First things first, there is NO WAY, that this film can be worse than the original which is boring as anything... Honestly for a heist film, you would expect lots of tension and fast paced action and it failed in both.. If this lives up to the Rule Of Remakes then i will have completely have lost faith in Denzel Washington.

 

First things first, there is NO WAY, that this film can be worse than the original which is boring as anything... Honestly for a heist film, you would expect lots of tension and fast paced action and it failed in both.. If this lives up to the Rule Of Remakes then i will have completely have lost faith in Denzel Washington.

 

What? The original was brilliant! No way can Denzel Washington live up to the acerbic wit displayed by Walter Matthau in the original. I mean ... I love Denzel Washington, ever since I saw him in St Elsewhere ... but I can see nothing but bore-fest from him in this! My 12 year old son watched the original Taking of Pelham 1-2-3 just months ago ... and he loved it. This and Charlie Varrick are two of my favourite films from the 1970's.

 

Maybe it was just a bit too 'wordy' for you Joao? :lol:

 

Norma

 

Synopsis and some customer reviews of the film so far - http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1111422/

 

And a trailer for the original

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNGagEjsdVM

Edited July 22, 200915 yr by Norma_Snockers

What? The original was brilliant! No way can Denzel Washington live up to the acerbic wit displayed by Walter Matthau in the original. I mean ... I love Denzel Washington, ever since I saw him in St Elsewhere ... but I can see nothing but bore-fest from him in this! My 12 year old son watched the original Taking of Pelham 1-2-3 just months ago ... and he loved it. This and Charlie Varrick are two of my favourite films from the 1970's.

 

Maybe it was just a bit too 'wordy' for you Joao? :lol:

 

Norma

I LOVE old school films (most of my faves are black and white and before my time), bit surprising coming from my generation but meh so i dont really understand where your coming from with "a bit too wordy", but this just did not do it for me. Even BOTH of my Film Studies teachers agreed on the fact that for a heist movie, which generally are quite faced paced, it is just so SLOW. Dont get me wrong im not asking for T4 kind of "loads of action but no plot" but for a film that is as long as it is, it just didnt work in terms of pace. The slight bit of ironic comedy worked well but just far too long in length for a film that took ages to get to the point.

 

I dont see how Quentin Taratino made Reservoir Dogs as good as it was when he counts the original as his "inspiration" for it.

But you're looking at the original as just a heist movie. When you've got actors of the calibre of Matthau, Shaw, Balsam, Elisondo (coupled with some of the finest smaller supporting character actors) you want more. The script for the original is littered with fantastic bits of comedy. A heist movie for me would be something like 'The Hot Rock' with Robert Redford and George Segal. I don't think of TTOP123 Mk1 as a heist movie - just a bloody good movie.

 

I've seen a couple of trailers for the remake - and yes, you can't go on trailers which is why I want to see this film when its near me. From what I've seen though - Travolta plays the Ryder character as you'd expect any 'nutter bad guy with a gun' in most of today's films. He even dresses the part. Robert Shaw on the other hand played him with subtlety - an absolute maniac and perfectly amenable - which is why - when he shoots the

train conductor

it is a shock. I love the line when towards the end Garber is conducting his conversation with Ryder he says something like '.... y'know when this is all over I suggest you seriously seek out some psychiatric help'. Despite the killing - there is a mutual respect between Ryder and Garber. At the end when

Ryder connects his feet with the rail lines to electrocute himself

Garber actually looks not only horrified but disappointed. You get the feeling he wanted to talk to Ryder - a man on the same intellectual level of himself.

 

I'll cast my review of the remake when I've seen it. Don't get me wrong ... it looks good ... but if it hasn't got Matthau in it ... for me it isn't going to be as good as the original.

 

Finally - I don't quite understand what you mean by The slight bit of ironic comedy worked well but just far too long in length for a film that took ages to get to the point. What point were you expecting? I'd liken the original to a classier episode of Columbo. The crime has been committed .... we know who did it .... its the relationship between Columbo and the villain that is interesting. I think the reason you hate the original is that you were looking at it just as a 'heist' film and not appreciating the acting or the script.

 

Norma

Edited July 23, 200915 yr by Norma_Snockers

Well first, you have to take films for what they are. If its a heist movie then you expect certain things to be in tune with that certain genre, same as you would do with every other genre. Yes ok there are some films which arent so faithful to the "rules" (i used to know so many of the "proper" words for some of the stuff im saying but thats gone completely out of the window along with Film Studies as a subject :lol:) but they can do it correctly. I guess the reason that i found it so boring and long and overall just not a good heist film is because when i was made to watch it, i was told that it was a heist film... I HAD TO DO MY A-LEVEL FILM STUDIES EXAM ON THE HEIST GENRE AND BASE IT ON A FILM THAT WASNT REALLY A HEIST FILM :lol: See my dilemma? :P

I think if i were to watch it any other time and didnt really know what to expect, then i may have appreciated it more... Also i never said anything about not liking the acting or the script... I actually praised the script for the "slightly ironic comedy"

I am so going to see this when it's released, looks good!

