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OPINION POLLS 2017

Qassändra
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That is a stereotype, and anyone who claims to be progressive should be well aware of the dangers inherent in those!

 

I suggest you look at the backgrounds at those in Parliament and most areas of society where power is held. I think any study you care to link in will show that Council Estate residents don't feature highly. Nor do lower middle class folk. YES some people manage to achieve despite the system and things are way better than they used to be, but if you've been to the right school and have the right networking links then you get favour over those that don't. Who you know is still very important. That 5% of folk you refer to as rich definitely DON'T hold 5% of power. This is true the world over and isn't unique to the UK.

 

You don't have to stick up for something that is blatantly true because someone else strongly and bluntly makes a point about it, you realise?

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I suggest you look at the backgrounds at those in Parliament and most areas of society where power is held. I think any study you care to link in will show that Council Estate residents don't feature highly. Nor do lower middle class folk. YES some people manage to achieve despite the system and things are way better than they used to be, but if you've been to the right school and have the right networking links then you get favour over those that don't. Who you know is still very important. That 5% of folk you refer to as rich definitely DON'T hold 5% of power. This is true the world over and isn't unique to the UK.

 

You don't have to stick up for something that is blatantly true because someone else strongly and bluntly makes a point about it, you realise?

 

I don't *have* to, no... ;)

That is a stereotype, and anyone who claims to be progressive should be well aware of the dangers inherent in those!

 

Show me the receipts.

Show me how the Tories aren't rich chaos thriving Little Fingers, but are really all misunderstood and actually from council estates, not Eton and how their expenses do not include top if the range cars, dinners, hotels, clothes, and how they are not descended from the landed gentry. I'mma sit hur waiting.

What a time to be alive!

 

Theresa May's favourability rating has fallen to an all-time low of -37. Jeremy Corbyn is ahead by 7 points at -30, according to YouGov.
The UK is now facing the humiliating situation of being simultaneously rejected by the US and the EU.

:lol:

Show me how the Tories aren't rich chaos thriving Little Fingers, but are really all misunderstood and actually from council estates, not Eton and how their expenses do not include top if the range cars, dinners, hotels, clothes, and how they are not descended from the landed gentry. I'mma sit hur waiting.

 

You need wait no longer :

 

https://www.parliament.uk/biographies/commo...am-afriyie/1586

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-31...inster-pad.html

 

Tory MP who grew up on a council estate in Peckham doubles his money on luxury Westminster pad in just 10 years as he puts it on market for £16MILLION

MP Adam Afriyie had poverty-stricken childhood on south London estate

He rose to become multi-millionaire businessman and respected politician

Now set to add to his vast fortune with sale of nine-bedroom London home

He bought the property for £7.5m in 2005 and it's on the market for £16.75m

 

If nothing else, it undermines your stereotype somewhat.

You need wait no longer :

 

https://www.parliament.uk/biographies/commo...am-afriyie/1586

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-31...inster-pad.html

 

Tory MP who grew up on a council estate in Peckham doubles his money on luxury Westminster pad in just 10 years as he puts it on market for £16MILLION

MP Adam Afriyie had poverty-stricken childhood on south London estate

He rose to become multi-millionaire businessman and respected politician

Now set to add to his vast fortune with sale of nine-bedroom London home

He bought the property for £7.5m in 2005 and it's on the market for £16.75m

 

If nothing else, it undermines your stereotype somewhat.

 

 

Now show what proportion of MP's are not rich, and your point might be made. That some didn't inherit wealth but turned towards an occupation that helps them stay rich, and not support policies to help those that come from disadvantaged backgrounds, doesn't actually make your point at all.

Now show what proportion of MP's are not rich, and your point might be made. That some didn't inherit wealth but turned towards an occupation that helps them stay rich, and not support policies to help those that come from disadvantaged backgrounds, doesn't actually make your point at all.

 

But I wasn't actually making a point, merely undermining Queef's stereotype.

 

Do you believe that people who escape from poverty are morally obliged to help others in similar situations? I don't *just* mean MP's here.

 

As for whether MP's are rich - given the salaries they receive, they will pretty much be rich by default, at least compared to most of their constituents.

 

 

 

But I wasn't actually making a point, merely undermining Queef's stereotype.

 

Do you believe that people who escape from poverty are morally obliged to help others in similar situations? I don't *just* mean MP's here.

 

As for whether MP's are rich - given the salaries they receive, they will pretty much be rich by default, at least compared to most of their constituents.

 

But it wasn't undermined ?

 

Again: show me the receipts.

 

They are all MILLIONAIRES IN THE TORY PARTY!! OF COURSE THEY ARE IN IT FOR THEMSELVES.

