Happy New Year to each and everyone of you, i hope its full of everything good.

 

Happy new year Pete! Hope you and your loved ones have a fab 2016! Kath, Al & Lou XXXXX

 

And a happy new year to everyone else here on the TT forum! Even though I don't like Gary Barlow .... I still have fond feelings for you all! XXXXX

Edited January 1, 20169 yr by Kath

Did anyone watch the Heart gig? From my stand point rather disappointing. Appears a number of songs were cut and the same set list as always..... when or when will they go outside of their comfort zone and try out some of their lesser known songs, or at least put a different spin on the best known ones!!!

 

Here's to lots of comments and opinions in 2016 - hopefully there'll be many things to discuss :)

Three falls a whopping 39 places to number 76 this week

Wow, I didn't expect that. I thought the documentary would have had a positive impact ! I suppose this signifies the end of the lll era; what a strange one it's been. Badly marketed and promoted after a strong start with the release of These Days.

 

I wonder if TT have reached the point Gary referred to in the documentary - a band which generates little interest in its new material? I hope not. It certainly isn't something I would have envisaged after the massive sales of Progress. Some posters have mentioned the importance of the next album having a very strong opening single - that goes without saying, and it's probably imperative at this stage in the bands career.

 

This is the most challenging time for the band since their return in 2005. Unfortunately with the introduction of streaming into the equation there's no guarantee they will have a number one with their first single release off the new album. They need to reconnect with the music public and recapture that winning formula and trademark TT sound.

 

2016 is destined to be a very interesting one!!!

Yes, this is likely the most important stage of their career in a while, they are kind of in a make or break situation as in going forward. I know success is the singles chart will be limited for many factors, album sales is where they do very well and some good singles would help that as would promotion and a possible tv show in the style of an audience with which i still think would be very successful all round.

 

As a fan, i liked Three but i can also understand why it didnt do as well as expected as it was messy release,singles were a disaster and there wasn't a huge amount of promotion, but part of me feels that a lot of people who bought progress were left disappointed and didn't invest there hard earned money in this album either.

 

They just need strong material with their trademark sound for the next era as it would be a huge help. Gary was spot on with Since I Saw You Last which i honestly feel is a far better album than progress/progressed or three and it sold very well, had take that released that album it would have sold even more. The talent is there to come up with the goods and i hope they will pull it off. I do have to say i still love these days its among one of favourite singles from them and i have yet to tire of it.

as usual I have another opinion :-). People who have bought Progress were so disappointed abut the release of III because it was so mediocre that they did not buy it. If it had been good, the huge TT fan base who visited the concerts in anticipation would have bought it. They didn't because it was a very mediocre offering. A lot of people had been left disappointed by the tour either. It was a show, but not something heartfelt.

Read this article which gives an impression what is necessary if the Zenith is behind a star.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/arts-an...2015/?tid=sm_fb

 

Plus, TT are UK centred. They think they can handle their still existing fanbase in other countries by occasional visits, which had been punished this time either. They did not even sell 30,000 copies of III outside the UK.

They should have called it a day after Jason left and should have concentrated on musical/solo in Gary's case, and the projects Howard and Mark are up to in their cases.

They are great, but times have changed.

This will very likely valid for Robbie either as solo act - so don't get me wrong here. In his case, the difference is the appreciation outside the UK just like the last tour in more than 30 countries showed.

By the way Robbie said that he will NOT rejoin TT for any project including Vegas

 

 

 

 

Elizabeth, fans cannot be disappointed in an album they haven't heard, but they can be disappointed by an album they bought. I'm with Aphrodite on this one. The true damage lies with Progress. It was so far from what TT fans were expecting that it probably put them off from future purchases. The Flood was a misleading single, as Gary pointed out very well - the rest of the album didn't sound anything like it. As I said, it's the only TT album I don't own or even intend on purchasing, simply because it's not to my taste.

