what do you think about the use of samples? modern (or not) tracks pinching hooks or riffs from our 'precious oldies'?..lazy? arty? acceptable? unacceptable?

 

 

 

 

To me its both lazy and unacceptable. I suppose its slightly ok as long as they reference the track on the cover and ask permision from the original artist.

 

I read once a while back, don't know what you think, that there are only so many different tunes you can make in music, and since there are millions of pieces of music that have been written over the last 50 years, there has to be duplication, it's inevitable. Sometimes it is obvious, and other times less so.

It's nothing new though.

Blockbuster & Jean Genie were basically the same riff.

 

If they use it 'artistically', then fair do's.

To me its both lazy and unacceptable. I suppose its slightly ok as long as they reference the track on the cover and ask permision from the original artist.

 

I read once a while back, don't know what you think, that there are only so many different tunes you can make in music, and since there are millions of pieces of music that have been written over the last 50 years, there has to be duplication, it's inevitable. Sometimes it is obvious, and other times less so.

 

well clearly there is duplication in music, one of the main criticism levelled at modern groups is that they are generic, they sound like blah blah blah... but where exactly can they go? it has all been done before... this is why im not against groups like oasis, kaisers, hard-fi, razorlight etc... it HAS been done before, so lets have some new songs in that style.

 

as for samples..... mostly they are lazy rip-offs, but i really like what klf did as the timelords 'dr in the tardis' as ive said many times, intelligent use of samples works. plus i like the way the sugababes used 'are friends electric' on 'freak like me'..

Use whatever you want as far as I'm concerned. If the record ends up being good then what does it matter. Sampling can be a very creative form of music. Look at Danger Mouse and the Grey Album.

 

And all samples have to be credited now or you will risk having your ass sued off.

 

I got over this after Utah Saints sampled Kate Bush. I was outraged at first but then I realised that they had made a really good record.

I'm not sentimental about sampling and cover version usually, unless a real hash job has been made with its use.

 

The Gary Numan sample in Sugababes probably is the great use of a sample as far as pop is concerned.

what do you think about the use of samples? modern (or not) tracks pinching hooks or riffs from our 'precious oldies'?..lazy? arty? acceptable? unacceptable?

 

..i wonder if this has got anything to do with the staurdays...however sampling can be a good thing

 

Pino D'Angio - Ma Quale Idea

 

Chic - Soup For One

 

HERBIE HANCOCK / BRING DOWN THE BIRDS

 

Isaac Hayes - Ike's Rap II/Help Me Love

 

William DeVaughn "Be Thankful For What You Got"

 

carly simon - why

 

Chaka Khan " Fate "

 

... discovering the originals

I'm not sentimental about sampling and cover version usually, unless a real hash job has been made with its use.

 

The Gary Numan sample in Sugababes probably is the great use of a sample as far as pop is concerned.

 

prefer this one...think this is a better record...

 

Armand van Helden - Koochy

if it's done properly like this:

Rufus Wainwright - Oh What a World

it begins at ~2:20 ;-)

 

 

 

.....then I don't mind ;-)

Edited September 29, 200816 yr by Moonloop

The Gary Numan sample in Sugababes probably is the great use of a sample as far as pop is concerned.

 

I was thinking about this yesterday with reference to their new single. 'Freak Like Me' had already been a club hit mixed by Richard X (as Girls on Top) when he mixed the original Adina Howard vocal with Gary Numan's 'Cars'. I thought it showed great insight and an eye on the underground when the Sugababes management (as I'm not so naive as to believe the girls make any decisions themselves) got them to do a 'cover'.

 

However, 'Girls' is a f***ing shocking cash-in on the popular Ernie K Doe music from the Boots advert. There's no thought there, it's 100% about making cash off the back of recognition.

 

As for sampling in general, when it's done originally and thoughtfully (like Utah Saints mentioned earlier or The KLF at the same time) and actually adds to a piece of music then it's great. When it's done purely for commercial means to make a c**p song sellable ('Girls', Mutya's 'Real Girl', thousands of others) then it should be blocked. Then again, the original artists love the extra royalties.

 

My label's actually been involved in sample clearance...it's amazing how much the stars / labels you're sampling can demand. We approached the Three Degrees to clear a short brass sample in a 12" called Foo' by Poj Masta we released. They initially said they wanted 100% of royalties but settled on 90% (we wanted to make sure Poj who was only a teenager would get some cash!) - all for a three second sample (mind you, it was the main hook of the record). I guess they knew we weren't destined to sell many so just gave us an extremely high 'take it or leave it' offer.

I was thinking about this yesterday with reference to their new single. 'Freak Like Me' had already been a club hit mixed by Richard X (as Girls on Top) when he mixed the original Adina Howard vocal with Gary Numan's 'Cars'. I thought it showed great insight and an eye on the underground when the Sugababes management (as I'm not so naive as to believe the girls make any decisions themselves) got them to do a 'cover'.

 

However, 'Girls' is a f***ing shocking cash-in on the popular Ernie K Doe music from the Boots advert. There's no thought there, it's 100% about making cash off the back of recognition.