The rich shouldn't be ruling us in these numbers when they account for 1% of the population. We now have a plutocracy, not a democracy. If the rich are in the Tory Party, it

Is. For. A . Reason. There are FAR fewer Labour Etonians and rich Labour MPs, and it is far more inclusive and progressive.

The rich shouldn't be ruling us in these numbers when they account for 1% of the population. We now have a plutocracy, not a democracy. If the rich are in the Tory Party, it

Is. For. A . Reason. There are FAR fewer Labour Etonians and rich Labour MPs, and it is far more inclusive and progressive.

 

Have you thought the alternative through? IT would involve power being in the hands of those who don't have the wherewithall to earn it through hard work.

Have you thought the alternative through? IT would involve power being in the hands of those who don't have the wherewithall to earn it through hard work.

 

Stop repeating neoliberal lies about meritocracy. Wealth begets wealth and there is rampant institutional inequality in this country. The poor are not lazy. The poor are not poor by choice. The rich capitalists sunning themselves on yachts profiting from others' labour however...

Stop repeating neoliberal lies about meritocracy. Wealth begets wealth and there is rampant institutional inequality in this country. The poor are not lazy. The poor are not poor by choice. The rich capitalists sunning themselves on yachts profiting from others' labour however...

 

Have you ever read anything but Das Kapital?

But I wasn't actually making a point, merely undermining Queef's stereotype.

 

Do you believe that people who escape from poverty are morally obliged to help others in similar situations? I don't *just* mean MP's here.

 

As for whether MP's are rich - given the salaries they receive, they will pretty much be rich by default, at least compared to most of their constituents.

 

And I had already agreed (without comment from you) that 5% of the rich people occupy far far more than 5% of Parliament, as they do the world over, so token gestures of an example of one doesn't change that basic fact.

 

Anyone who has known poverty and has no sympathy for others in the same boat has no morality, they are driven by self-interest. Those that DO try and help get slagged off as do-gooders, PC, ego-maniacs, "what do you rich pop stars known about being poor" and so on by those that don't do anything to help others.

 

I'm not talking about MP's who are well-off due to their salary, I'm talking about those who are rich before they even stand for political office. Those who become rich afterwards with all their cosy connections and sitting on boards and other top toffy-nose perks, though, are just as bad because they aren't using their position to help others (as befits a former MP) they are helping themselves, so I have nothing good to say about the likes of Blair either.

 

 

And I had already agreed (without comment from you) that 5% of the rich people occupy far far more than 5% of Parliament, as they do the world over, so token gestures of an example of one doesn't change that basic fact.

 

Perhaps MP's should be selected by lottery then, that would eliminate the influence of money. :rolleyes:

 

seriously though, however we select MP's, there are always going to be people unhappy with them. People tend to vote for politicians in similar social/financial situations to themselves - it's just that in a FPTP system, a lot of voters are going to be stuck with an MP who doesn't share their situation.

 

Anyone who has known poverty and has no sympathy for others in the same boat has no morality, they are driven by self-interest. Those that DO try and help get slagged off as do-gooders, PC, ego-maniacs, "what do you rich pop stars known about being poor" and so on by those that don't do anything to help others.
in other words, a Catch-22 situation.

 

I'm not talking about MP's who are well-off due to their salary, I'm talking about those who are rich before they even stand for political office. Those who become rich afterwards with all their cosy connections and sitting on boards and other top toffy-nose perks, though, are just as bad because they aren't using their position to help others (as befits a former MP) they are helping themselves, so I have nothing good to say about the likes of Blair either.

 

But disallowing candidates who are born rich is hardly a practical solution either, so what do you suggest?

Perhaps MP's should be selected by lottery then, that would eliminate the influence of money. :rolleyes:

 

seriously though, however we select MP's, there are always going to be people unhappy with them. People tend to vote for politicians in similar social/financial situations to themselves - it's just that in a FPTP system, a lot of voters are going to be stuck with an MP who doesn't share their situation.

 

in other words, a Catch-22 situation.

But disallowing candidates who are born rich is hardly a practical solution either, so what do you suggest?

 

1. Politicians should be selected based on ability and values, not money. Rich people running the world is nothing to do with "people being unhappy whatever" because that is just shoulder-shrugging excusing, as usual.

 

2. Don't vote for parties that stick rich candidates up to be voted for. Vote for those that hold values that stand up for looking after ordinary people. Simple.....

Perhaps MP's should be selected by lottery then, that would eliminate the influence of money. :rolleyes:

 

Please don't steal my ideas for reforming the House of Lords.

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