Piers

Obviously, I'd love it if they toured again. But. I feel a lot of the fandom has an optimism about touring I haven't had since 2000. For me, the first round of solo albums laid it out plainly. While their chemistry is amazing, they are a group of people who are just not matched in ambitions and motivation. It just can't work when you have one member who truly thrives when touring...and at least two other members who seem to be a ball of nerves over live singing. The first solo album eras exposed where each member's actual priorities were. After they abandoned promotion of Forever for no good reason (after drafting in the work of very expensive collaborators)...I went from 2001-2006 convinced they'd never tour again. Honestly, I'm surprised they managed to tour in both 2007 and (briefly) in 2019. But even at that...they could be much wealthier people if they kept performing together. And. They just can't do it. Now, the Netflix doc thing...that's different. They should do that, and it's crazy that it's such an ordeal to get it done. Sit your butts down and talk on camera for a few hours. The end.

All three are really good, honestly. Holler is a major highlight of all three of those tours. Technically, I think their best live performance of it is the Christmas in SpiceWorld tour. I think they sound their best here, and their energy is really good too. There really is no indication from this performance (or the rest of the show, really) that the group would be in near-shambles a few months later. There's a real spark to this, and it's my favorite choreography of the song they did. In terms of ideas and staging...I prefer the Return of the Spice Girls tour. The comic book theme's great. Walking the guys down the catwalk was great. There are so many little parts to it. The only minor bummer for me is I think the 1999/2000 choreography is better. In terms of musical arrangement...I go with the 2019 tour. It punches. I love the HOLLER spinning around the ring. I love the dance-off between the Mels. Nearly everything about it is epic. The only thing I don't like...is Emma and Geri drinking tea during the dance battle. I know. It's just a joke. But the other two went to the effort of doing intense choreography. I'd prefer Emma and Geri not doing something distracting in that moment...and just standing in the middle doing superhero poses. But. Eh. The performance is still great. For me, the divide between the three is razor thin. But I'll go 2019.

I agree with a lot of this. Mostly, I wish they'd gone with more of a Best of the Spice Girls setup, rather than a Greatest Hits. I feel like the typical track number for compilation albums was 18. So. I agree with you that I'd add in Step To Me, Never Give Up On The Good Times, and If You Wanna Have Some Fun. NGUOTGT deserves the spot as the obvious single that never was...and IYWHSF should be there as it's just so criminally underrated. It could have finally gotten its flowers. I wish they'd also done a deluxe edition with a CD2 of song demos and the previously unreleased stuff good enough for inclusion. The Greatest Hits era was honestly the best time to open the vault.

I just got around to watching this, and it's good! I like these retrospective videos that examine the era from several angles. Too often, Forever's commercial failure gets blamed firstly on the change in musical direction...and secondly, on the absence of Geri. This video hits those angles...but it also takes on what is (to me) the most important factor; the group's lack of support for the project. The group's reinvention was a gamble...so if there was any chance of pulling it off, it was going to take the group's full commitment. And... Anyway. This video's honest about it. And I also liked how it used the physical releases. A few things showed up in there I hadn't seen before. They were mostly press materials/promotional items...but cool to see anything with the FOREVER logo, really, since the era was so neglected.

I thought this too. The Christmas medley from the 1999 tour is by far my favorite of their Christmas recordings. It carries their spirit, and they're actual good songs. I know Mel B forgot the lyrics, but...I'd still be fine with them leaving it...or perhaps subbing out some vocals from a different tour date. That medley has always sounded to me like it could be a staple of Christmas radio...but I guess I like it better than most. I do like the production of Christmas Wrapping, but I've never thought the song was especially great. With Sleigh Ride, I can't get past that effect on their speaking voices...like it was recorded in a bathroom. Plus, I just wish they did something more interesting with the song...cause the Ronettes version just smokes it. (...side question...did the Spices' version of Sleigh Ride ruin Santa for anyone...?) But. Anyway. Not to be too negative...2 Become 1, Too Much, and Goodbye remain amazing. There.

