Saw someone state that there are TWO versions of Mel C's Independence Day??

Does anyone know the differences between the version released in the Bend it like Beckham Soundtrack and the Reason Japan edition? Is it mainly length or are they differnt productions? I can't find this info at all

20 hours ago, Mr.X said:

Saw someone state that there are TWO versions of Mel C's Independence Day??

Does anyone know the differences between the version released in the Bend it like Beckham Soundtrack and the Reason Japan edition? Is it mainly length or are they differnt productions? I can't find this info at all

There’s an entirely different version that was recorded during the sessions for Northern Star. Both the soundtrack and Japanese Reason tracks are exactly the same.

This is the original version. The promo Work In Progress and an American promo both have this version. She also performed it throughout 1999/2000 which you can see in videos like this. There was some debate at the time about its possible inclusion on the North American edition of the album. It was included as track 12 with Feel The Sun as track 13 on an Amazon listing at one time. It’s frequently labeled as a rough mix, but it is merely unmastered and was considered the final version until it was revisited early in the Reason sessions and reproduced and recorded with entirely new vocals.

The first version is way better than the second. It should have been included on Northern Star as you say at least on US.

1 hour ago, Re-Hash said:

There’s an entirely different version that was recorded during the sessions for Northern Star. Both the soundtrack and Japanese Reason tracks are exactly the same.

This is the original version. The promo Work In Progress and an American promo both have this version. She also performed it throughout 1999/2000 which you can see in videos like this. There was some debate at the time about its possible inclusion on the North American edition of the album. It was included as track 12 with Feel The Sun as track 13 on an Amazon listing at one time. It’s frequently labeled as a rough mix, but it is merely unmastered and was considered the final version until it was revisited early in the Reason sessions and reproduced and recorded with entirely new vocals.

Thank you, just updated the original post to reflect this and included this 'rough mix' version in the leaked section for Northern Star, and moved the released entry to the Reason section as a bonus (as it was technically a Bonus track for Japan).

Agree that this song could have easily been on Northern Star, and actually probably would have given Reason another uptempo boost in the middle of the album too! Another missed opportunity

9 hours ago, Mr.X said:

Thank you, just updated the original post to reflect this and included this 'rough mix' version in the leaked section for Northern Star, and moved the released entry to the Reason section as a bonus (as it was technically a Bonus track for Japan).

Agree that this song could have easily been on Northern Star, and actually probably would have given Reason another uptempo boost in the middle of the album too! Another missed opportunity

There’s the Rick Nowells Mix of I Wonder What It Would Be Like that was also on the Work In Progress promo along with the released version. The Billy Steinberg demo leaked as well.

There’s also an extended version of Mel C’s I Want You Back that clocks in at 3.36. It’s only 16 seconds longer and I’ve never been able to figure out what the difference is beyond a couple of seconds of silence at the beginning. It was on a promo with the edit that was released along with two(?) tracks, I think the album edit and the album version of NBTSA. Someone else will have to confirm which promo. I can’t seem to find it on Discogs now.

3 hours ago, Re-Hash said:

There’s the Rick Nowells Mix of I Wonder What It Would Be Like that was also on the Work In Progress promo along with the released version. The Billy Steinberg demo leaked as well.

There’s also an extended version of Mel C’s I Want You Back that clocks in at 3.36. It’s only 16 seconds longer and I’ve never been able to figure out what the difference is beyond a couple of seconds of silence at the beginning. It was on a promo with the edit that was released along with two(?) tracks, I think the album edit and the album version of NBTSA. Someone else will have to confirm which promo. I can’t seem to find it on Discogs now.

Thank you. Strangely I cant find the Rick Knowels version on discogs... Do you have any info?

Nonetheless, I will include these in the Northern Star section as demos? That seems like the most accurate place for these.

That leads me to think, is there a place where I can find any more demos of Mel C's songs that were then released?

3 hours ago, Mr.X said:

Thank you. Strangely I cant find the Rick Knowels version on discogs... Do you have any info?

Nonetheless, I will include these in the Northern Star section as demos? That seems like the most accurate place for these.

That leads me to think, is there a place where I can find any more demos of Mel C's songs that were then released?

I haven’t found a Discogs link for this one in quite a while. It was there for a really long time under the album listing, but I haven’t seen it in years.

It was pretty well known among Mel C fans back then that this existed. You Taught Me leaked in the middle of the album campaign if I remember correctly. It was listed in her discography on most fan pages that had a comprehensive listing as early as 2000.

