Dont you think some Indie/Alternative bands copy old tunes or rather new ones or are absolutely commercial in nature? I beleive there are some so called Indie/Alternative bands which are just formed with the Intent of selling records and making money so that they can own big cars and multiple girlfriends. They dont sound as if they are singing from their heart and soul and expressing themselves for any matter related to people or this world. They dont sound as if they are singing to express their views about anything or everything but they are just singing to because the music labels asked them to sing that and they cannot sing what they want to as the music labels, Govt agencies have total control over what should be sung and what not should be sung. Ultimately, they cannot sing what they want to and end being slaves to the system i.e Govt, politicians, people, money, society, culture, thoughts and most of slaves of themselves. They are not free.............to sing whatever they want to which is what music is all about. The REAL music is hardly reaches the common people or common man. :angry: :angry: :angry: :( :( :( Sadly this is the world we know and live in. :puke: :hic: :banghead: :whip: :angel:

 

Afterall the world is an evil place.

Hmm i'm not sure. I think when most bands start out it's all about the music, they're doing it because they want to and not because of the money etc. but of course on some bands that's always gonna influence them, but I don't believe that 99.9% bands that are about start up for the "party lifestyle" as it's just an added bonus. And of course there's always gonna be copying of tunes, as it's all one genre and there's bound to be cross-overs as it happens in all genres.

 

Just depends what your definition of indie is really. If you're on a major label then you don't have as much freedom as if you're on an indie label for example as they spend nowhere near the amount of money on promo etc.

Whilst yes, they do, the rate of sampling, stealing and covering is far higher in all other genres... And it's always been the case in music, if you want success you write a song that sells.

Edited April 25, 200817 yr by RabbitFurCoat

If you're talking about 'copying' and 'sampling' then Hip-Hop is FAR worse with the amount of rappers who just rap over the tune of some old song -_- Though I think you do have a very valid point there! So many bands are told to 'sound like this or your dropped' and so many so called 'Indie' bands on major labels are just pushed to sound like watered down versions of Razorlight or Arctic Monkeys <_< Those bands aren't Indie bands they're just marketed by major labels that way so people would think they're 'cool' :rolleyes:

It happens in every genre though, it's certainly not exclusive to indie/rock. Just look at Bodyrox 'Yeah Yeah', briliant dance single and huge hit. 18 months down the line and it's been copied/ripped off god knows how many times, and still is - the next number one here is likely to be the latest...

Grandwicky has it on the money, I'm sure that many bands are signed in a rush because they 'sound like' the last indie forerunner - Arctics, Oasis, Stone Roses, Smiths....then they're TOLD to sound like them.

 

But it's the nature of the beast - not everyone can be original. For every Oasis there's an Embrace, Coldplay an Athlete, Arctics a Fratellis etc. The best of these bands do formulate their own sound over time though.

Just depends what your definition of indie is really. If you're on a major label then you don't have as much freedom as if you're on an indie label for example as they spend nowhere near the amount of money on promo etc.

 

well i think to just equate indie with indie distribution in 2008 is a bit wrong - maybe in 1977 yeah then people might have a point - as just looking at the indie cool CD below (tho excepting Kula Shaker and Reef i guess) you can see that 'indie artists' has been co-opted by Sony BMG and other majors - there has been fake indie labels and major labels who have shares and deals in the recordings of indie acts. on the other hand you could think about punk bands and think well The Clash were on Sony BMG's CBS Columbia label and the Sex Pistols were signed A&M and Virgin (both minor-majors - both taken over by majors) - is that a part of indie thought - probs as indie seems to date back to Buzzcocks.

 

and i guess a number of 'indie' labels are not really like 'indie' record labels anymore being at a mutli-national size that labels like Zomba was before being absorbed by Sony BMG and Chrysalis Records was before being absorbed by EMI (btw Chrysalis Records was the only part that was sold from the Chrysalis Group as they kept the TV and Radio divisons and then launched - The Echo Label - an indie label, Zomba on the other hand owned Pinnacle Distribution)

 

1. Primitives - Crash (Lazy - RCA/Sony BMG)

2. Suede - The Drowners (Nude / Sony BMG)

3. The Wannadies - You and Me Song (MNW - Indolent / Sony BMG)

4. Kula Shaker - Govinda (Columbia / Sony BMG)

5. Slepper - Inbetweener (Indolent / Sony BMG)

6. Reef - Place Your Hands (Epic / Sony BMG)

7. Pop Will Eat Itself - Get The Girl! Kill The Baddies! (RCA / Sony BMG)

8. Wedding Present - Dalliance (RCA / Sony BMG)

9. Senseless Things - Hold It Down (Epic / Sony BMG)

10. Ned's Atomic Dustbin - Stuck (Furtive / Sony BMG)

 

Grandwicky has it on the money, I'm sure that many bands are signed in a rush because they 'sound like' the last indie forerunner - Arctics, Oasis, Stone Roses, Smiths....then they're TOLD to sound like them.

