The point I was making was that the Labour leaders response was pretty pathetic given the seriousness of the situation and this is the problem. No matter what the tories do and how bad things seem to get, labours response is also inadequate. Yes,I agree Johnson is unlikely to go just because Labour demand it but we need a far stronger opposition to get rid of this abysmal deceitful government who only had their own interests at heart.

 

What should their response be though? The general public don't like tittle tattle politics. I think people often what they want vs what the public want mixed up. Calling for Boris to resign is a trap which the Tory spin will easily avoid. Yes, of course he should resign, but he's not going to. This Government had an 80 seat majority 2 years ago, sometimes I don't know what people expect as Boris is still very popular with the public. The Government are making themselves look like idiots and its beginning to cut through.

At PMQ, Johnson is going for the 'I know nothing' defence and implying that the leaked video is banter. See what else comes out as I think it is likely that more will.

At PMQ, Johnson is going for the 'I know nothing' defence and implying that the leaked video is banter. See what else comes out as I think it is likely that more will.

 

Blame the underlings, it's worked for him in the past so why stop now?

 

What should their response be though? The general public don't like tittle tattle politics. I think people often what they want vs what the public want mixed up. Calling for Boris to resign is a trap which the Tory spin will easily avoid. Yes, of course he should resign, but he's not going to. This Government had an 80 seat majority 2 years ago, sometimes I don't know what people expect as Boris is still very popular with the public. The Government are making themselves look like idiots and its beginning to cut through.

 

It’s hardly tittle tattle politics. The leaked video is incredibly undermining for the governments reputation - not just here but internationally. Labour need to call on a vote of no confidence in his leadership and push further for a criminal enquiry into their actions. The problem is if we have to introduce further restrictions now, how can you expect the public to comply? Johnson has flaunted the rules all along and never taken covid seriously and this is evident in their woofully inadequate approach since the start of the pandemic.

It’s hardly tittle tattle politics. The leaked video is incredibly undermining for the governments reputation - not just here but internationally. Labour need to call on a vote of no confidence in his leadership and push further for a criminal enquiry into their actions. The problem is if we have to introduce further restrictions now, how can you expect the public to comply? Johnson has flaunted the rules all along and never taken covid seriously and this is evident in their woofully inadequate approach since the start of the pandemic.

 

You're just walking in to the Tory trap doing that though, as the Tories spin that to "we are trying to roll our a booster programme and keep you safe, while the opposition is trying to sack us". People are too used to the Corbyn emotional politics who would walk in to traps left, right and centre. A no confidence vote would achieve absolutely nothing, there is no way his own party are going to whip against him in public. You can already see the line the Tory spin machine is going with.

 

Johnson leaving as PM isn't gonna make people comply. People will comply because they want to keep their loved ones safe, not because Starmer calls for Johnson to resign.

Anyone who claims they're not gonna follow the rules if restrictions are brought back probably didn't follow them beforehand so nothing will change in that regard.

Anyone who claims they're not gonna follow the rules if restrictions are brought back probably didn't follow them beforehand so nothing will change in that regard.

 

Actually I think for a lot of people this is the final straw. After all the sacrifices they've made, this is how the people telling them it was necessary were thinking.

 

Anyway Boris is busy trying to play to the base with buzzword Tory bingo..

 

Boris Johnson says Sir Keir is "playing politics" and the government is dealing with immigration controls and changing the law to tackle with county lines drug gangs.

 

You're just walking in to the Tory trap doing that though, as the Tories spin that to "we are trying to roll our a booster programme and keep you safe, while the opposition is trying to sack us". People are too used to the Corbyn emotional politics who would walk in to traps left, right and centre. A no confidence vote would achieve absolutely nothing, there is no way his own party are going to whip against him in public. You can already see the line the Tory spin machine is going with.

 

Johnson leaving as PM isn't gonna make people comply. People will comply because they want to keep their loved ones safe, not because Starmer calls for Johnson to resign.