I liked III a lot - not as much as SISYL, which I still listen to very often - but a lot. The problem was the promotion and also the single releases. They should have promoted Get Ready for It more, cause it could have been a minor hit. All the comments on the song's video are very appreciative, even from people who don't know TT. Higher Than Higher could have as well never happened, since almost no one knew about its existence and release and Let In the Sun should have never been a single.

These Days was spot on, though, and it grew over me in time. I still enjoy seeing it being performed and I think it's up there with their classics.

 

The documentary seemed to have had an impact for a couple of days after it aired, but then the sales tumbled down again. Maybe not many people watched it?

 

I hope the boys get it right with the next album, because the talent is there and it would be sad not to see it put to work, especially when we have Gary writing such beautiful music for the musicals.

Elizabeth, I don't know anyone that likes Progress. The Flood was a great single and sold extremely well as it represented the TT sound, but it wasn't representative of the album as a whole, and many people have alluded to this. We acknowledge that the band isn't popular outside of the UK- no one has stated otherwise. The debate we're having is around their declining popularity in this country and not world wide.

 

I strongly believe that Rob's return was a huge mistake for the band in the UK. They popularity was forged on the image of the four of them and the trademark sound post 2005 was a big factor in their success. They managed to pick up a new fan base as I am testament too. lll was a solid album, but I and many have pointed out that it lacked killer singles and was still too far removed from their earlier work.

 

Following Gary's documentary with James Corden around three TT album shot back up the charts - yet within a week the tax issue reared its head and they received significant negative press. I don't know if this is still a factor but I wouldn't bet against it. It appears that the recent documentary wasn't watched by many, which suggests that interest in the band has waned.

 

It's imperative that they produce a fantastic album this year - in the mode of BW. Their promotion, marketing and single choices must be spot on. I'm beginning to revise my views on their continuation - they'll see out 2017 with the 25 year tour and the Greatest Hits album, but if they sell badly this year I do now believe they make see 2017 as the right point at which to bow out.

I love Progress (and to a lesser extent Progressed - which was just TOO weird, but kudos to them for attempting something completely different, most bands at their peak wouldn't risk it by changing their sound that dramatically), but I can see why a lot of people wouldn't, and yes The Flood was a highly misleading lead single - and by far the best song on the album.

I have a tendency to be over critical and I don't always acknowledge that many artists in their 40's and with nearly 25 years in the business see a decline in their sales. The problem is, I don't want to see them go the same way as artists who tour but have little interest shown in the new music they produce.

I think Gary still has a significant amount to give and remains a prolific songwriter - and for that reason I don't want them to call it a day just yet. I strongly believe they can be big sellers again, if they produce the right sound ( but there are so many variables in the music industry, and maybe their time has come and gone).

One question I have it the direction they've taken over the past 5 years- who's been instrumental in those decisions? Has it been all three and is there anyone within their inner circle with enough authority to tell them when the songs aren't good enough. The choice of producer will also be a major factor. For lll they used a number of producers and Stuart Price for Progress. My choice would be for one producer, preferably someone like John Shanks who has a firm direction and can give the album a cohesive sound.

 

I love Progress (and to a lesser extent Progressed - which was just TOO weird, but kudos to them for attempting something completely different, most bands at their peak wouldn't risk it by changing their sound that dramatically), but I can see why a lot of people wouldn't, and yes The Flood was a highly misleading lead single - and by far the best song on the album.

 

I love Progress and everything to do with the reunion and the tour. I still listen to Progress a lot and enjoy it.

My favourites are EightLetters, Wait and The Flood. Love Kids too. By Progressed the songs were starting to sound the same but Love Love is a good song.

 

I hope one day to see all five of them together again even if just for a one off gig.

 

I don't think any artist should go backwards in their musical evolution because for every person who wants a "traditional" sound, there are others who want something different. All artists need to move forward to grow otherwise they stagnate. They may not sell in the same high quantities but have the self respect to acknowledge that at least they tried. That's how music stays fresh and I think most artists want this.

