He didn't get elected until 1970 didn't he not?

February '74. He lost in Slough in 1970. It just confirms my geek status that I could reach for an old Times Guide to the HoC and go straight to his constituency without having to look it up!

Can we change the title please to reflect current reality?

Edited March 31, 20169 yr by Virginia's Walls

Even as someone who didn't vote for Corbyn, the last few weeks have made me glad he's leader tbh.

 

He has actually got RESULTS in terms of policies, in terms of making the Conservatives scrap the disability benefit cuts and now potentially forcing them into nationalising the steel industry. That is much better than one of the self-declared " credible moderates" who would've been busy abstaining on the benefit cuts and wittering on about how "globalisation" and being "pro-business" meant they had to accept the steel industry falling.

 

The fact that the "moderates" were all saying last week was a win for the Tories, because Corbyn didn't get some smart ripostes in at Prime Minister's Questions (which is apparently more important than ACTUALLY STOPPING DISABLED PEOPLE'S INCOMES GETTING CUT) only confirms to me that the "moderates" have completely lost all sense of what politics is supposed to be about.

Edited March 31, 20169 yr by Danny

Can we change the title please to reflect current reality?

 

Sure.

Here is the UK Polling Report list of recent opinion polls.

 

As you can see, of the 5 opinion polls from the past month, 3 give a Conservative lead, one gives Labour/Conservative on the same, whilst just one gives Labour a slight 1% lead.

 

Even as someone who didn't vote for Corbyn, the last few weeks have made me glad he's leader tbh.

 

He has actually got RESULTS in terms of policies, in terms of making the Conservatives scrap the disability benefit cuts and now potentially forcing them into nationalising the steel industry. That is much better than one of the self-declared " credible moderates" who would've been busy abstaining on the benefit cuts and wittering on about how "globalisation" and being "pro-business" meant they had to accept the steel industry falling.

 

The fact that the "moderates" were all saying last week was a win for the Tories, because Corbyn didn't get some smart ripostes in at Prime Minister's Questions (which is apparently more important than ACTUALLY STOPPING DISABLED PEOPLE'S INCOMES GETTING CUT) only confirms to me that the "moderates" have completely lost all sense of what politics is supposed to be about.

Do you really think he was the driving force behind the disability benefit cuts being reversed?! As with the tax credits, it wasn't that Labour were opposing (pretty inadequately, given the lack of any coordinated media strategy on it) that was driving the issue, but that even Tory backbenchers were uneasy with the principle.

 

I'd also add that Community Union (the steelmakers union which has a lot of moderate MP affiliates) gets pretty regularly accused of being a load of Blairite stooges. They and the affiliated MPs are taking anything but an 'oh just let it fail' position.

Sure.

!

February '74. He lost in Slough in 1970. It just confirms my geek status that I could reach for an old Times Guide to the HoC and go straight to his constituency without having to look it up!

 

Lol love that sort of info myself!

Even as someone who didn't vote for Corbyn, the last few weeks have made me glad he's leader tbh.

 

He has actually got RESULTS in terms of policies, in terms of making the Conservatives scrap the disability benefit cuts and now potentially forcing them into nationalising the steel industry. That is much better than one of the self-declared " credible moderates" who would've been busy abstaining on the benefit cuts and wittering on about how "globalisation" and being "pro-business" meant they had to accept the steel industry falling.

 

The fact that the "moderates" were all saying last week was a win for the Tories, because Corbyn didn't get some smart ripostes in at Prime Minister's Questions (which is apparently more important than ACTUALLY STOPPING DISABLED PEOPLE'S INCOMES GETTING CUT) only confirms to me that the "moderates" have completely lost all sense of what politics is supposed to be about.

 

NOW DONT YOU DARE GO AND GIVE CORBYN ANY CREDIT IN HERE QASS WILL GO NUTS!!!

Do you really think he was the driving force behind the disability benefit cuts being reversed?! As with the tax credits, it wasn't that Labour were opposing (pretty inadequately, given the lack of any coordinated media strategy on it) that was driving the issue, but that even Tory backbenchers were uneasy with the principle.

 

I'd also add that Community Union (the steelmakers union which has a lot of moderate MP affiliates) gets pretty regularly accused of being a load of Blairite stooges. They and the affiliated MPs are taking anything but an 'oh just let it fail' position.

 

In ref to disability cuts - so you retort his anti austerity cuts position on the one hand and congratulate Tory backbenchers for getting the government to back down on this immoral position on the other as if he had nothing to do with it even when in his budget reply he highlighted it? :mellow:

Edited March 31, 20169 yr by Steve201

Here is the UK Polling Report list of recent opinion polls.

 

As you can see, of the 5 opinion polls from the past month, 3 give a Conservative lead, one gives Labour/Conservative on the same, whilst just one gives Labour a slight 1% lead.

 

It says it all about how disastrous the current Labour leadership is, when they can't even gain a lead over a deeply unpopular and divided Tory government. The Opposition is weak. They aren't attacking in Parliament as they should when the Tories are pretty much handing them free reign to do so with their harsh policies. It's now they should be making real progress to win back voters, yet they're still stuck in this lull. No way should they be going into 2020 with Corbyn as leader, especially since the Tories will have a new leader by then.

