As I am not from the UK I would like to know, does the discussion around UK doing badly each year ever go anywhere? It seems like the songs are always empty and pure filler.

Nope, the BBC just do not listen. Even after bombing so many times, they just carry on as they are.

 

Eurovision is very unpredictable but I think mainly we do need to take a risk and send something that stands out. I don't think that really can go too badly, like the bottom end is usually safe pop songs that just don't really stand out.

Surely we must be due a year the BBC actually try. 2011 was the last time I can remember when there was a lot of hype around Blue and they really promoted them and Eurovision that year. They didn’t quite get the result but that was down to the jury’s more than the televote but still a decent result.

OK, I've self-indulged and popped on itunes top 200 this morning to see what the impact has been on record buyers, admittedly a minority these days.

 

BUT, relative to what else is available to buy this morning, the impact has been bigger than any previous contest I think (chart positions assumed in some cases with multiple versions selling) and this is what the UK is buying:

 

1 James Newman - Embers ( 1 )

2 Måneskin - ZITTI E BUONI ( 2 )

3 TIX - Fallen Angel ( 4 )

4 Daði Freyr - 10 Years ( 5 )

5 Blind Channel - Dark Side ( 10 )

6 Barbara Pravi - Voilà ( 11 )

7 Elena Tsagkrinou - El Diablo ( 16 )

8 Tusse - Voices ( 18 )

9 Gjon's Tears - Tout l'univers ( 19 )

10 Go_A - SHUM ( 21 )

11 Daði Freyr - Think About Things ( 24 )

12 Destiny - Je me casse ( 26 )

13 THE ROOP - Discoteque ( 29 )

14 The Black Mamba - Love Is On My Side ( 31 )

15 Duncan Laurence - Arcade ( 34 )

16 Efendi - Mata Hari ( 37 )

17 Jendrik - I Don't Feel Hate ( 40 )

18 Duncan Laurence - Stars ( 46 )

19 Stefania - Last Dance ( 53 )

20 Hooverphonic - The Wrong Place ( 58 )

21 Eden Alene - Set Me Free ( 60 )

22 Måns Zelmerlöw - Heroes ( 61 )

23 VICTORIA - growing up is getting old (Eurovision Version) ( 63 )

24 Senhit & Flo Rida - Adrenalina ( 69 )

25 Natalia Gordienko - Sugar ( 86 )

26 Jeangu Macrooy - Birth Of A New Age ( 106 )

27 Will Ferrell & My Marianne - Husavik (My Hometown) ( 109 )

28 Loreen - Euphoria ( 112 )

29 Loco Loco - Hurricane ( 118 )

30 Manhiza - Russian Woman ( 126 )

31 Will Ferrell & My Marianne - Ja Ja Ding Dong ( 144 )

32 Blas canto - Voy A Quedarme ( 148 )

33 Alexander Rybak - Fairytale ( 150 )

34 Lordi - Hard Rock Hallelujah ( 151 )

35 Gjon's Tears - Repondez-Moi ( 171 )

36 Lesley Roy - Maps ( 190 )

 

The only finalist to fail to make the list is Albania from the dreaded No.2 slot. Ireland have popped in despite flopping. Fire Saga Ja Ja Ding Dong proved a hit :lol: Lots of oldies selling again, and dadi freyr & Gjons'Tears also managed to get last year's entries in there too. Oh, and james on top for the sympathy sales after it's been ignored for a month or two by and large. Of course this won't sustain and most won't chart, but it's interesting to see how well-received it's been and where our tastes differ from European voters (Norway loved here, as did I).

Ultimately, it comes down to BBC not caring about winning. They could flash the cash for ANY artist if they wanted to do well, but they don't.

Think about it, they pay a few hundred grand a year for a 4 hour Saturday night ratings winner. All they need to do is be in the final. What other 4 hour show could you make for that money??

Yeah 100%, people are saying "how embarrassing, they'll withdraw" but I honestly don't think they care either. They got 8 million views having put minimal effort in, just sending the same person again as they were going to last year.

It won't be expensive to just call someone like Bree Runway and ask if she is willing to participate? Just one name that popped up.

 

The most important thing is to have someone who OWNS the gig and is keen to make the most out of it.

 

We had a disaster with Darude two years ago. He took the gig, but wasn't really interested in it. The song was lacklustre and the performance didn't go anywhere.

 

 

Edited May 23, 20214 yr by Sour Candy

Honestly the UK puts less than 0 effort in for an easy ratings win. It’s their cheapest ratings hit of the entire year for the beeb

 

 

Even the ARD put in more effort. To the show itself. Not the entries. Well, last years was spectacular, it’s a shame that Germany’s once in a decade effort ended up counting for nothing. They really should have offered Ben all the money to pull off another Violent Thing

I’m still processing Jeangu’s televote nul. Spain, Germany and UK’s failures all make sense, but for me zero for a passionate, stirring, charismatic and important entry from the host nation and with a good draw doesn’t compute.

