m8.... bulger was the kid they killed... its venebals and thompson who murdered bulger :)

I know, guess I've been pretty clumsy to say the least aswell!

 

lol... yeah i was rather clumsy, you are right in as much that it is a seriese of factors that played upon these boys that created the environment where they would commit evil. the boys though were products of abusive households and whilst not all victims turn into perpetrators, some do. if these boys had have grown up in different circumstances though they wouldnt hve been kiddy killers, it was avoidable, it wasnt inevitable, they were victims themselves of very unfortunate circumstances that they reacted too.

 

The thing is, you could use this argument with pretty much anyone who has behaved badly in history. Hitler, Hussain, bin Laden etc. Had they been brought up in different circumstances, would they have done the things they did? Would Henry VIII have gone around accusing his wives of being witches if he hadn't been brought up being spoilt in royalty? Would the Columbine massacre have taken place if those two lads hadn't been relatively ostracised in the school? Probably not.

There has to be a line where you can't make excuses for people. Yes, their backgrounds have all played a part, but ultimately with such acts of this level of evil, there is clearly something very wrong within the perpetrators, and they really have to take the lion's share of the responsiblity. And we need to stop making excuses and seeing them as victims.

i dont agree. i see no reason why this secret cant be kept and they both live a long and happy life. it was 15 years ago, and assuming hes 'cured' and is 'safe' then why not? he isnt the same person.

 

 

that isn't a serious answer is it?

 

we must have VERY different views on marriage :unsure:

I know, guess I've been pretty clumsy to say the least aswell!

The thing is, you could use this argument with pretty much anyone who has behaved badly in history. Hitler, Hussain, bin Laden etc. Had they been brought up in different circumstances, would they have done the things they did? Would Henry VIII have gone around accusing his wives of being witches if he hadn't been brought up being spoilt in royalty? Would the Columbine massacre have taken place if those two lads hadn't been relatively ostracised in the school? Probably not.

There has to be a line where you can't make excuses for people. Yes, their backgrounds have all played a part, but ultimately with such acts of this level of evil, there is clearly something very wrong within the perpetrators, and they really have to take the lion's share of the responsiblity. And we need to stop making excuses and seeing them as victims.

 

not quite the same thing though is it.... venebles and thompson were boys, not adults. ok adults are who they are as a result of upbringing, but there comes a time when an adult is responsable for their own actions, chosing what to endorse and what to reject.

 

the point is .. if they ARE victims themselves then are they responsable for their actions as kids? besides if we take the easy route out and 'hang the evil buggers' what would that solve?.... nothing if they arnt technically responsable for what happend. the problem there is that the real cause would go undetected and unresolved...leading to it happening again.

 

i believe them kids acted out that evil deed as a result of their upbringing and environmental influences... i dont believe them kids were born inherantly evil.

that isn't a serious answer is it?

 

we must have VERY different views on marriage :unsure:

 

lol.. im divorced so maybe you're right!

 

i dont think anything is 'forever' except ones personal history. i see no problem with withholding a dark secret from the distant past IF it is no longer active.

It was rumoured at the time that Thompson and Venables had watched the video of Child's Play before committing the murder. I can't remember if this was correct or not, but surely if it was 10 year olds should not be watching horror films if they are easily swayed by scenes of comical violence. But then the parents let them watch videos rather than being proper parents.

It was rumoured at the time that Thompson and Venables had watched the video of Child's Play before committing the murder. I can't remember if this was correct or not, but surely if it was 10 year olds should not be watching horror films if they are easily swayed by scenes of comical violence. But then the parents let them watch videos rather than being proper parents.

 

I wasn't much older than them when I saw Straw Dogs complete with graphic rape scene and the Exorcist, didn't make me into a murderer

I wasn't much older than them when I saw Straw Dogs complete with graphic rape scene and the Exorcist, didn't make me into a murderer

 

 

Don't misunderstand me, I am not making excuses for them, but was it not brought up at the trial by social workers as a contributory factor.

I wasn't much older than them when I saw Straw Dogs complete with graphic rape scene and the Exorcist, didn't make me into a murderer

 

*sigh*

 

you clearly have no understanding of people. we are not all the same and you simply just cant say that! you dont know how you would have acted if you were them. i think we all are born with varying degrees of negative traits that may or may not get employed due to the circumstances we are brought up with.

 

not everybody brought up on a rough estate who made good voted tory :P

They should have been locked up until the day they died with no chance of ever being released. Simple as that. It's a disgrace that they were ever allowed out to have a relatively normal life and get married,have partners etc.

They should have been locked up until the day they died with no chance of ever being released. Simple as that. It's a disgrace that they were ever allowed out to have a relatively normal life and get married,have partners etc.

Lol! I still cannot believe that you think he must lead a 'normal life'! Seriously, I very much doubt either of them will ever get over it.

They should have been locked up until the day they died with no chance of ever being released. Simple as that. It's a disgrace that they were ever allowed out to have a relatively normal life and get married,have partners etc.

