I will be one of the few to not beat about the bush here, she was an awful woman who destroyed countless lives, and I for one am glad that she is finally no longer a force for evil in this world.

I really don't understand why people are celebrating the fact that's she dead when as Tirren said, the ideas are still alive.

I was born a few months before she left office so obviously didn't live through much of her time as PM, but I've spent the time forming my own views on here over the years. What I hate is the people who regurgitate views from their parents/friends without really understanding WHY they are supposed to hate/love her or very much of what she did.

 

This!

 

I don't know much about it (me being born after she was Prime Minister) so don't have an opinion, but I'm sick of people who are barely teenagers on my Facebook going on as if they were living through her time.

I really don't understand why people are celebrating the fact that's she dead when as Tirren said, the ideas are still alive.

Because if you were around and aware of what was happening in the 80s you would understand how much of a hate figure she was to so many people.

She was the originator of these crap ideas that successive Tory and Labour governments have clung to.

 

Yes the Unions were too strong and Scargill was an absolute idiot but she and her government pre-planned for everything that happened during the Miner's strike and it played out exactly how they wanted. She was the epitome of callousness in the way she destroyed not only the Miner's but whole communities that depended on the mines and left them with nothing.

 

As she stated, society did not exist and everything was for the individual and at a push, the family.

I don't support the Tories at all, so I feel as if that isn't very relevant to me and you've left me with facts that I already know.

How is it irrelevant when the communities she mangled are still in a sorry state today?

I meant that it was irrelevant to what I was trying to say. Of course the communities that she destroyed are still suffering. I already know about that anyway...

 

I hate Thatcher but the ideas are still alive. That's my point.

 

Oh, I kind of get what Grebo's trying to say! Still, the vehicle might have died but the ideas are still alive.

Edited April 9, 201312 yr by Griefeon

How is it irrelevant when the communities she mangled are still in a sorry state today?

Let's be fair, the communities hardest hit by Thatcher's govenrment (specifically mining communities) were always doomed. In the '80s the mining industry was subsidised to the tune of hundreds of millions. In today's money that's into the billions. That was never sustainable and there was no point in pumping money into it. Although I would no doubt have felt differently if I was alive at the time and hailed from a mining community, the strikes were obnoxious and ill-advised. They made an enemy of one of the most bloody minded and fiercely determined politicians on the planet. That those communities were doomed to fall apart is not Thatcher's fault, industy was dying anyway. Unlike some, Thatcher wasn't in denial about that.

 

Let's be fair, the communities hardest hit by Thatcher's govenrment (specifically mining communities) were always doomed. In the '80s the mining industry was subsidised to the tune of hundreds of millions. In today's money that's into the billions. That was never sustainable and there was no point in pumping money into it. Although I would no doubt have felt differently if I was alive at the time and hailed from a mining community, the strikes were obnoxious and ill-advised. They made an enemy of one of the most bloody minded and fiercely determined politicians on the planet. That those communities were doomed to fall apart is not Thatcher's fault, industy was dying anyway. Unlike some, Thatcher wasn't in denial about that.

 

True to an extent, but the apparent glee she took in wiping them out is what grates - along with little effort to create jobs to replace those lost.

They could have also brought the miners out of the industry more slowly and replaced those jobs with new jobs, as Charlie said.

How is it irrelevant when the communities she mangled are still in a sorry state today?

 

This.

 

Let's be fair, the communities hardest hit by Thatcher's govenrment (specifically mining communities) were always doomed. In the '80s the mining industry was subsidised to the tune of hundreds of millions. In today's money that's into the billions. That was never sustainable and there was no point in pumping money into it. Although I would no doubt have felt differently if I was alive at the time and hailed from a mining community, the strikes were obnoxious and ill-advised. They made an enemy of one of the most bloody minded and fiercely determined politicians on the planet. That those communities were doomed to fall apart is not Thatcher's fault, industy was dying anyway. Unlike some, Thatcher wasn't in denial about that.

 

 

I'd dispute that. The mining industry was going through a lull at the time, but its the nature of all industries to have peaks and valleys. In Germany, they've routinely subsidised industries that have had equally tough periods as the mining industry had in the late 70s/early 80s, and even though it cost them money in the short term, it's paying off for them now because they're one of the only economies in the world who actually have something to keep their economy going now. Whereas, because our industrial base was entirely wiped out, we have absolutely nothing to keep our economy afloat now that the banks and financial sector have stopped producing the revenues.

 

(Obviously, even if the mining industry hadn't been killed off in the 80s, it's possible that since then environmental reasons would've seen it happen anyway---although, with that said, we still import coal now, probably at a higher cost than it would've been to continue "subsidising" the industry.)

Let's be fair, the communities hardest hit by Thatcher's govenrment (specifically mining communities) were always doomed. In the '80s the mining industry was subsidised to the tune of hundreds of millions. In today's money that's into the billions. That was never sustainable and there was no point in pumping money into it. Although I would no doubt have felt differently if I was alive at the time and hailed from a mining community, the strikes were obnoxious and ill-advised. They made an enemy of one of the most bloody minded and fiercely determined politicians on the planet. That those communities were doomed to fall apart is not Thatcher's fault, industy was dying anyway. Unlike some, Thatcher wasn't in denial about that.