Yeah Eight Letters was gorgeous, if the whole album had been along the lines of that and The Flood I'm sure the fans would have been content.

 

I prefer Progress to The Circus personally, though Beautiful World still trounces both. (III is a long way behind unfortunately, it's very good from start to finish but lacks many killer songs that I feel the need to rush back to).

Edited January 2, 20169 yr by gooddelta

I don't think it a case of going backwards; more of a case of great/good music as opposed to average or mediocre music. I would contend that EL, Wait and The Flood are songs more in the genre of 'traditional' TT music, but songs like Affirmation etc are not. The Progress album was too electronic sounding for my liking and what I associate as the recent TT sound based around beautiful orchestration and harmonies was absent.

 

Musical evolution sadly doesn't always equate to good music. There's a fine line between quality and experimentation. If bands want to retain a commercial approach with associated sales, they need to tread carefully. If commercial success is not important then go all out for experimentation - but be prepared to accept the outcome, be it positive or negative. TT is built on commercialism, whether that's a good or bad thing is debatable but I don't believe they'd wish to be viewed as a niche act. Success is central to their identity and legacy - critics may have liked Progress but I've no doubt that if the band had the choice between commercial or critical success, they'd choose the commercial route every time.

 

It's obvious we all have different tastes, but it comes to a point where the majority has to decide, in my opinion.

It's true that every artist has to keep his music fresh, but that doesn't mean he has to deviate from his sound to such point he alienates most of his audience. And I think this is what happened with Progress. I know that some TT fans and most Robbie fans loved Progress because it was centred on Robbie, but the fact is that MOST of the TT fans like that album the least. It would be easy for me to say I loved it because it was mostly Gary's concept, but aside from Eight Letters, Don't Say Goodbye, When We Were Young and Happy, I didn't love anything else from that era. And I'm one of the fans who stuck around. But many were put off by the musical output, Robbie's behaviour, Jason and Howard's exclusion and so on.

TT may wanna experiment, but what's the point of being "respected" if you have no one who listens to what you've done? If they want to do music for themselves, fine, they should record what they like, play it to their families and closed ones, but not waste the resources of a label and certainly not expect for fans to buy it just because...Music should be aimed at an audience, should touch hearts, not just be a testing matter. Poets and novelists in the 20th century certainly tried their best at changing what writing should be about and, aside from mentions in literary critique, almost nobody cares for their style or wants to read their output. Seriously, how many of you are passionate about dadaism? :D It's the same with music. Critics were over the moon with Progress's sound for obvious reasons, but, as a listener, I don't want to hear electronic distortions and I certainly don't want to feel like banging my head against a wall when listening to an album. It's also one of the reasons I can't listen to Mark's TAODN, it just gives me headaches and it's obvious most people feel the same.

I don't believe there's that much "honour" in always pursuing a new sound. What for? If people fell in love with a certain sound, it must be because it was good, so why change it? Holding Back the Tears is so old, but it still emotes because it has meaning and comes from the heart. Songs on Progress do not stimulate my emotions in any way.

If things will continue in the same vein, I, for one, will cease to be a TT fan and will remain a Gary fan only, because he, at least, has always delivered what I expected from him. Nothing on any TT album and certainly not on Progress/ed or III even comes close to Dying Inside and I doubt anything will ever match the magnificence and sincerity of that song for me.

 

I may have been a bit drastic with my post, but that's only because I don't want to see TT go to waste. I want them to make good music, not to try to keep up with the trends or be ahead of their time. Critics may love such approaches, but critics are not the ones buying the albums and going to tours.

TT is quite unique in their narrative and the different modes they've gone through. I largely agree with you, Milly. I love to listen to music, to hear the orchestra and the harmonies. I love to feel a connection with a song and Progress didn't do that for me, and neither did the concert for the same reason. If songs emote they tend to stand the test of time and for me that makes them classics.

