Then with all due respect they are lazy, they work to live as opposed to live to work

 

Work and making money is the most important thing in life imho, apart from good health, if they are in good health they should just get on with it

 

Bernie Ecclestone is stilll working at 83, Jackie Stewart in his 70s, Murray Walker still goes to most F1 races at 90, the ones who are under 50 odd and moaning dont have a strong work ethic, i bet they take a sickie the day after england games or of the weather is great

 

It is right that people work longer before getting a pension, with advances in medicine and prosperity people are living longer and longer

 

20 years ago people would retire at 65 and typically be dead by 75, now people who are 65 can expect to live to 80 and beyond due to improved medicine

That's cool for you and all, but loads of people think there's far more to life than work and making money - though they are doubtless important. I agree retirement ages should increase given the increases in life expectancy, but it doesn't necessarily indicate laziness that some people aren't overjoyed to be working until 70 - though I do realise empathy isn't really your strong point.

Also amazing that those three examples are less hard working pensioners and more people enjoying their hobby. And the same one at that!

That's cool for you and all, but loads of people think there's far more to life than work and making money - though they are doubtless important. I agree retirement ages should increase given the increases in life expectancy, but it doesn't necessarily indicate laziness that some people aren't overjoyed to be working until 70 - though I do realise empathy isn't really your strong point.

 

agree, ta, and also descento, agree - bit of a difference being 70 and manual labouring, or having someone operate on you.

 

Sandro, Believe me work is hard when you get into your 50's and 60's, constantly tired and friends and family regularly drop dead before reaching retirement. Already. I'm talking 50's here... Whooppee for those fit enough and loving their job enough to work till 70 but some of us are stuck doing stressful, difficult jobs for crap money for, ooh, most of our lives. And no, it's nothing to do with lack of ability, I'm very good at my job and widely appreciated from people at the top politically and man in the street. I'm 55 and already permanently tired.

 

Assume, Sandro, your company goes bankrupt (it happens) and you have to work as a dustman till you are 70. Might not be so keen, then, maybe......?

 

PS, we do get just get on with it. There's no time for anything else with ongoing job cuts, every day is a struggle to keep up. If there were jobs (which there arent) we would of course move on. In the meantime, we shut up and get on with it.

Edited December 5, 201311 yr by popchartfreak

I see no receipts, just right-wing horse shit. You entirely avoided my point there craig.

 

Either find me evidence to back up your ridiculous claims or can it. And avoid that evil woman, this isn't the 80's. The situations are so completely different it's pointless me even trying to point out how different they are because anyone with a brain cell can see it.

 

I see you also haven't taken me up on my deal. Which would suggest you have no evidence and are just spraying the forum with verbal diarrhoea.

 

My evidence is anecdotal, seeing many people remortgage their properties in order to buy a new car, extension, luxury holiday or whatever

 

I have seen family do it, friends do it, business acquaintances do it

 

Whether i am right or not will not be provable till May 15

Maybe because rent is so ludicrously high? It would cost £380 p/m to rent a one bed flat near me in a half-decent (by no means good) area near me, that's more than any of my friends who own houses pay on mortgage payments.

 

When I buy a house it's because I want somewhere to live and have something that's mine and can make my own rather than give money to some rich landlord, I generally won't care whether the price goes up, down or stays static, unless it's a massive difference.

 

If I buy a house for £100k why is it good if in 5 years time the price has gone up 20%? If I want to move to a bigger house or better area the chances are the price of the house I'm going to be moving into will also be around 20% higher, so how on earth does that make me better off than if the values were still the same?

 

Yes but once you have a mortgage and you see prices going up you can borrow against the value of your property to buy luxury items or start a business or whatever

 

Remortgaging and borrowing against the equity of the property is commonplace, not far off the norm either

 

If you buy a property for 100k and it goes up in value to 120k and you have a cashflow crisis or fancy a new car or fancy starting a business you got a nice reserve of money to tap into

Edited December 6, 201311 yr by Sandro Raniere

Lyndon Crosby also ran Michael Howard's campaign in 2005. And you thinking Romney would win last year doesn't mean 'many people thought Romney would win'. Any psephologist worth their salt knew the fundamentals of Obama's voting coalition favoured Obama to win last year. You really overestimate the impact one person can have on a campaign - it doesn't really matter how amazing the two people leading the campaign are when you're targeting seats where Labour themselves will be fighting tooth and nail and where we won in 2010 anyway. The likes of Middlesborough aren't going to be going Tory because of house prices and Jim Messina, and you reall show up how amateur your projections are if you think they will.

