The Window was NOT open from the inside. It had a Shutter on it.

Gerry has claimed - yes HIM - that the Shutter had been 'Forced'

from the inside - by the 'Abductor'. The Portuguese Police & Apartment

Complex Staff have long since said that the Shutter was NOT 'Forced'

at all - it was not open.

 

Gerry claims that the Shutter was 'Forced' - from the inside - so

that the 'Abductor' could climb out of the Apartment with Madeleine.

I do hope that ALL of this 'Evidence' from Gerry ends up in Court,

as I can't wait to see how the Court reacts - and the World!

That an 'Abductor' walked in through an OPEN DOOR, grabbed

Madeleine, & then decided NOT to leave through the OPEN DOOR,

but he decided to FORCE THE SHUTTER & LEAVE VIA THE WINDOW,

instead!!!!! (LOL, LOL, LOL!)

 

Please - please - do not let Gerry manipulate how you think

- his story's are laughable, & he loves it when people believe him.

 

Oh - the Portuguese Police say that 'Forcing' the Shutter would have

been impossible anyhow, (due to how they are made), & even had he tried

to do that, the NOISE would have woken up the entire Complex!!!!!!

 

Yes, that was always a strange part of this, however, her coming out of the apartment and then someone taking her would mean that no-one came in, and if the shutter was forced, then it surely would''ve still been when the police arrived? And there was hardly going to wake up the entire complex, seeing as it was not THAT late that it was meant to have occured.

 

Zeus, I think you're placing too much trust in the reliability of tabloids. A LOT of the stuff you're basing your theories on has not been 100% confirmed. Some of what you're saying is fairly plausible in practise, but what about the mental aspects? - if they killed her accidentally, would they really be capable of quickly formulating a plan, then not showing any signs of guilt in the weeks afterwards?

No, I do NOT speak of Gerry as if he is a 'personal friend'.

THAT is just some people's take on what I said about him

loving it when people fall for his 'take' on this Case.

- his stories.

 

This is because he is 100% clearly an 'Attention Seeker' - his behaviour

ever since Madeleine went 'missing' shows this. Trips to see the Pope,

George Bush's Wife, Laura, a virtual 'World Tour' - paid for by

the 'Find Madeleine' Fund', & so on.

 

I have met many people who crave attention, & they love it

when they can get people to believe nonsense, such as an 'Abductor'

came in through an open door, but 'Forced' a shutter to get out.

 

It was clearly a silly claim from the start, but a scary number of people

believed Gerry's story.

 

There was no 'Abductor'. It is the least likely scenario - even though a

Male 'Sun' Columnist insisted that it was the MOST likely scenario, in his

Column, yesterday.

 

I am sure that the UK Police, Portuguese Police, and any other Police who

have pondered on this Case, see that the 'Abductor' idea does not hold up,

as regards Madeleine's 'Abduction'.

 

I am glad that I - and many others - saw through the manipulations

from very early on, in this Case. Others still cannot see any contradictions - at

all in Gerry & Kate's claims - luckily the UK & Portuguese Police have certainly

done so.

 

Whether any of it will be enough to get them in Court is another matter.

 

Perhaps they are innocent - but their behaviour has made many people

suspicious of them. I just want whoever committed this Crime to be caught

& punished. Even if it turns out that Gerry & Kate are not involved - all that

matters is that whoever did it is punished - so Justice can be done.....

 

As for Madeleine, I fear that her body looks like it will never be found. I do

not share the view of some people, that she is still alive somewhere.

 

Danny, there have been Cases in the past where people have done something

very bad - by accident or on purpose, but they have been able to very quickly start

to cover it up.

 

With the McCann's, it simply turned into a 'Movie', with PR People getting involved,

& they got Sports Stars involved. Millionaires sent cash in, until the REWARD Money

for Madeleine stood at £2.5 Million, the last I heard. The 'Find Madeleine' Fund reached

just under £1,040,000. Someone Rich put a Private Jet at Gerry & Kate's disposal.