Well first, you have to take films for what they are. If its a heist movie then you expect certain things to be in tune with that certain genre, same as you would do with every other genre. Yes ok there are some films which arent so faithful to the "rules" (i used to know so many of the "proper" words for some of the stuff im saying but thats gone completely out of the window along with Film Studies as a subject :lol:) but they can do it correctly. I guess the reason that i found it so boring and long and overall just not a good heist film is because when i was made to watch it, i was told that it was a heist film... I HAD TO DO MY A-LEVEL FILM STUDIES EXAM ON THE HEIST GENRE AND BASE IT ON A FILM THAT WASNT REALLY A HEIST FILM :lol: See my dilemma? :P

I think if i were to watch it any other time and didnt really know what to expect, then i may have appreciated it more... Also i never said anything about not liking the acting or the script... I actually praised the script for the "slightly ironic comedy"

 

I think whoever presented it to you as a heist film was wrong then. If I'd have been your tutor ... I would probably have suggested you watch and do a review on Kubrick's The Killing - the ultimate heist film.

 

I'll be back with my review of the remake when I've seen it. I'm taking my son with me so he can give me his views too - as I say - he loved the original.

 

Have any of your tutors mentioned the film 'Last Year In Marienbad'? And no, its not a heist! If they do ... do not waste your time watching it! You'll be asleep within the first 13 minutes! :lol:

 

Norma

I think whoever presented it to you as a heist film was wrong then. If I'd have been your tutor ... I would probably have suggested you watch and do a review on Kubrick's The Killing - the ultimate heist film.

 

I'll be back with my review of the remake when I've seen it. I'm taking my son with me so he can give me his views too - as I say - he loved the original.

 

Have any of your tutors mentioned the film 'Last Year In Marienbad'? And no, its not a heist! If they do ... do not waste your time watching it! You'll be asleep within the first 13 minutes! :lol:

 

Norma

Lol the reason that we watched this film in the first place is cos we watched Reservoir Dogs as a case study and since Taratino consides this to be his influence, we would find it easy to compare the two for our exam essay. Ive dropped film studies as a subject anyway, mainly cos it took the fun away from watching films and i just found myself not enjoying them as much as i should be. Also due to the teachers ridiculous teaching... And since they were the only teachers i had no other choice...

it took the fun away from watching films and i just found myself not enjoying them as much as i should be.

 

Thats what I found! I'd rather just sit back and watch a film to enjoy it than think about what I'm going to write afterwards. I suppose if you've got time to jot down notes ... the film can't be that good! :lol:

 

Norma

 

Thats what I found! I'd rather just sit back and watch a film to enjoy it than think about what I'm going to write afterwards. I suppose if you've got time to jot down notes ... the film can't be that good! :lol:

 

Norma

Yes! It was like every film i would be like "Interesting piece of cinematography there..." and i just couldnt enjoy films anymore i was always thinking about the camera and the sound and the lighting etc and i just got :arrr: Of course im still gonna think about it when i go to watch a film but not to the extent i was before :lol:

Yes! It was like every film i would be like "Interesting piece of cinematography there..." and i just couldnt enjoy films anymore i was always thinking about the camera and the sound and the lighting etc and i just got :arrr: Of course im still gonna think about it when i go to watch a film but not to the extent i was before :lol:

 

I disagree, I think that doing my degree in Film Studies taught me to appreciate the form more when it's done extremely well.... If you look at something like a Lars Von Trier or David Lynch film, if you study it, you understand what they're doing a lot more.... To be honest, I think it's a good thing to be aware of what a film-maker (or a studio when you talk about mainstream Hollywood product) is actually doing with a film, every film has an agenda, these studio execs aren't thick, they're not just doing this for the fun of it, it's not 'just' entertainment, it also has a wider social and political context which people will often miss if they're not aware and dont have the tools to decode.... Better to be aware of it and be able to make an informed choice about whether to accept or reject the underlying message a film has within its text I feel......

 

A Heist film that isn't really a Heist film - well you could've done "Dog Day Afternoon", that really plays with the genre a fair bit as well.....

 

 

I disagree, I think that doing my degree in Film Studies taught me to appreciate the form more when it's done extremely well.... If you look at something like a Lars Von Trier or David Lynch film, if you study it, you understand what they're doing a lot more.... To be honest, I think it's a good thing to be aware of what a film-maker (or a studio when you talk about mainstream Hollywood product) is actually doing with a film, every film has an agenda, these studio execs aren't thick, they're not just doing this for the fun of it, it's not 'just' entertainment, it also has a wider social and political context which people will often miss if they're not aware and dont have the tools to decode.... Better to be aware of it and be able to make an informed choice about whether to accept or reject the underlying message a film has within its text I feel......