 

And I suppose you'd've kept the likes of Jimmy Boyle and John McVicar in prison "until the day they died" as well yeah....? Incarceraton can reform even some of the most extreme characters... Boyle and McVicar were both gangsters and killers, both committed vile acts of violence (as ADULTS I might add, so far less of an excuse for their actions than Thomson and Venables....), both totally turned their lives around, the system worked for them.... As it did for Mary Bell also, she got married, had a daughter and has never committed another crime ever again... Same goes for Pauline Parker and Juliet Hulme - the girls around which Peter Jackson's film "Heavenly Creatures" was made... As Rob says, life aint black and white....

 

I don't see how the press know about this ... surely if they know he's getting married they know who he is? Or have I misread something?

 

To be honest, I dont really see how they could either... I'm beginning to suspect the story might just be a load of cobblers to be honest.... The Press can write pretty much anything they want to about Thomson and Venables really cant they, not as if either of them would actually surface to take the fukkers to court for libel are they.....?

 

The thing is, you could use this argument with pretty much anyone who has behaved badly in history. Hitler, Hussain, bin Laden etc. Had they been brought up in different circumstances, would they have done the things they did? Would Henry VIII have gone around accusing his wives of being witches if he hadn't been brought up being spoilt in royalty? Would the Columbine massacre have taken place if those two lads hadn't been relatively ostracised in the school? Probably not.

That's not the same though... when you're an adult, you can look to the wider world and make up your own mind. A 10-year-old can't, they only have the family to draw from... I don't think anyone's saying people with bad upbringings should get (literal) "get out of jail free" cards even when they're adults, and I know that if these two had done what they did at, say, 22, I'd definitely be in favour of a life sentence, regardless of their upbringing.

Lol! I still cannot believe that you think he must lead a 'normal life'! Seriously, I very much doubt either of them will ever get over it.

 

 

I said a RELATIVELY normal life.

From a female perspective, I can say that I would not want to marry someone if something like that was being withheld from me. I think she should be told. Even if he's no longer a danger, she may want children with him and I think it's best knowing something like that.

 

Maybe she's not being told because if she were she (and many others like her) wouldn't want anything to do with him. You may think he's entitled to some kind of life but so was Jamie and it's been taken from him. And anyone who argues that they didn't know what they were doing is out of their mind. They were 10 and they knew damn well that killing a child would not be something that they'd get praised for.

 

His wife should be told. I would want to know if I was about to marry a murderer.

Edited December 27, 200717 yr by Denise Young

I would want to be told too. Marriage is about honesty. She may love him sooooo much that she stayed with him anyway, but it's her decision to make and not the papers, courts or his.

It means there is something in his mindset that can completely snap one day and cause him to do terrible things, you don't just decide to go out and kill someone one day there is an evil sadistic gene lurking inside that brings that out, maybe it will never happen again but it is too big a risk to take the idea he might snap again one day

 

He should not be allowed to father kids, he should be chemically castrated and if he wants to keep his past secret from his wife he can simply say he is impotent or something

 

 

What a lot of rubbish, Most humans are capable of horrendous acts given the right circumstances, individuals do not carry evil genes. Should we have stopped Germans having kids after the second world war, or Rwandans after the genocide there?

 

He was a ten year old boy, either we should allow him a second chance or we should lock him up for ever, you can not be held responsible for something you did at 10 for the rest of your life no matter how bad it was, afterall he was too young to make an informed decision about having sex, drinking, smoking....and many other things yet he was old enough to be held fully accountable for murder that doesn't seem right to me.

I started this thread back in July. If the story was true then he's probably married now.

What a lot of rubbish, Most humans are capable of horrendous acts given the right circumstances, individuals do not carry evil genes. Should we have stopped Germans having kids after the second world war, or Rwandans after the genocide there?

 

He was a ten year old boy, either we should allow him a second chance or we should lock him up for ever, you can not be held responsible for something you did at 10 for the rest of your life no matter how bad it was, afterall he was too young to make an informed decision about having sex, drinking, smoking....and many other things yet he was old enough to be held fully accountable for murder that doesn't seem right to me.

 

I disagree. His mind was obviously warped beyond most ten year olds, plus him or the other one had above average intelligence on top of that. The way they seemed to plan the whole thing (choosing the boy to kidnap, lying to adults about their relation to him, trying to make the boy's death appear to be a suicide) is worrying. Why would his mind suddenly be clean and refreshed after seven years?

 

If two adults with a mental age of 10 had committed the same crime they would almost certainly not have been convicted of murder. These two boys had a mental age of 8 or 9 so should never have been convicted in the first place.

 

Now that they are young adults they should be allowed to get in with their lives. They will always have to live with the fact that they have killed someone. Nothing can change that and nothing can bring James (note that his parents never called him Jamie) Bulger back. They have served their sentence and should now be left alone. I don't like the fact that so much money has been spent on preserving their anonymity but I blame the tabloid press for that. Perhaps the readers of those papers should think about how much of the money they spend on buying the paper has been spent on trying to track down Thompson and Venables.