March 28, 201510 yr I agree with you, Kath about the melodies being the same. It's something that concerned me at the start. There's bit of Happy and Forget that we've heard before, certainly. She does need to quit doing that and as you say she's capable of better. Solitaire and Immortal showed us that. I chose instead to enjoy the parts that were new sounding. The verses of Better than That, and large parts of Froot. What I felt was not 'more of the same' was the sounds her and her producer came up with. I was tempted to dismiss the whole lot when I heard Forgot. I'm glad I didn't. Point taken. 'Forget' was what really lost me with this era, really sub-par and MOR, something I'd never think I'd say about Marina, but I'm willing to give the album a chance nonetheless. For now, it's just not as remarkable as I expected it to be I actually think the production is one of the album's strongest points, though not as polished as Electra Heart or as interesting as The Family Jewels. It's the formulaic melodies especially on the choruses that bothers me the most, with the word 'formulaic' you'd expect them to be catchy and infectious to an extent, but here they fall quite flat and sound like the hooks on the songs before and after it, songs like 'Savages', 'Weeds' for example have such predictable hooks of belting out the title word. It's as if she picked song titles before writing their lyrics
March 28, 201510 yr Not 'Valley of the Dolls' stans rising from the ashes since its last place finish in the last Marina r8 http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v232/korn0818/ed2305b7.png
March 28, 201510 yr Point taken. 'Forget' was what really lost me with this era, really sub-par and MOR, something I'd never think I'd say about Marina, but I'm willing to give the album a chance nonetheless. For now, it's just not as remarkable as I expected it to be I actually think the production is one of the album's strongest points, though not as polished as Electra Heart or as interesting as The Family Jewels. It's the formulaic melodies especially on the choruses that bothers me the most, with the word 'formulaic' you'd expect them to be catchy and infectious to an extent, but here they fall quite flat and sound like the hooks on the songs before and after it, songs like 'Savages', 'Weeds' for example have such predictable hooks of belting out the title word. It's as if she picked song titles before writing their lyrics I can't disagree with anything you said there. After today's listening I really think her strong points are her verses. Better than That is growing with each play.
March 28, 201510 yr Not 'Valley of the Dolls' stans rising from the ashes since its last place finish in the last Marina r8 http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v232/korn0818/ed2305b7.png Hopefully Froot has had time to grow on you, at least a little, before you do that rate.
March 28, 201510 yr Some thoughts: - I disagree that the album has no instant tracks. Like, a couple of listens were necessary for stuff like 'Froot' to properly hit me but I'm like that with virtually every song, and I find that most songs that hit me on the first listen end up burning out very quickly (random example: 'Love Me Like You Do'). But in general I found a lot of songs instant. 'Blue', 'Savages', 'Can't Pin Me Down', 'Immortal' all come to mind here. That said I do think the album is vaguely subtle, but I like that because Electra Heart blew me away on first listen and now isn't the easiest album to listen to. - I do think Electra Heart is a good album but as time has gone on it's just become so abundantly clear that the concept was bullshit that the era has been oddly tarnished for me. Like, at first the era was "ooh Marina's doing a concept album how exciting" and now it's "Marina sold out and made an excuse to do so to try and appease her hipster fans". It's one of the main reasons I don't find it to be a very Marina album, in comparison to TFJ and Froot. That said, EH has good songs anyway. Not a bad album by any means, but everything surrounding it is really difficult to get behind (consistently stunning photoshoots aside). - I agree more with Tony than I do with Kath in the argument about FROOT being safe versus EH being safe. EH was very different with her but I really can't possibly agree with arguments that it was risky. Everything about that era was based on appealing to the largest amount of people possible, right down to releasing 'Fear & Loathing' before 'Radioactive' to stop the indier fans jumping off ship instantly. It was managed completely to be safe for radio and pulling in new fans, while minimising the risk of old fans leaving. That's not an exciting change or an artist going into uncharted waters. That's an artist trying to get as many sales as she can. FROOT isn't risky in the sense that it is pretty much a natural progression from TFJ, so it's pretty safe for older fans. But I don't think it needs to be a risky album, natural progressions tend to be a hell of a lot better than risky albums anyway and if Electra Heart is what people define as Marina taking a risk then frankly I hope she never takes one again. I must admit I'll never really understand how she picked up so many fans during the Electra Heart era. Never has a campaign been so transparent, or poorly executed.
