Probably a blow for the soft brexiteers in the cabinet as he was one of the more centrists close to May, interesting to see who his replacement is.

It seems not everyone is as pessimistic about Britain's future prospects as this group's Remainers are :

 

https://news.sky.com/story/uk-best-country-...nkings-11178253

 

 

It seems not everyone is as pessimistic about Britain's future prospects as this group's Remainers are :

 

https://news.sky.com/story/uk-best-country-...nkings-11178253

 

Forbes, the billionaires club magazine, who see a UK vision of low employment rights and people desperate for jobs to take advantage of, low tax for business, law that supports business not individuals or the general public (Hi Bankers!) and who also say anything could happen but choose to ignore the "political" risks in their assessment, not a mention, not one single one, of Brexit issues.

 

In other words, almost as if someone had a word in their ear.....

 

I'm sure any other glossy magazine could offer advice on How To Ignore Reality too, if they depended on sucking up to rich folk....

Forbes, the billionaires club magazine, who see a UK vision of low employment rights and people desperate for jobs to take advantage of, low tax for business, law that supports business not individuals or the general public (Hi Bankers!) and who also say anything could happen but choose to ignore the "political" risks in their assessment, not a mention, not one single one, of Brexit issues.

 

In other words, almost as if someone had a word in their ear.....

 

I'm sure any other glossy magazine could offer advice on How To Ignore Reality too, if they depended on sucking up to rich folk....

 

I don't know why I'm even surprised when you have a trite comeback to everything I post. :rolleyes:

 

I guess this is why I prefer Usenet, where the Remain'Leave balance is a lot closer to the 50/50 split that actually exists. :mellow:

 

Do they tolerate you not giving an answer to inconvenient questions there?

Anyone looking at certain front pages this morning or listening to the BBC news would think that the EU forced us to have a burgundy passport. Here is a picture of all EU countries' passports.

 

http://livingingreece.gr/wp-content/uploads/2008/03/eu-passports.jpg

It seems not everyone is as pessimistic about Britain's future prospects as this group's Remainers are :

 

https://news.sky.com/story/uk-best-country-...nkings-11178253

You mean the report where the UK's worst rating is for political risk? And the report that gives the UK a high rating for red tape, i.e.they don't think it is a significant problem.

Do they tolerate you not giving an answer to inconvenient questions there?

 

Ah , but you can use kill-files on Usenet... :heehee:

 

As for 'inconvenient questions' , it's a Catch-22 situation - If I answer them, my responses are dismissed as 'Daily Mail propaganda', and if I don't answer, I then get accused of dodging inconvenient questions! :banghead:

 

Maybe the plan is to make me feel like an oppressed minority group? :rolleyes:

Ah , but you can use kill-files on Usenet... :heehee:

 

As for 'inconvenient questions' , it's a Catch-22 situation - If I answer them, my responses are dismissed as 'Daily Mail propaganda', and if I don't answer, I then get accused of dodging inconvenient questions! :banghead:

 

Maybe the plan is to make me feel like an oppressed minority group? :rolleyes:

 

Just back up your views from a reputable source and I for one will accept the viewpoint. Nobody is topping you holding whatever opinion you want to hold. There is also no law that says anyone else should treat it like the word of a wise Prophet preaching from the top of a mountain either. Most rabid Brexiters prefer to chat amongst other rabid Brexiters so they can re-inforce each others views, so in that respect I'm quite happy to say you are exceptional and at least willing to venture forth into unknown territory.

 

Surely WE are the oppressed minority though, or rather, majority, in not wanting a Hard Brexit? That we are better at arguing our case suggests that those pushing for it have either less facts, or less ability (and I'm talking about the professional politicians, here, not the less involved public).

Just back up your views from a reputable source and I for one will accept the viewpoint. Nobody is topping you holding whatever opinion you want to hold. There is also no law that says anyone else should treat it like the word of a wise Prophet preaching from the top of a mountain either. Most rabid Brexiters prefer to chat amongst other rabid Brexiters so they can re-inforce each others views, so in that respect I'm quite happy to say you are exceptional and at least willing to venture forth into unknown territory.