 

As for sampling in general, when it's done originally and thoughtfully (like Utah Saints mentioned earlier or The KLF at the same time) and actually adds to a piece of music then it's great. When it's done purely for commercial means to make a c**p song sellable ('Girls', Mutya's 'Real Girl', thousands of others) then it should be blocked. Then again, the original artists love the extra royalties.

 

agreed :)

I was thinking about this yesterday with reference to their new single. 'Freak Like Me' had already been a club hit mixed by Richard X (as Girls on Top) when he mixed the original Adina Howard vocal with Gary Numan's 'Cars'. I thought it showed great insight and an eye on the underground when the Sugababes management (as I'm not so naive as to believe the girls make any decisions themselves) got them to do a 'cover'.

 

However, 'Girls' is a f***ing shocking cash-in on the popular Ernie K Doe music from the Boots advert. There's no thought there, it's 100% about making cash off the back of recognition.

 

As for sampling in general, when it's done originally and thoughtfully (like Utah Saints mentioned earlier or The KLF at the same time) and actually adds to a piece of music then it's great. When it's done purely for commercial means to make a c**p song sellable ('Girls', Mutya's 'Real Girl', thousands of others) then it should be blocked. Then again, the original artists love the extra royalties.

 

Spot on analysis.

 

By the way the Sugababes was formed by Cameron McVey the British music producer, best known for his work with Neneh Cherry (whom he is married to and father of two kids), Massive Attack, Portishead, All Saints, Orson as well as obviously the Sugababes. Although I don't know if he still owns the name as they might be in the same boat as Girls Aloud who bought (out) Louis Walsh to the rights to their band's name for future royalties of 20%.

 

Neneh Cherry - Manchild (1989)

 

So as far as I'm aware should the trio split up and Keisha Buchanan decided to form a girl group with two failed female solo singers Siobhán Donaghy & Mutya Buena then they could not be called The Sugababes. :lol:

 

Spot on analysis.

 

By the way the Sugababes was formed by Cameron McVey the British music producer, best known for his work with Neneh Cherry (whom he is married to and father of two kids), Massive Attack, Portishead, All Saints, Orson as well as obviously the Sugababes. Although I don't know if he still owns the name as they might be in the same boat as Girls Aloud who bought (out) Louis Walsh to the rights to their band's name for future royalties of 20%.

 

however i think an really really really important part was missed out on the history of Cameron "Booga Bear" McVey (tho in cirKus he is calling himself 'burt ford')...and yeah its not about somebody in fashion..or a fashion trendsetter (so not Alexa Chung then!!!!)..or remotely fashionable... well not in these parts....obv :lol: can you see who it is yet.... :lol:

 

"Morgan-McVey

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Morgan Mcvey were a mid-1980s pop duo with a background in fashion photography, video direction and modeling, composed on Jamie Morgan and Cameron McVey. Jamie Morgan has been highly influential as part of Buffalo, a styling team whose streetwise look was typical in the style mags of the time.

 

The group released a single, "Looking Good Diving," through Sony Records in 1986, produced by Stock Aitken Waterman and mixed by Phil Harding. The B side, called "Looking Good Diving (with the Wild Bunch)" featuring Neneh Cherry, was a tribute to the buffalo stance. The B side was rerecorded 2 years later by Neneh Cherry as "Buffalo Stance" and it went to #3 in the UK Charts and the Top 10 around the world in 1988.

 

Jamie J. Morgan also released a single through Sony, a cover of the Lou Reed classic "Walk on the Wild Side," which peaked on the Australia Charts at #23 in April 1990"

 

agreed :)

 

also agreed, I love the original, played to death here

 

sugababes was good but now are too big for their boots (sic) and now can p*** off

now theyve now booted two original members and become trash

 

also agreed, I love the original, played to death here

 

sugababes was good but now are too big for their boots (sic) and now can p*** off

now theyve now booted two original members and become trash

 

'girls' is easily the worst track theyve done, and with girls aloud must be approaching their sell by date (surely theyll want babies soon...lol) it opens the door for a new girlgroup.. i think the shyte-days are in the right place at the right time.

Sugababes haven't always been consistent with their singles. Personally, for every decent single there is atleast 2 iffy ones. These days however, they are in steep decline and this new single is so bloody lazy and forgettable.

 

Thumbs up for Neneh Cherry by the way!

i think the shyte-days are in the right place at the right time.

 

A much blander version to Girls Aloud. They'll need decent tunes is they want to stay around.

And while we're on the topic of covers and samples...

 

 

90s handbag anthem Livin' Joy "Dreamer" gets covered by one quarter of Artic Monkeys. The vocalist add's something to it, along with the wonky garage production values.

Sugababes haven't always been consistent with their singles. Personally, for every decent single there is atleast 2 iffy ones. These days however, they are in steep decline and this new single is so bloody lazy and forgettable.

 

fully agree .... and about the saturdays aswell...

 

apparently frankie is on buzzcocks tomorrow... :lol: lamb to the slaughter i think! :lol: