I had MANY issues with RTD's tenure of the show, being overly focused on emotional aspects of the story being prime among them. Those final 4 specials were largely dreadful as a result of them being as much of a wrap up of HIS time as the 10th Doctor's.

 

I fully expected Moffat to come in and be brilliant, and for a time he was. However as his tenure has gone on the show has gradually gotten worse and worse. I'm quite certain that isn't entirely his fault but in the role he is in the buck stops with him as far as I'm concerned. The first 3 episodes of this series each sum up my issues with him perfectly. The first episode was actually quite a strong story but it felt rushed and like the story had been made to fit the lofty idea rather than coming up with an actually strong story and building an episode round that. The second episode was just an utter, utter mess and really showed that the characters are actually a little 2D right now so it's hard to actually CARE about any of them and the whole 'love' as a deus ex machina type plot device is so obscenely abysmal it would have been savaged had it been most other shows of that ilk. Episode 3 showed much more promise but the whole 'sing song' aspect was contrived and it just felt like the pieces of the puzzle were all there but totally jumbled.

 

Again some of that is down to the writing and not him specifically but he does have a large say in the direction the show goes and for me it's fundamentally wrong right now. I LOVED the arc centric aspects of the previous 2 series and I think that totally worked but Clara feels like a carbon copy of a carbon copy and as a result, despite actually really liking HER, couldn't give a fig about her story/place in the universe. What the show needs next is someone who can take the good aspects of episodic TV like what RTD did and the good aspects of arc centric TV like S5/6 and blend the 2. I don't think Moffat is capable of that and I can only see it getting worse as his tenure continues.

 

RTD's era was abysmal. Can't sum it up any other way, TBH. :lol:

 

There are a lot of people that don't fully 'get' Moffat's era, because of the contrast it had to RTD's era. RTD's time on the show was filled with lots of fun, light-hearted family episodes, and Moffat's era is dark, complex, and opens a lot of doors and directions for the show to go in - quite a big difference between the two, so it's understandable that a lot of the audience have taken a bit of time to adjust to that.

 

The show as a whole in Moffat's era has (in my opinion) gone from 'a good start' (series 5) > 'out-of-this-world fantastic' (series 6) > 'good on first watch, but on second not as mesmerising (series 7A) > 'WOW' (series 7B). Are we talking about series 7B alone, though - because The Rings of Akhaten was episode 2, thought for a moment you were meaning Cold War was all about 'sing song', haha.

Moffat is, of course, the head writer, but I don't understand why he is always blamed for any episodes which are not deemed 'excellent', or don't meet the standards of the normal viewer (Whovians galore). His episodes have gone from strength to strength, getting better with every series (particularly his opening episodes, they're fresh, inviting and exhilarating). Most of the criticism from series 7B has thus far been directed at Neil Cross and Mark Gatiss (The Rings of Akhaten and Cold War). It was rather obvious that The Rings of Akhaten had a load of deleted scenes, and if the episodes had been an hour in length, I'm sure it would have made more sense to everybody. Moffat obviously commissions episodes from writers because of their original ideas, the stories they go to him with, and what they write at the start, and the final draft of the script. Once it's all filmed, the BBC just take it and cut it so that it can fit into the 45-minute time slot that the show has, and it's unfortunate that sometimes it doesn't make 100% full sense to the viewers. Moffat surely can't be to blame for that?

 

I understand where you're coming from about Clara, though. I think the main problem with her character is that we have obviously seen her in Asylum of the Daleks and The Snowmen prior to appearing as a full-time companion in series 7B, and what has happened is that we have been so excited and drawn in by what she has had to offer in the two one-off appearances in said episodes, and the mystery dragged us in, that we can't feel anything else for this 'third version' of her. Being a normal human on earth (or so it seems), it's not making people want to see more of her, and want to find out who or what she actually is. Hopefully by The Name of the Doctor, though - people can form a final opinion given we'll (hopefully) be finding out who she actually is.

The only person I could see succeeding Moffat and filling his rather large boots is Tom MacRae (Rise of the Cybermen/Age of Steel/The Girl Who Waited). He has written three fantastic scripts. Possibly, he could get a few new writers in as well. I think that's another problem with the current Doctor Who eras (both RTD's and Moffat's) - there is only a select few writers being chosen to show off their abilities. Giving a writer two separate episodes to write, instead of a two-parter is rather silly (looking at Moffat). Either give somebody else the opportunity to show off their talent (somebody that has never written for the show before, or somebody who hasn't written for the show in a long time), or get a two-parter written. Chris Chibnall and Mark Gatiss in particular are two writers who, whilst writing fabulous scripts (most of the time), are being given special attention from Moffat, and not allowing anybody else to write episodes. Chris Chibnall's first episode of series 7A was dreadful, and the second was a masterpiece. I'd have preferred The Power of Three to be a two-parter, rather than see Dinosaurs on a Spaceship.