March 28, 201510 yr I must admit I'll never really understand how she picked up so many fans during the Electra Heart era. Never has a campaign been so transparent, or poorly executed. I think Primadonna had good airplay and How To Be A Heartbreaker was featured on Glee. But that's just my guess, could be wrong :lol:
March 28, 201510 yr - I do think Electra Heart is a good album but as time has gone on it's just become so abundantly clear that the concept was bullshit that the era has been oddly tarnished for me. Like, at first the era was "ooh Marina's doing a concept album how exciting" and now it's "Marina sold out and made an excuse to do so to try and appease her hipster fans". It's one of the main reasons I don't find it to be a very Marina album, in comparison to TFJ and Froot. That said, EH has good songs anyway. Not a bad album by any means, but everything surrounding it is really difficult to get behind (consistently stunning photoshoots aside). - I agree more with Tony than I do with Kath in the argument about FROOT being safe versus EH being safe. EH was very different with her but I really can't possibly agree with arguments that it was risky. Everything about that era was based on appealing to the largest amount of people possible, right down to releasing 'Fear & Loathing' before 'Radioactive' to stop the indier fans jumping off ship instantly. It was managed completely to be safe for radio and pulling in new fans, while minimising the risk of old fans leaving. That's not an exciting change or an artist going into uncharted waters. That's an artist trying to get as many sales as she can. FROOT isn't risky in the sense that it is pretty much a natural progression from TFJ, so it's pretty safe for older fans. But I don't think it needs to be a risky album, natural progressions tend to be a hell of a lot better than risky albums anyway and if Electra Heart is what people define as Marina taking a risk then frankly I hope she never takes one again. I must admit I'll never really understand how she picked up so many fans during the Electra Heart era. Never has a campaign been so transparent, or poorly executed. What made Electra Heart risky was its concept and Marina introducing the era as an alter ego. It was more of a transition or an evolution than a progression, essentially making it a risk as the abovementioned is generally something that does not occur in the hipster indie pop scene, which was Marina's core fanbase with her debut, and where it's all about the music not the bling Her Marilyn Monroe, retro housewife, heart on cheek imagery was golden and very appealing. The album's tongue-and-cheek, depressing nature even moreso appealing. This type of thing is what should have properly launched her breakthrough into mainstream success (albeit to an extent it was), and was what won her hordes of fans leading up to FROOT. Perhaps a generalization, but teenage girls and the LGBT community are suckers for the type of imagery Marina had with Electra Heart, they STAN for depressing tongue-in-cheek lyrics - this is what's made the likes of Gaga and Lana Del Rey phenomenons. My friends begun wearing hearts on their cheeks on nights out, sported alice bands and so on as a result of Marina's impact during that era With FROOT, this imagery and sound was eradicated to a "froot of the month" thing, which people have actually been mocking. It's very childish and tacky, and I don't understand the concept within the context of the album. The only thing vaguely consistent about FROOT for me is its overload of similies and metaphors, and predictable more of the same melodies
March 28, 201510 yr If they were going to release songs every month leading up to the release of the album (not a bad idea) then it's not a stretch to imagine that the campaign could do with a name for itself. And as childish as it is, I'd rather have it than the mock-concept of EH which always seemed transparent to me as selling out. But perhaps she was forced to sell out - or be dropped, and I don't begrudge her doing in it, in the grand scheme. EH is far from being a total stinker of an album, it's just not one I go back to a lot as it gave up its treasure in the first couple of listens. If it's the weakest album she ever releases then we and her are in for a great career.
March 28, 201510 yr I must admit I'll never really understand how she picked up so many fans during the Electra Heart era. Never has a campaign been so transparent, or poorly executed. Not to be too dismissive of pop music fans (for I am one) , but some people just like well produced pop songs and perhaps not having been a fan for The Family Jewels they didn't care that they were getting semi-generic pop songs at the expense of former individuality. Edited March 28, 201510 yr by AntoineTTe
March 28, 201510 yr If they were going to release songs every month leading up to the release of the album (not a bad idea) then it's not a stretch to imagine that the campaign could do with a name for itself. And as childish as it is, I'd rather have it than the mock-concept of EH which always seemed transparent to me as selling out. But perhaps she was forced to sell out - or be dropped, and I don't begrudge her doing in it, in the grand scheme. EH is far from being a total stinker of an album, it's just not one I go back to a lot as it gave up its treasure in the first couple of listens. If it's the weakest album she ever releases then we and her are in for a great career. In her recent interview with Spin, she pretty much spills all the tea on Electra Heart Q: Last year, Charli XCX talked about how easy it would be for her to be this big pop star with all the proper dance moves, but that it wasn't a concept that appealed to her. Have you ever felt that push and pull between label expectations and what you actually wanted? A: I don't know. I'm not sure. It was a different situation. For example, my first album was quite successful. I didn't really know that it was gonna be pop. When I first signed, I was a slightly chubby person and I definitely did not look like a pop star. For the label, it was a very natural ascent to being popular. I guess what they saw off the second album was, "Well you know, you've got a lot of potential to grow," so I don't think they expected me to some generic pop star. I think there was the acknowledgement that to be popular over here, though, I had to follow certain routes with the Dr. Lukes and Stargates, and part of that is depressing because you think, "It's so limiting." It's also not encouraging for a true artist. If you're working with a manufactured artist, then that's fine, give them the song, but if you're working with someone who is actually in this for the real deal, it's really, really limiting. So yeah, I don't think it's quite the same situation as Charli, but it's another type of situation where they expect you to be something that they hope that you are. And you gotta explain it to them or not.
March 28, 201510 yr Fans have gone into fear and loathing http://i.imgur.com/E2hCwEr.jpg http://i0.wp.com/www.papelpop.com/papelpop/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Ana-Chonps_@anachonps04.jpg http://i2.wp.com/www.papelpop.com/papelpop/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Alexandre-Arruda.jpg http://i.imgur.com/9fS8pJZ.jpg THE FLAWLESS MERCH THO!!1!
March 28, 201510 yr Aww that's a shame :( I feel so bad for Marina and the fans alike! They must've been waiting and anticipating her for ages!
March 28, 201510 yr Not 'Valley of the Dolls' stans rising from the ashes since its rightful last place finish in the last Marina r8 http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v232/korn0818/ed2305b7.png fixed
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