I think the problem is that in a lot of places, religious institutions are the only institutions who provide certain services, such as summer camps. Which is why I support this Dawkins venture.

 

To broaden the point and comment on the situation here, churches are frequently the only places that provide social services in many of America's poorest urban and rural areas. The state has totally failed to provide decent schools, security, welfare and everything else. In the last bastions of American poverty and suffering -- the inner city ghettos -- churches are the only institutions left. They provide health care, job training, babysitting, activities, even pro bono legal representation and other services.

 

Conservatives and libertarians and the right wing have been deliberately and meticulously killing off all public services since Reagan's 80s and even in many cases giving money to faith organizations to pick up the slack, fooling everyone into thinking churches are the only places that could help the poor and suffering. In my opinion, the state and the government should be responsible for the safety, prosperity and welfare of its people.

I think the problem is that in a lot of places, religious institutions are the only institutions who provide certain services, such as summer camps. Which is why I support this Dawkins venture.

 

To broaden the point and comment on the situation here, churches are frequently the only places that provide social services in many of America's poorest urban and rural areas. The state has totally failed to provide decent schools, security, welfare and everything else. In the last bastions of American poverty and suffering -- the inner city ghettos -- churches are the only institutions left. They provide health care, job training, babysitting, activities, even pro bono legal representation and other services.

 

Conservatives and libertarians and the right wing have been deliberately and meticulously killing off all public services since Reagan's 80s and even in many cases giving money to faith organizations to pick up the slack, fooling everyone into thinking churches are the only places that could help the poor and suffering. In my opinion, the state and the government should be responsible for the safety, prosperity and welfare of its people.

 

thats an interesting perspective .. :)

:lol: When I was 5 I went to a Bible Camp type thing and on the last day they told us that we had killed Jesus and I got really upset cos I thought they were accusing me of murdering him :drama:

now i cant deny that..... however it is only a tool to help people out of their trouble..... it doesnt make the whole concept 'right'. and of course, when someone is 'rescued' god gets the credit when in fact anyone with abit of compassion for a fellow human being can lift their spirits from troubled times.

 

the 'rescued' are nearly always told that god did it, that without god theyd return to being troubled and unhappy.. and that christianity is 'the truth' <_<

 

now what muddled, confused, young teen would want to return to being unhappy and depressed? now that theyve 'found the answer to life'?..

 

Which is why I find it downright sinister tbh.... It's got fukk all to do with "God", it's simply good advice and counselling like you'd get from The Samaritans or any other Counselling service, it's HUMANS HELPING OTHER HUMANS.... Where the hell does "God" enter into the equation.....? Frankly, I dont think that "God" if it ever existed in the first place, even gives a flying fukk about its "creation" anymore... Prayers and Hymn singing are utterly worthless, GOD IS NOT GOING TO FUKKIN' INTERVENE, GET USED TO IT...... -_- Did "God" give a flying fukk when millions of its so-called "Chosen Ones" (ie, The Jews) were being massacred by Hitler and Stalin....?? NO, it did NOT.....

 

Which is why I tend to put a lot more stock into what the Existentialists such as Sartre had to say, and obviously Dawkins as well.....

I think the problem is that in a lot of places, religious institutions are the only institutions who provide certain services, such as summer camps. Which is why I support this Dawkins venture.

 

To broaden the point and comment on the situation here, churches are frequently the only places that provide social services in many of America's poorest urban and rural areas. The state has totally failed to provide decent schools, security, welfare and everything else. In the last bastions of American poverty and suffering -- the inner city ghettos -- churches are the only institutions left. They provide health care, job training, babysitting, activities, even pro bono legal representation and other services.

 

Conservatives and libertarians and the right wing have been deliberately and meticulously killing off all public services since Reagan's 80s and even in many cases giving money to faith organizations to pick up the slack, fooling everyone into thinking churches are the only places that could help the poor and suffering. In my opinion, the state and the government should be responsible for the safety, prosperity and welfare of its people.

 

Good point.... But, let's face it, we all know why this state of affairs came about dont we...? The US Govt has been killing off Social Services because they have the word "Social" in them, which is a bit too close for comfort to "Socialism" for the Republicans (and many Democrats too unfortunately) to bear.... Goes some way to answering the question "Why is America so fukked up?" really...... It also goes some ways as to answering just why it is so many Americans seem to hate Europeans so much... Well, it's because they're jealous of Europe's (particularly France, Germany and Scandinavia) generous and far more all-encompassing Social provisions.....

 

humans by nature tend to need a raison d'etre' , they/we need a focus in life. we find it in a variety of things, kids/family/partner, drink, career, sex, hobbies, sports whatever... these camps fill the young peoples void with religion, which is another reason i think its wrong to target young people.

Good point.... But, let's face it, we all know why this state of affairs came about dont we...? The US Govt has been killing off Social Services because they have the word "Social" in them, which is a bit too close for comfort to "Socialism" for the Republicans (and many Democrats too unfortunately) to bear.... Goes some way to answering the question "Why is America so fukked up?" really...... It also goes some ways as to answering just why it is so many Americans seem to hate Europeans so much... Well, it's because they're jealous of Europe's (particularly France, Germany and Scandinavia) generous and far more all-encompassing Social provisions.....