 

Surely WE are the oppressed minority though, or rather, majority, in not wanting a Hard Brexit? That we are better at arguing our case suggests that those pushing for it have either less facts, or less ability (and I'm talking about the professional politicians, here, not the less involved public).

 

I doubt there's any source that we'd both consider reputable though, so that's likely to create an impasse. Perhaps you could recommend a Brexit-supporting source that you nonetheless consider reputable, so that we could make progress?

 

 

 

 

 

I doubt there's any source that we'd both consider reputable though, so that's likely to create an impasse. Perhaps you could recommend a Brexit-supporting source that you nonetheless consider reputable, so that we could make progress?

 

wish I could help you there, but damned if I've found one yet....

Forbes, the billionaires club magazine, who see a UK vision of low employment rights and people desperate for jobs to take advantage of, low tax for business, law that supports business not individuals or the general public (Hi Bankers!) and who also say anything could happen but choose to ignore the "political" risks in their assessment, not a mention, not one single one, of Brexit issues.

 

In other words, almost as if someone had a word in their ear.....

 

I'm sure any other glossy magazine could offer advice on How To Ignore Reality too, if they depended on sucking up to rich folk....

 

Sounds like the Tory Parties manifesto there Pop!

Anyone looking at certain front pages this morning or listening to the BBC news would think that the EU forced us to have a burgundy passport. Here is a picture of all EU countries' passports.

 

http://livingingreece.gr/wp-content/uploads/2008/03/eu-passports.jpg

 

 

:wacko: I know and May tweets as if she has made a huge patriotic reverse to gain votes from populists! I will proudly hold my Red Irish passport in NI!!

:wacko: I know and May tweets as if she has made a huge patriotic reverse to gain votes from populists! I will proudly hold my Red Irish passport in NI!!

You would also think from the news coverage that we had had a blue passport for at least 500 years. We actually had it for about 80 years. Before that we had a single piece of plain paper. Then a group of nations got together and devised a set of standards for passports with which we had to comply. A whole series of other changes were forced upon us by the USA.

Imagine working together with other countries to work things out!!

wish I could help you there, but damned if I've found one yet....

 

Well, there's the problem - if you consider Brexit indefensible, then what's the point asking me to defend my position, when you know in advance that nothing I say will be accepted by you?

 

Imagine working together with other countries to work things out!!

 

What about the problems that are *generated* by working with other countries, e.g. cultural and religious ones?

 

Something just occurred to me :

 

Some people here seem to consider Brexiters to be under-educated xenophobes brainwashed by the Daily Mail.

 

Also, there have been regular calls for all matters Brexit to be decided by our elected representatives.

 

But since some of our MP's are themselves Leave supporters, does that tar them with the same brush as ordinary Leave voters?

 

Well, there's the problem - if you consider Brexit indefensible, then what's the point asking me to defend my position, when you know in advance that nothing I say will be accepted by you?

 

I'm always willing to be convinced by evidence. Only a fool denies reality. For example, there are reports coming out now that the UK has seen an upswing in the last few months in foreign trade. That's good news.

 

What you then have to ask, is...

 

Where exactly is the trade coming from?

Will it be affected by Brexit?

Is it in upswing because we have had a downswing immediately before that so it's just returning to where it was?

 

How does it compare to pre-referendum?

How does it compare to pre-banking crisis?

 

Now, a propaganda machine will just report the fact and spin it into something marvellous and proof that Brexit is working terribly well. Someone who isn't an idiot would ask the right questions. It's not difficult. Gullible people just accept the statement on face value and don't question it, or anything.

With Brexit I think it's a case of reality vs ideology like all political debates

With Brexit I think it's a case of reality vs ideology like all political debates

 

that's not my experience of people who support Remain and people who support Brexit. The former tend to be well-educated, moderate, well-informed people, the latter, irrational, impulsive, poorly-informed on the whole. That obviously can't apply to everyone - but then people look for reasons to support their pre-conceived opinions and nothing shakes that belief.

 

What you should understand is that remainers don't CHOOSE to oppose Brexit out of ideology, they do it out of practicality and an assessment of evidence. That is not in any way something that can be applied to Brexiters, most of whom having particular angry whinges about something, while remaining oblivious or unconcerned or both about the problems that exist due to Brexit.