 

But it's the nature of the beast - not everyone can be original.

 

but also wouldnt this to do with the way bands evolve - rather than being picked by a Simon Cowell as in the histories of many pop groups/boybands - wouldnt many indie bands evolved from people getting together as they like similar stuff and started jamming along a similar kind of vibe - before arriving at the sound they have.

 

http://image.guardian.co.uk/sys-images/Music/Pix/pictures/2008/04/17/lastshadowpuppets.jpg

 

btw it might be as obv even to like indie music and have a copy of forever changes and scott 4 at home - talking to my mates about old 60s and 70s music it does become obv that we're all into the same stuff

 

For every Oasis there's an Embrace, Coldplay an Athlete, Arctics a Fratellis etc. The best of these bands do formulate their own sound over time though.

 

and Bloc Party obv knicked it from Big Country and just rid of the bagpipes :lol:

yeah! the verdict is out and most music is copied these days which is just clear bull$h!t. They labels actually know that most listeners are dumb and idiots so they cater to their needs. Whereas, the ones who know that this music is just bull$h!t which is copied and remastered are the real winners as they do not end up spending money on artists which i call THIEVES. I can give out so many names which are actual THIEVES and the "Most popular" ones in every Genre. But I beleive these people come and these people go with their music......only the ones who music is real stays on FOREVER.

 

:yahoo:

Dont you think some Indie/Alternative bands copy old tunes or rather new ones or are absolutely commercial in nature? I beleive there are some so called Indie/Alternative bands which are just formed with the Intent of selling records and making money so that they can own big cars and multiple girlfriends. They dont sound as if they are singing from their heart and soul and expressing themselves for any matter related to people or this world. They dont sound as if they are singing to express their views about anything or everything but they are just singing to because the music labels asked them to sing that and they cannot sing what they want to as the music labels, Govt agencies have total control over what should be sung and what not should be sung. Ultimately, they cannot sing what they want to and end being slaves to the system i.e Govt, politicians, people, money, society, culture, thoughts and most of slaves of themselves. They are not free.............to sing whatever they want to which is what music is all about. The REAL music is hardly reaches the common people or common man. :angry: :angry: :angry: :( :( :( Sadly this is the world we know and live in. :puke: :hic: :banghead: :whip: :angel:

 

Afterall the world is an evil place.

 

No I don't agree atall.

Any chance of any examples to back up your opinion?

 

I'm not sure whether indie bands are blatantly plagiarizing, which is what you appear to be implying in the original post, but, indie music sure is boringly generic and interchangeable these days.... I compare it to the big indie bands of the 80s - The Smiths, The Cure, Echo and the Bunnymen, Jesus and Mary Chain, Siouxsie and the Banshees, you could certainly never accuse any of them of being boring or interchangeable, they all had an incredible individuality about them, Blur/Oasis/Suede had something about them too....

 

But Arctics, Kaisers, Kooks.....? Frankly, they just wash over me. Making no impact...

Dont you think some Indie/Alternative bands copy old tunes or rather new ones or are absolutely commercial in nature? I beleive there are some so called Indie/Alternative bands which are just formed with the Intent of selling records and making money so that they can own big cars and multiple girlfriends. They dont sound as if they are singing from their heart and soul and expressing themselves for any matter related to people or this world. They dont sound as if they are singing to express their views about anything or everything but they are just singing to because the music labels asked them to sing that and they cannot sing what they want to as the music labels, Govt agencies have total control over what should be sung and what not should be sung. Ultimately, they cannot sing what they want to and end being slaves to the system i.e Govt, politicians, people, money, society, culture, thoughts and most of slaves of themselves. They are not free.............to sing whatever they want to which is what music is all about. The REAL music is hardly reaches the common people or common man. :angry: :angry: :angry: :( :( :( Sadly this is the world we know and live in. :puke: :hic: :banghead: :whip: :angel:

 

Afterall the world is an evil place.

 

 

this is an age old dilema though and isnt the preserve of indie or even today.

 

bands have always 'sold out' to make money... right back to the fabled 60's when inovation, experimentation and creativity were buzzing in the new world of pop music. do you play what YOU want to play and hope it sells or do you use music to make money?... the point is, they have to live! most of the great groups of the 60's managed to balance the two... the beatles, stones, kinks, small faces (all guitar based pop/blues forerunner to 'indie') in particular managed to be creative and commercial. thats why groups like this are still seen as influencial. other 'lightweight' groups may have had greater chart success, but were under the control of the music moguls.