 

I did my degree in film-making too, and although I appreciate some advice and insight that was given ... some of it was given in a 'superior' and 'knowing' sort of way. Luckily one of my tutors was on completely the same wavelength as myself - both of us enjoying Peckinpah, Hitchcock, film-noir, etc. She'd actually been a working actress in her youth so it helped that she knew what she was talking about. At the end of the day though, I was glad to conclude that my opinion was as the next.

 

I'm guessing Grim, that you're about the same age as me - perhaps a bit younger. Where you 'introduced to' Last Year in Marienbad? If so ... what the hell did you make of it?

 

Norma

I'm guessing Grim, that you're about the same age as me - perhaps a bit younger. Where you 'introduced to' Last Year in Marienbad? If so ... what the hell did you make of it?

 

We did the French Nouvelle Vague more - Truffaut, Godard, etc; and those fantastic French Noirs/Policiers - Le Samourai, The Red Circle, Rififi, etc...... Le Samourai should be of interest to fans of John Woo, his film "The Killer" is based a fair bit on the cinema of Jean Pierre Melville...... Of course, there was a great modern day take on these sorts of stylish French thrillers of old done a few years back - The Beat that my Heart Skipped, which I thought was excellent, and "Anything For Her", which I saw a couple months back, was also good.... The French do crime thrillers with so much style and panache.....

 

The original is one of my all time favourite. Brilliant film. I am really glad this is not a remake as such though, apperently it is very different to the original which is a good thing. Denzel Washington never fails to deliver, and Travolta is always great as a villian. A great supporting cast too, and Tony Scott is usually very good with suspece thrillers so I have high hopes.

I'm not really a huge fan of Tony Scott tbh, and I feel that his directorial style has become seriously dated, he's barely progressed since Top Gun, whereas someone like Michael Mann, David Fincher or brother Ridley are always trying out new methods of shooting films.... I'd've preferred someone like Fincher, Mann or Paul Greengrass (the Bourne films) to direct this one, tbh.... Or maybe even Spike Lee, he did a great job of doing "Inside Man" (also a heist caper with a twist) and always seems to get the absolute best out of Denzel Washington....

 

I really like the original as well, it's that touch of black humour and irony that kind of lifts it out of the typical "Heist" sort of fare.... I really dont know why they've decided to give the hijackers actual names.... Is it because all the thickie 'Taranteenies' out there would say, with no sense of irony whatsoever, "oh, they're just ripping off Reservoir Dogs with the colour names..." :rolleyes:

 

Yeah, and Tarantino NEVER ripped off the original film of this and Ringo Lam's "City on Fire" did he....? :lol:

Off to see this a preview of this now so my verdict on it later.

I had posted my review of this the other day but its gone now due to the server change. It was a very solid thriller, with great performances all around, espcially from Denzel and Travolta (who was very amusing). I have to say I thought Tony Scott did a very good job in making this as modern as possible. The opening sequence was very impressive and I also thought the soundtrack was well suited. It certainly was not as good as the original, but was very enjoyable, although the ending was a bit silly. Travolta's charachter did not seem to mind being caught at all, he actually seemed glad about it which was odd :lol:

although the ending was a bit silly. Travolta's charachter did not seem to mind being caught at all, he actually seemed glad about it which was odd :lol:

Did they keep the ending similar to the original :lol: ?

Did they keep the ending similar to the original :lol: ?

 

Nope, not even close.... Then ending in the original is actually quite clever..... :lol:

 

Frankly, I thought the ending of the remake was absolutely silly... All of a sudden, you get overweight, desk-jockey Garber running around like he's Bruce Willis on speed, trying to catch bad guys, which is just straining credibility to the max, imo.... Matthau's character in the original film is a cop (he's Luietenant Garber), so obviously it's far more realistic for him to do what he does... The film also completely airbrushes racial/sexual tensions that punctuated the original also (and it's certainly not as if such ethnic tensions dont still exist in New York..), I thought you'd seriously get a race tension thing going on between Travolta and Washington, but, nah, nothing really, beyond a comment Travolta makes about Washington "In prison, he'd be my bitch".... The complete lack of any kind of semi-important female character as well, I mean, yeah, the original being made in the 70s, it would be rare for a woman to be, say the undercover cop, the hostage negotiator, or working for the Transit authority, but in 2009 the only female characters we (briefly) see is Washington's missus and a hostage....??? That doesn't scan somehow......

 

Like Scotty, I also thought that Travolta almost seemed "glad" to be caught, which really doesn't make much sense.... Maybe he was being philosophical about it, but it all just seemed a bit glib to me, and it really just punctuated the fact that while the original has a carefully thought out, and rather ironic, ending, I really just got the impression that very little thought was put into the finale in the remake....

 

Right... after seeing the remake I actually found it quite good, not bad for a remake I do think the characters from Denzil and Travolta gave a stronger performance, but I do prefer the original.