See, having read that I fully understand where you are coming from but I fundamentally disagree with a lot of it. I guess it just comes down to what we want from the show. For me S5 was superb, an almost perfect mix of the RTD stuff (which for me was VERY good, but ultimately flawed through his over-reliance on simplistic and overly obvious storytelling and patronising the intelligence of the viewer towards the end) and the new arc centric, more complex, rewarding viewing.

 

Then S6 came along and it sort of fell off the rails somewhat. The arc was good, but the conclusion wholly unsatisfying for me. It felt like the exact antithesis of RTD's stuff. Let's NOT tell them ANYTHING beyond the bare minimum and as a result they'll definitely be more interested in coming back. That's not a great way to run a show I don't think. By all means set up a mystery and carry it over a series if you wish, but the show has now gone so far to the opposite end of the spectrum it's almost as bad as the 4 RTD specials, albeit for entirely the opposite reasons. It's contrived, joyless (some of the time anyway) and needlessly complex and up its own arse. I realise that Moffat isn't entirely to blame for that and the other 'favoured' writers should get some of the blame too, but at the end of the day the man in charge WILL get the flack because he can be the one to change those others' decisions if they aren't working.

 

And yes I am referring to 7B, for me 7A was fine but much like 7B a bit uneven in terms of quality. Some very good ideas but the execution was lacking. It just feels like they don't QUITE have the courage of their convictions. Take foe example last weeks episode, by far my favourite of 7B (and probably S7 overall). It owed more to RTD style storytelling than anything else, but it was SUCH an enormous breath of fresh air. It also managed to advance the arc (albeit in a totally ludicrous way - seriously, HOW did those kids get those pics? Is it just going to be chocked up to some time space mumbo jumbo or something equally ludicrous about the great intelligence or and indeed I expect this - not explained AT ALL) whilst still being an individually compelling story.

It also managed to advance the arc (albeit in a totally ludicrous way - seriously, HOW did those kids get those pics? Is it just going to be chocked up to some time space mumbo jumbo or something equally ludicrous about the great intelligence or and indeed I expect this - not explained AT ALL) whilst still being an individually compelling story.

I don't quite understand how they managed to retrieve them either. My best guess is that the Great Intelligence planted them in Clara's computer, though, so that they would be found by somebody (being the children).

See, having read that I fully understand where you are coming from but I fundamentally disagree with a lot of it. I guess it just comes down to what we want from the show. For me S5 was superb, an almost perfect mix of the RTD stuff (which for me was VERY good, but ultimately flawed through his over-reliance on simplistic and overly obvious storytelling and patronising the intelligence of the viewer towards the end) and the new arc centric, more complex, rewarding viewing.

 

Then S6 came along and it sort of fell off the rails somewhat. The arc was good, but the conclusion wholly unsatisfying for me. It felt like the exact antithesis of RTD's stuff. Let's NOT tell them ANYTHING beyond the bare minimum and as a result they'll definitely be more interested in coming back. That's not a great way to run a show I don't think.

This pretty much sums up how I'm feeling. Moffat was the obvious choice to take over RTD and Series 5 is a very well-crafted stylistic series. However, it's as if he keeps on coming up with these great ideas but they aren't fully explained. This may be because he wants to keep people watching or because he doesn't know how to tie up these ideas. If it's the former, then viewers arenmt loyal enough to care and forget about these things. It could be the latter as the fact that the TARDIS exploded hasn't even been mentioned as to why since and it feels as though River Song's identity was thought of along the way. It was meant to be a massive game changer and something the Doctor should be annoyed at her for but actually she's just Amy and Rory's daughter. The conclusion to The Wedding of River Song and, to a lesser extent, The Pandorica Opens/The Big Bang were just totally unsatisfying whereas the conclusions to the RTD eras were great even if not realistic. Some other annoyances from the Moffat era is the lack of focus on the endings, all the Timey-Wimey nonsense (it was GOOD in Blink but it's been overused) and his focus on trying to grab headlines. The lack of great endings is particularly seen in Cold War where it's somehow resolve by Clara singing? The fact that Doctor Who can reinvent itself is what makes me unworried about the fall in ratings and I think rather than a change in Doctor it needs a change of exec. When he does go, I still hope he returns to write for the show.

