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The Official Labour Foot-Shoot Thread, Mk II

Brett-Butler
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I agree with McDonnell there should t be a remain option, if it's another referendum the best way would be to have a ref over the deal, you can't just ignore a referendum voted on by 17m people.

 

WHAT?!

 

You mean a 50 50 SPLIT VOTE? IT WAS AN OPINION POLL, NON BINDING.

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I watched loads of Steve Richards lectures on BBC parliament especially the ones on previous PMs, he's an excellent political commentator!

 

What can I type into the iplayer to get this series?

Prime seems to do the trick. The brings up, among other things, Reflections: The Prime Ministers We Never Had.

I agree with McDonnell there should t be a remain option, if it's another referendum the best way would be to have a ref over the deal, you can't just ignore a referendum voted on by 17m people.

A referendum where around 50% of the electorate cannot vote for their preferred option is not acceptable. It would be just as undemocratic as the Crimea referendum after the Russian invasion which did not allow for the status quo.

McDonnell hinting that there could be a second referendum but only on the terms of Brexit, with no option to stay in the EU.

 

No way out of Brexit under Labour then, how progressive!! Labour have let so many people down with their inconsistent Brexit policy

 

It's been fairly consistent actually. In the 2015 election it was: let's not have a referendum on EU membership.

 

After 23 June 2016 it was: let's not have another divisive referendum on EU membership.

 

The Liberal Democrat policy was: let's have a referendum on EU membership (But only if the answer is Remain).

 

The Conservative policy was: if we have a referendum on EU membership, will you PLEASE stop voting UKIP.

Edited by Doctor Blind

Prime seems to do the trick. The brings up, among other things, Reflections: The Prime Ministers We Never Had.

 

That's right, the last one was called reflections too, thanks!

A referendum where around 50% of the electorate cannot vote for their preferred option is not acceptable. It would be just as undemocratic as the Crimea referendum after the Russian invasion which did not allow for the status quo.

 

Then I would say don't have a referendum and just have a general election. I think it would be a disaster for democracy in the UK if the 2016 referendum was overturned due to pro eu/free market politicians twisting things in favour of another referendum so they can undo the 2016. Democracy would be lost to a lot of those who voted Yes in 2016 and they were the majority in that vote.

Then I would say don't have a referendum and just have a general election. I think it would be a disaster for democracy in the UK if the 2016 referendum was overturned due to pro eu/free market politicians twisting things in favour of another referendum so they can undo the 2016. Democracy would be lost to a lot of those who voted Yes in 2016 and they were the majority in that vote.

General elections on a single issue are a terrible idea.

 

A referendum on the deal would not overturn the 2016 advisory referendum. It would be a totally different vote on the deal. It would be no different from allowing somebody to withdraw their offer to buy a house once they realised that ir was in imminent danger of falling down.

The GE would be on many issues as always with Brexit as the reason it was called.

 

Withdrawing the offer would in effect put two fingers up to those who wanted Brexit which would be a disaster for British democracy. The centre ground still don't know or more likely care about the opinions of those who voted Brexit which is my concern.

The GE would be on many issues as always with Brexit as the reason it was called.

But that's the point. A party that "won" an election fought largely on one issue (almost certainly with well under 50% 0f the vote) would claim to have a mandate for their stance on the EU issue and anything else they happened to include in their manifesto. That's exactly what May tried to achieve last year.

The Lib Dems.

 

I would be horrified if the Electoral Commission allowed a referendum with no Remain option.

would be the only one I'd consider legitimate.

Whereas it

 

WHAT?!

 

You mean a 50 50 SPLIT VOTE? IT WAS AN OPINION POLL, NON BINDING.

 

FFS - and people think *I* repeat myself...

 

General elections on a single issue are a terrible idea.

 

A referendum on the deal would not overturn the 2016 advisory referendum. It would be a totally different vote on the deal. It would be no different from allowing somebody to withdraw their offer to buy a house once they realised that ir was in imminent danger of falling down.

 

Nice analogy, and not biased at all... :rolleyes:

  • 2 weeks later...
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-62...government.html

 

People are far more worried about Corbyn than Brexit’: Wealthy are ‘preparing to leave Britain’ amid rising fears of a hard-Left government

 

*****

 

There goes his 'secret money tree' :rolleyes:

 

Lmao they move money around all the time. They would have done it REGARDLESS of the opposition due to um YOUR UNDEMOCRATIC BREXIT COUP.

 

The mainstream media, terrified of the left, just use it as more propaganda to fool people like you x

 

Notice these hacks talk about a moderate left of centre government as HARD RADICAL LEFT, but the extreme right radical hard right Tory government is just the government. Lol.

Lmao they move money around all the time. They would have done it REGARDLESS of the opposition due to um YOUR UNDEMOCRATIC BREXIT COUP.

 

So you still don't think that winning a referendum is democratic? :rolleyes:

 

 

The mainstream media, terrified of the left, just use it as more propaganda to fool people like you x
There's a very good reason why its so effective...

 

Notice these hacks talk about a moderate left of centre government as HARD RADICAL LEFT, but the extreme right radical hard right Tory government is just the government. Lol.

 

You wouldn't know a hard-left gov't if it bit you on the ass!

So you still don't think that winning a referendum is democratic? :rolleyes:

There's a very good reason why its so effective...

You wouldn't know a hard-left gov't if it bit you on the ass!

 

So you admit it is propaganda? And you're PROUD of billionaires pulling the strings and feeding people opinions??

 

I would. I also know a European slightly left of centre one when I see one. I also know a hard right government when I see one: Tories, and a fascist one if it ever happened: TORYKIP or straight UKIP.

 

It wasn't a win. 37% of the electorate for a huge decision is not a win. Not getting the youth vote for a permanent decision is not a win. Only getting two nations and no small territories is not a win. It is however a right wing coup

So you admit it is propaganda? And you're PROUD of billionaires pulling the strings and feeding people opinions??

 

I would. I also know a European slightly left of centre one when I see one. I also know a hard right government when I see one: Tories, and a fascist one if it ever happened: TORYKIP or straight UKIP.

 

It wasn't a win. 37% of the electorate for a huge decision is not a win. Not getting the youth vote for a permanent decision is not a win. Only getting two nations and no small territories is not a win. It is however a right wing coup

 

1. When has an election ever *not* been influenced that way - included, say, the 1997 Labour landslide...

 

2. You have a very distorted view of the political scale - Blair's Labour was slightly left-of-centre, Corby's is well left of that!

 

3. Yawn

1. When has an election ever *not* been influenced that way - included, say, the 1997 Labour landslide...

 

2. You have a very distorted view of the political scale - Blair's Labour was slightly left-of-centre, Corby's is well left of that!

 

3. Yawn

 

My scale is correct. Yours is EXTREMELY DISTORTED by the Overton Window being pushed further and further right by Thatcher and the plutocrat media. Sorry. Corbyn is left of European centre. Slightly. Blair was centre right. Tories are far right. The end x

 

My scale is correct. Yours is EXTREMELY DISTORTED by the Overton Window being pushed further and further right by Thatcher and the plutocrat media. Sorry. Corbyn is left of European centre. Slightly. Blair was centre right. Tories are far right. The end x

 

I suspect even most of those here who disagree with me on Brexit, would find your interpretation of the political scale flawed.

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