:lol: all change again, according to this news item if true, I doubt very much there will be another TT tour as a 5 :P

 

No-one knows what's true with these five dickheads anymore. I honestly don't believe however, that Gary Barlow would be bothered by Rob's ego - as long as it means they're all rolling in it. The main motivation in TT5 is making money after all.

 

Kath

Gary Barlow about When we were young and a new album:

 

'It feels like a hint to where TT will land when approaching their next studio album. Back to real instruments with less tempo and lyrics with an emotional edge.'

 

Sounds good.

Gary Barlow about When we were young and a new album:

 

'It feels like a hint to where TT will land when approaching their next studio album. Back to real instruments with less tempo and lyrics with an emotional edge.'

 

Sounds good.

I don't know if i should say Hurra or Damn.

 

Real instruments: hurrra, hurrra, hurrra! :yahoo:

 

Less tempo: damn :huh: :unsure: ! From their last two albums the best songs were the up-tempo ones (Hold up a light, Up all night, SOS and Kidz)! Lyrics with emotional edge sounds always blah coming from Gary (apart from Never Forget i am not a fan of his lyrics, quite middle of the road, nothing to think twice (only because the grammatik is poor or i don't understand the build of the sentence i read them more) !

 

Do you have the whole newsletter of Gary?

Title says: Robbie hints at new Take That album and tour!

 

Ain't happening :P

Gary at war with Rob is :lol: though. I guess Gary will welcome him to perform his single at XF and judge him as well. ;)

 

All in all I enjoyed the tour and the album was good but it was not really a TT album imo. Gary just had to give Rob enough space to be back in the band, and despite the fact their voices sounded identical musically they are still miles away. I bet Rob's lyrics were torturing Gary all over the album. If you mix 2 good acts you don't get an even better act. Gary has written much better songs than Progress (assuming he wrote some for Progress, which is not given imo) and so has Robbie. A 'classic' album is the only thing TT4 or TT5 could do after 'progress' but the surprise and reunion elements are now gone. I doubt Robbie would want to give up his solo career that way. If he lets his new album without proper promo or tour but tours and promotes for TT it would be toxic for his career. People will start talking again and fans could be deserting both acts.

 

How did the 'Progess era' collaboration work?

Robbie thinks to himself: "well I am the biggest solo brit of all time, let Gary be in charge here, I have OVERproven myself after the split up anyway"

Same way Gary thinks: "I've written all TT stuff over these years; let him write progress, I have nothing to prove. I call the shots, I have chosen to let him back, and I am generous enough to let him lead for the time being (perhaps Kath will think I am a warm person rather than greedy now :lol: )."

 

They are grown men and friends now only because there is a sweet balance in both acts being extemely successful. If Rob sinks his solo he will 'need' a leading role in TT and they could spilt up in no time again. And staying in TT while neglecting his solo WILL sink Robbie's career. That's why it ain't happening (yet) and all 5 are happy with it.

 

How did the 'Progess era' collaboration work?

Robbie thinks to himself: "well I am the biggest solo brit of all time, let Gary be in charge here, I have OVERproven myself after the split up anyway"

Same way Gary thinks: "I've written all TT stuff over these years; let him write progress, I have nothing to prove. I call the shots, I have chosen to let him back, and I am generous enough to let him lead for the time being (perhaps Kath will think I am a warm person rather than greedy now :lol: )."

Yeah since the reunion Gary has written all TT stuff... what a deluded person you're 7heDreamer

Even from TT's interviews (especially from Gary) you can learn that he doesn't think like that at all.

Another hint may be a collaboration with Ben Mark and Jamie Norton ( Mark's old band mates) on some TT's songs (How Did it Come to This, Throwing Stones, Hold Up The Light, Up All Night) . You don't have to be a genius to guess which TT member is responsible for those songs largely.

....And Flowerbed have to be Rob's song... after all he is responsible for the whole "Progress" LP :rolleyes:

Same way Gary thinks: "I've written all TT stuff over these years; let him write progress, I have nothing to prove. I call the shots, I have chosen to let him back, and I am generous enough to let him lead for the time being (perhaps Kath will think I am a warm person rather than greedy now :lol: )."