I’m not exactly sure when it leaked, but they were .ra files if that tells you anything (RealAudio for anyone who wasn’t around then). I used to think the Rick Nowels mix was the one on the single, and that the released version was the other unreleased mix. I live in the US, so I didn’t know any better. It wasn’t until 2003 when I started buying her singles online I realized I had burned the wrong mix onto the end of my NS deluxe I made in 2001 or so.

For reference I’ll post the timings for the promo versus the (released) versions, as well as comparisons to the American promo where applicable.

Goin Down (Single Version) 3.44 (3.38) - No difference to the released single version. Just silence at the beginning and end of the track that makes up the difference.

Ga Ga (Rick Rubin Mix) 3.54 (3.52) - Album version.

Why (Pat McCarthy Mix) 5.44 (5.29) - Slightly extended outro with a later fade, otherwise the same. This is also the version found on the American preliminary album promo.

Never Be The Same Again (Pat McCarthy Mix) 4.54 (4.54) - Album version.

I Wonder What It Would Be Like (Rick Rubin) 3.43 (3.40) - Same as the released version.

I Wonder What It Would Be Like (Rick Nowells) 3.44 - Alternate mix.

If That Were Me (Pat McCarthy Mix) (4.33) - Album version.

Suddenly Monday (Rough Mix) 4.33 (2.37) - Significantly extended from the album version. The American promo has an edit of 3.06. Both feature longer instrumental sections and extended outros.

Closer (Rough Mix) 6.36 (5.44) - Another longer outro without a fade. The American promo has an even longer edit at 6.44. Both are relatively similar.

Be the One (Rough Mix) 3.40 (3.37) - Album version.

Northern Star (Pat McCarthy Mix) 5.37 (5.32) - This is the Full Version that was released on the single. The American promo has an edit that clocks 4.50, about ten seconds longer than the released album version. The fade is a bit longer.

Independence Day (Rough Mix) 4.28 - This is the “first version” I mentioned above. The same mix appears on the American promo.

You Taught Me (Rough Mix) 4.50 - I think we all know this one.

I just found the listing for the promo with the extended I Want You Back.

4 hours ago, Mr.X said:

That leads me to think, is there a place where I can find any more demos of Mel C's songs that were then released?

You have the Billy Steinberg mix listed as being on the Work In Progress. Don’t quote me, but I think it was found on a publishing site around the same time as Show Me The Way, I Didn’t Hear You Leave, and I Won’t Leave You Alone. It’s not been seen on any promo so far.

There’s a Reason promo which I believe is this one. It features an unmixed/unmastered mix of On The Horizon.

There are two German promos for The Sea. The first is this one. Let There Be Love is not mastered. One By One is a rough demo. All the rest are demos and different from their released versions.

The second promo. Let There Be Love, Drown and One By One are the same as the former promo. Neither of the “Latest” mixes are the same as the album version. The rest is pretty self-explanatory.

For Emma, I can only think of the first album promo that had Everybody Wants To Be. There’s a rough mix of A Girl Like Me. The rest of the album is the same.

Hopefully that’s what you meant.

oofff first of all, thank you for all of that, very useful.

I am kind of intrigued about how to list some of those. I think a demo is an unfinished song that hasnt been mastered and/or an early version of a song that was then released. Both definitions work for the idea of a 'demo'. In some cases, I like to separate them in the original post between demos of songs that havent been released and demos of songs that were released (such as the Wannabe demo in Wannabe25 and the demos in Spice25)... This also fits the descriptions of 'rough mixes' which are versions of the songs that then got released or got to almost the finish line before being taken out of the albums (such as 'You Taught Me').

Genuinely, I have mostly been guided by lists in fan sites, ASCAP and other publishing sites, as well as promo CDs on Discogs (though I find these very unreliable to understand if they are demos or remixes sometimes!)

Thanks, I will have a look and see how to catalogue those into the original post!

Edited April 17Apr 17 by Mr.X

8 hours ago, Mr.X said:

oofff first of all, thank you for all of that, very useful.

I am kind of intrigued about how to list some of those. I think a demo is an unfinished song that hasnt been mastered and/or an early version of a song that was then released. Both definitions work for the idea of a 'demo'. In some cases, I like to separate them in the original post between demos of songs that havent been released and demos of songs that were released (such as the Wannabe demo in Wannabe25 and the demos in Spice25)... This also fits the descriptions of 'rough mixes' which are versions of the songs that then got released or got to almost the finish line before being taken out of the albums (such as 'You Taught Me').

