I know it might be an unpopular view, but I really think it would be an idea if the NHS started charging people at least half the treatment costs in cases where the illness has been brought about by smoking/drinking/over-eating.

 

You seem to forget that the Govt taxes ciggies and alcohol, in fact, THIS country taxes these things more than any other European country... If our Govt put the revenue from booze and ciggies purely into the NHS, then it wouldn't be an issue, but of course, they probably dont, do they....? <_<

 

The NHS aint having problems because of people drinking and smoking, it's having problems because of all those fukkin' Trust managers, accountants, admin people and "financial consultants" and their exorbitant fees bleeding the system dry....

NHS services should always be free at the point of delivery - that's the whole point of having a National Health Service. We already pay for dental treatment and glasses. Let's not add more things to pay for.

 

Education is the answer. It doesn't always work effectively but I don't think we should be victimising people for being overweight.

 

(I'd have made this post earlier but I've just been for a 26 mile cycle run!)

TRIPE! if that was true then obesity wouldnt be on the rise. obesity has EVERYTHING to do with what you eat.

 

however there are a few, a very small minority that are obese through a medical condition and their doctor would diagnose it, they deserve treatment .

Exactly! If someone is quite fat it's not necessarily their fault as some people are naturally like that but for someone to be OBESE that's the fault of the person for eating too much or basically not taking care of themselves.

I am just over 6ft tall and have a BMI of around 27 which puts me in the slightly overweight catergory but no doubt I am damaging my internal organs by drinking so much coke and eating so much chocolate and crisps but no one talks about making me pay for treatment because I don't look obese at all but I am eating every much amount of junk food as an obese person, add to that the 4 lots of 12" pizza I have every week, I am a heart attack waiting to happen so why should I get free treatment if anything happens to me yet someone 16 stone has to pay ?

 

And Rob where does this making people pay for treatment stop ??

 

Should anyone who drinks too much alcohol have to pay for their NHS treatment ?

 

Should someone who smokes have to pay ?

 

Should people who's houses are near airports have to pay given the emmisions from planes ?

 

Should people who are not obese but do not belong to gyms or sports clubs have to pay ?

 

Should people who injure themselves playing sport have to pay ?

 

Should people who make too many mobile phone calls have to pay as it is proven that over use of mobiles can cause brain tumours ?

 

Every time we go outside we are breathing in all sorts of $h!t into our lungs from traffic pollution and industrial pollution and so on so should there be an outdoors tax too where anyone that gets asthma or lung probs through being outside has to pay for their treatment as they could have just stayed indoors ?

 

Where does it end ? why penalise one group of society and not others ? hell lets penalise EVERYONE who has a non perfectly healthy living llifestyle and charge NHS treatment to everyone except vicars, nuns and trappist monks :rolleyes:

 

silly argument m8... we arnt talking here about minute evils that harm our health but about DELIBERATELY stuffing your face with c**p to a point where its harmful to our health.

 

alcohol and fags are taxed (but not all the money goes to the nhs....it should do).

 

im 6' and 13.4 stone, i eat healthily and excercise, i want to live long and have a good quality of life, therefore i dont sit on my arse and eat c**p.

 

if there wasnt so many alkies/smokers/gluttons then the nhs could spend more on real illnesses.

It shouldn't be called a "fat tax" because skinny/slim people eat that junk food too. They should make unhealthy food more expensive or make healthy food cheaper.

 

They seem to forget that the reason some are obese is because they don't exercise regularly e.g. 5-6times a wk, or eat healthy food the majority of the time, which is just like some skinny/slim people, but they don't get the stigma or get laughed at.

 

If they did this, they shouldn't stop there. Tax smokers, drinkers, car drivers, motor cyclists, people with children, the elderly, etc who also put a strain on the NHS.

It shouldn't be called a "fat tax" because skinny/slim people eat that junk food too. They should make unhealthy food more expensive or make healthy food cheaper.

 

They seem to forget that the reason some are obese is because they don't exercise regularly e.g. 5-6times a wk, or eat healthy food the majority of the time, which is just like some skinny/slim people, but they don't get the stigma or get laughed at.

 

If they did this, they shouldn't stop there. Tax smokers, drinkers, car drivers, motor cyclists, people with children, the elderly, etc who also put a strain on the NHS.

 

they DO tax smokers and drinkers, it just doesnt go to the nhs.... <_<

 

drivers are taxed more then anyone too!

 

the point of this fat tax (unhealthy food more expensive, ?.... like a fat tax you mean? :lol: ) is that obesity 90% of the time is caused by glutony, a self inflicted disorder. getting old or having kids is normal and is what the nhs should be there for, to tackle natural disorders.

silly argument m8... we arnt talking here about minute evils that harm our health but about DELIBERATELY stuffing your face with c**p to a point where its harmful to our health.

 

alcohol and fags are taxed (but not all the money goes to the nhs....it should do).