^ I agree. Though. It's so curious to me that Victoria would willingly float the idea of a Spice Girls show at the Sphere. It's like...Victoria, you have spent ages talking about how you have no passion for music and let everyone else do all the singing...and yet...here you are hyping this idea. Granted, that could be as simple as taking a page from Mel B and Mel C...nothing brings more attention to a solo project interview like talking about a Spice Girls reunion that's not actually going to happen.

Oh. Yeah. I noticed that too...that she's making it sound like she was the last to be convinced to do the 2007/2008 reunion tour. My memory of all this is she was saying as early as 2004 that the only way she'd return to music would be an opportunity to work with the Spice Girls. I was under the impression Victoria was one of the major driving forces of the 2007 reunion...and it was Mel C who had to be persuaded back. Credit to Victoria...she honestly did do a pretty great job of hyping that reunion at the time...

I enjoyed Victoria's Call Her Daddy appearance, and I'm just about done with the doc series (I'll admit...that's taken me a while to finish). If she's feeling creatively fulfilled by the fashion industry, that's the most important thing. But I'm not sure I can think of anyone who experienced as much success in music...who tries as hard to minimize those contributions. For one, when she claims the Spice Girls were four years of her life...is she referring to the group formation up until Geri leaving? Or the years from Wannabe's release to Forever? Both her doc series and the Call Her Daddy interview make it sound like her music career was over by the time Brooklyn was born...but...technically, she would have recorded far more songs after that point than before. The doc series just addresses her solo music career as "I didn't know what I was doing." But. Honestly, we can argue if she picked the right singles out of her material, but the campaigns were always fairly clever. This many years on, I wish she had the clarity to realize...underperforming by her standards had less to do with her than it did...being the fifth Spice-related album to be released in a year? Her claims of not singing when the other girls were have stuck. I have heard co-workers state it matter-of-factly..."You know, they didn't even turn Victoria's microphone on." And then I have to stop myself from sounding like a total nut...wanting to explain "she did her share of lip syncing...but when the others were singing live, so was she. She's just lying about that for...some reason."

So. It occurs to me...when there was that tease in the mailer recently...cryptically including the lyrics to WOMAN... ...that's likely just referring to an upcoming 4K video release of the WOMAN performance at Earls Court.

It's so strange to think of the (admittedly brief) Forever era being 25 years ago...just because I can remember it so clearly. The fan forums were such an exciting place to be in the lead up to the release. It seemed most of the fandom was in love with Holler. The tracks were posted on the old SpiceNews site. I limited myself to listening to only two. Tell Me Why and Right Back At Ya. I wanted to hear the rest of the album when I bought it. Of course, my main memories of this era is how the group botched so much of the release. In the US, the album was out for weeks before the Holler video was debuted on MTV's TRL. It seemed such obvious mistakes were being made. The fan forums had a ton of claims about big upcoming TV appearances...and how the promo blitz was about to kick in. Then...after years of hype, the whole project was just over. It was kinda shocking. But. Anyway. What about the actual album? I've always thought Holler and If You Wanna Have Some Fun are as good as the the group's previous singles run...and I really like Oxygen. The rest of the album, I think, is good...except for Time Goes By. Didn't like it 25 years ago. Don't like it now. I'm partial to the Spice Girls' first two albums...partly because they sound like the work of people who were making the project their top priority. To me...Forever sounds like what it is; good work by a producer (Rodney Jerkins) who's doing his best...but is being overextended by how in demand he was at the time. In fairness to Jerkins, I like what he did for the Spice Girls quite a bit better than his work for Britney Spears. His work for Michael Jackson is punchier, but I don't think he gave MJ any songs as good as Holler. But I have always maintained this. Forever had the makings of a hit, and the group wrecked the potential of a very expensive/high profile project. I have to wonder how differently things would have gone if they'd given Holler and If You Wanna Have Some Fun the same push that Mel C gave I Turn To You...or Victoria gave Out Of Your Mind.

