from "falling down the stairs" to having their fukkin heads blown off for carrying a fukkin TABLE LEG in a carrier bag....

 

Prat..... <_<

Oh p*** off you idiot.... So now, in our "democracy" we shouldn't be able to call the Police to account for when they make fukk ups that cause innocent people to DIE.... I think that this is just a little more important than some fukkin' posh bint in an accidental car crash in Paris dont you....? <_<

 

De Menezes's death while tragic will ultimately save lives, the police regardless of any cover up by Blair after was swift and decisive and that is exactly how a suicide bomber should be dealt with, ultimately he was no one but next time a similar situation occurs I hope the police are as decisive

 

You can't compare Diana and De Menezes, I use tubes 3 or 4 times a week and you probably use them regularly too and I want to not be blown up

I use tubes 3 or 4 times a week and you probably use them regularly too and I want to not be blown up

 

Me neither, but I dont want the Pigs to fukk up, confuse ME for some mad bomber because they're a bunch of incompetent pricks who dont know sh!t from shine-ola and blow my fukking HEAD OFF while I'm listening to my bloody I-Pod, know what I mean....? <_<

 

Oh, what am I saying....???? I'm WHITE aren't I...??? Unlikely that I'm gonna get blown away or have a Pig do a "stop and search" on me innit....?

My gripe in the whole matter is with Clarissa Dick and Ian Blair, the cops on the ground that actually carried out the killing are heroic men to me who risked their lives because they thought they were dealing with a suicide bomber, the f*** up was by Clarissa Dick

 

The guys that carried out the killing could have been blown to kingdom come along with the entire passengers of the train, they dont have laptops on them with pics of DeMenezes and the wanted suicide bomber, they just went "route 1" and took him out when Dick identified De Menezes as a suicide bomber, you can't arrest a suicide bomber mate

 

Remember Madrid

Oh p*** off you idiot.... So now, in our "democracy" we shouldn't be able to call the Police to account for when they make fukk ups that cause innocent people to DIE.... I think that this is just a little more important than some fukkin' posh bint in an accidental car crash in Paris dont you....? <_<

 

You think that this is the only "suspicious death" that the Police have been responsible for....? You have GOT TO BE KIDDING!!!!!! Try actually doing some bloody research some time.... Then you'd find out that the British police have been responsible for the deaths of over 1100 unarmed civilians in this country.... Ranging from "falling down the stairs" to having their fukkin heads blown off for carrying a fukkin TABLE LEG in a carrier bag....

 

Prat..... <_<

 

If there was going to be any inquest it should have been private and behind closed doors, now would be suicide bombers know every little bit of police procedure some of which would be needed in the event of future suicide or would be suicide bombers so any would be suicide bomber pretty much has a police training manual now thanks to the media, any inquest should have been behind closed doors and no media present in the interests of national security

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