 

even REAL 'indie' soon sold out to commerce... independant record labels started in the punk (do it yourself) era created to promote local bands to express their individuality free from music companies like emi, (sex pistols referance there), were soon bought up by the very companies they were formed to fight.

 

so real music id suggest hardly exists, i think they are all 'in it for the money'. modern indie has nowhere else to go... it has to re-cycle 'retro' sounds as its all been done before.

 

tbh though i dont mind the recent 'indie' explosion (although its NOT 'indie' its good old fashioned traditional pop music played by pop groups!), as its bringing back my favoured style of music. its the style that has dominated pop for 40 years plus, it has given us a variety of incarnations and has made our music the best in the world.

modern indie has nowhere else to go... it has to re-cycle 'retro' sounds as its all been done before.

 

Very true mate, but there's a way of doing it that breathes a bit of fresh air into things - look at Portishead, Ladytron, Mercury Rev, The Flaming Lips, Interpol, P J Harvey, Jack White, etc... The new Bauhaus album is utterly immense, certainly showing up the likes of Editors, Coldplay, Arctics, Kooks, etc.. "Oldies" like Echo and the Bunnymen, The Cure, Morrissey, Nick Cave, etc still make great records.....

Very true mate, but there's a way of doing it that breathes a bit of fresh air into things - look at Portishead, Ladytron, Mercury Rev, The Flaming Lips, Interpol, P J Harvey, Jack White, etc... The new Bauhaus album is utterly immense, certainly showing up the likes of Editors, Coldplay, Arctics, Kooks, etc.. "Oldies" like Echo and the Bunnymen, The Cure, Morrissey, Nick Cave, etc still make great records.....

 

.... but i LIKE the arctics, kooks, kaisers.. im not so sure 'oldies' make good music, WE tend to get short of new, fresh ideas as we drift into senility! :lol:

WE tend to get short of new, fresh ideas as we drift into senility! :lol:

 

Speak for yourself mate... You're certainly not speaking for Moz, Mac, Smithy, Siouxsie or Cavey that's for sure.... :P

 

Sorry, but I listen to most of these "new" bands, and frankly they sound old, tired, tedious, they make me yawn..... Bands like Kings of Leon, Coldplay and Magic Numbers are making sh!t that sounds like it should be coming from old geezers in their 50s..... It aint fresh mate, and it sure aint exciting or youthful joie de vivre.....

 

The likes of Moz, Mac, Rotten, Smith, Cave, etc showed up the "old guard" of the 60s and 70s, I see absolutely NO ONE from this generation that comes close to matching the songwriting of the Indie legends of the 80s and 90s.... The Kaisers and The Arctics just dont even register on my radar...

yeah! the verdict is out and most music is copied these days which is just clear bull$h!t. They labels actually know that most listeners are dumb and idiots so they cater to their needs. Whereas, the ones who know that this music is just bull$h!t which is copied and remastered are the real winners as they do not end up spending money on artists which i call THIEVES.

 

and talking about thieves - black homosexual shoegazers - now thats quite an alternative non mainstream ladrock type - more money should be spent here on intersting underrated artists like David here rather than usual ladrock and/or Duffy!!!

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/berkshire/content/images/2006/05/11/david_mcalmont203_203x152.jpg

 

But Arctics, Kaisers, Kooks.....? Frankly, they just wash over me. Making no impact...

 

i have albums by all of these and like some of their records - but having ruby ruby ruby ruby on the tv every few songs or so - does get v boring, so boring - v boring does not do it justice.

 

its realy the fault of peopl elike charles allen - his group buying other radio groups and re-programming them to a very safe mostly rhthmic hit40 or adult contemporary (whatever the vibe - one that continues to get a good and stady auds reach - which has not much variation from week to week) - these businessmen are the problem

Hmmm its good to see some people share my opinion. Because the idea of copying music and making it sound like original still exists. So, good and original music is rare and hardly and one has to look out for it. But i am sure there are bands who make good music but the record labels tell them to "get lost" cause thas not the majority of the people would like to hear in the whole of the world. So, these guys stop making music and start creating record labels to promote or create commerical music and hence the vicious cycle continues. Very few labels actually understand what music is all about.

i agree that labels sometimes stand in the way of the consumer and great music, but not all the time. I also don't think music copying happens as much as you think

i agree that labels sometimes stand in the way of the consumer and great music, but not all the time. I also don't think music copying happens as much as you think

 

nah i think its radio as they have to keep their reach constantly good - so they are not gonna sabotage that by trying something they might not think works or alientates listeners - good to keep their advertisers happy - music is not that important - advertising space is.