^ Oh wow. I really liked that performance. I'm one of the people who was iffy on the single choice when it came out, so now I've had a bit of time to think on it. I still prefer everything from the Melanie C album era...but I do have to say I really like Sweat's music video...and I also like how all-in Mel was with this performance. So. We are getting some really good stuff from Sweat. I guess some of my hangup with Sweat is it reminds me a bit of latter-career Madonna (I'm also a big fan of her). It's not so much that Sweat sounds like her. It's something else. Madonna's been big on defying expectations around being an older artist in music, and she's right for that. Why would you have to just up and turn into Joni Mitchell after 40? Buuut. In her fight against ageism, Madonna's released a lot of songs that are the most simplistic/shallow of her career. Now. To be fair, Sweat isn't as bad a situation as, say, Madonna's Vulgar or Material Gworrllllllll. And we also don't know if the songwriting simplicity of Sweat represents the full album. Mel may have just wanted to do something pure fun. So. Still looking forward to the album. And if I'm being honest, even if Sweat's not among my favorite of Mel's singles...it does have me more interested in the upcoming album than other lead singles Here It Comes Again and The Moment You Believe did.

I mean. Several of the Spice Girls have a longstanding tradition of using reunion talk as just a way to drive attention to whatever they're promoting. That may be all this is. But...at the same time...is this the first time we've actually heard her sound a little open to performing in ages? I think others have spoken for her a few times and claimed she's up for this and that. But I don't think we've actually heard it from her. Anyway. Not reading too much into it. She also agrees she's open to holograms in this clip (which...hopefully she's kidding by that point...) But The Sphere is an honestly interesting concept for them...and perhaps a plausible one. Being in their 50s, they are not too old to tour. Not even close. However. I don't know how many artists tour in their 50s when they haven't made it a lifestyle by that point. Besides Melanie C...they haven't. I just see a residency as more likely for them if something were to happen. The Backstreet Boys definitely made some waves performing at The Sphere. Each of the girls' shows have been so different, this would provide them with yet another new staging. Plus...there'd be so much going on, it'd be a distraction if one of the girls wasn't as in the zone as the others. Not naming names.

It's not very good...which is kinda a bummer since I think her last few lead singles (Think About It, Anymore, Who I Am) are pretty great and have really held up for me. I guess Sweat could grow on me a bit, but I like everything from the Melanie C album/era quite a bit better. But I'll also admit...the songs by Madonna/Britney where their contributions are mostly spoken word were never my favorite in their catalogues either (...though I think the style fits them better than Melanie). Curious what the performances of this will be like. Anyway. I'm not put off the upcoming album or anything. Looking forward to what she's got in store. I'm just landing at...for her to be gone so long...I was hoping she'd return with more of a song.

^ It's definitely a good song. I think it not doing better on the 2001 charts mostly comes down to...the total avalanche of Spice-related releases that year. It's so bizarre to think...if we're measuring from October 2000 to October 2001, that's five albums by either the group or solo members...and (I think?) nine singles. And to think...there were plans for us to get more than that...if Hot and Forever kept releasing singles. If you were to add up all the solo Spice sales for 2001, I'm sure you'd get a fairly respectable number...but it was inevitable that some releases would be effected at some point. They were asking so much of the group's fanbase by scheduling all their releases on top of each other. Five albums in a year? The fans were mostly very young...limited money to spend...and I'm sure they wanted to also buy records from artists who...y'know...weren't also from the Spice camp. I've always thought the solo Spice run of Take My Breath Away, Not Such An Innocent Girl, and Calling would have performed far better in a less crowded time.