 

Still shocked at San Marino too, definitely deserved ten times that televote score - Flo Rida proved to be less of a draw for votes than Cascada. International success really means nothing at ESC!

Ms Hari deserved so much more :(

It's not a nice thought but the fact that Destiny, Senhit and Jeangu all underperformed expectations with the televote sets off my racism spidey sense!

It won't be expensive to just call someone like Bree Runway and ask if she is willing to participate? Just one name that popped up.

 

The most important thing is to have someone who OWNS the gig and is keen to make the most out of it.

 

We had a disaster with Darude two years ago. He took the gig, but wasn't really interested in it. The song was lacklustre and the performance didn't go anywhere.

 

I know bree is only an example you are using but she’s trying to build her UK profile at the moment so although Eurovision could boost that it could also isolate her new growing fan base too. That’s why it’s always artists like James Newman who haven’t had a hit in a while.

 

Also the Uk doesn’t care because overall it’s music industry is the biggest and best in the world. Developing that is much more important to them.

I know bree is only an example you are using but she’s trying to build her UK profile at the moment so although Eurovision could boost that it could also isolate her new growing fan base too. That’s why it’s always artists like James Newman who haven’t had a hit in a while.

 

Also the Uk doesn’t care because overall it’s music industry is the biggest and best in the world. Developing that is much more important to them.

 

America's is the biggest and best in the world.

It's not a nice thought but the fact that Destiny, Senhit and Jeangu all underperformed expectations with the televote sets off my racism spidey sense!

100% I thought the same! Especially Destiny with an empowering feminist kind of song, not saying all of Europe is racist but it really does feel like a moment of implicit bias, when you look at it that way :/ Then Jeangu's song was very much rooted in his culture.

Also Benny Cristo got nul on the televote in the semi, and Eden did badly on the televote in the final too, but there are many other factors at play with those examples (not least the dire performance by the former).

 

I was quite encouraged at least by Tusse actually doing better on the televote than the jury vote (who’d have ever thought it?). I think The Mamas would have done quite well last year too, so no doubt it is a lot down to the aforementioned songs and performances just not connecting with the public, but nevertheless, history and this year’s results suggest that black artists do seem to have to work so much harder for votes (going by how many have underperformed compared to the odds). I dearly hope this situation changes in the coming years.

(Amanda Holden didn't exactly help last night with her 'I don't know any of your languages!' thing).

that was clearly a joke lmao

 

we'd love to FINALLY see a moment UK tries hard because the current "woe is me, let's double down!!1" attitude benefits the rest as at least one of the bottom 5 spaces is automatically reserved by UK and other countries have less competition x

America's is the biggest and best in the world.

 

America and UK are hand in hand the biggest!

100% I thought the same! Especially Destiny with an empowering feminist kind of song, not saying all of Europe is racist but it really does feel like a moment of implicit bias, when you look at it that way :/ Then Jeangu's song was very much rooted in his culture.

 

How can you just suggest this with absolutely no evidence though?

How can you just suggest this with absolutely no evidence though?

 

There is consistent evidence of a systemic bias against black artists? Particularly for the Netherlands, who literally had a song with full on anti-colonialist lyrics. Across Europe there'll be a lot of people, who, without even thinking about why they're doing it, disfavour those types of songs because of centuries of cultural in-grouping/out-grouping. Certainly enough of them to make black artists work harder for success with similar quality songs.

I wouldn't call Europe racist based on those songs . I think being performed 6th was the main reason Destiny flopped on televote. (And Netta did that thematically in more unique way 3 years ago)

 

That said, I don't think there are lots of local stars that are poc in European countries and general public might think that poc are only good at rapping which is of course wrong in all aspects.

Edited May 23, 20214 yr by Sour Candy

I know bree is only an example you are using but she’s trying to build her UK profile at the moment so although Eurovision could boost that it could also isolate her new growing fan base too. That’s why it’s always artists like James Newman who haven’t had a hit in a while.

'My Last Breath' for 2020 was only his debut single! (outside some random dance features)

 

The sad thing for James is that My Last Breath showed glimmers of doing ok. I think it would have picked up decent jury support last year and it even appeared in the votes of a couple of the countries that ran their own local televote, like Sweden.

 

MOR blokes doing earnest guitar pop like Ed Sheeran, Lewis Capaldi and Tom Walker is one of our biggest export genres across Europe so I don’t think he would have been bottom five last year at all, more like 15th.

Edited May 23, 20214 yr by gooddelta