Genuinely, I have mostly been guided by lists in fan sites, ASCAP and other publishing sites, as well as promo CDs on Discogs (though I find these very unreliable to understand if they are demos or remixes sometimes!)

Thanks, I will have a look and see how to catalogue those into the original post!

Glad to help! If I think of anything else I’ll be sure to post it. There is one Mel B promo for Hot that has a rough mix of Lullaby that is a rough mix and a slightly different version of Pack Your Shit that is completely uncensored and has a different intro. It’s also about twenty seconds shorter. The mix of Tell Me is also about twenty seconds shorter.

It does become difficult figuring out how to categorize them. I do think your idea of separating them into the two categories is the best option. You could argue that anything prior to the final mix and release could be considered a demo, so that’s probably the best way to label them unless you want to drive yourself crazy.

For most of what I’ve posted, the rough mixes aren’t exactly rough mixes. If something was considered a rough mix on a promo prior to 2005-ish, it was usually labeled as such for internal purposes to distinguish it from a final edit or master so it wouldn’t accidentally be included in the master sent to production facilities for the physical releases.

There are some tracks that fit in the grey area between a demo and a not mastered final mix. One example, Emma’s rough mix of A Girl Like Me is not a demo. It has a fully produced vocal (the same vocals used for the released version) and backing track, and the mix was late stage. It was beefed up to add another poppy/upbeat song to the album since it already had a significant amount of mid-tempos. So while it isn’t the final mix, it isn’t a demo either. This would fit in the same category as Mel C’s ‘Latest Dance Mix’ of Stupid Game on the second promo I linked as well as the pre-release version of On The Horizon that I mentioned as well.

None of the tracks labeled as rough mixes on the Mel C Work In Progress are demos. They are the finished mixes that were then sent off for mastering. Even You Taught Me and Independence Day are both finished tracks. All would qualify as unreleased tracks/edits that are not mastered rather than unreleased demos.

The only ‘rough mix’ demo is One By One. It’s an acoustic demo with just her solo vocal and a guitar. The others labeled as just ‘demo’ are actually demos.

Personally, I’d like to thank you for your work on this list. It has greatly improved the running list I had going 15 years ago. The publishing sites are a great resource for comparing tracks mentioned on fan sites, and Discogs is also a really great site for finding information on remixes (specifically) that weren’t commercially released at the time. With the girls as a group and solo, most of the promos listed on Discogs were sent to radio/publications. They don’t differ from commercial releases for the most part other than what I’ve posted. I’m still digging though, so if I remember anything or come across anything specific I’ll be sure to let you know.

Please feel free to PM me if you have any other questions or you think I might be able to clarify information you got elsewhere. I’ll do my best.

Edited April 17Apr 17 by Re-Hash

Thank you so much for all the info and yes, I think there must be some changes in the original post to diferentiate this.

Ultimately even looking at the various versions of 2 become 1 available, or the Say You'll be There ones too (like, the version with the wrap is a pretty good one to be just a demo and has a different title even!) makes me think these are not just demos but very well polished versions that were considered for potential release.

A demo is a more rough mix, or even an early idea. Think Feed Your Love or Likely Stories where it is clearly a first-day-in-the-studio type of recording that than never got more 'production' or vocals recorded because it was deemed not appropriate/right/good enough for release.

It's all very confusing indeed and I might just do two sections for each girl:

1 - Released demos and/or early mixes of released songs (so Feed Your Love and the various demos and mixes on Spice25 would fit in this)

2 - Demos and early mixes of unreleased songs - so songs like Sugar & Spice and Melody of life would go hear, as well as the earlier mixes of Say You'll Be There would fit in this, or the demos of 2 Become 1 and Love Thing...)

So in the case of Mel C, we would have both Independence Day and I Wonder What it Would Be Like various leaked versions, as well as the demo for Drown or One by One in Section 1 but then demos for songs like Whenever You're Near in Section 2

I think this might help diferentiate them properly here, so as not to go completely crazy with categorisations lol

Does that make sense?

That does make sense. It’s the easiest and least confusing way without having to add a third category IMO. It’s not really any different than listing a single edit/version or radio edit as an alternate version to the main album version.