I love Baby Please Don't Stop too, actually. I love the production, the chorus, Emma's vocals. I knew it didn't make a huge splash with the fanbase, but...I dunno. It clicked for me, and I do think it ranks alongside her best solo material. It's true that it could have been released at pretty much any stage of her solo career. But. I chalk that more up to this...once you get past the young pop tracks on A Girl Like Me, the best of Emma's material has a somewhat timeless feel. Now, I will say I'd rank Too Many Teardrops and I Wish I Could Have Loved You More about on the same level. I like all three about equally and think all three were the right choices for singles. My general feel is Baby Please Don't Stop sounds a bit more like a lead single over Too Many Teardrops (though I wish Teardrops got a video, some TV performances and a proper push as a second single). I Wish I Could Have Loved You More is a unique thing because I do think that song commands attention from the jump and would be a unique release for Emma. I consider it among her best vocal showcases. The biggest trouble with that one is...I can't imagine Emma performing it live at all. Emma can pull off lovely live performances, but that song's vocally demanding in a way that...I just don't think she'd chance it going wrong. I also think...after that long a time away...it was best for her to be able to talk about actually writing her comeback single herself.

So... The good: I think her voice is really gorgeous on this. Another perfect vocal for Bunton. The mixed: It does reinterpret the song. The bad: Yeah, I don't like the orchestration of this at all. 2 Become 1 is an uncommonly beautiful 90s pop song...and it's a shame to lose the haunting qualities of it with this. The little flourishes this version brings are more random than anything. This falls into the category of "why would you listen to this over the original?" for me. I do get the logic of it. If Emma's going to make a splash, it's probably safest to go with a nostalgic throw-back. I think there's a little fault in that strategy just because she's already attempted a 2 Become 1 solo cover...that people were indifferent to even with a Robbie Williams feature (that part I think was a mistake, but that's besides the point...). Here's how I see it with Emma. If this is how she wants to express herself musically, she's the artist...and I hope she's fulfilled by it. But that has to be taken with the knowledge that...this level of safe/soft/sweet just isn't where her audience is at by and large.

This is all so interesting about the background of Angels. The Greatest Hits era is such a fascinating thing...with the team behind Angels, George Michael, and Ne-Yo all contacted to write for the girls. It just didn't seem like there was any particular direction. Maybe testing all sorts of things and seeing what worked? I know the concept of someone writing for the girls without them present seems very against their brand...but then, it was clear the five of them were too busy to reunite for studio sessions. Different times perhaps called for a different approach. Obviously, I would love to hear Angels. But my guess is the group probably leaned toward material written with Richard Stannard, Matt Rowe, Emma, and Geri all in the room together. It probably felt at least more authentic to who they are as a group as opposed to "song that almost went to Jordin Sparks" (I don't mean that as a knock on Jordin or the song) I will say this. The Angels writer saying Headlines came through at the last second is a bit of an odd statement. I'm not sure it went exactly like that. Over on the old DenDen forums, we had an insider (she worked for Geri) who was telling us about the progress of two songs Biff's team was doing...a ballad and a party song...that did, indeed, turn out to be Headlines and Voodoo. We also had paparazzi shots of Emma and Geri leaving the studio. I don't remember any of this being absurdly late in the process, per se. I kinda figure the Biff tracks were always likely to be favored...and the Angels writer was only given the bad news late in the game.

Ah...the Forever album cover... Y'know. The fanbase is so divided in perspectives on everything Spice Girls in their careers after 1998. I think the disdain for the Forever album cover might be the one thing we are all most united about. It's still an interesting thing to behold...even 24 years later. The Terry Richardson photoshoot is practically a feat...in how he managed to take four uncommonly beautiful women and repeatedly get unflattering shots of them. Beyond that, though, there's this weird disconnect between Richardson's work and the album it represents. The various solo Spice albums have covers that vary in quality, but I don't think any of them betray the contents of the album quite like Forever does. Does the Forever album cover say "new rnb direction"? I'd argue it says "we've hung up this pop star thing and are now available for hire as entertainment for fancy dinner parties." It's especially weird because there IS a synergy between the music and the two videos we got in Holler and Let Love Lead The Way. Choose collaborators wisely, I suppose. I don't think any of the girls have ever commented on that cover, have they? I remember someone writing an article a while back...saying they were at the photoshoot and witnessed the Virgin reps' nervousness about Richardson using cheap disposable cameras.