Do you really think he was the driving force behind the disability benefit cuts being reversed?! As with the tax credits, it wasn't that Labour were opposing (pretty inadequately, given the lack of any coordinated media strategy on it) that was driving the issue, but that even Tory backbenchers were uneasy with the principle.

 

Labour opposing wouldn't have been sufficient on its own to get the cuts reversed, but it was a necessary pre-condition. In a parallel universe where one of the "moderates" was leader, and they were pledging to abstain on cuts, Cameron would've still had the arithmetic to get cuts through and he would've been able to credibly wave away IDS's resignation as just one man's ego rather than being about the substantial issue of the cuts being wrong.

 

As I say, the "moderates"' reaction last week when they were whining about how a "credible" leader would've scored more points at PMQs (the inference being that this is more important than actually affecting government policy) shows they haven't even started learning their lesson. I'm sorry but to me it does show that they STILL think getting their own backsides on the government benches is the most important thing, and that policy and the wellbeing of the country is secondary.

 

I'd also add that Community Union (the steelmakers union which has a lot of moderate MP affiliates) gets pretty regularly accused of being a load of Blairite stooges. They and the affiliated MPs are taking anything but an 'oh just let it fail' position.

 

Do you really think Liz Kendall as leader would be supporting government intervention to save the steel industry? Her constant refrain in recent months (when she's not been uttering total banalities) has been how the Left is too hostile to "globalisation", and that they shouldn't stand in the way of "modernisation" and free-market-induced changes. Indeed her most recent tweet is words to that effect:

 

Liz Kendall ‏@leicesterliz Mar 26

Liz Kendall Retweeted Janan Ganesh

"Leicester is the modern world. Do not hold out against change, this season teaches us, absorb & master it." on.ft.com/22zGtcB

The Andrew Neil interview Liz Kendall did to kick off the leadership election was about how government should ensure people aren't left behind as a result of globalisation, something which she specified as one of New Labour's biggest failings. Not exactly 'let it collapse and let them eat cake'. For that matter, I don't think many MPs would avoid retweeting an article praising their constituency's football team's success as an example to all!

 

In a parallel universe where one of the moderates was leader, I don't think they'd have taken the view that disability cuts are fine (unless you think their position would have been that literally no cut to welfare would have been opposed...though I actually wouldn't be surprised if you did).

In ref to disability cuts - so you retort his anti austerity cuts position on the one hand and congratulate Tory backbenchers for getting the government to back down on this immoral position on the other as if he had nothing to do with it even when in his budget reply he highlighted it? :mellow:

I'm not congratulating, I'm literally stating facts. Corbyn mentioning it in his budget reply had nothing to do with Conservative backbenchers opposing the cuts. Osborne backing down was entirely to do with Conservative backbenchers opposing the cuts, not Corbyn.

So it was nothing to do with the electorate reaction? Or Corbyn whatsoever?

 

As Danny highlighted above it takes various interest groups to create a U Turn and you not crediting the leader of the opposition shows your moderate bias in this case - and as I said JCs budget response is in Hansard that's all the FACTS I need!

Edited March 31, 20169 yr by Steve201

In a parallel universe where one of the moderates was leader, I don't think they'd have taken the view that disability cuts are fine (unless you think their position would have been that literally no cut to welfare would have been opposed...though I actually wouldn't be surprised if you did).

 

On the example they set in the last parliament, and especially what they did in the months after the last election, I highly doubt they would've opposed the disability cuts.

So it was nothing to do with the electorate reaction? Or Corbyn whatsoever?

 

As Danny highlighted above it takes various interest groups to create a U Turn and you not crediting the leader of the opposition shows your moderate bias in this case - and as I said JCs budget response is in Hansard that's all the FACTS I need!

The backbenchers were registering their anger with cuts to disability payments before the Budget had even been announced and before there had been any reaction - it was fairly heavily prebriefed! I don't think you realise just how much of a joke he is considered by Conservatives MPs at *all*. Just because it was in his response doesn't mean any of them were influenced by it.

On the example they set in the last parliament, and especially what they did in the months after the last election, I highly doubt they would've opposed the disability cuts.

I think even if you're convinced they wouldn't oppose cuts to disability payments at the same time as tax cuts for higher rate taxpayers on a moral level (which I think all three candidates would have been), on a basic level of political intelligence none of them would have been in favour of cuts to the one group universally agreed from left to right to be deserving of welfare at the same time as tax cuts.

The backbenchers were registering their anger with cuts to disability payments before the Budget had even been announced and before there had been any reaction - it was fairly heavily prebriefed! I don't think you realise just how much of a joke he is considered by Conservatives MPs at *all*. Just because it was in his response doesn't mean any of them were influenced by it.

 

I wasnt totally talking about Tory MPs on this though I was looking at the greater picture of disability cuts whereas you seem to be focused on how brave backbench MPs are at briefing against their chancellor - I only care about defending JC and what he has done and in this case predictably he defended the weak and vulnerable. I dont care or claim the Tories were influenced by him.