 

im 6' and 13.4 stone, i eat healthily and excercise, i want to live long and have a good quality of life, therefore i dont sit on my arse and eat c**p.

 

if there wasnt so many alkies/smokers/gluttons then the nhs could spend more on real illnesses.

 

 

Bizarrely you are the second person to proclaim their weight on this thread - and the second person to be slightly overweight! Your Body Mass Index is 25.23. It should be below 25 - so, to be fair, you're only just over! :lol:

 

Anyone else want to criticize the overweight while being overweight themselves? Perhaps you should try the NHS's Body Mass Index Calculator here before you do!

 

Oh, and in case you were wondering, my weight is 12 stone 2 pounds and I'm 5'11". My BMI is 23.71. :P

Bizarrely you are the second person to proclaim their weight on this thread - and the second person to be slightly overweight! Your Body Mass Index is 25.23. It should be below 25 - so, to be fair, you're only just over! :lol:

 

Anyone else want to criticize the overweight while being overweight themselves? Perhaps you should try the NHS's Body Mass Index Calculator here before you do!

 

Oh, and in case you were wondering, my weight is 12 stone 2 pounds and I'm 5'11". My BMI is 23.71. :P

 

according to my doctor my ideal weight for my age and height is 13.7, so im slightly UNDER weight! :P

 

anyway, the argument isnt about being overweight, its about being OBESE.

People have rejected the Size Zero indoctrination and have gone OTT the other way where they don't care what people think.

If people want to be fat then let them. If people want to skinny/slim/slender then let them.

Its really no ones business but the individuals.

 

Sure, it would be great if we can all be fit and terrific ( I feel bloated when I put on a kilo. I have no idea how some people can carry so much weight around. )

but at the end of the day, you can't dictate to people how they should live. And if you do, people just tune out and miss the message anyway.

Edited September 15, 200717 yr by Naomi Watts

It all depends on someone's metabollism though that is what causes obesity not what they eat

 

I eat typically 3 or 4 packets of crisps a day and a large bar of Milky Bar and at least 3 cans of Coke but because of my metabollism I do not get abese, I am a relatively ok 14 and half stone even though I eat like a pig in a trough, I think that it would be unfair to fine people for having a bad metabollism rate when I am just as at much and am at risk from the same food related illnesses

 

Perhaps it is unfair, but at the end of the day, if you know you have a low metabollism, it's down to you to make adjustments to your lifestyle, rather than continue eating multiple packets of crisps/chocolate bars a day and expect someone else to sort the problems out later on. The only exception would be where there's a medical condition at the cause of the obesity.

 

 

The NHS aint having problems because of people drinking and smoking, it's having problems because of all those fukkin' Trust managers, accountants, admin people and "financial consultants" and their exorbitant fees bleeding the system dry....

 

I agree that this is the most problematic issue, although the over-eating/smoking/drinking doesn't help improve things. A reasonable wage cap on consultants working in the public sector would be a GREAT help, but can you see the government agreeing to this?

you can't dictate to people how they should live. And if you do, people just tune out and miss the message anyway.

 

you can when it effects YOU, smoking is banned from public places because it impinges on non smokers.. if every lard arse ate themselves silly because they want to, the tab for treating them on the nhs would come back to us! i have no problem with supporting the nhs to treat ill people, but i object to my taxes being wasted on people who inflict ill health upon themselves! smokers and drinkers pay high taxes on their vices, why shouldnt gluttons?

It shouldn't be called a "fat tax" because skinny/slim people eat that junk food too. They should make unhealthy food more expensive or make healthy food cheaper.

 

It doesn't matter what the government called it. The press would call it a "fat tax".

the point of this fat tax (unhealthy food more expensive, ?.... like a fat tax you mean? :lol: ) is that obesity 90% of the time is caused by glutony, a self inflicted disorder. getting old or having kids is normal and is what the nhs should be there for, to tackle natural disorders.

 

Not all the time. I was obese myself and I didn't overreat, my problem was I didn't exercise. Skinny/slim people can be gluttonous too and no one says a word, but was obese/overweight people do it, they get ridiculed. Some people don't eat enough food so their bodies think they're starving and hold onto everything they eat, but as usual, society thinks fat=lazy, ugly, greedy pigs.

 

Not all the time. I was obese myself and I didn't overreat, my problem was I didn't exercise. Skinny/slim people can be gluttonous too and no one says a word, but was obese/overweight people do it, they get ridiculed. Some people don't eat enough food so their bodies think they're starving and hold onto everything they eat, but as usual, society thinks fat=lazy, ugly, greedy pigs.

 

erm.... you quoted me saying "90% of the time...." and you replied "not all the time"... which is what i said! :lol:

 

i know its not all black and white, but MOST obesity is down to laziness... eating c**p for conveiniance, and not being responsable enough to excercise. its a pretty simple equasion... consume more energy then you expend and your body will store the excess.