 

How do you know that for certain that s no confidence vote in his leadership won’t change anything? You can’t possibly predict the outcome. You can’t judge the situation on past scenarios neither as covid is such a unique situation and this is likely to cause public outrage. A number of Tory MPs have told media outlets they are furious about the situation and how undermining it is.

 

I agree Johnson leaving won’t make people comply because it’s too late now. The damage is already done by the government last time with the Cummings effect and this just reinforces it. You lead by example and when you have an absolute Moran in charge, how can you expect anyone to take you seriously!

Edited December 8, 20213 yr by slowdown73

Actually I think for a lot of people this is the final straw. After all the sacrifices they've made, this is how the people telling them it was necessary were thinking.

 

But if police are gonna start fining the common man again they'll have no choice. Unfortunately, unlike the MPs, we're not above the law.

At PMQ, Johnson is going for the 'I know nothing' defence and implying that the leaked video is banter. See what else comes out as I think it is likely that more will.

 

I mean, who could possibly know if a party was going on in their own house? 🤦‍♂️

How do you know that for certain that s no confidence vote in his leadership won’t change anything? You can’t possibly predict the outcome. A number of Tory MPs have told media outlets they are furious about the situation and how undermining it is.

 

I agree Johnson leaving won’t make people comply because it’s too late now. The damage is already done by the government last time with the Cummings effect and this just reinforces it. You lead by example and when you have an absolute Moran in charge, how can you expect anyone to take you seriously!

 

Yeah it's one thing saying "I am furious with the PM" to actually voting against him in a no confidence vote. So first of all it would be the Opposition that calls it, so you're relying on 80+ Tory MPs to vote with the rest of the opposition, that's not gonna happen. No confidence votes are rare unless the Party is severly weak. What you need is the 1922 committee to decide they want someone else running the Party and that's not gonna happen when Starmer runs his mouth off saying "Johnson should resign".

Yeah it's one thing saying "I am furious with the PM" to actually voting against him in a no confidence vote. So first of all it would be the Opposition that calls it, so you're relying on 80+ Tory MPs to vote with the rest of the opposition, that's not gonna happen. No confidence votes are rare unless the Party is severly weak. What you need is the 1922 committee to decide they want someone else running the Party and that's not gonna happen when Starmer runs his mouth off saying "Johnson should resign".

 

The internal Tory party procedure will likely be how he's booted and out, and the Tories have shown in recent years to know how that process works.

1922 committee is the only way that Johnson is resigning. Any proper challenge from the SNP or Labour will just send them rallying round.

 

A number of Tory MPs are cowards who won't reveal who they are when they voice their ever so real 'dissatisfaction' with the government.

 

I think I heard 'playing politics' 5 or more times from Johnson's mouth at this PMQs. Still think this is going to be another 'ah well, nevertheless' but he's guilty as f*** and he can't say anything aside from criticising his opponents for opposing him.

The internal Tory party procedure will likely be how he's booted and out, and the Tories have shown in recent years to know how that process works.

 

Absolutely, that's the only way Johnson is going. Any motion passed by the Opposition is just "playing politics" as Johnson calls it right now. If the Tories lose the up-coming by-election that's when I think the 1922 committee might start to begin their moves.

 

I know it's totally frustrating and we're a laughing stock, but it does look like some of this stuff is starting to cut through. The big thing for me is if The Mirror have more info and are holding back still. Someone surely somewhere has that list of who attended the party.

The only way for a No Confidence motion to succeed is for dozens of Tory MPs to rebel and vote against the government. There is a very good reason why that won't happen. If the government loses a confidence vote, there is a two-week period for someone else to form a government. Unless the Tories can find an alternative PM in that time, it won't happen unless Starmer can somehow cobble together a coalition of all opposition parties plus the rebel Tories. That, then, means an election early next year. The rebel Tories would all lose the party Whip which means they could not stand as Tory candidates in that election. In other words, they will lose their jobs.

Oh yeah a vote of no confidence will do f*** all. For all the clowns tears of them playing politics all they are doing is what the people expect and that is to hold the gov to account. The longer and harder they do that without calling a vote of no confidence the harder it gets for the Tories and the more likely we are to see them implode and trigger the 1922 process.