^ Yes...and tabloids were so cruel about stars' bodies at that time, I've wondered if she was just trying to avoid that criticism. Even in some interviews she did with these performances, she tended to get draped with extra leather fabrics and what not. I've wondered too if that's why she's practically dressed as a satellite in the second Word Up video...as some sort of distraction. It's to note, though, just how body positive she was through that first pregnancy. I've always really liked Word Up. It reinvents the original into something new and interesting...and something that fits Mel. It's my favorite Spice cover song (group or solo). It did have a few things working against it. The first video was too edgy for her fanbase at the time. Did the chair performances hurt her chart prospects? Um...maybe? I feel like any time the girls have shown any lack of dedication with a project, it hurts its chances.

I figure it would have performed better than We're Not Gonna Sleep Tonight...but also, I don't think anything else on the album commanded attention like What Took You So Long. Personally, I would have released both High On Love AND Better Be Careful as singles off the album. For me...Richard Stannard's three tracks on A Girl Like Me just had the best grasp of what Emma's sound should be in 2001. The album's kinda at an unusual place where half the album has this maturity...and the other half sounds younger than the Spice Girls releases from five years earlier (generally). My memory is that Emma called High On Love her favorite song off the album, so that's part of why I was expecting it to get released. Then A World Without You was a fan favorite...and reviewers had kinda been buzzing around Sunshine On A Rainy Day. All of it led to the feeling of We're Not Gonna Sleep Tonight being a random pick. I'd probably consider it the album's...8th strongest track? Not ideal for a single. Reverting to an earlier conversation...I will say. I get the logic of releasing We're Not Gonna Sleep Tonight. There's a touch of Spice Girls nostalgia...choreography the fans can do alongside Emma. Geri had major success with a Latin-tinged song...Mel C had major success with a heavily remixed single version of one of her tracks. Beyond all that, the singles of the Spice Girls and solo Spice albums to that point tended to showcase the various sides of the artist. My guess is if Take My Breath Away had been as big a hit as What Took You So Long, we would have seen a more expected song as a single...as opposed to the intended shake-up of We're Not Gonna Sleep Tonight.

It's an interesting 'what if'. My general feeling is...the album's issue isn't cohesion. It's just that there were ten new tracks given to us in 2000, and roughly half of them weren't good enough for Mel/the project. I actually think the variety of collaborators is sometimes a strength. Jam and Lewis captured her vibrant positive side with Feels So Good. The Darkchild team allowed her to vent her love life frustrations with Tell Me. Mel's a complex enough person that it made sense to have several collaborators play to the different sides of her. But then you have several tracks in the mix that are personality-free...and wrong enough for Mel's range that session singers do much of the heavy lifting. The Teddy Riley songs mainly. So. While I think the variety of collaborators was a good idea...it needed to be all collaborators who were unified in trying to make the project good. Of course, I wish Missy had at least contributed some new material. With I Want You Back, Missy clearly understood Mel's range and persona. That song fits her like a glove. I did wonder why they didn't work together again. But to Spiceboy's point, yes...releasing just before Forever was going to tank Hot no matter what. To me, Missy's involvement isn't a question of 'would the album be more successful?'...it's a question of 'would it be a better album?'