 

The latter! :lol:

 

Kath

I very much doubt Robbie and Gary are 'at war'. If anything they seem to be bestest buddies at the moment. :unsure:

Yeah since the reunion Gary has written all TT stuff... what a deluded person you're 7heDreamer

Even from TT's interviews (especially from Gary) you can learn that he doesn't think like that at all.

Another hint may be a collaboration with Ben Mark and Jamie Norton ( Mark's old band mates) on some TT's songs (How Did it Come to This, Throwing Stones, Hold Up The Light, Up All Night) . You don't have to be a genius to guess which TT member is responsible for those songs largely.

....And Flowerbed have to be Rob's song... after all he is responsible for the whole "Progress" LP :rolleyes:

 

Gary has written almost every TT song until 'Progress', it is crystal clear to me too (sorry if by saying Gary I offended a Mark or Howard fan they had their input into the songs I just wanted to underline it was not Robbie). It is just my opinion (and I have arguments to support it in case you want to listen to them - which doesn't mean that I couldn't still be wrong) that Progress is to Gary what the Emancipation of Mimi is to Celine Dion. I think Robbie is one of the most likeable superstars of all time and I do not like the way Gary has been managing himself during all these years. Stll, at the critical point (when they were both trying to become famous and prove themselves) Gary (with a little help from the management) chose to put Robbie in the shadows at the first TT era proving how selfish he was and following that Robbie bashed Gary at every chance during the beginning of his career 'feasting' on his downfall. I am not delusional ;) . It is obvious that not much is at stake now and they can both pretend to be (or even really be) nice but they weren't always like that and they both have a huge ego.

 

You are not supposed to know everything I've posted but the truth is I've already said that flowerbed and What do you want from me do not sound like Robbie's songs. I say Robbie is mainly resposible for the concept, the direction and most of the songs. This doesn't mean the producer didn't do the production or Gary didn't change any music or the 5 of them didn't work some of he songs/choruses together. (as a matter of fact some hybrid features in songs for example in SOS show it has been worked in two 'layers' to be made TT friendly.)

Edited August 15, 201113 yr by 7heDreamer

I don't know if i should say Hurra or Damn.

 

Real instruments: hurrra, hurrra, hurrra! :yahoo:

 

Less tempo: damn :huh: :unsure: ! From their last two albums the best songs were the up-tempo ones (Hold up a light, Up all night, SOS and Kidz)! Lyrics with emotional edge sounds always blah coming from Gary (apart from Never Forget i am not a fan of his lyrics, quite middle of the road, nothing to think twice (only because the grammatik is poor or i don't understand the build of the sentence i read them more) !

 

Do you have the whole newsletter of Gary?

 

 

its all on his website...http://www.garybarlow.com/

Gary has written almost every TT song until 'Progress', it is crystal clear to me too (sorry if by saying Gary I offended a Mark or Howard fan they had their input into the songs I just wanted to underline it was not Robbie). It is just my opinion (and I have arguments to support it in case you want to listen to them - which doesn't mean that I couldn't still be wrong) that Progress is to Gary what the Emancipation of Mimi is to Celine Dion. I think Robbie is one of the most likeable superstars of all time and I do not like the way Gary has been managing himself during all these years. Stll, at the critical point (when they were both trying to become famous and prove themselves) Gary (with a little help from the management) chose to put Robbie in the shadows at the first TT era proving how selfish he was and following that Robbie bashed Gary at every chance during the beginning of his career 'feasting' on his downfall. I am not delusional ;) . It is obvious that not much is at stake now and they can both pretend to be (or even really be) nice but they weren't always like that and they both have a huge ego.

 

You are not supposed to know everything I've posted but the truth is I've already said that flowerbed and What do you want from me do not sound like Robbie's songs. I say Robbie is mainly resposible for the concept, the direction and most of the songs. This doesn't mean the producer didn't do the production or Gary didn't change any music or the 5 of them didn't work some of he songs/choruses together. (as a matter of fact some hybrid features in songs for example in SOS show it has been worked in two 'layers' to be made TT friendly.)

 

Damn My post was written with the acridity towards Gary"the only talented song-writer in TT". It seems you didn't get it probably due to my bad English, sorry for that. I meant since the reunion Mark's been responsible for many songs in TT, lyrics and melodies. On BW album TT members collaborated with other outside writers so it is not easy to tell who did write what song, but still I'm pretty sure Mark sings lead vocals on songs he was largely responsible for. On "The Circus" it's much easier to guess which songs are Gary's and which are Mark's. And the songs I've mentioned before are definitely Mark's (some of them he wrote with Jemie Norton and Ben Mark, his mates from solo years). It may be impossible to believe but Mark can play piano a little bit (not so well like Gary but enough good to write songs with the help of it).