A trip to see the Pope was arranged, & so on & so on.

 

Gerry & Kate - innocent or guilty - must have felt like the 2 Leads in a Movie - and

more & more people were offering to join in that Movie - once it started this all just

grew & grew, & it was hard to stop it.

 

IF Gerry & Kate had nothing to do with the 'vanishing' of Madeleine, then I will

come here & admit that I was wrong. However, it is hard for me to admit to

that if there is no Trial. A Trial not going ahead - due to lack of Evidence - will not

be enough for me - and many - who want to see how a Court Judges them.

A lack of Evidence as in - they cannot find her body.

 

I am not forgetting that a 4 Year Old Child is at the heart of this. I know that

both Pro McCann people & Anti McCann people, want to know what happened to Madeleine.

As do people with Neutral views on Gerry & Kate - by 'Neutral', I mean that such people

have not come to any conclusions about Gerry & Kate, at all.

 

I do hope that the Portuguese Complex puts CCTV all over the place, now, as had they

only had CCTV everywhere on May 3rd, we would have been able to see who went in

& out of the McCann's Apartment that Night. Then there would never have been any

doubt that an 'Abductor' went into it - or not.

 

 

Edited September 15, 200717 yr by zeus555

Zeus, I think you're placing too much trust in the reliability of tabloids. A LOT of the stuff you're basing your theories on has not been 100% confirmed. Some of what you're saying is fairly plausible in practise, but what about the mental aspects? - if they killed her accidentally, would they really be capable of quickly formulating a plan, then not showing any signs of guilt in the weeks afterwards?

 

i disagree, zeus is one of the few here who have actually looked deeply into this case and has coloberated evidence from several different scources. his posts are as ever, a very high quality, being well thought out and logically put.

I am glad that I - and many others - saw through the manipulations

from very early on, in this Case. Others still cannot see any contradictions - at

all in Gerry & Kate's claims - luckily the UK & Portuguese Police have certainly

done so.

Oh, I do see the contradictions definitely. But likewise, there are holes in the theories of them killing her as well. The shutter thing is kind of suspicious - I think, if the theory of Madeleine wandering out of the apartment and getting picked up after that are true, the parents possibly made it look like someone broke in because they didn't want to admit they'd left the door unlocked maybe?

The new ad campaign is obviously pointless, but I don't think it's either here nor there in terms of proving their innocence or guilt. The aim is undoubtedly to try and make people think they're innocent, but I'm sure they'd be equally likely to want to do that regardless of whether they were guilty or genuinely innocent.

Zeus, you are analysing the entire situation as if you were some kind of expert phsychologist. Even if you were, I think half of your points are very daft; to call the McCann parents 'attention seekers' is absolutely ridiculous. Let's assume they're innocent - they of course want to drum up as much promotion as is possible for the campaign to find their missing daughter, as any other parents would, regardless of the fact that they shouldn't have left her alone in the first place.

 

And if they're not innocent, don't you think it would look highly suspicious to sit in the shade, out of sight from the papparazzi, as if to say they've given up looking? In the instance that this is all one big lie, to blow their cover by not seeming at all arsed about raising awareness would be absolutely madness - so either way, Kate and Gerry have no choice whatsoever but to keep this campaign in the papers, in either the hope or the faux hope of finding their daughter alive.

Bah.

 

Tbh I think Zeus is making EXCELENT points, interesting to read. £80,000 on a Find Madeleine Campaign?! Strange, as to a few weeks ago I read that Gerry admitted that he fears she might be dead, yet they've gone ahead and took £80,000 and started a new campaign, bit strange/pointless?

Oh - so because she might be dead, they can't carry on looking? HARSH.

Oh - so because she might be dead, they can't carry on looking? HARSH.

Erm no. They've admitted that they fear that she might be dead, so whats the point in all this campaigning to carry on (which is so obviously a cover up), when they should be spending their time fighting for themselves to prove they're innocent.