 

The election wont be decided in the likes of Middlesborough, the key battlegrounds are the midlands, essex and the south west, the north will go red, not worth putting much effort into a campaign there

12% lead for Labour last night btw :kink:

 

Even though that's probably an outlier, more important is this:

 

 

Which of the following do you agree with most?:

George Osborne who says his long-term plan for economic recovery is working: 24%

Ed Balls who says George Osborne is in denial about the cost-of-living crisis: 40%

Neither: 27%

Don't know: 10%

 

Much for all the bizarre back-slapping among Tories yesterday, I think they should be happy that Osborne smugly telling people who are on the breadline that they don't know how good they've got it has been knocked off the headlines.

 

That's cool for you and all, but loads of people think there's far more to life than work and making money - though they are doubtless important. I agree retirement ages should increase given the increases in life expectancy, but it doesn't necessarily indicate laziness that some people aren't overjoyed to be working until 70 - though I do realise empathy isn't really your strong point.

 

When i was a kid old people would work till 65, get a nice watch as a leaving present and then live 5 to 10 years before they died

 

With medical advances and greater prosperity they can typically live about 20 years past retirement

 

In 30 years time i suspect dying in 90s or 100 will be the norm, so i dont think it is unreasonable asking people to work a few more years

 

 

12% lead for Labour last night btw :kink:

 

Even though that's probably an outlier, more important is this:

Which of the following do you agree with most?:

George Osborne who says his long-term plan for economic recovery is working: 24%

Ed Balls who says George Osborne is in denial about the cost-of-living crisis: 40%

Neither: 27%

Don't know: 10%

 

Much for all the bizarre back-slapping among Tories yesterday, I think they should be happy that Osborne smugly telling people who are on the breadline that they don't know how good they've got it has been knocked off the headlines.

 

Mandela dying helped labour a lot, after Ed Balls producing one of the worst parliamentary performances in living memory and being ridiculed all across the media labour got a get out of jail free card with Mandela dying

 

Mandela dying means instead of the focus being on Balls and labour it is on Mandela

 

 

Craig, have you got everyone else who uses this forum blocked or are you deliberately not responding to what we say directly?

 

Literally of the 130 times you've posted in this topic I think everything you've said could be boiled down into about five.

Yes but once you have a mortgage and you see prices going up you can borrow against the value of your property to buy luxury items or start a business or whatever

 

Remortgaging and borrowing against the equity of the property is commonplace, not far off the norm either

 

If you buy a property for 100k and it goes up in value to 120k and you have a cashflow crisis or fancy a new car or fancy starting a business you got a nice reserve of money to tap into

Can I just add as someone who bought for the first time just this summer that now I'm on the property ladder it really doesn't matter whether prices go up or not as when I come to sell I'll only pay more for wherever I move to so it's only important for those getting houses by inheritance (when they already have their own house in addition) or those getting on the ladder in the first place- I think this point has already been made.

 

 

As for re-mortgaging and borrowing- yes it makes it possible but do you really want ANOTHER boom based on debt? Surely that's how we got here? Don't get me wrong I'm far from a labour supporter (as many will know) but having the option of borrowing against your home will only ultimately lead to repossession/ housing market collapse later on down the line when you over-reach yourself.

 

On a general note I think the GE could go either way in my opinion but I doubt there will be any great swing either way.

The election wont be decided in the likes of Middlesborough, the key battlegrounds are the midlands, essex and the south west, the north will go red, not worth putting much effort into a campaign there

 

Labour won't (and don't need to) make big gains in Essex and the southwest. They'd need a 1997-type landslide for that, and noone is expecting that. If they take the majority of marginals where they came within 6-8% of the Tories in the north, Wales and Midlands* then that's more than enough to get a majority even without making many gains in Essex and the home counties (even though that would probably come as a shock to the media who never venture further north than Milton Keynes so simply can't fathom how a party could win even while being unpopular in the south).