And Flowerbed is also Mark's song.

I understand that there are many people who doesn't like his voice but nevertheless Mark can pen a good song too. And actually in most cases I prefer his writing than Gary's.

I also have to say I don't blame Gary for the common opinion he's the only songwriter. In many interviews he talked about the input from other members, once he even compared Mark to Neil Young (which was very nice but IMO over the top ). People just don't listen to him or don't believe his words (especially journalists).

As for Rob, I don't neglect his impact on Progress album, but IMO it isn't fair to say he is responsible nearly for everything. Have you seen a documentary about the making of that album? I didn't get the feeling it's all about Rob, and if I remember correctly Gary prepared the whole background music.

Edited August 17, 201113 yr by FireWoman

You're right. Gary came up with all the backing tracks and the five of them worked on them. Was even confirmed by Rob. He said he was surprised with what kind of music style Gary came up. He was the main driver behind Progress.

By the way Gray co-wrote and co-produced Robbie's next album. They are doing fine.........

Real instruments: hurrra, hurrra, hurrra! :yahoo:

 

I don't know why but I find Gary's use of the term 'real instruments' totally and absolutely hilarious. Is this as opposed to the imaginary instruments they all play? :lol:

 

Kath

I have to be honest and say that I think Gary had actually been sitting on 'Patience' (incidentally one of the best songs of the last decade) for a long while just waiting for an opportunity to use it. I also don't think any of the others (not even Mark) had anything to do with Rule The World (at the same time I think Shine (my favourite song from BW) is nearly all Mark's own work with no input from Gary. I truly don't buy this 'we're all writing together' lark. I'm not saying the others don't write - but you can tell the songs Gary Barlow has written - and the ones that Mark has written - and no matter what - Gary and Mark are the only songwriters in TT4 (with additional input from outside sources - Mark's former colleagues as already stated). If you listen to The Beatles post-1965 - you can tell which song was written by Lennon and which was written by McCartney - even though they put both names to all compositions.

 

I think Gary Barlow has probably had most input musically into Progress with Rob doing the bulk of the lyrics. Sadly I don't believe Progress is either's finest hour.

 

Kath

Ya its kind of a weird thing to say and dont fully know what gary means by it.,

Well, their orchestration at the Progress was more electronic, synth and "computer made" one. I think he means with "real" instruments the classical ones.

 

Kathy, i had a professor who began at 70 to learn to work with a computer. He didn't need it, but he wanted to. I have a lot of respect for those people who begins low and try to improve even when they are at their highest success. So, if three of TT feeel that they want to improve by learning now to play an instrument (Gary plays enough long piano now), they should go for it. To harmonise the voices is not so easy as one could thing. I sang in a chor and i took ofen the notes of the alto instead of soprano, just because an alto was near me. So good harmonies are good enough for me at a band. There was a band in Germany called Comedian Harmonist, was amazing what they could achieve with their voices!

Its all very well taking up a musical instrument, even at a late age - for one's own amusement and fulfilment. When you are in a professional outfit such as Take That - you should really stick to your strengths (it cannot be argued that they are just a vocal group). They should really leave the playing of instruments to the professionals (Mike Stevens, Milton McDonald, Lee Pomeroy, etc) and crack on with the job that they do so well. When I pay good money to see a concert I don't really want to see people more or less practicing, or just 'playing at' playing instruments.

 

I've always felt this about Take That (and I've never made a secret of it) I get a bit embarrassed when I see them trying to play instruments (it was the weakest part of The Circus tour - and made me begin to dislike songs that up until then I had loved.) Sometimes when I hear people harping on about how great they are, and 'they're trying', etc (with regard to instruments) I get the feeling that some fans see them more as their children in a nativity play rather than a fully grown group of performers. Having said that - maybe it is this kind of reaction from fans that has made them so enduring - one never gives up on one's children I suppose.

 

Kath

Oh, this was my fav part (apart from the music at the beginning) from the tour. I was tired from all buhahhhaaaaa and the circus-overload :unsure: . I actually thought "how nice, some relaxing time, they bring once again the spot-light on the music and that they try to play instruments shows their enthusiasm for the music".