 

Just want to share something, I was in a shop today (sweet shop up town :lol: ) and the two lady shop owners where talking, and one of them was going to Portugal on holiday and one said, "Would you ever do that, leave your daughter alone" and the other replied, "No, no bloody way, I could and never would do that, especially if she was 3" and then the she replied, "True, Im not to keen on the parents either" and the other said "Same, always thought they where strange from day 1, they way they act and behave".

 

Ok it's nothing really and there was ALOT more conversation going on, but it's just interesting to hear what 2 Mothers have to say about it. :lol:

Erm no. They've admitted that they fear that she might be dead, so whats the point in all this campaigning to carry on (which is so obviously a cover up), when they should be spending their time fighting for themselves to prove they're innocent.

 

 

So Jark's point still stands - they say she might be dead, of course she might be dead, I'm sure they thought that since day one (presuming they are not behind this), but just because she might be dead, surely does'nt mean they shoudl just give up - unless of course they have been given evidence that proves she is in fact dead, which they clearly have not. So it's hardly a surprise they want to continue looking for their daughter. And as far as them fighting for their innocence, what can they do exactly? They were let go home, they don't know what is going to happen, they just have to wait and see what the police decide to do.

Zeus, you are analysing the entire situation as if you were some kind of expert phsychologist. Even if you were, I think half of your points are very daft; to call the McCann parents 'attention seekers' is absolutely ridiculous. Let's assume they're innocent - they of course want to drum up as much promotion as is possible for the campaign to find their missing daughter, as any other parents would, regardless of the fact that they shouldn't have left her alone in the first place.

 

And if they're not innocent, don't you think it would look highly suspicious to sit in the shade, out of sight from the papparazzi, as if to say they've given up looking? In the instance that this is all one big lie, to blow their cover by not seeming at all arsed about raising awareness would be absolutely madness - so either way, Kate and Gerry have no choice whatsoever but to keep this campaign in the papers, in either the hope or the faux hope of finding their daughter alive.

 

no hes not, he in proposing a well thought out, well researched, intelligently put point. he fully explained why he proposes the parents are attention seekers, and his point stands. if you understood what he put you wouldnt have written this.

no hes not, he in proposing a well thought out, well researched, intelligently put point. he fully explained why he proposes the parents are attention seekers, and his point stands. if you understood what he put you wouldnt have written this.

Of course I understood! His evidence for Gerry being an attention seeker is that he went to see the Pope, Laura Bush etc when actually, as I said in my response, all he was trying to do is keep the story on the front pages, as any parent of a missing child would want to do! What I said stands 100%, Mr.M can see that.

Let's assume they're innocent - they of course want to drum up as much promotion as is possible for the campaign to find their missing daughter, as any other parents would, regardless of the fact that they shouldn't have left her alone in the first place.

Well said. That's one thing I definitely can't see as suspicious. If my child had gone missing, I know I'd want to be doing as much as possible to try and get her back, and anyway, maybe they wanted to constantly keep busy to keep themselves from facing the reality that they'll probably never see her alive again (this is all assuming they're innocent obviously).

Also, where did this myth that the parents never looked like they were grieving come from? For the first couple of weeks, the mum in particular looked like she was on the verge of a complete mental breakdown, and if you all think about it, have you EVER actually seen her properly smile?

I agree. Just because she's not crying on TV every day these days, people say she's not grieving - and if she was, they'd no doubt say she had some 'attention seeking disorder' -_- And how can anybody here pass judgment on how these two parents would or should act if they're innocent of losing they're daughter to a paedophile or child thief?

And how can anybody here pass judgment on how these two parents would or should act if they're innocent of losing they're daughter to a paedophile or child thief?

Another good point. I don't like how people are saying their behaviour isn't "normal" for people who've lost a child - there is NO "normal" way for people in this situation to behave!