 

We weren't always this way... It's greed and entitlement left over from the 80s. Unfortunately we never got over it, mostly because corporate/right-wing interests used it to hijack many institutions (media and government being the two most significant). Richard Nixon (a staunch conservative) enacted a health care plan in the 70s that provided better benefits and greater security than the plan Obama is about to fail to pass even with huge popular support and an enormous majority in Congress.

 

It's so sad but this country has become virtually ungovernable... corporations and powerful individuals control the media and the congress. It's legalized corruption on the scale of a Sub-Saharan African or Latin American country.

 

To be fair, Americans don't hate Europeans. But the right wing will continue to propagate anti-European sentiment in order to discourage Euro-style reform that threatens its interests.

 

And finally a word of warning, don't think for an instant that the UK could never experience the same thing. I've watched the American-style commercialization of the media the past 10 years in the UK... it's a worrying sign that the UK could end up ungovernable and entrenched in corporatism in a decade or two.

And finally a word of warning, don't think for an instant that the UK could never experience the same thing. I've watched the American-style commercialization of the media the past 10 years in the UK... it's a worrying sign that the UK could end up ungovernable and entrenched in corporatism in a decade or two.

 

Why do you think I left the UK out of the examples I quoted... I'm all too aware of the "Americanization" that has been occuring in this country over the past 30 years, which started with Thatcher, funnily enough.... :rolleyes: But since 9/11 in particular, the UK has basically become the "Mini Me" to the USA "Dr Evil"... The reason why we got so badly fukked up by the Recession/Credit Crunch is because we're way too tied in with the US system, which is the reason why we've refused to join the Euro amongst other things... France, Germany, etc, have come out of the Global Recession recently, we're still very much in it....

 

TBH, I'm seriously getting sick of this country and what it's become, and am seriously looking at moving to Germany, Holland or Scandinavia.......

 

Why do you think I left the UK out of the examples I quoted... I'm all too aware of the "Americanization" that has been occuring in this country over the past 30 years, which started with Thatcher, funnily enough.... :rolleyes: But since 9/11 in particular, the UK has basically become the "Mini Me" to the USA "Dr Evil"... The reason why we got so badly fukked up by the Recession/Credit Crunch is because we're way too tied in with the US system, which is the reason why we've refused to join the Euro amongst other things... France, Germany, etc, have come out of the Global Recession recently, we're still very much in it....

 

TBH, I'm seriously getting sick of this country and what it's become, and am seriously looking at moving to Germany, Holland or Scandinavia.......

 

 

:o You're thinking of emigrating Scott? :o I may be moving to Philippines soon, had enough of this rubbish country.

:o You're thinking of emigrating Scott? :o I may be moving to Philippines soon, had enough of this rubbish country.

 

They have no welfare state in Phillipines how will you cope ? :o

 

Or are you suddenly going to find a miracle cure for your "depression" and start working ?

They have no welfare state in Phillipines how will you cope ? :o

 

 

You are correct. There are no benefits or pensions. You work to buy food or you starve! If you're disabled or too ill to work then your family has to support you. No sickness or disability benefits at all there. Younger people have to look after and feed and clothe their elderly retired parents. That's why people have big families.

 

Anyway I shall ride the buffalo that my wife owns and plough the rice fields.

Edited September 4, 200915 yr by Crazy Chris

Anyway I shall ride the buffalo that my wife owns and plough the rice fields.

 

will someone pass this post onto the people who pay out our money to this bone idle skiver?

will someone pass this post onto the people who pay out our money to this bone idle skiver?

 

 

:rolleyes: It was a joke only Rob. :rolleyes: Surprised you didn't see it as that! Of course I'm not fit to do that. :(

Edited September 5, 200915 yr by Crazy Chris

:rolleyes: It was a joke only Rob. :rolleyes: Surprised you didn't see it as that! Of course I'm not fit to do that. :(

 

So, what the fukk are you gonna do then, Chris, given that there's no Welfare System in Phillipines for you to sponge off...? Just sponge off your missus....? Jesus Christ, you just have absolutely NO self-respect do you...? <_<

 

So, what the fukk are you gonna do then, Chris, given that there's no Welfare System in Phillipines for you to sponge off...? Just sponge off your missus....? Jesus Christ, you just have absolutely NO self-respect do you...? <_<

 

 

I'm sure all my in-laws there won't see me starve.

I'm sure all my in-laws there won't see me starve.

 

So, that would be sponge then..... -_- You seem to be totally proud of the fact that you're a useless, shameless, parasitical no-mark with zero self-respect... Well, it's really nothing to be proud of, frankly..... I cant believe that you're even saying this sh!t with a straight face tbh.... Do you seriously not see the shame in actually expecting your poor suffering wife's own family to put food in your belly...? Are you so completely without any sense of dignity....? God, I actually feel sorry for you if this is the case.....

I'm sure all my in-laws there won't see me starve.

 

in their culture, you ALL muck in.... you dont help, you dont get fed...

 

PLEASE go there

in their culture, you ALL muck in.... you dont help, you dont get fed...

 

Spot on Rob....