In all honesty I would greatly struggle if Rob returned, but I can understand that first time TT fans and Rob fans would love him to rejoin the band. However, I doubt it will happen unless there's something in it for him - sorry, but that's what I believe.

The crucial thing for me is the quality of the music. I've stuck with them because I genuinely believe they have talent and they can re-capture their trademark sound. If the next album is characteristic of Progress then I will struggle to remain on board.

It's possible they may come under some pressure from the record label to deliver because I can't imagine they've made much money from the lll album era; given the relatively poor album/DVD sales and the major production issues with the re-lease.

 

One interesting thing is that despite the lack of huge success saleswise for this era they seem to be more relaxed, happy and enjoying themselves a lot when performing etc. How much should an artist try to adjust in order to get commercial success? Yes, commercial success is important, but at what cost? If they find it more challenging and inspiring to try new ways, should they not do that instead of going back to the "old" and safe sound?

 

Looking at other aspects than just the music, maybe people simply are not as interested in TT any longer? I'm thinking that when they came back in 2005 they were kind of underdogs and I think that many people were surprised at how good they were. They came back with great new music and put up great shows, and they did it without Robbie! It was such a good and fascinating story, and the media loved them too. Many things has happened since then and the fascination and "goodwill" is no longer there.

 

On the negative side is also the lack of B-sides on their singles nowadays, I'm also missing some extra material on the latest DVD. Maybe these kind of things doesn't affect the sales figures a lot but it just feels like they are getting more and more lazy with that kind of stuff. Regarding the lack of promotion, I wonder if that was partly due to Gary's many other commitments? Before you chop my head off, this is not an accusation, just a thought from my side.

 

 

You have a valid point regarding Gary, Cat. He's had numerous commitments with FN and TG musical and his time must have been very limited. In terms of the DVD I'd be surprised if they thought much in relation to extras or B sides on singles - I'd expect that to be more of a management/record label consideration. The industry has also changed considerably since their return in terms of downloading, etc.

It is interesting to see how genuinely happy they all are given the dip in their popularity. My guess is they came very, very close to splitting after Jay's departure (closer than any of us imagined) so they probably appreciate whatever achievements and opportunities come their way. From the documentary there seems to be a recognition that their time at the top has come, or is coming, to a natural conclusion. There's no bitterness or envy from what I can see, just an understanding that new artists such as Adele and Ed Sheeran have taken over the mantle.

 

It is interesting to see how genuinely happy they all are given the dip in their popularity. My guess is they came very, very close to splitting after Jay's departure (closer than any of us imagined) so they probably appreciate whatever achievements and opportunities come their way. From the documentary there seems to be a recognition that their time at the top has come, or is coming, to a natural conclusion. There's no bitterness or envy from what I can see, just an understanding that new artists such as Adele and Ed Sheeran have taken over the mantle.

 

This could very well be the case, and I think that's why they now are taking the chance to do things they haven't done before, like the Vegas thing.

I suppose from the boys perspective, they would have never imagined the success they achieved over the last 10 years, it was all totally unexpected and for them to be doing as well 10 years on is a bonus to them. Sales have dipped but are respectable nonetheless. They have offered something different with each release so far, we can argue the good and bad side of that but they cant be accused of playing it safe and thats probably whats keeps them going. From a commercial point of view i think they really need to evaluate their next move closely and if a natural end to the band is coming they should go out on a high like they did first time round. They have achieved far to much and released excellent material to go out on a whim or just fade away.

 

It may not be as hugely important to them as we think but i still think the decline in sales will bother them in some way and they are probably wondering why, and im sure they themselves would like to go out on a high. They have nothing to prove as they have achieved so much but if the next release is the last they should pull out all the stops to make sure its a huge success.

Three is number 50 in the latest midweek chart information.