Branson’s £100,000 to defend Gerry and Kate McCann

The Times Online

 

THE billionaire tycoon Sir Richard Branson is giving £100,000 to create a fighting fund to help the parents of Madeleine McCann to clear their names.

 

The fund, which will cover both legal and PR expenses, is to seek the support of wealthy businessmen convinced of the McCanns’ innocence. Branson, who has been in regular contact with the couple since their daughter went missing, hopes that it could amass £1m.

 

The money would mean that members of the McCann family could drop their plans to sell their houses to pay legal costs.

 

A source close to Branson said: “Sir Richard wants to ensure the McCanns get access to the best legal advice. He has a good instinct on these things. It will help to ensure that they get a fair hearing and that all of the facts become available.

 

"A number of other individuals will be involved. The fund’s size is potentially unlimited. It will initially look to raise about £1m, but it will be as much as it takes to make the McCanns’ case.”

 

According to John McCann, Gerry’s brother, they would welcome a court hearing. “Gerry and Kate feel it would be better for them to be charged so they could prove their innocence. In court it would be there for all to see how ridiculous the charges and the evidence are. Unfortunately their reputations have been tarnished and no matter what happens people will think they are guilty,” he said.

 

According to a YouGov poll for The Sunday Times, only 20% of respondents believe that the McCanns are completely innocent. Nearly half (48%) believe that they could have been responsible for their daughter’s death, even if it was an accident; 32% were unsure. A total of 40% said that the McCanns’ high-profile campaign had made them suspicious, but 50% said that it had not.

 

Portuguese police officers were last night on stand-by awaiting authorisation from a judge to begin "extensive" searches for a body. According to Portuguese press reports, British detectives will also reinterview Kate on behalf of Portuguese police who suspect she may have accidentally killed her daughter. There are also plans to reconstruct the night of May 3 to clarify discrepancies in statements.

 

The McCanns announced that they will be spending £80,000 on an advertising campaign in Spain and Portugal appealing for information on Madeleine.

Hmm, even though I don't think they killed her, I don't really think Branson is making a good move, considering he could afterall be paying for murderers at the end of the day, unless of course he knows they definatly did'nt do it, and has some inside info or something :lol:

 

Although, if the evidence is strong enough, it won't matter at the end of the day - and him paying their legal bills will mean they won't have to sell thier house.

Also, where did this myth that the parents never looked like they were grieving come from? For the first couple of weeks, the mum in particular looked like she was on the verge of a complete mental breakdown, and if you all think about it, have you EVER actually seen her properly smile?

 

Exactly, the mother looked completelly drained for ages, and has clearly lost so much weight etc. They probebly grieve in private anyway. If they started crying everytime a camera was put in their face, THAT would be more suspicious IMO.

Madeleine: Police on trial for torturing mother of another missing girl

By DAVID ROSE

Mail On Sunday

http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/a...d=1770&ct=5

 

The senior Portuguese detective jointly in charge of the investigation into the disappearance of Madeleine McCann is set to face a criminal hearing into an alleged cover-up involving another missing girl.

 

Chief Inspector Goncalo Amaral has been accused of concealing evidence that the mother of eight-year-old Joana Cipriano, who disappeared in the Algarve three years ago, was tortured by police into confessing she had killed her daughter, whose body was never found.

 

The senior officer, who heads the Policia Judiciaria in Portimao, the nearest town to Praia da Luz from where Madeleine vanished, could appear before the secret hearing as early as next month, The Mail on Sunday has learned.

 

The revelation casts further doubt on the conduct of the Portuguese police, who have faced increasing criticism about their handling of the McCann case.

 

In a separate development, this newspaper has discovered that fragments of hair found in the McCanns' hire car, said to belong to Madeleine, cannot be matched to the missing four-year-old.

 

Sources close to the forensic scientists investigating the case say they have concluded the hair could belong to any number of people. This undermines earlier claims that DNA evidence proved the McCanns used the car to move their daughter's body.

 

The leaking of these original claims fuelled fears that Portuguese police were conducting a smear campaign against Kate and Gerry McCann as they faced increasing pressure for results.