OK I will slowly go through it. I think the Spice Girls sections and Emma sections are mostly done by now. I have a few questions though:

Is this the 'rough' version of A Girl Like Me or is it a fan made mix? I ask because I dont remember at all listening to it and you mention earlier that the rough mix was slower?... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXjK7-y-D4c

From this German promo of The Sea, have the demos apart from American Sweetheart and Bck in Your Arms ever leaked? I guess the Drown demo is also out there, and I would think it comes from this cd as well?

Also, do you have a link to the Hot promo CD that includes the incensored version of Pack Your Shit and the rough mix of Lullaby?

Thank you!!

Edited April 18Apr 18 by Mr.X

7 hours ago, Mr.X said:

OK I will slowly go through it. I think the Spice Girls sections and Emma sections are mostly done by now. I have a few questions though:

Is this the 'rough' version of A Girl Like Me or is it a fan made mix? I ask because I dont remember at all listening to it and you mention earlier that the rough mix was slower?... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXjK7-y-D4c

From this German promo of The Sea, have the demos apart from American Sweetheart and Bck in Your Arms ever leaked? I guess the Drown demo is also out there, and I would think it comes from this cd as well?

Also, do you have a link to the Hot promo CD that includes the incensored version of Pack Your Shit and the rough mix of Lullaby?

Thank you!!

Yes! That is the rough mix on the promo I linked. The cover they have on the video is incorrect. I have that specific promo and none of the tracks are different. Much more mid-tempo than what was released.

Here’s the uncensored Pack Your Shit. Here’s the rough mix of Lullaby. This is the ‘Mix for Approval’ of Tell Me that’s shorter than the album version. All from that Hot promo.

The Sea promo:

Let There Be Love (Not Yet Mastered)

American Sweetheart (Demo)

Drown (Demo)

Beautiful Mind (Demo)

One by One (Rough Demo)

Back In Your Arms (Demo)

Stupid Game (Demo)

You are correct. The Drown demo does come from the two promos. I can’t find a link for Beautiful Mind or Stupid Game unfortunately. Beautiful Mind sounds like it’s the same as the album version. Maybe a rough vocal, but it’s pretty close. Stupid Game is a demo though, I’ll keep trying to find a link for you. None of the videos I’ve come across are the same demo.

I also need to correct some of the info I gave regarding the 11-track promo of The Sea. I think Drown and One By One are the only tracks that are different from the final versions. These are the same as the links I gave above. The rest of the tracks labeled as a demo sound like rough mixes that haven’t been mastered. Similar to the NS Work In Progress. Other than some balancing and volume inconsistency, they’re pretty much identical I’m afraid. No significant differences. Even the ‘Latest Dance Mix’ of Stupid Game is closer to what was released than I remember. Tbh I haven’t listened to most of them in years and should have before posting. SMH.

Links for the remaining tracks not on the previous promo:

Get Out Of Here (Demo)

Stupid Game (Latest Dance Mix)

Weak (Latest Mix)

This is a very long shot, but maybe 'Dingeling' was reworked into 'Ting-a-ling'? They’re both Biffco co-writes. Hmm...

https://youtu.be/lgr0TIux7fE

5 minutes ago, VampFan said:

This is a very long shot, but maybe 'Dingeling' was reworked into 'Ting-a-ling'? They’re both Biffco co-writes. Hmm...

https://youtu.be/lgr0TIux7fE

hhhmmm could you ask Biff on instagram directly please? lol he often answers

Thank you for that, very helpful. I have removed those from the OP since there is no significant changes, it just creates 'clutter' here imo.

If you do find the links for demos of Beautiful Mind and Stupid Game that are from that promo CD, please do let me know as I'd love to hear them and include them in the OP

On 19/04/2025 at 14:00, VampFan said:

This is a very long shot, but maybe 'Dingeling' was reworked into 'Ting-a-ling'? They’re both Biffco co-writes. Hmm...

https://youtu.be/lgr0TIux7fE

hhhmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm........................................................

Two things that just came to light:

A listing on ASCAP of a Girls Just Wanna Have Fun (A Night To Remember) that lists the girls as writers alongside Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis (and the writers of the A Night To Remember sample) as well as them listed as performers too. Here's a link https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=1226758275775117&set=g.478081472578599

This might be a If You Wanna Have Some Fun early demo since that song also sampled A Night To Remember anyway, so it might be an early idea of the song that then flourished into the final one that got released. Interesting to have it published and the first I heard of it... Are we about to get some demos on Forever25?? 😋

Also, a fan just shared a bunch of Passion demo clips, but I cant figure out if these are real or fan made... Do we know if they are real at all?

Edited April 22Apr 22 by Mr.X