 

The industry was dying because it was cheaper to get coal from abroad and Maggie smashed the NUM because she held it responsible for bringing down the Heath government.

As soon as the oil and gas runs out, whoever is in charge will soon be going back for the approximately 5 billion tons of usable coal under the UK.

Let's be fair, the communities hardest hit by Thatcher's govenrment (specifically mining communities) were always doomed. In the '80s the mining industry was subsidised to the tune of hundreds of millions. In today's money that's into the billions. That was never sustainable and there was no point in pumping money into it. Although I would no doubt have felt differently if I was alive at the time and hailed from a mining community, the strikes were obnoxious and ill-advised. They made an enemy of one of the most bloody minded and fiercely determined politicians on the planet. That those communities were doomed to fall apart is not Thatcher's fault, industy was dying anyway. Unlike some, Thatcher wasn't in denial about that.

 

Finally some sense being spoken!

 

True to an extent, but the apparent glee she took in wiping them out is what grates - along with little effort to create jobs to replace those lost.

Let us not forget there was history here- namely the 1972 strikes and the 1974 election. The fact that the unions held the country to ransom did make it personal. In looking at the decimation of the mining industry you have to factor in the disportionate pay rises they received in the 70s comparative to other sectors coupled with the meglomania of Scargill, same in 1984- the fact he called the strike without a democratic ballot (as he feared losing it- which he probably would have). He is in effect responsible for making the industry uncompetitive.

This.

 

I did reply to this earlier - Charlie had completely misinterpreted what I said.

 

I studied the Miners' Strike and the Brixton riots, so let's just say that me and my classmates don't really have a nice impression of Thatcher.

I studied the Miners' Strike and the Brixton riots, so let's just say that me and my classmates don't really have a nice impression of Thatcher.

I don't see why you and your classmates would all share the same opinion, unless you had a teacher who wasn't particularly neutral.

 

Edited April 9, 201312 yr by Jark

I did reply to this earlier - Charlie had completely misinterpreted what I said.

 

I studied the Miners' Strike and the Brixton riots, so let's just say that me and my classmates don't really have a nice impression of Thatcher.

 

I agree. We studied them as well and it helped me form my own less than positive opinion on Mrs Thatcher. Not to mention the personal connection my family has to the mining closures with my grandfather losing his job from it meaning my father's childhood was a very poor one with almost no money so yeah I didn't like her one bit

 

But my issue with this whole (for want of a better word) celebration is the effect it must be having on her family. I just think that their feelings don't seem to have been taken into account; yes Thatcher was a cow and many people despised her but at the end of the day there is still a family grieving for a lost one and I don't think I'm totally in the wrong for daring to say that their feelings should be being better respected at this time

 

Plus, I really dislike the song Ding Dong The Witch Is Dead

 

Also Griff; if ALL your classmates shared the same opinion it seems to me that your teacher may have been fairly one sided in this. I know when we studied this many people in my class came out with arguments supporting Thatcher and this class was pretty divided over the issue.

Edited April 9, 201312 yr by justinthomas92

I don't see why you and your classmates would all share the same opinion, unless you had a teacher who wasn't particularly neutral.

 

Well, our teacher wasn't particularly neutral but she didn't express her opinion too much. My classmates all formed their own opinion of her and most of them think she was a c**t. I guess the theory of children getting more liberal as time goes on is partly true in this case.

Well, our teacher wasn't particularly neutral but she didn't express her opinion too much. My classmates all formed their own opinion of her and most of them think she was a c**t. I guess the theory of children getting more liberal as time goes on is partly true in this case.

 

Well that's good (that your classmates formed their own opinions, not that your teacher wasnt neutral as she probably should have been)

 

One of the most annoying things I've personally found about this whole thing is the amount of uninformed teenagers who don't know anything about Thatcher and the politics of the 80s but are celebrating her death because they've been taught to hate her or they're merely following the crowd.

Finally some sense being spoken!

Let us not forget there was history here- namely the 1972 strikes and the 1974 election. The fact that the unions held the country to ransom did make it personal. In looking at the decimation of the mining industry you have to factor in the disportionate pay rises they received in the 70s comparative to other sectors coupled with the meglomania of Scargill, same in 1984- the fact he called the strike without a democratic ballot (as he feared losing it- which he probably would have). He is in effect responsible for making the industry uncompetitive.

Arthur Scargill proved to be one of her greatest allies. Central Casting would have found it hard to come up with a union leader easier to turn into a hate figure.

 

The phrase "holding the country to ransom" has often been thrown at the unions. Somehow it is used less often against latge companies etc. who threaten to leave the country whenever it is suggested that they might, perhaps, like to pay a bit of tax.

 

Some of her union legislation was justified. No mainstream party is likely to suggest abolishing the need for a strike ballot. However, it was very one-sided. For example, she abolished the closed shop but it remains possible for an employer to ban unions.

Well that's good (that your classmates formed their own opinions, not that your teacher wasnt neutral as she probably should have been)

 

One of the most annoying things I've personally found about this whole thing is the amount of uninformed teenagers who don't know anything about Thatcher and the politics of the 80s but are celebrating her death because they've been taught to hate her or they're merely following the crowd.

 

Indeed, I'll bet that quite a lot of them are taking part in this 'Ding Dong...' campaign Another thing the Daily Mash got spot on: http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/society...d-2013040865066