 

you admitted yourself that you didnt excercise, so is it any wonder that 'society thinks fat=lazy...'

 

i admit that i am sizeist, i do think that morbidly obese people are disgusting, lazy, greedy pigs... they ARE! its self inflicted, but ill be right behind anyone who wants to take responsability for their actions and do something about it. as i see it, theres NO excuse, help is there, information is rife about healthy eating.

erm.... you quoted me saying "90% of the time...." and you replied "not all the time"... which is what i said! :lol:

 

i know its not all black and white, but MOST obesity is down to laziness... eating c**p for conveiniance, and not being responsable enough to excercise. its a pretty simple equasion... consume more energy then you expend and your body will store the excess.

 

you admitted yourself that you didnt excercise, so is it any wonder that 'society thinks fat=lazy...'

 

i admit that i am sizeist, i do think that morbidly obese people are disgusting, lazy, greedy pigs... they ARE! its self inflicted, but ill be right behind anyone who wants to take responsability for their actions and do something about it. as i see it, theres NO excuse, help is there, information is rife about healthy eating.

 

Do you exercise 6 times a week for an hour? Hardly anyone does so why jump on obese people and leave people who are skinny/slim who are lazy and don't exercise alone? Yeah I'm still 20lbs overweight but I workout for one hr six times a week, whilst skinny/slim girls at my school are proudof themselves for exercising once a year before the summer. Who's lazy- fat me or slim them?

 

I feel sorry for you, because people like you don't change until you see first hand what it's like. Good luck to you when it does happen.

Do you exercise 6 times a week for an hour? Hardly anyone does so why jump on obese people and leave people who are skinny/slim who are lazy and don't exercise alone? Yeah I'm still 20lbs overweight but I workout for one hr six times a week, whilst skinny/slim girls at my school are proudof themselves for exercising once a year before the summer. Who's lazy- fat me or slim them?

 

I feel sorry for you, because people like you don't change until you see first hand what it's like. Good luck to you when it does happen.

 

im a manual worker so yes! i do 4-6 hours a day :P

 

again you are missing my point.... " 90%".... "MOST" i acknowledged that its not black and white and you seem to be focusing on the young, im talking about ALL ages, not only the young. i realise though that this might sound somewhat offensive to you IF you fall in the 10% bracket who have a poor metabolism, who find it incredibly hard to lose weight dispite trying.

 

i HAVE been overweight, it creeps up on you without you realising it, i did something about it, i stopped eating $h!te and started eating FOOD.

Everything is Tax today, nothing isn't trust me.

 

Everything that's being sold is Taxed, so making it being taxed even more is silly.

 

Not everyone can help what size they are, I don't eat $h!t but I put on weight due to a holiday, came back was eating salad and exercising but still not lost a fukking pound!

im a manual worker so yes! i do 4-6 hours a day :P

 

again you are missing my point.... " 90%".... "MOST" i acknowledged that its not black and white and you seem to be focusing on the young, im talking about ALL ages, not only the young. i realise though that this might sound somewhat offensive to you IF you fall in the 10% bracket who have a poor metabolism, who find it incredibly hard to lose weight dispite trying.

 

i HAVE been overweight, it creeps up on you without you realising it, i did something about it, i stopped eating $h!te and started eating FOOD.

 

Is there a study that proves that only 10% have a poor metabolism or is that your own generalisation? I'm sure if I fall in that 10% because my weight loss has stalled right now.

 

Well done to you for taking charge, but I don't understand why people like you express so much disgust towards the overweight/obese people who don't exercise and eat "FOOD" while there's skinny/slim people who do the same and get away with it? Why don't they get ridiculed and be called greedy pigs too? I personally am tired of people lecturing the overweight/obese to do something, diet, etc and yet they don't do it themselves.

 

I just think it's sad. I don't think we're going to agree so I think we should go our separate ways with our separate views.

 

"You have your way. I have my way. As for the correct way, the right way and the only way- it doesn't exist.

 

 

Everything is Tax today, nothing isn't trust me.

 

Everything that's being sold is Taxed, so making it being taxed even more is silly.

 

Not everyone can help what size they are, I don't eat $h!t but I put on weight due to a holiday, came back was eating salad and exercising but still not lost a fukking pound!

 

You say that you ate salads, but were you eating enough food in general? You could stick to salads and exercises for 4-6 hours a day and lose nothing because you're not giving yourself enough fuel. Also remember that some people stay the same weight but lose inches off their body, so measure yours. If they go down then you are not losing weight but losing FAT which is obviously what you want to do. Also get your body fat percentage and BMI tested to see if you really do have weight to lose.

 

sunrise sunset

 

my distain is towards lazy pigs who DO sit on their fat arses and eat c**p... not people whos metabolism or body type/genetic makes it difficult/impossible to lose weight :)

 

however i understand that society wont/cant differentiate between the two. fatties like dawn french who revels in being a glutton dont do "the ten percent" of people who cant help it any favours.