 

Do not forget that the so called profi were not so good to make a name for themselv. They are not Lang Lang...

 

You don't know also for how many years some of TT are playing instruments. And they are not playing Rachmaninov :lol: . I won't put playing instruments as so high and only to be aquired till you are 18. In fact my neighbourh learn now a new instruments and she play in a little orchestra (ok, amateur), but she is easily over 50.

I think Gary Barlow has probably had most input musically into Progress with Rob doing the bulk of the lyrics. Sadly I don't believe Progress is either's finest hour.

 

Kath

 

I HUGELY agree. No matter what they say at the documentaries I do not believe the 5 sat down and came up with the music and lyrics.

 

Musically GB cannot persuade me EVER he could write some of the baselines on Progress and do not wonder why! Underground machine? SOS? Kidz? :lol: It is not his kind of thing. The only idea I could consider as possible is: Gary has written a piano thing that was converted and HUGELY enriched to an electronic baseline by the producer (which actually takes away most of the credit from him anyway). It looks like some of the songs were worked on two layers (or more).

 

Happy Now lyrically and musically is 100% Robbie. But the chorus is SO not Robbie. My best guess is he suggested it and they changed the chorus to sound more TT.

 

SOS Same thing.

 

8 letters Even though Robbie said he wrote 8 letters, I cannot see how Robbie could have lyrically written the verses. He doesn't write like that, this is Barlow. I wouldn't be surprised if an older Robbie demo leaks some day with 8 Letters but different (lyrically) verses.

 

What do you want from me and Flowerbed could be just Mark and then the producer brought them to life with music.

 

Underground Machine Robbie song (I don't see why would anyone disagree here). It must have been an unfinished song because the chorus sounds like it was written over the rest. I guess the 5 together could have written the chorus, or even Robbie himself.

 

Pretty things sounds A LOT like Robbie's Rudebox songs, leftovers or even like Last Days of Disco from RKTVS. Not lyrically, MUSICALLY. Could it be that Gary wrote the strings and the producer WANTED to make them sound like Robbie's previous material? Perhaps. Lyrically it is strange enough to be written by more than one persons at he same time so this could be a collaboration (or just Robbie, he writes obscure lyrics every now and then).

 

The Flood Lyrically Robbie and Robbie musically it is like Robbie verses Gary chorus but it is not a sure thing. Also looks like the chorus has been placed over the verses.

 

Wait Lyrics to Robbie, musically DOES sound like Rudebox (the Actor) doesn't it? It could be Gary only if he has been browsing Robbie's Rudebox material :lol:

 

Kidz This is a tough one. Lyrically (unsurprisingly) Robbie musically it is closer to Robbie and Mark. It must have been the song they worked the most on. It sounds like it was modified a lot of times. No doubt they used it for Love Love as well. (which actually is what Kidz would musically sound like if it was a TT song)

 

All in all I think all songs except from FB and WDYWFM have strong Robbie orientations musically and the lyrics are Robbie's thing appart from some TT friendly written-over choruses. (2nd layer). Forget all that, if you istened to this album (sang by an unknown voice) who would you think this is? Counting out FB and WDYWFM I would say Robbie for sure. Compare Rob's and TT discography and you'll get to the same conclusion. Was it really ''a new direction, a new path the 5 walked to together for the first time"? No :rolleyes: Just the four of them. (unless if they WANTED to make it sound like Robbie which makes no sense to me)

 

P.S. I have read here and there people saying that Mark wrote the lyrics for KIdz and Gary for the Flood and Wait. :lol: That was a good one.

 

On Gary co-writing Robbie's album I guess we will have to wait and see whether his presence has an impact on Rob's material, or not. (I didn't see it on Shame and Heart and I to be fair)

 

(To be honest I do not expect any change. Gary will be writing strings FOR Robbie, "he knows what he should sound like''. They are not reforging Robbie's career together and I am pretty sure Gary knows that. It should be just more pleasant ,and let's hope productive, for Robbie to work with Gary rather than other ''music people'' since he is not a fully accomplished musician and only writes baslines. But this is still only a 'good' predicion. Perhaps they will surprise me after all.)

 

On Mark, besides finally singing a big percentage of the songs and writing some on his own he looked to me like the ''connecting'' element of the band.