 

* Slight tangent, why do you keep claiming the Midlands is booming? Unemployment there is still above the national average, and more importantly, wage growth in the East Midlands especially is the slowest of anywhere in the UK. And no, house prices booming there won't matter one bit.

Middlesborough is the exact kind of seat the Tories need to be winning to make the gains you're on about Craig.

In 30 years time i suspect dying in 90s or 100 will be the norm, so i dont think it is unreasonable asking people to work a few more years

Err...life expectancy wasn't in the sixties in the 80s. Advances won't be that big for average life expectancy to be that high in thirty years, even if I do agree retirement ages should increase.

And given the polling work for that poll would've been done a few days ago (i.e. before Mandela died), that's not going to be the reason for the Labour boost. Which is in likelihood a big outlier.

Can I just add as someone who bought for the first time just this summer that now I'm on the property ladder it really doesn't matter whether prices go up or not as when I come to sell I'll only pay more for wherever I move to so it's only important for those getting houses by inheritance (when they already have their own house in addition) or those getting on the ladder in the first place- I think this point has already been made.

As for re-mortgaging and borrowing- yes it makes it possible but do you really want ANOTHER boom based on debt? Surely that's how we got here? Don't get me wrong I'm far from a labour supporter (as many will know) but having the option of borrowing against your home will only ultimately lead to repossession/ housing market collapse later on down the line when you over-reach yourself.

 

On a general note I think the GE could go either way in my opinion but I doubt there will be any great swing either way.

 

People should not over extend themselves but if they can afford to remortgage to treat themselves or renovate their property then they are helping the overall economy and helping to create jobs

 

The important thing right now is to create the market conditions to ensure a tory majority in 2015

Labour won't (and don't need to) make big gains in Essex and the southwest. They'd need a 1997-type landslide for that, and noone is expecting that. If they take the majority of marginals where they came within 6-8% of the Tories in the north, Wales and Midlands* then that's more than enough to get a majority even without making many gains in Essex and the home counties (even though that would probably come as a shock to the media who never venture further north than Milton Keynes so simply can't fathom how a party could win even while being unpopular in the south).

 

* Slight tangent, why do you keep claiming the Midlands is booming? Unemployment there is still above the national average, and more importantly, wage growth in the East Midlands especially is the slowest of anywhere in the UK. And no, house prices booming there won't matter one bit.

 

I would not say anywhere is booming bar London and say 40 or 40 miles around it but one area that is doing very strongly atm is manufacturing, especiallly the car manufacturing industry, and the South/West/East midlands is a manufacturing heartland so as the economy continues to improve so there is a good chance that people in the midlands exposed to manufacturing will start to feel better off

Middlesborough is the exact kind of seat the Tories need to be winning to make the gains you're on about Craig.

 

Geordies would never vote for tories, I just don't see it

And given the polling work for that poll would've been done a few days ago (i.e. before Mandela died), that's not going to be the reason for the Labour boost. Which is in likelihood a big outlier.

 

The poll must have been taken before Balls's shambolic speech on Thursday, will be interesting to see the results over the coming days

 

 

People should not over extend themselves but if they can afford to remortgage to treat themselves or renovate their property then they are helping the overall economy and helping to create jobs

 

The important thing right now is to create the market conditions to ensure a tory majority in 2015

And that is how people end up in negative equity. Also there are millions of people who did that last time and then when interest rates rose they found they could no longer afford the payments because the banks had conned them into thinking they were getting a cheap loan.

 

We can not build a recovery on credit, it will just lead to another bust that will once again threaten to collapse our banking system.

 

I would not say anywhere is booming bar London and say 40 or 40 miles around it but one area that is doing very strongly atm is manufacturing, especiallly the car manufacturing industry, and the South/West/East midlands is a manufacturing heartland so as the economy continues to improve so there is a good chance that people in the midlands exposed to manufacturing will start to feel better off

Last time I checked the best performing car manufacturing plant in the UK was actual the Nissan plant at Sunderland, which has been continuously praised as one of the best in the world. Renault and Nissan's CEO, Carlos Ghosn, has promised it'll close if the UK votes to leave the EU.