 

In relation to Clara, I agree with Calum that the modern version is a bit of a let down after the previous two incarnations. I think I said it before, but the fact that we don't know much about her and who she is makes her a bit bland and lacking in personality. However, I really do like Jenna-Louise and so I hope/think this will be resolved in the finale.

This pretty much sums up how I'm feeling. Moffat was the obvious choice to take over RTD and Series 5 is a very well-crafted stylistic series. However, it's as if he keeps on coming up with these great ideas but they aren't fully explained. This may be because he wants to keep people watching or because he doesn't know how to tie up these ideas. If it's the former, then viewers arenmt loyal enough to care and forget about these things. It could be the latter as the fact that the TARDIS exploded hasn't even been mentioned as to why since and it feels as though River Song's identity was thought of along the way. It was meant to be a massive game changer and something the Doctor should be annoyed at her for but actually she's just Amy and Rory's daughter. The conclusion to The Wedding of River Song and, to a lesser extent, The Pandorica Opens/The Big Bang were just totally unsatisfying whereas the conclusions to the RTD eras were great even if not realistic. Some other annoyances from the Moffat era is the lack of focus on the endings, all the Timey-Wimey nonsense (it was GOOD in Blink but it's been overused) and his focus on trying to grab headlines. The lack of great endings is particularly seen in Cold War where it's somehow resolve by Clara singing? The fact that Doctor Who can reinvent itself is what makes me unworried about the fall in ratings and I think rather than a change in Doctor it needs a change of exec. When he does go, I still hope he returns to write for the show.

 

In relation to Clara, I agree with Calum that the modern version is a bit of a let down after the previous two incarnations. I think I said it before, but the fact that we don't know much about her and who she is makes her a bit bland and lacking in personality. However, I really do like Jenna-Louise and so I hope/think this will be resolved in the finale.

The TARDIS exploding was explained, though? The only thing we don't know in regards to that chain of events is who wanted to blow it up (presuming it wasn't the Silence, and that the voice saying 'Silence will fall' wasn't an early version of the sinister Silence voices).

 

I would hope that Moffat would stay on to write for the show when he does end his time as head writer. But with RTD, he's always wanted to come back himself, but Moffat's never asked him (quite rightly so, too - he'd make it shit :P).

The TARDIS exploding was explained, though? The only thing we don't know in regards to that chain of events is who wanted to blow it up (presuming it wasn't the Silence, and that the voice saying 'Silence will fall' wasn't an early version of the sinister Silence voices).

That's what I meant, we don't know who blew it up. It's obviously not TOO important but it would be nice to know considering the actual explosion was so vital to the plot. :lol:

Edited May 9, 201312 yr by Rabbit Heart

I think if RTD came back now it would be only be to the shows benefit. He could temper things a little and bring some dimension back to the characters. The grass is always greener though I guess, I mean back in 2009 I would have scoffed at the idea of anyone telling me I'd ever want him back.

I would hope that Moffat would stay on to write for the show when he does end his time as head writer. But with RTD, he's always wanted to come back himself, but Moffat's never asked him (quite rightly so, too - he'd make it shit :P).

Moffat has asked him back btw, it was in an issue of DWM but RTD thought it was too soon.

Ah, thank god he turned it down then. He needs to concentrate on a new series of Torchwood, as well as Series 2 of Wizards vs. Aliens. :dance:

The last episode made me wish that Jenny Flint was the doctor's companion and not Clara.

 

I'd love to see a spin off show with Madame Vastra, Jenny and Strax.

Edited May 9, 201312 yr by Sabrewulf

I still think of Matt as recent and fresh, and would like him to stay on a while yet. Interesting opinions on the 2 driving forces behind the Who comeback I hadn't realised they were viewed so differently, but I think both deserve to be worshipped for successfully re-inventing/continuing Dr Who for a modern generation and making it bettr than it had ever been before. I speak as someone who watched the very first episode as a 5-year-old, went to the pictures to see the films, and wrote and drew pictures of Dr Who in my schoolbooks in 1964 (still have them) cos I was obsessed with Dr Who (and pop music). Still love both.