 

Here having the SNP call for him to resign while labour don’t quite go that far is a great two prong pressure strategy. Both are playing to different audiences and by playing both cards the Tories never quite know who to attack. They could go after the SNP but given the absolute disgrace they pulled at Holyrood they’ve no legs to stand on, and with labour not going quite so far it then neuters the options the Tories have to push back.

 

At least that’s how I see it

 

 

 

 

I personally really hope for a vax passport for England so I can watch Douglas Ross vote for it and then come back to Holyrood and try to attack the SNP for running one. The Scottish media won’t push the Tories on their hypocrisy, they never ever ever do, but watching them squirm at FMQs will be joyous. (The Scottish medias refusal to hold the Scottish Tories to account or even ask them anything approaching a moderately challenging question is a very very real and dangerous problem)

The only way for a No Confidence motion to succeed is for dozens of Tory MPs to rebel and vote against the government. There is a very good reason why that won't happen. If the government loses a confidence vote, there is a two-week period for someone else to form a government. Unless the Tories can find an alternative PM in that time, it won't happen unless Starmer can somehow cobble together a coalition of all opposition parties plus the rebel Tories. That, then, means an election early next year. The rebel Tories would all lose the party Whip which means they could not stand as Tory candidates in that election. In other words, they will lose their jobs.

 

There's a difference between a No Confidence Vote in the government in parliament and a no confidence vote in the Prime Minister within the Tory Party.

 

I don't think anyone's seriously suggesting the former when the Tories have a whopping majority, but the very fact the Tories have a whopping majority means their unlikely to want to lose it and makes the latter possible,

The only way for a No Confidence motion to succeed is for dozens of Tory MPs to rebel and vote against the government. There is a very good reason why that won't happen. If the government loses a confidence vote, there is a two-week period for someone else to form a government. Unless the Tories can find an alternative PM in that time, it won't happen unless Starmer can somehow cobble together a coalition of all opposition parties plus the rebel Tories. That, then, means an election early next year. The rebel Tories would all lose the party Whip which means they could not stand as Tory candidates in that election. In other words, they will lose their jobs.

 

Understand that but I think the Tories would easily vote in another candidate to raise their standing in the polls and protect their jobs. There are plenty of candidates waiting in the wings - most obvious Truss and Sunak. Tories will change their loyalties like the weather, none of them really want Johnnson outside of his electability.

Yeah it's one thing saying "I am furious with the PM" to actually voting against him in a no confidence vote. So first of all it would be the Opposition that calls it, so you're relying on 80+ Tory MPs to vote with the rest of the opposition, that's not gonna happen. No confidence votes are rare unless the Party is severly weak. What you need is the 1922 committee to decide they want someone else running the Party and that's not gonna happen when Starmer runs his mouth off saying "Johnson should resign".

 

I’m not suggesting a confudence vote in the government, I’m suggesting a no confidence vote in the leadership so not sure if you are getting confused. I do think there will be a level of public outrage over this in the coming weeks and it’s only a matter of time before his MPs turn on him. He clearly can’t answer the allegations for clearly incriminating himself so he’s guilty as hell.

There's a difference between a No Confidence Vote in the government in parliament and a no confidence vote in the Prime Minister within the Tory Party.

 

I don't think anyone's seriously suggesting the former when the Tories have a whopping majority, but the very fact the Tories have a whopping majority means their unlikely to want to lose it and makes the latter possible,

Indeed. Starmer's role, then, is to work to undermine confidence in Johnson. He needs to make Tory MPs embarrassed to be sitting behind Johnson in the Commons.

 

Understand that but I think the Tories would easily vote in another candidate to raise their standing in the polls and protect their jobs. There are plenty of candidates waiting in the wings - most obvious Truss and Sunak. Tories will change their loyalties like the weather, none of them really want Johnnson outside of his electability.

Truss is absolutely useless. Even in a Cabinet of dimwits, she is particularly dim. As long as Starmer doesn't have any problems with attacking a woman (I assume he doesn't as he would have had to do so in his career as a barrister), he would make mincemeat of her.