I do understand where you are coming from and I stand up for these issues even with my own limited understanding of it. However I also think it's problematic too when we are so quick to lash out at every single tiny this, this really shouldn't be an issue.

 

Also again I understand what you are saying re black female artists but then how many British female artists full stop have really made a dent outside the UK? Adele is the only real success, Annie Lennox perhaps but her success dwindled just like Leona's did...

 

I don’t think it’s ever problematic to have these discussions. It’s more problematic when they’re ignored.

 

How do you know Cheryl was chosen over black artists? For all we know black artists could have been approached but cba because it's a podcast nobody really cares about

 

Because she’s done it and the black artists haven’t. Keep up.

 

As if any artist who needed it would turn their nose up on such exposure.

I don’t think it’s ever problematic to have these discussions. It’s more problematic when they’re ignored.

Because she’s done it and the black artists haven’t. Keep up.

Keep up? :lol: Nobody cared about this podcast until now when a few keyboard warriors saw an opportunity to make a media storm about it. That tells me all I need to know.

Keep up? :lol: Nobody cared about this podcast until now when a few keyboard warriors saw an opportunity to make a media storm about it. That tells me all I need to know.

 

Do you not see that there is some sort of lack of awareness on the BBC’s part for commissioning this with Cheryl at the fore front? Rather than you dismissing any point made I’m interested to know what your thoughts on the actual matter at hand are, rather than calling people keyboard warriors who are getting their knickers in a twist!

Keep up? :lol: Nobody cared about this podcast until now when a few keyboard warriors saw an opportunity to make a media storm about it. That tells me all I need to know.

 

At least you own your willfull ignorance, I guess...

I don’t think it’s ever problematic to have these discussions. It’s more problematic when they’re ignored..

 

 

But when we make every single little thing problematic that in itself becomes problematic and then the real issues do get ignored.

 

While Cheryl may not have been the 'best choice' when we are saying someone cannot comment on or play her favourite songs from her favourite genre THAT is problematic. What next she can't listen to the genre either. Would this have been a problem if a Chinese person did it?

Edited September 1, 20213 yr by spiceboy

But when we make every single little thing problematic that in itself becomes problematic and then the real issues do get ignored.

 

Systemic racism is not a real issue to you?

Do you not see that there is some sort of lack of awareness on the BBC’s part for commissioning this with Cheryl at the fore front? Rather than you dismissing any point made I’m interested to know what your thoughts on the actual matter at hand are, rather than calling people keyboard warriors who are getting their knickers in a twist!

I agree that a better artist could have been chosen and it's a testament to lack of representation of POC. But at the same time it was a casual chat. Had it been on the topic of culture, origins and history of R&B music, then I would understand the backlash because Cheryl is obviously not knowledgeable of that being a white pop singer.

Systemic racism is not a real issue to you?

 

 

I never said that don't put words into my mouth that are clearly not intended. I am a gay, disabled person I face lots of systematic disadvantage every single day so of course I think it is important. This however is not necessarily systematic racism, how do you know Cheryl wasn't given the show and asked what she would like to do, wouldn't it then be racist to say no you can't do RnB because you are not black? This is like when people say how women are forced into the beauty myth but then totally disregard the same impact of masculinity on men.

Edited September 1, 20213 yr by spiceboy

Whilst I understamd and agree that the bigger issue about systemic racism is not okay in this day and age. I do feel based on the description of the podcsst it does not appear to be an issue. I am fully taking of my GA fan goggles. Could they have got someone better yes, but the podcast is about a genre of music she loves, it isn't about a history of the genre where you probably would need someone more qualified. I will say I wish some underappricated POC artists like Jorja Smith, Laura Mvula and Ray BLK do need more attention in the genre and would have loved to see them get this kinda show or any podcast they want.

 

I will say something thats kinda been urking me in the thread is people labbeling people as keyboard warriors. Is some of the stuff said about cheryl on the extreme side yes but there are also a lot who are more interested and conversating on the topic of systemic racism on the whole. I don't think its fair to label them as a "Keyboard Warrior".

Racism is suggesting that a person cannot host a certain radio show just because of their skin color.

I never said that don't put words into my mouth that are clearly not intended. I am a gay, disabled person I face lots of systematic disadvantage every single day so of course I think it is important. This however is not necessarily systematic racism, how do you know Cheryl wasn't given the show and asked what she would like to do, wouldn't it then be racist to say no you can't do RnB because you are not black? This is like when people say how women are forced into the beauty myth but then totally disregard the same impact of masculinity on men.

 

Well I’m not sure what else I was supposed to infer from your ill thought out comment. It seemed to me that you saw my attempts at discussion of a serious issue were ‘problematic’.

 

Anyway, I think I’m done here. There’s no point opening a debate with the closed minded.

I will say something thats kinda been urking me in the thread is people labbeling people as keyboard warriors. Is some of the stuff said about cheryl on the extreme said yes but there are also a lot who are more interested and conversating on the topic of systemic racism on the whole. I don't think its far to label them as a "Keyboard Warrior".