 

Troughton & Tom Baker were good times overall, others sporadically good, but Ive been just as excited (if not more so) with the last 3 doctors as I ever was with old faves, and the quality of writing has largely been very good to brilliant. Even if it's dipped a bit lately it's still my only must-see drama show....

 

 

None of the classic Doctors beat Jon Pertwee for me. :wub: Some of the best stories... The Claws of Axos, Inferno, Spearhead from Space, Planet of the Daleks, etc.

 

Rumours have surfaced that John Hurt's character in the 50th Anniversary is

the REAL 9th Doctor (from between the 8th Doctor [Paul McGann] and the 9th Doctor [Christopher Eccleston])

, which leads me to thinking that the secret that will be uncovered in The Name of the Doctor is that

Matt Smith's incarnation is actually the 12th Doctor.

 

None of the classic Doctors beat Jon Pertwee for me. :wub: Some of the best stories... The Claws of Axos, Inferno, Spearhead from Space, Planet of the Daleks, etc.

 

Oddly enough I missed the first 2 seasons of Pertwee as my dad was in the RAF and we were living in Singapore - where TV there repeated all the Troughton 68/69 episodes in 70/71, so i got to see 5 years of Troughton (and therefore saw the missing episodes twice) and 2 of Pertwee (the first I saw back in the UK was a xmas compilation repeat of The Daemons which was good) so Troughton was really "my" doctor more than any other...:) I still havent seen all the Pertwee episodes. :o

It may cause outrage but I actually really like Sylvester McCoy. Tom Baker and Patrick Troughton are my other favourites. Jon Pertwee is very good but his kung-fu skills annoy me too much. :lol:

It may cause outrage but I actually really like Sylvester McCoy. Tom Baker and Patrick Troughton are my other favourites. Jon Pertwee is very good but his kung-fu skills annoy me too much. :lol:

Sylvester's underrated. :( He had some really good stories, and the best companions (aka Ace in Remembrance of the Daleks, The Curse of Fenric, etc).

Sylvester's underrated. :( He had some really good stories, and the best companions (aka Ace in Remembrance of the Daleks, The Curse of Fenric, etc).

 

his last season, when he got all dark, showed what might have been if a certain so n so hadnt taken it as his mission to cancel a moderately watched TV show and replace it with a totally rubbish one that few liked....

 

Great to see Sylvester in The Hobbit being all manic too:)

 

 

A picture from The Name of the Doctor has emerged:

 

http://doctorwhotv.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/series-7-whispermen-nt.jpg

Sylvester's underrated. :( He had some really good stories, and the best companions (aka Ace in Remembrance of the Daleks, The Curse of Fenric, etc).

McCoy was pretty good in places but not Ace. Never Ace. She remains probably my my hated companion ever (alongside Bonnie Langford).

 

Best companions?

 

Sarah-Jane (just lovely)

 

Leela (nice interplay with her being smarter than The Doctor in so many ways despite being the savage)

 

Nyssa (painfully wasted from a great start)

 

K-9 (cheesy but fun and I was a child)

 

Romana II (obvious chemistry)

 

Amy Pond (I miss her)

 

Ian & Barbara (because I still believe the show should be educational too, but be fun with it)

 

Actually that last point touches on what I feel is a big flaw lately. There's too much technobabble and nonsensical 'science' in there when sometimes it could be done better without it. The Doctor also relies too much on the sonic screwdriver to solve nearly everything. It was the same reason they destroyed it in the 80s and why K-9 was scrapped. It allows the writers to be lazy.

 

 

Best companions?

 

Sarah-Jane (just lovely)

 

Leela (nice interplay with her being smarter than The Doctor in so many ways despite being the savage)

 

Amy Pond (I miss her)

 

Actually that last point touches on what I feel is a big flaw lately. There's too much technobabble and nonsensical 'science' in there when sometimes it could be done better without it. The Doctor also relies too much on the sonic screwdriver to solve nearly everything. It was the same reason they destroyed it in the 80s and why K-9 was scrapped. It allows the writers to be lazy.

I agree with those three. :D I miss Amy too. :cry:

 

I agree about the sonic screwdriver - it seems now that it's capable of destroying/unlocking/solving nearly everything, and as you say, it allows the writers to be lazy with scripts, and think "Oh, he's got the sonic screwdriver, so there, problem solved".

Back in Season 8 but not in all of the episodes, how is that going to work, when the Dr. is the centre of the whole TV series, than again they could be bring Sally Sparrow back :wub: for a few episodes.