 

Against this background comes the revelation that Chief Inspector Amaral has been accused of concealing evidence into allegations that three of his colleagues tortured the mother of missing Joana Cipriano in order to secure a confession.

 

Leonor did confess, after almost 48 hours' continuous interrogation, but later retracted her statement. But she was charged and convicted of murdering her daughter and is now serving a 16-year jail term.

 

The four detectives, plus a fifth accused of fabricating evidence, deny the allegations and say that injuries Cipriano sustained came when she tried to commit suicide by throwing herself down police station stairs.

 

The case has been adopted by the public prosecutor, and next month's hearing, which may be the first of several, aims to gather further evidence to help him decide whether to proceed to trial.

 

Amaral is not the only accused officer linked to the McCann investigation. Another is the recently retired Chief Inspector Paulo Pereira Cristovao, who has been writing a daily column on the Madeleine inquiry for a Portuguese newspaper that has been reporting sensational stories, leaked by sources close to the police inquiry, some of which have later been proven to be untrue.

 

Cristovao makes clear in his column that he considers the McCanns are probably responsible for Madeleine's death or disappearance.

 

In the Cipriano case, Cristovao is alleged to have been one of those involved in the torture, but not the cover-up. Leonor was unable to pick out her assailants from among the accused officers on an identity parade.

 

Sources say the prosecutor is now investigating the allegation that police paid outside thugs to beat up Leonor.

 

Like Amaral, Cristovao denies all wrongdoing.

 

 

 

Madeleine: Hair in McCann Renault: 'It could be anyone's'

Mail On Sunday

 

Hair found in the car hired by Madeleine McCann's parents cannot be matched to the missing four-year-old, it was revealed last night.

 

British forensic experts have concluded the fragments said to be Madeleine's could belong to any number of people who had come into contact with the silver Renault Scenic.

 

This demolishes earlier claims that the hairs would prove the McCanns had hidden Madeleine's body in the car after killing her in their holiday apartment.

 

The fragments found did not even allow the scientists to establish the sex or age of the individual.

 

Sources have told The Mail on Sunday that the hairs discovered in the vehicle hired by Kate and Gerry McCann after she disappeared were found in only very small quantities on the seats - and not in the boot as was previously reported.

 

Additionally no roots were found in the samples, which meant that experts at the Forensic Science Service in Birmingham were unable to test for a DNA match to any individuals.

 

"They were only asked to try to determine sex and age. It was simply not possible to determine whether the hairs belonged to Madeleine," said a source.

 

It has also been reported that police had found 'bodily fluids' - but not blood - in the car with an 88 per cent match to Madeleine's genetic profile.

 

That fuelled speculation that the little girl had been killed, possibly after being given an accidental overdose of sedatives, and her body hidden before being transported in the boot of the vehicle.

 

The McCanns hired the Renault from Budget 24 days after Maddie vanished on May 3.

 

Portuguese police have become suspicious about the number of miles on the car's mileometer.

 

In the seven days between May 27 - when the Renault Scenic was first rented in Portimao - and June 3 when the McCanns' first contract lapsed, the car travelled 450 miles.

 

The couple pointed out to investigators that the car did many runs to Faro airport, 55 miles away. They emphasised that they flew to Rome to meet the Pope on May 29, returning the next day, and that they then departed for Madrid on May 31.

 

They also told police that friends and family had access to the car while they were away - and that it was used to ferry relatives to and from Faro.

 

But despite what the McCanns have presented as an innocent explanation behind the distances, Portuguese police have asked Budget to provide all details of the vehicle's mileage.

 

The Mail on Sunday has learned that those records show that between June 3 and July 3, the car travelled a further 1,256 miles.

 

Further trips to airports in Lisbon and Faro to pick up relatives and deposit the McCanns for a trip to Germany have been presented as a justification for the high mileage.

 

However, according to a source, the police have not been satisfied with the explanations.