I never labeled anyone in this thread that. I was referring to the reaction on Twitter which we know is a very toxic place. A lot of the people are basically having a go and going wild at Cheryl just based off the headline without even listening to the podcast. She was just talking about her favorite songs and they're arguing making out if it was disgraceful and racist for her to do that

Edited September 1, 20213 yr by k👠th

Racism is suggesting that a person cannot host a certain radio show just because of their skin color.

 

This is my point exactly. If it were a pop show and Ms Dynamite or Jamelia were presenting it this would not be an issue at all. It becomes problematic when it's an issue the other way round.

I will say something thats kinda been urking me in the thread is people labbeling people as keyboard warriors. Is some of the stuff said about cheryl on the extreme side yes but there are also a lot who are more interested and conversating on the topic of systemic racism on the whole. I don't think its fair to label them as a "Keyboard Warrior".

 

 

I agree with this, I also think it works the same both ways when other label people "closed minded" though. It's no longer a discussion when you say that a different opinion is closed minded just because it's not the same as their own.

Whilst there is a 2 sided discussion to have here (and I don’t know the ethnicity of everyone commenting on this obviously) it’s very uncomfortable to see a lot of presumably white people label a debate around a race issue as over reacting or clutching at straws. It’s really not our place to tel POC what they are allowed to be angered by or disappointed in, more so to listen as to why they are feel this may be an issue

 

I’m not saying you can’t have your own articulate opinion on the matter which many have put forward, put to label it as jusy “Twitter being outraged again” isn’t it

Guys, I’m sorry but I’m absolutely not here for the ‘it would be racist against a white person if a black person presented a pop show’ conversation and whilst I try to respect everyone’s opinions, I’m really surprised that these type of statements (in addition to others) are still being made in 2021.

I never labeled anyone in this thread that. I was referring to the reaction on Twitter which we know is a very toxic place. A lot of the people are basically having a go and going wild at Cheryl just based off the headline without even listening to the podcast. She was just talking about her favorite songs and they're arguing making out if it was disgraceful and racist for her to do that

I meant more on twitter as yes there those who have gone wild against cherylbut those who are using the situation to bring up a important issue to the convsosation forefront don't deserve to be labbelled as such.

It’s really not our place to tel POC what they are allowed to be angered by or disappointed in, more so to listen as to why they are feel this may be an issue

MNEK's catty tweet about the toilet incident is not a good example of articulating this and there are many more on Twitter.

 

For me personally, I do not agree with using race to spread hate (I've lived my whole life in South Africa). Anyone should be allowed to talk about their favorite songs or discuss this backlash regardless what race they are. Music is one of the few things in life that brings people of all cultures and races together.

 

Jorja Smith recently made an amapiano song (South African genre) and got criticism in our country because the featured DJ was not South African. That I can understand, but Cheryl having a casual chat about her favorite R&B songs getting this amount of backlash feels unwarranted and extreme in my opinion.

Assuming that Cheryl was specifically commissioned to host a R&B show, I’d say it is an example of typical white privilege in the UK. The whole point of white privilege is when white people are chosen due to society’s norms when they aren’t the most qualified for the job, or the familiarity factor means that they are more likely to be successful etc.

 

There’s an interesting book called ‘how to be an anti racist’ which I think is worth a read. It explains very well how supporting a current system by not opposing it actually is the equivalent of supporting racism, and that you either actively challenge the systemic racism in society when you can in order to not be a racist. It takes more than just not being unkind to BAME individuals to bring the UK to a place where racism isn’t a thing. I don’t particularly want a backlash against Cheryl as an individual but I am very surprised that the BBC didn’t spot that this podcast wasn’t a good idea.

 

 

That said, I don’t think this is the worst example of it in our country, it’s just that it is more public. The worse examples are the exclusively white senior boards and management structures of companies, plus predominantly white politicians throughout the uk as they actually have a more direct financial impact on its BAME population.

MNEK's catty tweet about the toilet incident is not a good example of articulating this and there are many more on Twitter.

 

For me personally, I do not agree with using race to spread hate (I've lived my whole life in South Africa). Anyone should be allowed to talk about their favorite songs or discuss this backlash regardless what race they are. Music is one of the few things in life that brings people of all cultures and races together.

 

Jorja Smith recently made an amapiano song (South African genre) and got criticism in our country because the featured DJ was not South African. That I can understand, but Cheryl having a casual chat about her favorite R&B songs getting this amount of backlash feels unwarranted and extreme in my opinion.

 

I agree with the part in bold but I do think it misses the point. It’s not that Cheryl is talking about R&B or listening to the music that’s the issue, of course she should be free to talk about her favourite songs or listen to whatever she pleases… the issue is that the BBC have chosen her as the person most suitable to be paid to do it on a R&B show. She’s not self funding as far as I’m aware, she’s being employed to do it.