I think everyone's bringing up valid points...but I will say. I liked it better than most. Yes, some things don't work. Spending so much time with the courtroom is a mistake. I'd kinda argue that movies about trials really only work if they're uncovering something we don't already know. Too much of this courtroom stuff is a rehash of what we saw in the first movie. With the musical numbers, I'll acknowledge several of them don't advance the plot. But. Personally, I didn't mind them. They're shot beautifully. For me, they added a boost of energy. I like musicals in general. Could they have done better with integrating the songs into the story? Yes. But the idea of Arthur escaping into his own head to cope with the world made enough sense to me. I rolled with it. I thought the performances were uniformly excellent. Granted, going in, I'd already heard this wasn't really a co-lead film with Joaquin and Gaga. It's Joaquin as the obvious lead...with Gaga's role just about how she influences him. Her performance doesn't go gleefully off-the-rails in a way people might have anticipated. But for what the script called for...I thought she was great. Oh. I know the ending is a major point of controversy among fans of the first movie. But. I dunno. Without spoiling anything here...I thought both movies had been hinting this is where we were headed? Final thought. I think my fear from the reaction was that the filmmakers had done some soulless cash-in cause the first movie made a billion dollars. Having seen the movie...I do not think that. Regardless of if everything works, I do sense a passion for the filmmaking in this.

I'm seeing the movie tomorrow. I always have a fascination with sequels that so firmly defy audience expectations. You can see that in, say, 1978's The Exorcist 2...and as recently as Halloween Ends. It's not that all the sequels like this are necessarily bad (well, Exorcist 2 is...). But. It's just interesting to me when filmmakers know they'll make the audience mad...and charge forward anyway. Who WANTS to make a fanbase mad? Is it bold? Is it just...unwise? I think it's interesting. And it's certainly sounding like the new Joker film falls into this camp. Here's where I'm at before I see it. Big Gaga fan. There's nothing about it being a musical that I'm opposed to. I didn't like the first movie. I'll acknowledge Joaquin Phoenix deserved all the awards love he got for his performance...while also saying I didn't get much out of the first movie beyond it being a slog to sit through. I know a lot of people feel it's a bold vision...but I'd urge everyone to watch the early 80s movie King of Comedy. Joker is pretty intentionally inspired by that film. They both even have Robert DeNiro in them. But...for me, at least...Joker did blur the line between tribute to the earlier film and blatant rip-off. So...all that said, I'm hoping I can be one of the ones to like the sequel a smidge better than most people? It's definitely the movie to pile onto and hate at the moment.

Know how I know the Geri/Starbucks story isn't real? A Halloween-themed ad campaign would have required her to dress in fall colors. And...well. We know six-figures still wouldn't be enough to get her in anything other than white. Though. It's Halloween. I guess she could be a ghost... But. No. Really. I'm not buying it. It's all 'sources say'. I'm not seeing any outlets I'd consider reputable reporting it. I also just don't think any of this makes sense. Why would it only be Geri? Wouldn't it make more sense for at least a four-piece Spice Girls to front a pumpkin spice campaign? It's Starbucks. They could afford it. Also. Starbucks is a US-based brand...and all four of the other girls have done better at maintaining a profile here than Geri has. Geri's a part of 90s pop culture, but she...by herself...wouldn't mean much to a US audience in 2024. Starbucks partners in the past with Oprah and Taylor Swift, and now they're going with solo Geri? I guess you could argue she could be used in specific global markets. But. A year of negotiations and six figures for just Geri wouldn't be worth it to Starbucks. This story is shenanigans, I tell you!

In defense of Stop's release date...when the release schedule was coming together, could the girls have known how huge It's Like That was going to be? That's an honest question, actually. It's Like That turned out to be one of the biggest hits of 1998 in the UK. But...to people living there at the time...how far back did people see that coming? It's certainly a bit random to me. It's a remix of an early 80s song from a group that hadn't been especially active in a while. For contrast, here in the US, the It's Like That remix didn't break the top 100 at all. If the girls had released much earlier in the month, they would have been up against Celine Dion's My Heart Will Go On...the gargantuan soundtrack song from Titanic, practically the movie of the decade. It's also one of only two 1998 singles to outsell It's Like That in the UK. If they released earlier than Celine, they would have been up against Madonna's Frozen...an epic lead single from the album the world was heralding as her career best. Honestly, if I were the girls, I would have chosen to go up against It's Like That too...